Why Religion Failed

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Isurrender73
Religion failed for one simple reason. It's always about man's attempt to please God through the works of his flesh. God is only pleased in the works of His only begotten Son, Jesus Christ, who paid the penalty of our sins on the cross. Believe in Christ, and God will be pleased with you on account of His Son who purchased us with His death to make us spotless in Him.

Yes.

Jesus often reminded those religious leaders that He had not come to abolish the Law but to fulfill it (Matthew 5:17). He, as God, was the Author of the Law (2 Timothy 3:16). The Pharisees focused on the letter of the Law but missed the true spirit of it, which is given in Galatians 5:14: “The whole law can be summed up in this one command: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’”

a reply to: Isurrender73

They are not the problem, but their faces scream "THERE IS A PROBLEM".

Yes, their faces do.

Reading their mini-bios was stirring as well.
There is DEFINITELY a problem.

a reply to: Isurrender73

The entire premise of religion is fundamentally flawed in the sense that it creates an end goal to an existence to which there is none.

The Creator(s) seem to have no will to interfere in the human perception of right and wrong.

There is no real progression from A to B that we are meant to achieve. There is no objective morality for the human race to work towards. I used to think there was but that is absurd rationale in hindsight.

This is a playground which is dictated ultimately by us, and in that sense my friend, it is not religion that has failed - but humanity as a whole for choosing to entertain the selfish pleasures more so than the awareness of the divine that is shared consciousness. Failure is subjective however.

Personally, all I can do is aim to maximise happiness of those around me when given the chance.

Why do I need to be taught on how to live beyond that simple principle? Why should others live by my principle likewise? Because it's 'logical'?

If the human gift of choice is being continously dampened by abstract ideas of objective or logical morality and law, we become less divine and more animal or herd like. Divinity is the gift of thought and hence choice.

Yes - even great evil is divine. Nothing can be as cruel as a human. Did people miss the meaning of the 'knowledge of good and bad' and the curse that comes along with it?

The curse is that for us to experience true happiness we must also open the doors for unimaginable suffering. Beyond that point we cannot turn to the Creator(s) for the Earth is now both our Heaven and Hell by choice.

I cannot bear 'evil' and I spend every day of my life attempting to spread good vibes and love - that does not mean I can truly judge 'evil' people however.

For me to judge a person for raping or murdering someone, is for me to say that if I was in their shoes - I would not have pursued their thoughts.

But I'm not in their shoes, and I have no idea how such a thought can be tempting to them, for it fills me with instant anger and sadness to imagine a man hurting a woman - for example.

How can I judge someone's actions when I cannot possibly comprehend their experience. This is why the state of humanity as a whole makes me sad.

That does not mean I would not take action against such things. I will do anything in my power to stop an 'evil' act occurring - but I am under no illusion of righteous grandeur.

What I'm getting at here is that morality is subjective and not objective to a higher goal.

The whole point is, if people like us - who seem to naturally agree on what's 'right' and 'wrong' - want the world to more like what we want , then we have to actively do this through action and not through words and opinions.

This is why we've created a justice system and laws/punishment. However, even that in an objective sense isn't the 'right' thing to do - despite me agreeing that from my perspective it's logical.

People naturally realise this through their lives, but they tend to ignore it. We like to believe we're genuinely better and nicer than other people - but that's just your soul. You didn't do anything special to be nice - it's driven in your human character through your fundamental essence.

To then have a doctrine stating in absolute what morality and the universal reward/punishment system is actually goes against the entire human experience thus far.

We need to wake up and take the reigns of our playground back into what we deem 'good' people's hands.

This will not come from preaching instructions but rather from each and every human, who has the capacity, exercising their ability to demonstrate unselfish love to their fellow brothers and sisters of this Earth - as you've said.

One key thing we must also accept by now, and which is fundamentally ignored in every religion, is that we are not born equal.

We are given the gift of thought/choice, but not unfettered and equal thought/choice - such a scenario cannot exist within the framework laid out, and neither could a lot of other beautiful things.

Some are turned humble by this inequality where as others thrive on a sense of superiority. The typical human duality.

The Creator(s) would know this truth and therefore our common religious doctrines would become completely illogical.

I know the Creator(s) is/are logical in the sense humans understand logic, because it is displayed evidently through both the universe and us.

There is no way you can cut the cake then to make sense of those stories as being from the true Creator(s). I am much more likely to believe we are talking about a deceitful and advanced terrestrial or alien race in our ancient past.

I will admit though, I have quite an unorthodox view on all of this. I used to be a stone-cold atheist. Sometimes I genuinely look around and think people on this Earth come from altogether different sources from outside the universe.

The range of choice and characters that this place supports is simply astonishing - truly both beautiful and tragic at the same time.

Maybe because the religions are false trees not giving of the spiritual fruit they should and that corrupted trees are allowed to spreed while true spirituality is hunted by the religious.

Humans could have treated spirituality just like any science fields and understood the mechanics by being truth seekers and not just followers of religion. Just look at the discussions on new age where some people in fact get real experience that can even be discussed by theories on how the nature of spiritual energy is interacting with the body.

The Christians and Islam cry foul and sometimes kill the wise people with the healing gift (gift of energy that creates relaxation and promotes self healing/placebo effect), psychics and even frauds who only make money on it. In a way it is funny that religion is probably the biggest hurdle for gods plan to be implemented on earth and a harmonic human society created.

a reply to: Revolution9

Wow, that is a turn up for the books, a Wiccan speaking well of Christ.

No, it's not.

Wiccans' philosophy mimics Christ's, actually.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: Revolution9

Wow, that is a turn up for the books, a Wiccan speaking well of Christ.

No, it's not.

Wiccans' philosophy mimics Christ's, actually.

I thought it more resembled Alistair Crowley "Do what thou wilt and it harm none" kind of thinking.

I know a great deal about Wicca. The modern movement began in Britain, initiated by Gerald Gardner and Alistair Crowley. It continued its development with Doreen Valiente, Alex Sanders and Janet and Stuart Farrar. I read all theirt books. I was initiated into a coven here in Cornwall at Lamorna. I met one of the authors of "The Great Cosmic Mother", Monica Sjoo at Lamorna. The other writer was Barbara Mor who is American. Monica died a few years back. She was a highly intelligent lady. (well worth a read if you are interested). I have read "The White Goddess" by Robert Graves, too. Then there are the American Wiccans like Starhawk, who I have also read. I used to practise magic big time and did all the Sabbath rituals, dancing sky clad and all that. It was a fascinating period of my life. Check out an artist who had a studio at Lamorna called Ithell Colquhoun; she was an amazing Goddess inspired painter. There are lots of her paintings online if you feel like doing a google image search. All the writers and artists I listed were very anti patriarchy and organised religion.

The reason I left Wicca was because the High Priest of the coven who taught me was too much into sex magic and started saying he was a Satanist. It freaked me out a bit and I went back over to Christianity. I tried hard with spiritual life, but as I got older I became cynical I guess.

I'm sorry. I was a bit cynical with you. Please forgive me. Just feeling the blues about a lot of things lately. I only wish you luck on your path. I guess my critical faculties have led me to a more sober and boring outlook on existence. If anything I found the Wiccan time of my life to be the most fun.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

ps; Two other interesting books:

"The Wise Wound" and "The Black Goddess" by Penelope Shuttle and Peter Redgrove.

a reply to: Revolution9

Folks, I've read lots of the books. I studied under a High Priest, and was initiated to the extent I needed to be. I practiced for a while as a solitary practitioner, and also explored covens. There was NOTHING evil, or un-Christlike about it.

Wicca does, in fact, say: "If it harms none, do as you will."

And what is wrong with that???

Nothing. It's exactly the same thing that progressives now are saying. "If you're not hurting others, do whatever."

Probably now I'll get labelled a Satanist or some hogwash like that - or folks will say: "Well, THAT explains what a miscreant and erroneous libtard she is!!"

But the fact is - Wiccans just want everyone to get along- to get along with Nature, and each other - and to harm none.

HARM NONE.

If you (the general 'you') think that's not the very same idea that "Jesus" and "Buddha" and "Krishna" all had in common, and taught, well, then......that's what you think. You are mistaken, but if that's what you want to continue to think, go right ahead!

Religion says yay and the hearts of weak men say nay. That is what it tries to show you, that God knows you better than yourself and that he is the truth of who we are. We must be grateful and serve mankind for he wishes this, it is up to us to decide if we invite the wanderer and shepard the weak in the valley of darkness or not.

Men don't practice the truth very often, we convince ourselves that things will get better, that technology will find a solution when nature is the best technology there is, and it is for free. We just need to work together. We all have made some mistakes and we know what is right in our hearts about how to treat others for I am you and you are me. Not literally, but I see myself in all my brethren.

Rejoice in a new beginning of walking in the light of the truth.

Aren't the relgious set to increase in numbers over time?

a reply to: igor_ats

Aren't the relgious set to increase in numbers over time?

Depends on their breeding patterns and the extent to which they indoctrinate their kids.....

a reply to: igor_ats

Don't you think the majority of the planet practices at least one of the big four religions already?

a reply to: DazDaKing

We are born spiritually equal. We are not born physically or mentally equal. This is the message found in the spiritual texts.

We all have the ability to Love without doing harm to others. However, I agree with most of your ideas.

originally posted by: Isurrender73
a reply to: DazDaKing

We are born spiritually equal. We are not born physically or mentally equal. This is the message found in the spiritual texts.

We all have the ability to Love without doing harm to others. However, I agree with most of your ideas.

Do not agree that we are born spiritually equal. There are souls that are very advanced born who cannot behave selfishly(non harmonious) and there are the ones that are very low level who have no control at all.

The souls shines thru. The end realized potential of a soul is the same but the starting point is not. There is a mix of tourists, servants (blessed ones), middle leveled ones and lower leveled ones here. Some will advance, some will fall lower, some will know their full soul potential.

Even if the souls are not equal you should still try to help all souls much as you can so that they reach higher levels as quick as possible to decrease suffering on all levels.

a reply to: LittleByLittle

It is impossible for some to be connected to the light and follow it according to your ideology.

Why do you feel you are spiritualy superior, what did you do other than believe what you read and heard? Why do feel that others simply are not spiritually intelligent enough to understand what you understand?

Your religious ideology has caused you to exualt yourself above others. Are you sure this is what Siddhartha Gautama taught?

One of the basic principles in Buddhism is equanimity, we all have same ability to become Buddha regardless of our birth rights.

Siddhartha Gautama did not teach inequality that leads to exalting oneself above others.

a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

Religion failed for one simple reason. It's always about man's attempt to please God through the works of his flesh. God is only pleased in the works of His only begotten Son, Jesus Christ, who paid the penalty of our sins on the cross. Believe in Christ, and God will be pleased with you on account of His Son who purchased us with His death to make us spotless in Him.

Well said BELIEVERpriest. That had to be the Spirit of God talking through you. I will always remember that.
God Bless

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Wicca does, in fact, say: "If it harms none, do as you will." And what is wrong with that???

But then what if you are wrong and you are destroying others? What if you are actually teaching others in a false premise? So far in this thread I see that religion is at fault in this physical life only but what about the afterlife? What if one of those religions out there is the truth and the afterlife requirements are true? We then have egg on our faces do we not? But then it may be too late according to the true religion. (if there is one)-

If Wicca is not a religion then can it not be considered a belief? You say that you studied under a high priest? Why does that somehow give me the idea that you must have some sort of doctrine or rules that govern your belief? I see no difference between that and other organized beliefs. Religion is a name of many beliefs. I don't know who made up all of these rules but when a person believes and practices a belief then it is religion practiced and if that one does not practice his or her belief it is still religion not practiced. Just my opinion of course.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Isurrender73
Religion failed for one simple reason. It's always about man's attempt to please God through the works of his flesh. God is only pleased in the works of His only begotten Son, Jesus Christ, who paid the penalty of our sins on the cross. Believe in Christ, and God will be pleased with you on account of His Son who purchased us with His death to make us spotless in Him.

So what do we do once we believe that the PERFECT SPIRIT who was WITHOUT SIN is WITHIN US?

A. Do good works?
B. Continue to sin as fallen men?
C. Nothing because works are not required?
D. Pursue PERFECTION because the PERFECT ONE is GUIDING you?

The answer is "D". Unless you are PERUSING PERFECTION you are not FOLLOWING the PERFECT ONE.

How do I know that I can pursue PERFECTION, even though I am not yet perfect. Because I have faith that the perfect one lives in me and is my SHEPHERD.

My faith in PERFECTION proceeded my WORKS towards PERFECTION. I WORK for PERFECTION, because faith without deeds is dead.

I could not follow the PERFECT STONE rejected by the builders if I did not first have FAITH in PERFECTION.

Perfect faith is to have faith in perfection.

a reply to: Seede

Why does that somehow give me the idea that you must have some sort of doctrine or rules that govern your belief?

IF IT HARMS NONE, DO AS YOU WILL.

That is the doctrine. That is the rule.
Harm none.
What more is needed?

Who am I 'destroying'? No one.
Not even the ants in my yard, or the moles that make the earth spongy.

a reply to: Isurrender73

Just because every soul have the potential to become a Buddha do not mean all souls start at the same place from birth.

What about reincarnation? Bettering the soul in one life so you are further along in another and do not have to do that part of the journey again. Reaching the energized body state and bliss so you know some secrets from the other side of the veil by experience not faith. Knowing the feeling of oneness of the higher levels thru the veil.

Some souls that are low leveled will advance quickly in their life here and surpass my potential and be further along than me. Good for them and that is exactly like it should be.

One of the basic principles in Buddhism is equanimity, we all have same ability to become Buddha regardless of our birth rights.

If it was the same starting point why do not all souls become enlightened at the same time spent or the same effort spent? Why do some (monks) advance quicker than others? Everyone can reach enlightenment if they work on it but the effort needed can be different between souls, thru for instance meditation. You can advance quickly if you want and push yourself (the ego).

Why do some reach instant enlightenment naturally without seeking thru the Amagydala fear overload experience if your intentions are pure enough and other soul do not?

Your thinking is like saying all souls are born Maraton runners and training do not improve ability at all and there is no reason of improving since the souls potential is stagnant. Live my life and you would see it a very differently. The souls shine thru in some and darkens thru in some. Seen both types of beings and they are definitely not the same.

Are you sure this is what Siddhartha Gautama taught?

I will let you ask him yourself.