How a crisis in Estonia could lead to World War III

a reply to: Whereismypassword

One really has to look deep into the notion of wanting to take over any state . It can be viewed that with that you get all the debt , corruption , and other issues of governing . Putin as far as I understand it had ,has ,is is going to have issues to deal with for his own country moving forward . Just trying to pull out of one system and move to the BRICS system is a plate full imo . One thing he has going for him is the trust of the Russian people and that is the most important things .

What I think you will see in the not too distant future is a move by ethnic Russians moving back to the mother land . That is if the economy moves in the right direction . That is not a hard thing to imagine seeing the economic situation of some European countries and China's emergence . When I was a kid growing up the cry was go west young man go west . This century seems to be changing to look east young man look east .

a reply to: intrptr

And yet both Ukraine and Georgia had their applications denied. Funny how they both had territory subject to an actual military occupation shortly thereafter.

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: Cabin

Some flow chart.

Lets cut to the chase. If war breaks out in Europe it will be because…

Estonia is today part of NATO…

---

…and the US is deploying heavy military equipment there…

Imagine how the US would respond if Russians did that on the US border with Mexico. Who would be the aggressor in such a case?

Well the Russians tried do something like that back in the 60's..

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: cenpuppie


The reason Soviets put missiles in Cuba was because US had missiles in Turkey. Trade off agreement to remove both.

Little known fact.

"If you take your missiles out of Turkey we'll take ours out of Cuba…"

Lol either way, Cuba was a lot closer to D.C. than Turkey was to Moscow.

a reply to: Xcalibur254

And yet both Ukraine and Georgia had their applications denied. Funny how they both had territory subject to an actual military occupation shortly thereafter.

Shortly after what, the US encroached in the vacuum of the Wasrsaw Pact? How long did you think Russia would tolerate the reverse Warsaw Pact maxim? How far you want to go back? The Middle East, Vietnam, Korea, Hawaii, "New" Mexico?

The rest of the world isn't that forgetful.

a reply to: intrptr

Hey thanks for the info on the Estonian President Ives being from New Jersey. Total classic, I never knew It's almost beyond belief, but follows a steady pattern of leaders in Eastern Europe having a US state education. Absoute classic, almost made my eyes pop out when I read the Wiki on him, President Obama says "he's know as Tom." Wow, maybe they can get Saakashvilli in to the party to, maybe a main position once he's booted out of Ukraine or wherever else he ends up next

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: abstractvision

In other words, if a known armed robber was sleeping "out front" your house, you'd have no concerns…

"its his right".

I'd have concerns, but if I pre-emptively shot him, I'd be the one prosecuted for murder.

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: Cabin

Some flow chart.

Lets cut to the chase. If war breaks out in Europe it will be because…

Estonia is today part of NATO…

---

…and the US is deploying heavy military equipment there…

Imagine how the US would respond if Russians did that on the US border with Mexico. Who would be the aggressor in such a case?

Nail hit squarely on the head!
NATO should have never been expanded past Germany and we have no business placing heavy weapons in Estonia. It'll end up in the wrong hands anyway!

originally posted by: cenpuppie
a reply to: intrptr

We've already seen what the USA does when someone creeps to close, the Cuban Missile Crisis.

The US didn't like it when the Russians parked ICBMs in their backyard, so why moan and complain when someone else gets pissed when you do the exact same thing?

Damn government is ran by hypocrites that want things their own way.

Wait. I missed the part where we parked ICBMs in Latvia.

originally posted by: ufoorbhunter
a reply to: intrptr

Hey thanks for the info on the Estonian President Ives being from New Jersey. Total classic, I never knew

It's almost beyond belief, but follows a steady pattern of leaders in Eastern Europe having a US state education. Absoute classic, almost made my eyes pop out when I read the Wiki on him, President Obama says "he's know as Tom." Wow, maybe they can get Saakashvilli in to the party to, maybe a main position once he's booted out of Ukraine or wherever else he ends up next

Many leaders in the world wind up with a Western education.

www.ericshiraev.com...

It's interesting to see where they all went although this paper is old. It's also interesting to see the patterns that emerge.

a reply to: Whereismypassword

Is the Estonian president realy from New Jersey? Lol

According to the wikipedia current Estonian president Toomas Hendrik Ilves

Ilves was born in Stockholm, Sweden; his parents Endel and Irene Ilves were Estonian refugees.[1] His maternal grandmother was Russian from St. Petersburg.[2][3] He grew up in the United States in Leonia, New Jersey, and graduated from Leonia High School in 1972 as valedictorian.[4] He received a bachelor's degree in psychology from Columbia University in 1976 and a master's degree in the same subject from the University of Pennsylvania in 1978.[5] He also received an honorary degree from St. Olaf College in 2014 in recognition of his relationship with the college.[6] He speaks both Estonian and English as first languages, and he also is fluent in German, Spanish and Latvian.

It is plausible that he was US citizen at some point in his life before returning to Estonia.

I know that former Latvian president Vaira Vike Freiberga from 1999-2007 was Canadian citizen before returning to Latvia.
Also former Lithuanian president Valdas Adamkus 1998-2003 had a career in USA before returning to Lithuania.

He joined the United States Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) at its inception in 1970, working in Cincinnati. In 1981, he was appointed regional administrator by President Ronald Reagan, and was responsible for all air, water, hazardous waste, and other pollution control programs in Illinois, Indiana, Michigan, Minnesota, Ohio, and Wisconsin. In 1985, President Reagan presented him with the Distinguished Executive Presidential Rank Award – the highest honor that can be bestowed upon a civil servant.

So, it is a common thing among all Baltic states.


The Baltic states are more like direct vassal states of USA and less belonging to Europe per se. For example Latvian citizens have a visa free arrangements with USA, which is quite rare even among many other USA allies. Well, they all joined Euro zone in recent years despite the looming crisis of Greece and other southern Europe states, so they do participate in European life, but more like providing USA influence inside Europe.

a reply to: ketsuko


I love Vladir Putin and his MA in International Law He's now doing a Doctorate in How to bend Internation Law

a reply to: Wardaddy454

Well the Russians tried do something like that back in the 60's..

They put missiles in Cuba because US put missiles in Turkey, first.

Google it, little known fact.

a reply to: Wardaddy454

Lol either way, Cuba was a lot closer to D.C. than Turkey was to Moscow.

Sorry, if thats what you meant. See my other reply.

By the by, by ICBM, that difference matters little. If one side launches the other does too, without recall.

a reply to: intrptr

By the by, by ICBM, that difference matters little. If one side launches the other does too, without recall.

The distances from Cuba to D.C. and from some points in Turkey to Moscow are similar, about 1700-2000 km. Little bit closer D.C. - Cuba, but not by much.

To put this into proportion, since we are talking about Estonia.
Narva (Estonia) - St. Petersburg 135 km.
Narva (Estonia) - Moscow 690 km.

originally posted by: ufoorbhunter
a reply to: intrptr

Hey thanks for the info on the Estonian President Ives being from New Jersey. Total classic, I never knew

It's almost beyond belief, but follows a steady pattern of leaders in Eastern Europe having a US state education. Absoute classic, almost made my eyes pop out when I read the Wiki on him, President Obama says "he's know as Tom." Wow, maybe they can get Saakashvilli in to the party to, maybe a main position once he's booted out of Ukraine or wherever else he ends up next

You're most welcome. None of the Putin bashers want to address that, obviously makes the west look manipulative.

Same in Ukraine… Bidens son gonna run the oil business there for the West. "Yur'e our boy!"

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: abstractvision

In other words, if a known armed robber was sleeping "out front" your house, you'd have no concerns…

"its his right".

I'd have concerns, but if I preemptively shot him, I'd be the one prosecuted for murder.

Exactly. No complaining about NATO allowed. They're the "good guys".

a reply to: ketsuko

From your sarcasm, you have missed alot.

That's okay, that's what ATS is for.

a reply to: intrptr

Bidens Son died recenty so he wont be running anything.

a reply to: oddnutz

The WORLD should count their BLESSINGS LeMAY didn't hold sway over Kennedy.