Banning the US flag as well.

considering its not actually ON THE BUILDING but just the PROPERTY it should not be moved then right?

a reply to: Annee

I've been wondering that my whole life. It's not just the South's fixation on that flag that baffles me, its the South's fixation on the entire Civil War that baffles me. The Confederate Flag is just an extension of that fixation.

I've already mentioned it to several other posters, but I used to live in a small town in Mississippi and I felt like we spent each year going over the Civil War in history class.

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: Annee

German's are probably the most significant group in building this country.

Not at all.

The most significant group that built The U.S, where the first British Colonists who built the original colonies and went into the unknown possibly putting their lives at risk.

Where do you think most of the German immigrants came from?

They were Protestants sponsored by England. But, that's another story.

a reply to: Annee

Germans only began arriving once the colonies had been established.

They also only settled mainly in New York and Pennsylvania.

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic
a reply to: nenothtu

Sorry, I have no idea what you mean, but I'm pretty sure I don't care, as it seems to be an attempt to insult me. I have made no claims for conquerors or the conquered. I don't even know what you're talking about.

Of course you don't ! I wouldn't, either, if I were in your shoes, so it's understandable to feign ignorance of the matter. Keeps one from having to respond to difficult questions.

That you "don't care" is the entire root of the problem - not just "you", but the collective "yous". It is apparent you "don't care" - but like we all do, you chose what to care about, and that's OK too - until it comes time to set the rest of the world "straight". The rest of the world may have different cares at odds with yours, and that creates friction when one set of folks decide to attempt to impose their cares on another set of folks with different cares.

An observation is not an "insult" - insults are entirely in the minds of the folks taking offense - I'm not responsible for your feelings of "insult", or indeed any other feelings you may have. Those are yours, and yours only.

originally posted by: nenothtu
Of course you don't ! I wouldn't, either, if I were in your shoes, so it's understandable to feign ignorance of the matter. Keeps one form having to respond to difficult questions.

I swear, I'm going to quit asking for clarification on here. I am not "feigning" ignorance, I just don't understand you point. I make it a personal policy to either answer questions, ask for clarification or at least say I'm not going to answer.

So, never mind.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Annee

I agree, but I wouldn't agree to banning it. That will just have the opposite effect and ingrain it even further into the Southern psyche. Just take it off the state buildings and educate people about its true past. Hopefully someday everyone comes around and the flag is no longer used.

Ah! "Social Engineering" via politically-directed "education"! Where have I ever heard that suggestion before?

I'll take a double helping, please, I LOVE being "re-educated"! Will there be camping involved?

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: Annee

German's are probably the most significant group in building this country.

Not at all.

The most significant group that built The U.S, where the first British Colonists who built the original colonies and went into the unknown possibly putting their lives at risk.

The Scotch-Irish and Germans who actually WENT into the "unknown" might take exception to that characterization of British coast-huggers.

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: Annee

Germans only began arriving once the colonies had been established.

They also only settled mainly in New York and Pennsylvania.

A German named Tyrkr came here with Leif Erikson. he went farther "into the unknown" than the Vikings did, too. He was the one who discovered the grape vines that gave Vinland it's name, and brought samples back to the Viking settlement.

It seems Germans were going into the American unknown a significant length of time before the British ever even considered it.

Not to mention the French and Spanish getting here before the Brits as well. The British were the latecomers here... but they took the prize in North America in the end, didn't they?

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: nenothtu
Of course you don't ! I wouldn't, either, if I were in your shoes, so it's understandable to feign ignorance of the matter. Keeps one form having to respond to difficult questions.

I swear, I'm going to quit asking for clarification on here. I am not "feigning" ignorance, I just don't understand you point. I make it a personal policy to either answer questions, ask for clarification or at least say I'm not going to answer.

So, never mind.

Fair enough. Have a nice day then.

For future reference, when "asking for clarification", it often helps to... ask for clarification.

For your edification in this "question", however, I will elucidate just a bit - you can read it or ignore it. Matters nary a whit.

1) The Confederacy Ceded from the US, and formed another nation.

2) the US didn't like the loss of agricultural base (not to mention the tax revenues from Confederate import/export trade), took exception, and invaded the Confederacy to re-annex it.

3) the US conquered the Confederacy, and did indeed re-annex it.

4) The US conquered what they like to claim now as "their own people".

5) Life is strange.

a reply to: nenothtu

Do you have links, documentation, that your version of history is accurate?

Yup. It needs to be! It's a symbol of hate to many, many extremists that wish to exterminate all of us and continuously cause chaos and go on killing sprees around the world and in our own country. We need to be more tolerant and think of them, we need to get the message when we see them burning our flag every other hour on the news as they threaten us and the rest of the world, they don't want to see our american flag, that's the last thing that they should have to see, it causes so much hate!

O'h and every other flag in the world that offends people (ONLY certain people though) in any way.

I wonder what our forefathers would do if they had a magical crystal ball that could see into the future back then, I'm pretty sure they wouldn't believe what this country and their people have come to. People have become too soft and bend at the knees far too much. It's disgusting.

We need to ban bans because bans offend me.

originally posted by: nenothtu

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: nenothtu
Of course you don't ! I wouldn't, either, if I were in your shoes, so it's understandable to feign ignorance of the matter. Keeps one form having to respond to difficult questions.

I swear, I'm going to quit asking for clarification on here. I am not "feigning" ignorance, I just don't understand you point. I make it a personal policy to either answer questions, ask for clarification or at least say I'm not going to answer.

So, never mind.

Fair enough. Have a nice day then.

For future reference, when "asking for clarification", it often helps to... ask for clarification.

For your edification in this "question", however, I will elucidate just a bit - you can read it or ignore it. Matters nary a whit.

1) The Confederacy Ceded from the US, and formed another nation.

2) the US didn't like the loss of agricultural base (not to mention the tax revenues from Confederate import/export trade), took exception, and invaded the Confederacy to re-annex it.

3) the US conquered the Confederacy, and did indeed re-annex it.

4) The US conquered what they like to claim now as "their own people".

5) Life is strange.

The Civil War was about economics. Why was it about economics? Because the plantations could not be run without slave labor.

Anyway you twist it, it's still about slavery. About owning another human being. About forcing that human being to work for your own profit.

Slave laborers in Bangladesh probably have more rights.

That is what the Confederation is about. That is what the flag represents.

You can spout all you want about Seceding, about state rights, about not being controlled, etc etc ----- does not change the real bottom line.

There is no comparison between the U.S. flag and the Confederate flag.

a reply to: icewater

America is a blessed nation, it has shared its blessing with many other nations, I will not dispute that...but like all great nations, American has become increasingly corrupt.

The flag has done no good nor any evil to anyone. It's a piece of cloth. The choices of each individual personal in America is what ultimately determined our fate. So what good is it to attribute human actions to a piece of colored cloth?

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: nenothtu

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: nenothtu
Of course you don't ! I wouldn't, either, if I were in your shoes, so it's understandable to feign ignorance of the matter. Keeps one form having to respond to difficult questions.

I swear, I'm going to quit asking for clarification on here. I am not "feigning" ignorance, I just don't understand you point. I make it a personal policy to either answer questions, ask for clarification or at least say I'm not going to answer.

So, never mind.

Fair enough. Have a nice day then.

For future reference, when "asking for clarification", it often helps to... ask for clarification.

For your edification in this "question", however, I will elucidate just a bit - you can read it or ignore it. Matters nary a whit.

1) The Confederacy Ceded from the US, and formed another nation.

2) the US didn't like the loss of agricultural base (not to mention the tax revenues from Confederate import/export trade), took exception, and invaded the Confederacy to re-annex it.

3) the US conquered the Confederacy, and did indeed re-annex it.

4) The US conquered what they like to claim now as "their own people".

5) Life is strange.

The Civil War was about economics. Why was it about economics? Because the plantations could not be run without slave labor.

Anyway you twist it, it's still about slavery. About owning another human being. About forcing that human being to work for your own profit.

Slave laborers in Bangladesh probably have more rights.

That is what the Confederation is about. That is what the flag represents.

You can spout all you want about Seceding, about state rights, about not being controlled, etc etc ----- does not change the real bottom line.

There is no comparison between the U.S. flag and the Confederate flag.

This is the type of thing that is really mind blowing to me. How can you and so many people think that the south (and it's flag) stood for slavery, and only that? The south was a beautiful civilization that was apart of this country, with a beautiful culture that also shaped this country. HOW can you people think that the civil war was about slavery- do you know nothing about the actual history- do you care to take a look at the facts and gaze away from the BS mainstream lowly public school level of academia that is completely and utterly full of fabricated, falsified shi*??

GUESS WHAT, the north had slaves too - guess WHAT the north didn't fight the south for this lovey dovey ideal of equality for african americans to have equal rights, in fact they had no intentions of the sort - Lincoln and the leading union state's plan was to send them to central america after the war - to basically in laymen's terms get rid of them and kick them out of America. Lincoln doesn't seem to think very deeply on the issue in one of his (many similar) statements here:

"I have no purpose, directly or indirectly, to interfere with the institution of slavery in the States where it exists. I believe I have no lawful right to do so, and I have no inclination to do so."

Another thing, should most of the world take down their flags too? Since, (you probably don't know this since they don't spoon feed the actuality of the history of slavery to the masses) EVERY ETHNICITY/GROUP OF PEOPLE WHO HAVE HAD A THRIVING (OR TO PUT IT MUCH LESS ABOVE AVERAGE) CIVILIZATION HAD SLAVES - AND GUESS WHAT? THEY ENSLAVED OTHER RACES OF PEOPLE AS WELL. THIS HAS BEEN GOING ON SINCE THE DAWN OF TIME. Does that mean that their flags are hateful too and that all of their history only stands for hate and slavery?

Have you ever heard of the Arab slave trade? IN FACT from the 7th century all the way up to the 20th century their slave trade of africans continued in amounts well over 20 million. O'h not to mention another slave trade that they had which no one cares to know any damn thing about since it's just white people (double standard right on QUE) - for hundreds of years they ALSO kidnapped and took over 1.5 million Europeans from their homes on the coast and forced even small children to go with them back to their land as slaves.

That's just a recent form of slavery that no one cares to dwell about and embed into the minds of students and sheep.

So, where is their apology? Where are the hours and hours worth of the history of that in mainstream books/academia (like there is for the south who had a mere grain of sand in comparison to the duration of time that this went on (and still does) and amount of slaves that they had? Where is the arabic muslim apology to the people of Africa, and of course less sought after and the unthinkable - where is the apology to the millions of Europeans? Where is their guilt for practicing a far more horrendous form of slavery? Where are their attempts for reparations to try to heal the past suffering that was endured?

O'h I think I see it! It's shown when their radicals are burning our flag and worst of all doing something insanely prejudice - like constantly threatening to kill and of course going to the level OF killing people who are not one of their own, who do not practice their religion! That's their way of doing these things! There we go!

The devastatingly disgusting amount of hypocrisy and double standards is absolutely insane. People need to stop being brainless wonders and begin to actually look at the facts and reality of things.

a reply to: yuppa

We might as well start banning all flags and corporate insignias. Good point.

I am definitely not for this "ban the confederate flag" censorship nonsense and I'm a liberal. I think that people should openly be able to express whatever views they may have, and I also think that the confederate flag stands for more than just slavery.

a reply to: TheIceQueen

Please, just stop.

You're making too much sense and I just can't handle it!

Seriously though, well said.

originally posted by: TheIceQueen

This is the type of thing that is really mind blowing to me. How can you and so many people think that the south (and it's flag) stood for slavery, and only that?

Because I don't have a dog in this fight. I am unbiased and emotionally detached.

The Civil War was #1 about slavery. All those who keep trying to drip honey on it need to get real.

The flag was political, not some beautiful garden.

originally posted by: poncho1982
a reply to: TheIceQueen

Please, just stop.

You're making too much sense and I just can't handle it!

Seriously though, well said.

What?

You like romance novels?