NYPD Can't Hire African Americans Because "So Many Of Them Have Spent Time In Jail,"

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: enlightenedservant

on the flip side a persons appearance does relate to their job, especially when a uniform of some kind is required. How you portray yourself when asking for / applying / interviewing for a job can give an idea of how that person sees the job in question. If you aren't going to go out of your way to dress and act professional then what is to say you wont carry that attitude over into the job?

Its one of the reasons law enforcement is required to dress up for court, either uniform or business professional. Its a sign of respect to the court as you are representing not just yourself, but your employer. Its why we have uniform inspections. Its why a lot of agencies have visible tattoo policies.

A persons appearance is just as important as they handle themselves with speech.

Its called command presence and contrary to popular belief criminals do pick up on how an officers uniform is and can essentially behaviorally profile that officer. If the officer is out of shape, bad fitting / unclean uniform the consensus is he does not take care of himself and shows little respect for his job. They also assume that the officer is also going to do the bare minimums when it comes to training and self defense etc. Un shined shoes are another area criminals will look.

Appearance is important.

People complain about the way officer acts and many more complain about them behaving unprofessionally.. People need to make up their minds on this topic. If standards are set high its up to the person who wants the job to decide -

A - How bad do they want this job
and
B - Are they willing to do whats needed in order get the job
and
C - Will they maintain that standard once they get on.

Ok but what does any of that have to do with civilians in daily life? This isn't Saudi Arabia where civilians have to dress a certain way or risk being singled out by their religious police. Correction: This isn't Saudi Arabia, so civilians shouldn't have to dress a certain way or risk being singled out by police. In the West, we should basically be able to dress however we choose (there are even nudist communities & nude beaches here, if we prefer that route).

That's why I pointed out the stereotypical outfits of skinheads, bikers, cowboys, and gangsters. How would their situation be any different from that of ethnic minorities in daily life attire? Same for openly carrying a firearm. How is that any less "menacing" than a hoodie, especially since people of other ethnic groups wear hoodies with no problems? Kind of like Geraldo making comments about hoodies then being caught wearing them himself.

originally posted by: amazing
This is really the stupidest thing I've ever seen.

Every single metropolitan area, if it's larger that is, when they post job hirings for the police department ...They are inundated with candidates.

It's easy for them to be picky. That's why it upsets me when they hire so many bad cops. New York has way over 8 million residents. That's just the City proper, and not counting all the surrounding areas.

You mean to tell me that every single eligible minority candidate has been arrested? LOL

Impossible!

I agree. This is a piss poor excuse from the officials in NY City, to be honest.

Are people blind to crime stats? Not all black people are criminals but they have a disproportionately high violent crime rate compared to everyone else.

Bring on the racist claims now.

a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14

You need to address more than just poverty. The inner city culture and values in and of itself need to be addressed; however, for that to happen people need to be willing to walk away from that type of lifestyle.

originally posted by: Legman
a reply to: TonyS


While we are at it we should only allow Hispanics to police Hispanics and Muslims to police Muslims. Then perhaps in thirty years we can divide this country up into city states. I like it.

To be fair, isn't that the point of democracy in the first place? To let the citizens govern themselves?

And we already have those city-states. That's literally the point of local governments, county governments, and state governments. The citizens of those jurisdictions are allowed to govern themselves to a degree. and look at the HOA's in Florida (and probably elsewhere). They have a lot of power when it comes to city ordinances that affect their communities.

Why shouldn't other communities be allowed the same power?

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: Legman
a reply to: TonyS


While we are at it we should only allow Hispanics to police Hispanics and Muslims to police Muslims. Then perhaps in thirty years we can divide this country up into city states. I like it.

To be fair, isn't that the point of democracy in the first place? To let the citizens govern themselves?

And we already have those city-states. That's literally the point of local governments, county governments, and state governments. The citizens of those jurisdictions are allowed to govern themselves to a degree. and look at the HOA's in Florida (and probably elsewhere). They have a lot of power when it comes to city ordinances that affect their communities.

Why shouldn't other communities be allowed the same power?

So you're actually ADVOCATING for segregation?

Just making sure we're clear here.

a reply to: enlightenedservant

I am referring to how they come dressed to pick up an application and subsequent testing / interviews. I have seen people show up in jeans and a tshirt before.

originally posted by: DrakeINFERNO
Are people blind to crime stats? Not all black people are criminals but they have a disproportionately high violent crime rate compared to everyone else.

Bring on the racist claims now.

I won't call it racism, just selectively choosing your stats. You speak of violence, but leave out the obvious violence like invasions, wars, torture, domestic violence, rape, etc.

Since the beginning of World War I, hundreds of millions of people have been murdered in wars. But you never count that violence as "white violence" do you? Hitler and the Germans killed more than 20 million Slavic people in their war against Russia, which is far more people than African Americans have killed in America. Yet somehow you're labeling us the violent ones? And King Leopold killed between 6-10 million black people in the Congo alone, yet we're the ones with the violent stereotype? And let's not forget the tens of millions of Natives killed in North America, South America, and Oceania. But somehow that doesn't count either right?

Also, the US killed several million civilians in the 2nd Indochina War (aka the Vietnam War); hundreds of thousands of civilians in the Iraq War; and at least 80,000 civilians in Afghanistan. And at least 500,000 Iraqis died as a result of the US sanctions on Iraq after Desert Storm (it took the Oil for Food program to stop the famine). How many of those deaths are contributed to us? Or does that violence not count?

In fact, I'd guess white people probably killed more people in the Civil War alone (roughly 600,000) than black people have killed in American history total. Yet we're stereotyped as being the violent ones?

originally posted by: Cypress
a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14

You need to address more than just poverty. The inner city culture and values in and of itself need to be addressed; however, for that to happen people need to be willing to walk away from that type of lifestyle.

There's a great book by Robert Greene and 50 Cent that talks about that lifestyle and how hard it is to get out of it.

What people need is more opportunity. Not so much a hand out but a chance to succeed. That's all any of us really want. That starts with Education and inspiration.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: enlightenedservant

I am referring to how they come dressed to pick up an application and subsequent testing / interviews. I have seen people show up in jeans and a tshirt before.

Dude, that's all ethnic groups though. You can go to most temp services and find people of all walks of life in similar attire. And that's before, during, and after the interviews.

Besides, the person I initially responded to was saying that people who wear certain clothes are putting a target on their backs. And that "dressing and acting aggressively" makes it justified. That's why I mentioned what I mentioned.

a reply to: trollz

I simply stated a fact, as it was.

Anecdotal observations aren't facts. You've also given no context (how about population data?) and frankly, given your obvious intent, your claims seem suspect.

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: Legman
a reply to: TonyS


While we are at it we should only allow Hispanics to police Hispanics and Muslims to police Muslims. Then perhaps in thirty years we can divide this country up into city states. I like it.

To be fair, isn't that the point of democracy in the first place? To let the citizens govern themselves?

And we already have those city-states. That's literally the point of local governments, county governments, and state governments. The citizens of those jurisdictions are allowed to govern themselves to a degree. and look at the HOA's in Florida (and probably elsewhere). They have a lot of power when it comes to city ordinances that affect their communities.

Why shouldn't other communities be allowed the same power?

So you're actually ADVOCATING for segregation?

Just making sure we're clear here.

I didn't say I was for or against it. So please don't make assumptions.

I said that's the point of democracy. And in a representative democracy, the citizens are supposed to have the right to pick who represents them. There are entire counties in America that have less than 5% ethnic minorities. Those citizens have to right to select white people as their leaders & law enforcement, right? And I'm not even talking about sundown towns, which still exist in the US.

EDIT: So to clarify, this only seems to be a problem when ethnic minorities form the majority in a municipality. There's never a problem when a majority of Protestants select a fellow Protestant as their leader, or when a white majority community selects a fellow white person as their leader. But if black people decide we want a black leader & black law enforcement, suddenly it becomes a problem.

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: Legman
a reply to: TonyS


While we are at it we should only allow Hispanics to police Hispanics and Muslims to police Muslims. Then perhaps in thirty years we can divide this country up into city states. I like it.

To be fair, isn't that the point of democracy in the first place? To let the citizens govern themselves?

And we already have those city-states. That's literally the point of local governments, county governments, and state governments. The citizens of those jurisdictions are allowed to govern themselves to a degree. and look at the HOA's in Florida (and probably elsewhere). They have a lot of power when it comes to city ordinances that affect their communities.

Why shouldn't other communities be allowed the same power?

So you're actually ADVOCATING for segregation?

Just making sure we're clear here.

I didn't say I was for or against it. So please don't make assumptions.

I said that's the point of democracy. And in a representative democracy, the citizens are supposed to have the right to pick who represents them. There are entire counties in America that have less than 5% ethnic minorities. Those citizens have to right to select white people as their leaders & law enforcement, right? And I'm not even talking about sundown towns, which still exist in the US.

EDIT: So to clarify, this only seems to be a problem when ethnic minorities form the majority in a municipality. There's never a problem when a majority of Protestants select a fellow Protestant as their leader, or when a white majority community selects a fellow white person as their leader. But if black people decide we want a black leader & black law enforcement, suddenly it becomes a problem.

I have no problem with majority ethnic communities electing persons of their own ethnicity to serve in public office, or hire them on as police officers. I'd LOVE to see more young black men join PDs across the country, majority black or not. The problem is that in many inner city communities, if you join the PD you're seen as a race traitor. That stigma needs to go away.

I thought you were advocating for like... Sharia zones, Protestant Zones, Black Zones, Hispanic Zones, etc.

My apologies.

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: Legman
a reply to: TonyS


While we are at it we should only allow Hispanics to police Hispanics and Muslims to police Muslims. Then perhaps in thirty years we can divide this country up into city states. I like it.

To be fair, isn't that the point of democracy in the first place? To let the citizens govern themselves?

And we already have those city-states. That's literally the point of local governments, county governments, and state governments. The citizens of those jurisdictions are allowed to govern themselves to a degree. and look at the HOA's in Florida (and probably elsewhere). They have a lot of power when it comes to city ordinances that affect their communities.

Why shouldn't other communities be allowed the same power?

So you're actually ADVOCATING for segregation?

Just making sure we're clear here.

I didn't say I was for or against it. So please don't make assumptions.

I said that's the point of democracy. And in a representative democracy, the citizens are supposed to have the right to pick who represents them. There are entire counties in America that have less than 5% ethnic minorities. Those citizens have to right to select white people as their leaders & law enforcement, right? And I'm not even talking about sundown towns, which still exist in the US.

EDIT: So to clarify, this only seems to be a problem when ethnic minorities form the majority in a municipality. There's never a problem when a majority of Protestants select a fellow Protestant as their leader, or when a white majority community selects a fellow white person as their leader. But if black people decide we want a black leader & black law enforcement, suddenly it becomes a problem.

I have no problem with majority ethnic communities electing persons of their own ethnicity to serve in public office, or hire them on as police officers. I'd LOVE to see more young black men join PDs across the country, majority black or not. The problem is that in many inner city communities, if you join the PD you're seen as a race traitor. That stigma needs to go away.

I thought you were advocating for like... Sharia zones, Protestant Zones, Black Zones, Hispanic Zones, etc.

My apologies.

No no, sorry if I gave that impression. I didn't mean it like that at all. I think the easiest way to end racism & bigotry is to have different groups live together. Then people can see that we're all human & that stereotypes are mostly BS. [I say "mostly" because I do love melons, though I prefer cantaloupe & honeydew varieties over watermelons. Then again, who doesn't like melons?]

I was just saying that the concept of democracy allows for it, so it's hard to stop it. And yeah, we do need all communities involved in our legal system. I think that's the only way people will be treated equally, since humankind has shown that it doesn't like treating "different" people equally.

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: Legman
a reply to: TonyS


While we are at it we should only allow Hispanics to police Hispanics and Muslims to police Muslims. Then perhaps in thirty years we can divide this country up into city states. I like it.

To be fair, isn't that the point of democracy in the first place? To let the citizens govern themselves?

And we already have those city-states. That's literally the point of local governments, county governments, and state governments. The citizens of those jurisdictions are allowed to govern themselves to a degree. and look at the HOA's in Florida (and probably elsewhere). They have a lot of power when it comes to city ordinances that affect their communities.

Why shouldn't other communities be allowed the same power?

So you're actually ADVOCATING for segregation?

Just making sure we're clear here.

I didn't say I was for or against it. So please don't make assumptions.

I said that's the point of democracy. And in a representative democracy, the citizens are supposed to have the right to pick who represents them. There are entire counties in America that have less than 5% ethnic minorities. Those citizens have to right to select white people as their leaders & law enforcement, right? And I'm not even talking about sundown towns, which still exist in the US.

EDIT: So to clarify, this only seems to be a problem when ethnic minorities form the majority in a municipality. There's never a problem when a majority of Protestants select a fellow Protestant as their leader, or when a white majority community selects a fellow white person as their leader. But if black people decide we want a black leader & black law enforcement, suddenly it becomes a problem.

I have no problem with majority ethnic communities electing persons of their own ethnicity to serve in public office, or hire them on as police officers. I'd LOVE to see more young black men join PDs across the country, majority black or not. The problem is that in many inner city communities, if you join the PD you're seen as a race traitor. That stigma needs to go away.

I thought you were advocating for like... Sharia zones, Protestant Zones, Black Zones, Hispanic Zones, etc.

My apologies.

No no, sorry if I gave that impression. I didn't mean it like that at all. I think the easiest way to end racism & bigotry is to have different groups live together. Then people can see that we're all human & that stereotypes are mostly BS. [I say "mostly" because I do love melons, though I prefer cantaloupe & honeydew varieties over watermelons. Then again, who doesn't like melons?]

I was just saying that the concept of democracy allows for it, so it's hard to stop it. And yeah, we do need all communities involved in our legal system. I think that's the only way people will be treated equally, since humankind has shown that it doesn't like treating "different" people equally.

It's alright, I understand stereotypes. I'm Native American, (One half, at least) and I used to be a chain smoker, though now I just use a vaporizer. I struggled with borderline alcoholism, though thankfully I stopped that before it got too bad. I'll still have a drink every now and then, but I truly understand moderation now.

So I fit two of the Native American stereotypes.

Then against, I'm also a brilliant IT gal living in Japan who collects manga, teaches english to Japanese professionals on the side, and can devour her body weight in Sushi. So... F**K stereotypes! Haha.

I'm just glad to see yet another issue that can and will divide us all further.

/sarcasm

a reply to: beezzer

The intentional division has long been at play, unfortunately.

The media plays stories like this 24/7 because it's what keeps people glued to the TV, and talking over the dinner table about it later. I think the race debate is one that deserves to happen, but not the way it's happening right now, with blame flying in every direction and nobody wanting to bring the communities TOGETHER for dialogue. Instead, the people who profit from unrest will continue to foment the issue until every dime possible has been squeezed from it.

Only then I think will actual dialogue and change occur. Until then, we (Read: You poor Americans) will have to ride this particular storm out.

a reply to: arjunanda

Yeah a criminal record disqualifies you for a lot of jobs. Thats just the way it works. No apology. Also, i dont think 'stop & frisk" was policy long enough to blame for the disproportionately high incidence of criminality amongst blacks.

originally posted by: damwel
Biggest bunch of racist crap I've ever heard. Is he trying to tell me there isn't a black person who hasn't been to jail. I know lots and lots of blacks and none of them have been to jail. What a tool.

He's not saying all blacks have criminal records. He's saying proportionately more blacks have criminal records than do other races. This, according to math, happens to be true. Math is not racist.

a reply to: enlightenedservant ok if we are counting wars and genocides lets talk about Africa. Lol what a joke, wars are not local community violence.