Ditch Thought and Start Being

a reply to: Itisnowagain


You did:

"Or is the 'world' made up of concepts appearing only in thought?"

The present is not a 'thing'

Then quit speaking about it as if it was.

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: Itisnowagain

You did:

"Or is the 'world' made up of concepts appearing only in thought?"

Thought is made of concepts. Words appear in stories but 'stories' is not a place is it?

a reply to: Itisnowagain

I thought the world, a place, was made of concepts. Now thoughts, not a place, is made of concepts, even though concepts can appear in it.

Very interesting.

My mind has been roiling with deep thoughts lately....but they all seem to be pointing me in the same direction...this jives with my inclinations.

Ugh...more navel noodling ahead. Or not?

a reply to: LesMisanthrope

Concepts are the constituents of thoughts.

plato.stanford.edu...

a reply to: cooperton

"Through the abandonment of desire the deathless state is realized" (Buddhism: Samyatta Nikaya xlvii 37)

Hence the story of Jesus being tempted in the desert, he transcends desire.

...or it could be showing all the secret to attainment. When one looks through a prism, the light changes colour depending on the "angle" one views it...

To desire is to admit one does not have what they seek. What you admit to being within the present can only be "reflected" back to you (pool of Bethesda). To seek is to never find. Just BE. To transcend desire is to see the harvest four months before it physically can be reaped...

Again, to desire is to suffer. It is unconsciously admitting that you do not have what you seek.

Whenever a desire pops into my consciousness, I view it as my inner consciousness showing me what is already done...

There are many rooms in thy father's mansion. Choose one.

Just Be.

m.youtube.com...

To sing out with an idren in song To introspect from humane reasons

After all is said and all is done Same I ah one Same world reaction to hate and to love Same I ah one

Mek dem si it when the lion have the fire up inna dub Seeking balance Same I ah one I and I a one!

There's a natural mystic in the earth, that's what they really don't know Spiritual uprising in di people with a burning glow Confidence in di victory over evil in this Armagiddion IT'S A COLD WORLD, BUT DI WHOLE WORLD HAFFI WITNESS AFRIKAN REDEMPTION!

After all is said and all is done Same I ah one Same world reaction to hate and to love Same I ah one Mek dem si it when the lion have the fire up inna dub Seeking balance Same I ah one I and I one!

This is a Haile salutation to the all the world nation FAILURE FI OVERSTAND SEEM ON DI BRINK OF DEVASTATION World need redemption - A sound mediation Medication, mediation Fi bring more balanced stands and rest in all di lands BEFORE NUCLEAR PRETENSE WAS NUCLEAR ASPIRATION Di root of the thought as a method of deterrence, but with adverse results, all to encourage all the strong AND THE POSITIVE AND THE NEGATIVE AND THE NEUTRAL MARCH ALONG AND THE ONE THREAD OF I-MANITY RUN THROUGH EVERYONE WORLD NEED SOME CONSCIENCE TO BE FAIR TO WOMAN JUST WATCH YUH FAMILY AND REGARD DEM AS ONE

Same I ah one Same I ah one Same I ah one -

Oppressing di poor - We caan tek it no more I am sure that unity will bring us back to di core Like before, when we were one, like di sea and di shore What is yours is not for me, I've got my own to adore Where's the love in the town? WHERE'S THE JOY INNA FROWN? You're a king, where's your crown? EVERY WORD CARRY SOUND

You waan fi si di world, watch how our nation play Likkle boy and girl, what diplomacy say Look how 70,000 gymnasts in asymmetrical say Blessing coming through dem working on their inity Like a drop inna di flow of di ocean sway We sway and - We stay as one Seeking balance Same I ah one I and I ah one

Think of everyting you hold inna sentimentality How your love and care dem inna yuh frequency Get together and provide fi our banquet-be MEK DEM AUSTERITY MEASURES FIND A LENIENCY As wi gather the mass a people inna di ghetto, plenty When dem find means of a measure with the aristocracy - As one We stay, as one

After all is said and all is done Same I ah one Same world reaction to hate and to love Same I ah one Mek dem si it when the lion have the fire up inna dub Seeking balance Same I ah one I and I one!

edit on 6-6-2015 by GoShredAK because: (no reason given)

edit on 6-6-2015 by GoShredAK because: Freakin retarded, how do I imbed YouTube videos?

a reply to: Involutionist

Just be...what? "Just be" used as a dictum is as meaningful as saying just breathe or just digest. It's not difficult to just be when we are always just being.

And no, desire is not even similiar to suffering.

a reply to: LesMisanthrope

Just be...what? "Just be" used as a dictum is as meaningful as saying just breathe or just digest. It's not difficult to just be when we are always just being.

Whenever a desire pops into my mind, I accept that as a wish already fulfilled. I give thanks (in my own way) and go about my business with the feeling that reflects this state.

To me, the phrase "state of being" is to be in the moment fully present to what is. Each moment is a different and NEW state of being. To 'just BE', is to be in a state where I fully surrender to the flow of energy without the mind filtering that flow in any way after I do so. In other words, if one is consciously aware of their thought process and state of being, then they are in a state of 'acting' instead of state of 'being'. Of course we move into a different state of being through the mind, but once we choose 'to be', we are no longer aware of being, we 'just be'.

This affects me along my journey in that the inner reflects the outer; unconsciously.

And no, desire is not even similiar to suffering.

It depends on the angle one views the prism...

I agree with you as well when I tilt my head. This is why I starred all your comments...

Context.

a reply to: Involutionist

It is an act of will to not think, and to do so is to not be, but to struggle against a condition of our being.

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: Involutionist

It is an act of will to not think, and to do so is to not be, but to struggle against a condition of our being.

If thought is not arising do you stop being aware of colour or sound?

a reply to: LesMisanthrope

Yes, I agree.

Again, if one is consciously aware of their thought process and state of being (at the same time), then they are in a state of 'acting' and NOT in a state of state of 'being'. The former is conscious and the latter is unconscious. It takes willpower to not think. To do so is 'acting'.

Yet, we are always in a state of Being regardless of what we choose to do or think. We exist (Being). Everything else is an abstraction. For instance I personally classify "State of Being" as such; thinking is a state of being characterized by thinking. Laughing can be a state of being. Play is a state of being such that in which we are engaged is not seen as important to our mind. We lose ourselves in the moment.

To "just be", is to be an state of being appropriate for the situation at hand, true to who and what we are without a conscious effort to be in that way of thinking and functioning. That is, we do it without the involvement of mind thinking to do it. To be is to be fully surrendered to the flow of energy without mind shifting or channelling that flow in any way.

Playing an instrument freely and becoming lost in the moment without following musical notes is a true state of Being. The mind is not dictating, yet it is part of the deal...

a reply to: Itisnowagain

If thought is not arising do you stop being aware of colour or sound?

Yes and No. It's thought that gives rise to identifying colour and sound. One can hear a sound without labelling it (with thoughts), but they cannot deny they heard a sound...

As an adult it takes will power and training to develop a mind of quiescence. Comes naturally to babies though... we just get into the habit of thinking about everything that, the natural quiescence slowly fades and thoughts dominate our experience. So much so, many people can't even listen beyond 7 words before a thought takes over and the message beyond those 7 words gets convoluted by a persons inner thought... mental processes can get so thick, it can turn into a disorder called adhd. They can get so focused on a particular subject, they can turn into anxiety and or paranoia disorders.

If all we are experiencing is the internal dialogue against external objects, then we can miss the true beauty experience because of the lack of balance, between thought and quiescence. When this happens and we are shifted more towards thought as an extreme of being, not only do mental disorders arise but our very concepts about reality become clouded and in chaos where few can agree on any concept.

What happens is when we turn to thought domination, we quit putting our minds in full on work that must be accomplished. It still gets done but the efficiency of on task takes a huge hit. We can then get stuck in indecision, procrastination, 2nd guessing, lack of direction, and floating along without a real sense of purpose... all because our mind isn't truly in balance.

The mental labeling the mind does is useful to the extent of learning the names of things in ones environment, in order to accurately describe something to another. The mental labeling does not explain directly what that something does, so the label is just a rote concept that makes the brain go... door knob? Oh yeah, that thing that you twist to open a door... the label is just a short cut that leaves the definition up to the listener.

Now considering every single word in every single language is like this? That's a lot of mental leaps and translations going on to accurately comprehend what someone is actually saying or trying to describe for a listener. So the best any one can do, is simplify and hope that the meaning they are trying to convey gets represented properly by their words... if they care about comprehension in the listener. Dogmatic terms are like exclusive clubhouse terms, and if there is no familiarity with these dogmatic specialized terms... then the listener will be lost on the subject matter one is trying to convey... in such an instance the listener will then form their own meaning... when this happens all comprehension is lost, and the speaker has wasted their breath.

Just for a moment think about how much this goes on in the world... millions of speakers jabbering on, and millions of listeners smiling and nodding without a clue to what the speaker is actually attempting to convey... but it's the best we've got without bringing the mind to a proper balance of thought and quiescence. It is very important in my opinion and experience that people make an attempt to bring back the mental quiescence so that the mind and individual regains balance.

Aside from the benefit of erasing mental neurosis of all sorts, there is a fundamental change in being. To the inexperienced mental quiescence, is about as useful as a full brain lobotomy. But the true difference in the two? The extreme of thought constantly chatting is something people chase... they follow the mind where ever it goes. On the surface this seems like no big deal... but experience knowing that the mind can be one's best friend or worst enemy? It takes on a much greater significance; many people get plagued with unwanted thoughts, some go so far as to denial of actual occurrences in order to quell the minds onslaught to remain mentally and emotionally stable.

That is one of the man reasons many religions are still in business... they sell peace of mind. Guilt? No need for that; just blame it on a non-corporal being instead. So now instead of actually pacifying the mind properly, it's allowed in the idea it's directly under the influence of a being not oneself at all times. If that sounds like madness... you are correct. The focus and quality of ones mind is up to the individual in possession of it. If people say some evil being is in possession of their mind or attempts possession of it, instead of them it becomes a rational excuse to other believers, removing the personal responsibility from that persons actions that gained intent from thought.

So we can see how all of this becomes dangerous business and fuels most of the words problems... first there's a general lack of focus that leads to all thought disorders, then there's the removal of personal responsibility of action based on these disordered thoughts, 3rd there's the wrench of cognitive dissonance... that will argue why all of that is acceptable.

The change that occurs when the balance of thought is restored along with quiescence, is the mind no longer grasps at pure logic alone... there is much logic that is irrational in nature; but it made sense at the time, if it wasn't a moral fault is the usual self defense in such circumstances. Quiescence brings rationality to logic into an inseparable union, logic can't arise without ration any longer... so everything irrational flies right out the window. The more one brings the mental scales back into balance between; thought chatter and mental quiescence, the less apt a person is to chase the mind where ever... eventually the mind wondering off going where ever it wants on whatever topic it wishes just stops.

When this stopping occurs, the whole internal realm changes with it... in the sense that a person starts placing the mind exactly on what and remaining exactly where the person wants it to be, until they place it somewhere else. This is the utmost in full mental development, the mind becomes not only your friend, but the best tool one could possibly own. The drives and motivations of others are lain bare in an instant and compassionate direct understanding arises; that no matter what one does there is a hope of some happiness or ease behind the action. Understanding situations in such a manner in an instant, is much better than misunderstanding them as being directly against you... indeed some things people do are directly against you... but it is in a hope for happiness of some sort, if you are human then you can empathize with the struggle, if they are a true friend or family member, you can understand they meant well. In short a lot just becomes impersonal water under the bridge.

As an example, one of my close friends of many years hated that he was forced to grow up in a cult like church environment... because of how out of step it put him among his peers, he and I had that in common as it is where we met as pre-teens. Immediately, it's apparent that his nor my parents meant any ill to come from their association on their children... it's also immediately obvious, that they thought it would be good for us. That it made a positive change to their life, and what parent doesn't want positive in their kids lives? Of course, the road to hell is said to be paved with good intentions... the road to hell being from those intents; were what actually occurred in many youth instead. His nor my parents had the foresight to see this, so how could they be faulted? They did the best they could at the time with what they knew.

(Cont next post)

(Cont. from last post)

Considering that is how most people operate in the world; chasing happiness and trying to share it when they think they've found it... often disregard the benefit it will bring to others, in a sort of self other blindness. This happens not only in parenting, but religion and politics as well. Seeing the framework beneath all the complications the world has comes from the ability for the mind to simply shut up about it, and actually see and experience it as it is.

Sure, the same thing can be accomplished with much study into a topic of logic or reason... or worked out with years of therapy, but understanding the nature of everything just being there in an instant, beyond all the words complicating or convolution of the subject is far superior in my experience.

We also learn that many many things are just better left unsaid, as silence can speak volumes that words cannot, inside and out.

As a thought is about to exit; there's a small glimpse of the quiescence, before the next thought has a chance to arise... grab onto that space and widen it with continuing practice... the mind takes time, to fully master. If mastering it is something you want to accomplish; for mental health, a content mind of ease and peace, an increase learning and understanding as well as many other benefits? Give it a shot. If you are someone unfortunately tortured by your mind, instead of it being your friend? Know this: You are not your thoughts, in any way shape or form. Thoughts are but a reflection of reality trying to make sense of reality through interpretation, instead of reality in and of itself. The ego can't tell the difference between the reflection of reality, and reality; but experience can. I sincerely, hope it is an experience more people can wake up too and develop, to not only benefit themselves but all others as well. Imagine all thought stemming from logic and rationality, rooted directly in reality in every situation the world over... in such a situation? Humanity will have mentally evolved, far beyond it's present condition.

Happy Saturday everyone.

Everything is a thought including Earth and humanity.

God thought the universe into existence (as some say, "Let there be Light!") and the Life of the universe keeps thinking and creating.

We are the children of Our Father in Heaven and The Child has the likeness of The Father. We are Creators/Mind thought up by the Original Mind/Creator (God/Heavenly Father).

Suffering is not caused by "thought" but by miscreation which is caused by negative thought.

Negative thoughts, beliefs, and perception leads to negative intention and action. Positive thoughts of unity, love, compassion, and all that comes from loving thy neighbour as thyself, will keep the negativity away so that The Kingdom of Heaven will be on Earth as in Heaven.

a reply to: cooperton

I have read Maharishi Yogi's The Science of Being and The Art of Living, It has absolutely nothing to do with The Bible, so I don't understand why you quoted it here. Transcendental Meditation is about expanding the human mind to it's unlimited cosmic potential. It's about self empowerment, not worshipping any God. Well......other than the Universe itself. ~$heopleNation

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: Itisnowagain

Thought isn't a place where concepts appear. I've never once experienced something called a present arising. I think you should discern what is actual, because none of what you are speaking about actually is.

You've thought about the concept of present arising; otherwise the post I have quoted is an impossibility in existence. It would be nice if itsnowagain layed the dogmatic terms down and explained the concept instead of the short hand. Present arising in that case is what is actually occurring, the discernment or thinking about what's occurring as you suggest with speaking, is the exact opposite of present arising, because it is contemplation about a phenomena that has already occurred and passed... the only place the phenomena that arose being discerned still exists; is in conscious memory, whether you understand it's meaning or not; via your will to continue contemplating it. Then you think something else; off it goes back into the nothingness from whence it came, until it arises again. If you are attached to it's arising, then it will steal your focus away from what is arising while you're distracted with it's contemplation yet again.

There's no error in any of that; but attaching to it or the desire to grasp after it and miss out on reality as it constantly manifests is the issue... simply because holding onto one puzzle piece trying to quantify where it's location belongs in your picture of quantification, causes you to miss the picture already existing... it's as if you pull out a piece of puzzle from one already completed to examine it and attempt to see if it fits into your own, which is simply just the ego in action... attaching to a conglomerate of these mental phenomena that are arising, is what gives one sense of self to defend and uphold... when none of it is truly the self, but a conceptual mental construct identified as a self.

a reply to: BigBrotherDarkness

Why must I attend to all "present arising" except for thought, discernment and words? It sounds like a part of reality you and itsnowagain are against and would gladly miss out on. This is the diminishing of faculties, not the strengthening of them. This is the silencing of "present arising".

The methodology is false. There is no arising occuring at all. It castrates more than it enhances. To me, it sounds ridiculous.

a reply to: Involutionist

detachment is not freedom anymore than anesthesia is an antibiotic.