The Fermi Paradox — Where Are All The Aliens?

Just caught this, and its something I and many many others believe. Life is everywhere in the cosmos/universe. Some of it has been and is continuing to visit us. We are being watched and studied. I think there is a TON of life as we know it, and alot of life as we don't know it. For example, some scientists all ready are thinking that there may be life on Titan already. We have no idea yet, if there is something, somethings swimming in its methane lakes and rivers. Indeed it looks more promising there is life in our solar systems moon, than its planets. We are going to find out soon as NASA and the European Space Agency is planning trips to Europa and maybe Enceladus another moon, that some scientists think may harbor life. Something to ponder...

originally posted by: data5091
Just caught this, and its something I and many many others believe. Life is everywhere in the cosmos/universe. Some of it has been and is continuing to visit us. We are being watched and studied. I think there is a TON of life as we know it, and alot of life as we don't know it. For example, some scientists all ready are thinking that there may be life on Tian already. WE have no idea yet, if there is something, somethings swimming in its methane lakes and rivers. Indeed it looks more promising there is life in our solar systems moon, than its planets. We are going to find out soon as NASA and the European Space Agency is planning trips to Europa and maybe Enceladus another moon, that some scientists think may harbor life. Something to ponder...

Well I'm assuming you mean titan. And yeah there may be life but nothing like we would recognize realize the entire planet is hydrocarbons. Basically need an organism that can live in gasoline. Don't think it would lead to higher life forms.

originally posted by: dragonridr

originally posted by: data5091
Just caught this, and its something I and many many others believe. Life is everywhere in the cosmos/universe. Some of it has been and is continuing to visit us. We are being watched and studied. I think there is a TON of life as we know it, and alot of life as we don't know it. For example, some scientists all ready are thinking that there may be life on Tian already. WE have no idea yet, if there is something, somethings swimming in its methane lakes and rivers. Indeed it looks more promising there is life in our solar systems moon, than its planets. We are going to find out soon as NASA and the European Space Agency is planning trips to Europa and maybe Enceladus another moon, that some scientists think may harbor life. Something to ponder...

Well I'm assuming you mean titan. And yeah there may be life but nothing like we would recognize realize the entire planet is hydrocarbons. Basically need an organism that can live in gasoline. Don't think it would lead to higher life forms.

You may be right, but we don't know that yet. I think anything is possible, we just do not know yet. IN time we may know more as we find more and more and more solar systems and exoplanets.

a reply to: dragonridr

"All the cool stuff happens in the center where you can travel to diffrent solar systems [with] easy [because] they are close."

Reminds me of the recent film "Jupiter Ascending."

PLOT: At the beginning of the story, Earth's residents are unaware that the human species on Earth and countless other planets were established by families of transhuman and alien royalty for the purpose of later "harvesting" the resulting organisms to produce a type of youth serum for the elites on still other planets.

If the woeful human race did run the core planets
this is exactly what we'd expect--endless war.

originally posted by: wasaka
If the woeful human race did run the core planets
this is exactly what we'd expect--endless war.

Please note that aliens in most of science fiction represent mere mirrors of us, humans.

I remember reading that Wells' motivation for 'War of the Worlds' was Imperials wars and colonization of Africa by industrial world. It is rare that aliens were viewed as positive fellas, and now even Stephen Hawkins warns of bad intention aliens.

Just imagine good intention aliens to come and offer their help to everyone... what would industrial world do with possibility to eliminate economic and industrial dependance of 3rd world countries...

Interesting concept. For some reason I haven't actually heard of it before - or, at least the terminology for what it represents.

I would have to agree with Bill Nye on this one. It's not as if we have been listening for a long time. Nor is our technology sophisticated enough that we may even be able to listen at all.

With our current advancements and the rate of which technology is continuing to advance, it wouldn't conceivable that we would have some sort of sign or discovery that would clarify if life can live elsewhere in the universe.

Personally, it just doesn't seem likely that NOTHING exists. The universe is simply too massive, and the formation of how we came to be is relatively simplistic for the same process not to happen outside of Earth.

Mankind has been around for just the blink of an eye in the existence our star. If there is intelligent life out there why would they want to contact us? we're nothing but pond scum to them. Also given our track record for wanting to kill everything is sight if there were greater life forms that could make contact why would they want to enlighten us? If they gave us the key to higher technology we'd probably use it to destroy the universe. I'm from Detroit people here aren't responsible enough to own a butter knife they'd just kill you with it.

Some very interesting and, dare I say, very insightful replies... Some fascinating ideas and thoughts.


In recent years, with deforestation of the Amazon jungle there has been increased with uncontacted or "lost" tribes. Typically they are spotted by a helicopter or airplane, the tribe watch in amazement and fear, then fire arrows at the flying contraption.

"Uncontacted" Tribe Seen in Amazon
The Last Untapped Civilization
First Film Footage of Remote Amazon Rainforest Tribe
(And so on.)

As modern people our first reaction is typically "Leave them alone!!!".
We respect them and in a way admire their innocence. We want them to remain untouched by modern life. Would they want flushing toilets, double ply toilet paper, microwave ovens, rocky road ice cream, roller coasters and silk underwear if they knew that's what they're missing out on? Shouldn't we be sharing the wonders of 3D movies and air conditioning with them?
I bet your response is "no"?

There are also scientific reasons why we can't just simply make contact with an isolated tribe. Such as the communication gaps and vulnerable immune systems. They could very easily die from something like the common cold or expose Westerners to a virus the tribe is immune to...?

What if we are the "lost" and "untouched" tribe? What if we are the simpletons shooting "bows and arrows" at the flying machines from outside our basic "mud huts"? An intelligent alien race may (as many have suggested already in the thread) very well be aware of our existence, but they don't want to upset our "basic" way of living and "innocence"...

Or a slightly angle. We expect them to be humanoid form or at least a recognizable solid state... This, I think was best illustrated by the well known short story They're made out of meat. It's a very short read, but gets the message across very well. Do yourself a favor.

Spoiler: It's basically aliens contemplating the idea of making contact with humans - but find it a bit weird because humans are meat...

Here's just a short snippet:

...
"Oh, there's a brain all right. It's just that the brain is made out of meat! That's what I've been trying to tell you."

"So ... what does the thinking?"

"You're not understanding, are you? You're refusing to deal with what I'm telling you. The brain does the thinking. The meat."

"Thinking meat! You're asking me to believe in thinking meat!"

"Yes, thinking meat! Conscious meat! Loving meat. Dreaming meat. The meat is the whole deal! Are you beginning to get the picture or do I have to start all over?"

"Omigod. You're serious then. They're made out of meat."
...

I won't spoil the ending, but the very last line of the story:

...
"And why not? Imagine how unbearably, how unutterably cold the Universe would be if one were all alone ..."

Read it here - By Terry Bisson

And then, my favorite, we may be nothing but ancient space poop. 3 million years after the actual intelligent beings flew past earth whilst looking for intelligent life...

There was a thread a while ago about the theory of the genesis of the universe ( XD ) being that everything appeared at the same time, not from the big bang, if I recall well...

If that is to be the case, then it would explain why we still haven't made contact or been contacted; simply because we all are about the same age and wouldn't have gotten the time to develop the technology needed to go everywhere and easily contact others.

OR... maybe we are the first race?

Tanks Gemwolf for the OP and the links of the two stories.

It's astonishing how man anthropomorphizes everything around him. A truly advanced species would have no use for physical reality, FTL travel would be a joke to the quantum rangers where time and space as we understand it would seem like the playthings of fools or children.

The way to contact the others isn't thru primitive radio styled communications but by way of something much more esoteric, perhaps even closer to paranormal/religious means or the substances that are forbidden to even discuss on ATS.

www.organiclab.narod.ru...'___'-The-spirit-molecule.pdf

www.world-of-lucid-dreaming.com...

The reality we perceive is just a minuscule fraction of the cosmos.

Well, the little alien bugs out there are not going to find us, and we're going to have a really hard time finding them. On the other end of the spectrum, if there are aliens out there so far in advance of us that we are like bugs to them, then does it really even matter if they exist?

I keep going back to the question, "If something exists that we cannot detect and don't have the ability to comprehend, does it really exist?" A real giant brain planet a billion light years away is not really any different than a fictional giant brain planet a billion light years away.

originally posted by: olaru12
It's astonishing how man anthropomorphizes everything around him.

Yeah, but it's all we know. Our reality will always be a kind of reflection of our perceptions. How can we think different?

The reality we perceive is just a minuscule fraction of the cosmos.

But if we can't perceive it, is it really real or just speculation? Somewhere in the distance there is a massive galaxy we will never see or detect. Or is there?

Fermi paradox? Well here's another Fermi quotation: "What is not statistically impossible is compulsory".

a reply to: HUMBLEONE

“Culture is the effort to hold back the mystery, and replace it with a mythology.”
– Terence McKenna

Visitors would quarantine us in a heartbeat. Advanced technology might well make unimaginable power available to virtually anyone. Our 2nd amendment yahoos could easily be trusted with a nuclear weapon, now couldn't they. We have had to develop very elaborate ceremonies to limit the number with access to real destructive force, and filter them trough a number of different sieves (democratic elections, communist party closed room struggles, hard nosed dictators who, above all else, have to be practical in dominating their foes.) We now are seeing the first "loose cannons" (Kim Jong Il) emerge who might well drink a six pack and shoot off a magazine. Imagine if a truly exponential increase in the power available to ANYONE were made available. Would YOU give monkeys Gatling guns to fool around with? If an interstellar race or community existed do you really think they would announce themselves, and share their knowledge? Would YOU let humans loose on a peaceful society? Solving the problem of peace in ALL OF US is the ticket for entry. So, for now, fuggeddaboudit.

a reply to: Indigent

Interesting post. I would like to point out that we are looking at this from the perspective of current technological capabilities when we should be theorizing using the law of accelerating returns. Our technology is evolving at an exponential rate rather than a linear trajectory. I recommend reading some of Ray Kursweil's work, perhaps "The Singularity is Near".

Why doesn't some rich person from America go visit Africa or the Middle east without a body guard and have the latest technologies an weaponry?

Why doesn't an educated black man visit the KKK who suffered years of incestry go to the HQ and say "I bring gifts"?
O wait, he wouldn't be educated.

a reply to: Blue Shift

@Blue Shift Your raise interesting questions. I would respond to your question about how can we think differently. Keeping it in context with your discussion I would say that while most people do explain the inexplicable using common themes and ideas that are native to us, there are people out there who are able to put aside our ancestral biases and dream big so to speak. They are able to develop ideas that are based on unknown physical limits and new technologies. Think about Tesla or some of the other visionaries who lived before their time.

Most of the planets in our timeline are unoccupied right now(the exception is Sirius C, but they're neutral.) They will become occupied only after we colonized other planets and become them essentially. E.Ts also do not communicate by radio or "conventional methods." They communicate telepathically. Read this thread to see how they communicate(copy the link after typing in godlikeproductions.com):

/forum1/message791837/pg1

The name of this poster is AlcyoneofMars. Read and listen to all posts by this poster, she speaks the truth,
I've explained everything about her here:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

If you wonder how she is able to communicate with us through the Internet, well first, since she's already on Earth and off her ship, it's probably different. Second, by the way she posts, it's difficult to say if E.Ts mean just the Greys, or her and other races also.

I’ve posted this elsewhere but will do so again for this thread’s benefit. This is indeed a fascinating discussion – thank you, Gem, for adding your insights and giving me and others different perspectives to ponder.

Good 'ole Enrico had a point, and a strong opinion -but there are indeed other ways of considering his conundrum.

Like some of you here, I’ve done extensive research on this topic of extraterrestrial life, and while I personally believe in it, I admit we have no (public) empirical evidence of their existence. Nevertheless, I believe some of the logic presented can be used to validate a premise of quantifiable existence.

I agree that some of Drake/Sagan assumptions for variables in their equation are perhaps a bit optimistic, superfluous even. In circumspect, there are alternative ways to think and logically, mathematically, reach a similar conclusion.

I implore everyone here (esp. the OP) to pick up a copy of the following book and read it. You’ll find yourself amazed and quoting from it often. This is a great addition to any library for those interested in this subject. The author does not rely on Drake’s equation, yet clearly lays out in lay terms an unambiguous, irrefutable case for it to be impossible that our planet alone harbors life in the universe.

Almost no hard math and no complex equations will distract you from the treatise and it is an enjoyable, captivating quick reading. You’ll have no trouble finishing the paperback in a few sessions. The basis for the author’s study is heavily grounded in mathematics, however, particularly the probability laws, such as the:
*Union of collection of independent events
*Sequential probability paradigm
*Information inspection paradox
*Panspermia hypothesis
*Increasing entropy in thermodynamics
*Chaotic probability distributions in deterministic and random systems

For those unfamiliar with these terms, don’t let them intimidate you – the book is very easy to grasp…

Probability 1, by Amir D. Aczel, Harcourt, Inc., ISBN: 0-15-601080-1 (pbk.)



This is a fun, entertaining read and may even alter your thinking a bit. There are a bunch of used copies available at Amazon - often less than one dollar. See – now there’s no excuse not to read it!

You can get it here, right now (used from only $0.01!):
Probability 1.

Probability 1 should be a part of every library. I’ve shared it with many skeptics and believers alike. The result is always similar: “Wow – I had no idea it was so obvious…”

Intriguing Thread -thanks - and keep looking up!

Spend ONE lousy Penny - and get this book. Then let us know what the "likelihood" may be...

'They' may not be 'Here', but that doesn't mean they are not out 'There'...