Current/former "preachers" of any faith: what is/was your training?

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

I think it wasw very similar. Church was held on saturdays as well.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

If I want information on your experience in Wiccan and the people you have meet there? How specific information are you sharing about you and the people you have meet?

Like for instance if you have met any high level empaths? If you or your group have astral projected? What kind of physical manifestation in the body different tools/behaviors/ritual give you?

To be totally open: I am myself not an empath but know 2 empaths so I think I have understood the ability they have as well as I can logically without having the ability myself. I do not astral project but vibrate very much when I try instead.

I am one of those souls who see spiritual practice in a scientific way. If you know how everything fits together on all levels then you understand how everything works and even how to be the most effective. . Seek understanding and you will gain understanding.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: grandmakdw

Ma'am, I am not "Christophobic" -
I just am curious to know what official training religious leaders have. Leaders of ANY religion. Some of them require no training at all. Some of them go to Divinity school, or Seminary, or whatever 'training'. Some of them don't.

May I please just have a thread that enables discussion of the various methods of teaching religious leaders?

"Love your neighbor as yourself" should be the guiding principal of all Christians.

Yep, and if you followed my posts you'd see that that is exactly what I believe:
The Golden Rule.

But, the fact is that preachers are trained somehow, and I'm genuinely interested in hearing about their educations.

Thanks for providing the info that you did. Was his training different from other ministers that you know?

His training (an undergraduate degree from an accredited University or College, plus a 90+ hour Masters Degree) is very similar to the training given most mainline denominations. For example: Methodist/Lutheran/Episcopal/Presbyterian/Assembly of God/Evangelical Covenant/Catholic/some Baptist denominations (there are many different kinds of Baptist).

Although a separate, second Masters degree is unusual. Normally the second degree is a PhD

Churches that are not affiliated with denominations often have ministers with no training at all. Sometimes Bible College, sometimes no college degree at all. A very few denominations do not have formally trained ministers; Mormon, sometimes Church of Christ, some Baptist. If a church is not affiliated with a denomination then you have to check with the minister. Some even didn't finish high school. This is unfortunate but only the established denominations require a Masters Degree and normally a year or two of on the job training. Non-affiliated churches can have someone who just announces one day, "i"m a preacher". That is normally where the loonies come from, the "pastors" who preach unlovely and unloving things.

Try going online to search for requirements for ordination and then name the denomination and you should be able to find this out.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: grandmakdw

That the main thing he was taught is something that you make fun of normally, a deep abiding faith in Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. "Love your neighbor as yourself" should be the guiding principal of all Christians. That the Jewish faith should be honored as Jesus was Jewish.

Make "fun" of? No, grandma, I think that a "deep abiding faith in Jesus Christ" is unnecessary......the Golden Rule has been around for FAR LONGER than 2000 years.

And the Jewish people don't (as far as I know) think Jesus was "Lord and Savior". So - I'm confused.
I wish you'd give me more info, but, I guess not.

I think NONE of this is "funny", though.

I knew you only asked in order to ridicule.

In order to be a minister in a Christian church, the only universal requirement is a "deep abiding faith in Jesus Christ", it is absolutely necessary and the core requirement of all Christian churches. Although in some independent churches there are charlatans who are in it for the money, (which is normally so bad I don't know why they'd do it for the money), or in it for strange personal reasons unrelated to faith; the churches who have a "preacher" with no training have this.

As for the Jewish people, I was saying my husband was taught to deeply respect the Jewish faith. A Jewish seminary near my husbands seminary helped teach him in Old Testament. His school and the Rabbinic school had a very good relationship. My husbands Old Testament professors also sometimes taught at the Rabbinic school.

If you weren't so intent on ridicule, you would have read my post carefully enough to see I said they had a good relationship.

If you want to know requirements to lead a church,it is so easy to find on the internet it is ridiculous. If you can't find the information, then the answer is, no requirement.

originally posted by: LittleByLittle
a reply to: BuzzyWigs

If I want information on your experience in Wiccan and the people you have meet there? How specific information are you sharing about you and the people you have meet?

Like for instance if you have met any high level empaths? If you or your group have astral projected? What kind of physical manifestation in the body different tools/behaviors/ritual give you?

To be totally open: I am myself not an empath but know 2 empaths so I think I have understood the ability they have as well as I can logically without having the ability myself. I do not astral project but vibrate very much when I try instead.

I am one of those souls who see spiritual practice in a scientific way. If you know how everything fits together on all levels then you understand how everything works and even how to be the most effective.

. Seek understanding and you will gain understanding.

I'll tell you my experience with Wiccan's. The local high priestess daughter found out my daughter was a Christian ministers daughter. One day my daughter was in the cafeteria eating lunch with hundreds of other kids (so there were many witnesses to what happened). The Wiccan girl came up to my daughter, called her out and started beating her, my daughter curled up in a ball and the wiccan girl broke her hand in the beating. The wiccan girl was suspended. The priestess was furious my daughter wasn't suspended because all kids involved in fights were supposed to be suspended and she hounded the principal. But since my daughter was just minding her own business and curled up in a ball and did not hit back, the principal said she wasn't fighting. The wiccans then went out of their way to make problems with my family because they felt the Christian's got special treatment and the wiccan girl was unfairly treated.

Now, how do I feel about Wiccans. Well, I have to admit that clouded my thinking. But in general if someone wants to be a Wiccan, it is not my business. I won't ridicule them or put them down. I don't want to associate with them, but that is because of my personal event. I won't preach to them and I want them to leave me alone and we'll be just fine and dandy. Live and let live, on both sides.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: grandmakdw

So, can you at least share with us whether or not he studied other religions while he was there?

Yes, Judaism of course.

Yes, he had a course in comparative religion.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: infolurker

Not exactly. It's a "let's find out how preachers get groomed" request. It is directed at EVERY preacher - Muslim, Buddhist, Christian, Jewish, Jehovah's Witness, Mormon, Hindu, etc. I'm genuinely interested in learning how one would go about becoming a "leader" in any religion, and sect of any religion, etc.

But, oh well. Already - the Christian fanatics are attacking (assuming) that I am attacking. I asked a question. Should a person not be allowed to find out where teachers got their training/education?
And what their classes (if any) were about?

Of course, with your history on ATS of slamming Christians and ridiculing Christians, we would be quite suspect of your reason for the thread. Even referring to me as a Christian fanatic is condescending and rude. For a Christian fanatic, I sure spent a lot of years teaching at major state Universities, you know I wasn't allowed to even whisper any religious word or thought in the classroom, that's how fanatic I am.

If you want to know where mainline denominations get their ministers trained it is on online with only minimal searching. Course content is even online for the majority of seminaries. There had to be an ulterior inner motive for you to start this thread, because you really enjoy putting down people of faith on ATS, it is one of your regular past times.

In here theology studies are of all religions, not just Christianity in universities of theology.

University of Helsinki homepage

The study of religions has been a major subject of the Faculty of Theology at the University of Helsinki since 1970. It has also been a major subject of the Faculty of Arts since 1971. This places the Department in unique position between two faculties.

The purpose of the Department’s teaching in general is to foster interest in the religious dimensions of societies and peoples in the World. Religion commonly encapsulates people’s values and ideas, sets forward their role models and is integrally related to a sense of identity for many. The study of religion is therefore concerned with the inspiration (for good or ill) of peoples’ culture, history and beliefs concerning ultimate issues.

The scholarly study of religions requires all the academic (and transferable) skills of amassing, ordering and critically assessing materials relevant to a specific issue, where appropriate in the original or other relevant languages; developing powers of reasoned analysis, exercising independent thought and communicating effectively in both literary and oral form.

The department is deeply committed to the study of religions both in ancient cultures and classical literature, as well as in modern society. This department makes no religious assumptions; staff and students come from different religions or from none.

It is impossible to understand any culture without studying its religion. In studying religions one is studying how people reflect on and react to what they consider to be of ultimate significance.

Not only Universities have this approach, also middle schools and highschools teach all main religions neutral way without spicing up with one religious view.

a reply to: grandmakdw

Scary experience. If she believes in the Rule of Three then the backlash would be 3 times what she gives out (3 fold karma return/debt repay). Not a wise action.

BuzzyWigs do you believe in three fold karma return on what you give out if negative?

a reply to: LittleByLittle

If I want information on your experience in Wiccan and the people you have meet there? How specific information are you sharing about you and the people you have meet?

Ask me anything, and I will share it.

a reply to: LittleByLittle

BuzzyWigs do you believe in three fold karma return on what you give out if negative?

Yes.
But "negative" is a subjective term. I don't think advocating for children is a "negative."

a reply to: dollukka

FABULOUS. You are in Scandinavia (or thereabouts) right? Ah, edit: Finland. My father's heritage is half Finn. Koskinen.
I think you all are an excellent example for the whole world.

a reply to: grandmakdw

I'll tell you my experience with Wiccan's. The local high priestess daughter found out my daughter was a Christian ministers daughter. One day my daughter was in the cafeteria eating lunch with hundreds of other kids (so there were many witnesses to what happened). The Wiccan girl came up to my daughter, called her out and started beating her, my daughter curled up in a ball and the wiccan girl broke her hand in the beating.

Wow! Yeah, that's not what I learned or was taught.

Sad, and aberrant.

The wiccans I was familiar with spend their time working towards healing, helping, and kindness.
Sorry you had such a bad experience.
So - you're "Wiccaphobic" then?

a reply to: grandmakdw

Churches that are not affiliated with denominations often have ministers with no training at all. Sometimes Bible College, sometimes no college degree at all. A very few denominations do not have formally trained ministers; Mormon, sometimes Church of Christ, some Baptist. If a church is not affiliated with a denomination then you have to check with the minister. Some even didn't finish high school. This is unfortunate but only the established denominations require a Masters Degree and normally a year or two of on the job training. Non-affiliated churches can have someone who just announces one day, "i"m a preacher". That is normally where the loonies come from, the "pastors" who preach unlovely and unloving things.

BINGO!

Exactly right.
Some don't even finish High School. Some get advanced degrees in their field.
I'm trying to learn how to tell them apart.
The ones who are professionally and ethically trained, versus those who just wake up one day and announce they are "a preacher."

What do you think of this phenomenon? Is it "okay"? Or is it not?

a reply to: LittleByLittle

To be totally open: I am myself not an empath but know 2 empaths so I think I have understood the ability they have as well as I can logically without having the ability myself.

I myself am an empath.
But of course, I'll be ridiculed for claiming that.
Oh well!

a reply to: grandmakdw

I knew you only asked in order to ridicule.

Wait.

WHAT? How is my post there "ridiculing"??

Yikes.
I spent this morning looking into what is "required" for various faiths, and thought I would ask ATS members about their own training/education.
HOW is that RIDICULE?

(I guess you were offended by the word "fanatics": You are a fan of Christianity, right? Sorry, I should have said "adherents" or something else. I did read your posts, and again, thank you for participating.)

a reply to: grandmakdw

Yes, Judaism of course.

Yes, he had a course in comparative religion.

Awesome.
I'm very glad to know that.

a reply to: grandmakdw

Churches that are not affiliated with denominations often have ministers with no training at all. Sometimes Bible College, sometimes no college degree at all. A very few denominations do not have formally trained ministers; Mormon, sometimes Church of Christ, some Baptist. If a church is not affiliated with a denomination then you have to check with the minister. Some even didn't finish high school. This is unfortunate but only the established denominations require a Masters Degree and normally a year or two of on the job training. Non-affiliated churches can have someone who just announces one day, "i"m a preacher". That is normally where the loonies come from, the "pastors" who preach unlovely and unloving things.

This is one area I'll agree with you on. I wasn't a pastor, but I did preach and teach. I was fortunate enough as an elder to have a very sharp pastor(degreed) who scrutinized every word that came from the pulpit, and shared pointers and advice with me. I remember thinking back then, with some of the mistakes I made, that I wasn't ready in the beginning, and I probably shouldn't have been allowed to preach to a congregation til I was. Fortunately, I didn't make any big mistakes, and I was well studied by that time. But I think some formal schooling wouldn't have hurt by any means.

a reply to: Klassified

I was fortunate enough as an elder to have a very sharp pastor(degreed) who scrutinized every word that came from the pulpit, and shared pointers and advice with me. I remember thinking back then, with some of the mistakes I made, that I wasn't ready in the beginning, and I probably shouldn't have been allowed to preach to a congregation til I was. Fortunately, I didn't make any big mistakes, and I was well studied by that time. But I think some formal schooling wouldn't have hurt by any means.

Thanks so much for contributing, Klassified. I'd hoped you would.
So, do you mind if I ask where your adviser was schooled? Did he talk about religious training?? I'm quite happy to hear that he was helping you out.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Yes.
But "negative" is a subjective term. I don't think advocating for children is a "negative."

I want to clarify this.

I believe in the 3-fold karmic payback, whether the deeds are positive OR negative...it will come back on the practitioner 3 times stronger.

I DO NOT believe that the "Wiccan" that grandma describes was in the right. That Wiccan was wrong, and I believe that the fruits of her abusive behavior toward a daughter of a minister will eventually revisit that so-called Wiccan by a factor of 3. Three times stronger than the misery and fear and abuse and pain that she inflicted. I DO believe that questioning ANY religion is fair, and not 'negative', even if some people take it that way.

I'm truly sorry that so many ATS Christians are reluctant to talk to me. I have only myself to blame, for speaking my mind.
But, all I can say is that as I continue here on ATS in these forums, I learn more and more, every day....and this thread - the OP - is not something I posted as "bait" so I could troll people.

Like I already said, I've read so much negative stuff about the Mental Health Profession on here that I've reconsidered my own position. Is it that impossible for people of faith to reconsider theirs?


So, guys and gals, friends and foes - if I have caused you pain, I expect to suffer that same pain myself (and in fact, do).....and yes, I admit that I 'ridicule' certain ideological/theological dogmas. I do it on purpose. The thing I'm hoping for is that everyone try to honestly examine their belief systems and beliefs, and think critically about them.

Have I been "hurt" by disrespect of the Mental Health profession? Yep. But that is because of my own defensiveness. When I open my mind, I am able to see the other side of the debate. I would only hope that people of spiritual-teaching persuasions would be willing to do that as well.

But, oh well. Guess I'll go straight to hell...right?