Misunderstood Sleep Paralysis And Astral Projection

a reply to: booyakasha

i've also read a lot about pythagorean hylozoics and it deeply resonates with me. Kenny b, that was a very good summary of the subject. Thanks for that.
It seems people really hate when pythagorean hylozoics is mentioned. There were some threads about the subject a couple years ago but they were always closed for discussion after some time.

Hi booyakasha

I remember that, there was a member called initiate, who came over a bit strong at times. What he was relating was most definitely hylozoics and claimed to be an initiate of a master being. An initiate would never reveal that fact ever, and he lived his online experience through his lower emotional envelope much of the time, and allowed himself to become reactive. That was what caused him to be banned I believe.

It is easy to become frustrated with cynical people when you believe something through spiritual awareness. Since I discovered hylozoics I feel as though I have found the truth and so I will continue along that path. My causal awareness is expanding, but who knows how long that takes to mature or how easy it will be to re-discover it during my next incarnation.

a reply to: mysterioustranger

I really like your "vibe" and what you have to share. You make me smile.

With Astral Travel, I am a single soul who will help, advise, refer, explain anything asked or needed placed before me or addressed at me.Trying to explain that is not so much understood by a huge majority of readers here.

You would be surprised who is silently reading along who might find a spark in one sentence that sends them down a rabbit hole that in turn provides them tangible experiences if pursued. Spread your seed and let the wind carry it wherever it chooses.

Unfortunately, most of the insight either ends up in someone's blog post, coaching package, or in a book to be sold as if it came from their own personal experiences or simply dismissed. It still does not matter. Sow that seed anyway.

There is a thin veil between this world and the next…our dimension and others parallel to our own. That veil is becoming thinner each day. Someday soon perhaps, society will be able to experience that which I and other travelers know to be true.

The imagination is that doorway to other dimensions. It is the veil. Depending on how one understands the faculty of imagination will determine how soon they can experience many things falsely thought of as only fantasy and/or needing practice. More importantly they will discover more practical uses for here and now that goes beyond astral projection experiences.

All is a projection of mind and imagination is that doorway.

Astral projection (as been shown to me by "energy"): Aspects of your consciousness remain embedded within the physical body while "another part" of the consciousness pushes outward. There is a lower aspect of consciousness that consist of energy, which holds certain physical and functional traits. Energy from the Universal Energy Field (humour me!) "joins" this lower aspect of consciousness in order to project "part of the consciousness away from the body". As it expands due to "the energy input", it is able to stretch out towards its intended destination, which in reality, is really not a destination at all, but simply an expanded scope of perception that remains encased within the mental and emotional aura field. Mindscape.

Here is an easy way to conceptualize the above: Becoming lost in a vision (such as a past memory) is a projection of mind that appears as if we travelled due to being immersed in that vision of past. When consciousness allows for that experience to be wholly sensed with all our body; the experience becomes surreal to the point we find ourselves physically experiencing it as a distant location. Astral projection works something like that.

Those guides and such many speak about are simply archetypes of themselves. It's just self being a playmate with self. Astral projection is akin to dreaming up a world and experiencing it objectively. There is no travel at all. No destination to be reached.

All is mind.

When you dream at night, although all the people and places (including distance) seem three dimensional and separate, it is all being projected by your mind. You didn't go anywhere, the people are all simulations of your mind, and the space between objects is an illusion, but the mind projects as if that were not so.

Again, cultivating the imagination can be done by all. Something to contemplate:

en.wikipedia.org...

Bless

originally posted by: Involutionist
When you dream at night, although all the people and places (including distance) seem three dimensional and separate, it is all being projected by your mind. You didn't go anywhere, the people are all simulations of your mind, and the space between objects is an illusion, but the mind projects as if that were not so.

How is waking reality different?

a reply to: daskakik

It isn't...

en.wikipedia.org...

a reply to: Involutionist
Wouldn't this mean that everyone I run into in this dream is just a simulation so, it would make no difference how I treat any of them?

In short, FTW because it ain't real anyway.

Where is the body when you say:

Energy from the Universal Energy Field (humour me!) "joins" this lower aspect of consciousness in order to project "part of the consciousness away from the body".

What and where is the mind which is causing all these projections?

Btw, in gonna look into Laurency and this pythagorean hylozoics

a reply to: daskakik

Wouldn't this mean that everyone I run into in this dream is just a simulation so, it would make no difference how I treat any of them?

Are you asking me how you should go about living your life and engaging with others? Are you asking me to calibrate your moral compass for you? Are you seeking an excuse to display a lack of integrity?

Here, I will answer your question in two parts:

Wouldn't this mean that everyone I run into in this dream is just a simulation...?

I would look at All as one and One as all.

so, it would make no difference how I treat any of them?

Do unto others as one would want done unto them. As far as differences go: Go ahead a blow another man's brains out; NOTHING will happen to you or your "spirit" when you pass on.

However, committing such a horrendous act while incarnated here will land you in jail for life. That certainly makes a difference, does it not? It sure does effect the currency and flow of life being locked in a cell...

Where is the body when you say:

Energy from the Universal Energy Field (humour me!) "joins" this lower aspect of consciousness in order to project "part of the consciousness away from the body".

What and where is the mind which is causing all these projections?

I carry the entire world on top my shoulders...my point of awareness flows from my mind which is atop my...body.

Again: it is called Astral projection. Not "astral travel". The word travel is an abstraction. It causes confusion.

originally posted by: Involutionist
Are you asking me how you should go about living your life and engaging with others? Are you asking me to calibrate your moral compass for you? Are you seeking an excuse to display a lack of integrity?

I'm pointing out an observation in your logic.

I would look at All as one and One as all.

I had a feeling that was going to be the jist of the answer. That doesn't really answer anything.

Do unto others as one would want done unto them. As far as differences go: Go ahead a blow another man's brains out; NOTHING will happen to you or your "spirit" when you pass on.

However, committing such a horrendous act while incarnated here will land you in jail for life. That certainly makes a difference, does it not? It sure does effect the currency and flow of life being locked in a cell...

So as long as I can get away with it, its cool.

ETA: There are no others, according to the claim I was originally asking about.

I carry the entire world on top my shoulders...my point of awareness flows from my mind which is atop my...body.

Again: it is called Astral projection. Not "astral travel". The word travel is an abstraction. It causes confusion.

Again another non-answer.

Some do call it astral travel which just shows that the symantics angle really doesn't mean much.

a reply to: daskakik

I'm pointing out an observation in your logic.

There is NO logic in what I have stated...we are speaking about the metaphysical here. Please keep that in mind.

I had a feeling that was going to be the jist of the answer. That doesn't really answer anything.

I agree. I'm sure you will find the answer you seek in a book or online like most new agers.

Some do call it astral travel which just shows that the symantics angle really doesn't mean much.

It makes a huge difference to the ignorant. For instance; the OP is speaking about lucid dreaming and confusing it with astral projection. Another member confused that with remote viewing. You in turn, actually implied by asking where the body was, that physical travel was involved. So, of course, it does indeed cause an abstraction of thoughts. Just read through this thread...

There are no others, according to the claim I was originally asking about.

In my earlier post (one of them) I made reference to archetypes of Self. The all is one is one is all is the same thing. I agree, there are no others in conceptual metaphysical meaning of the word, but a simple look around at your family, friends, and co-workers will show that is not exactly true in the physical sense. This in turn:

...just shows that the semantics angle of "no others" really doesn't mean much when you contemplate the fact you and your parents are three autonomous beings which means you do not control their actions or dictate their will.

Again another non-answer.

It was an answer. Just not to your liking. Most new agers resent me. I would be quite surprised if the opposite were true. I didn't ask for my experiences others so desperately seek to have or read up about. Perhaps, that is what is preventing them from those experiences...? The arrogance of intellectualizing of these matters and attempting to define what the experience entails creates a wall that prevents them from actually experiencing what they seek.

You know what happens to those people?

They spend their lives philosophizing about it on social media. Again:

en.wikipedia.org...

I'm actually attempting to help you in this and my last post. However, your energy and attitude of mind is off putting.

I think I might go back to head hunting bigots in the other forums. This is getting boring.

What do you want to know about astral projection from my personal experiences that you want to compare with what you have and will read?

Go on...shoot.

originally posted by: Involutionist
There is NO logic in what I have stated...we are speaking about the metaphysical here. Please keep that in mind.

I asked about this reality.

I agree. I'm sure you will find the answer you seek in a book or online like most new agers.

Actually that is one of their stock answers.

It makes a huge difference to the ignorant. For instance; the OP is speaking about lucid dreaming and confusing it with astral projection. Another member confused that with remote viewing.

I did read through the thread. I understand what the OP is saying and I don't see how you came to the conclusion that they are confusing anything.

You in turn, actually implied by asking where the body was, that physical travel was involved. So, of course, it does indeed cause an abstraction of thoughts. Just read through this thread...

You said "project "part of the consciousness away from the body". " and I asked that you clear up what you mean by body.

ETA: This, of course, based on your earlier premise that this reality is just like dreams and everyone but the dreamer is a simulation.

In my earlier post (one of them) I made reference to archetypes of Self.

That wasn't the part I was asking about. You said that people who appear in our dreams don't exists. I asked how we could be sure this reality isn't the same (everyone else but the dreamer of this dream) isn't real.

You said it was the same so, despite what I and my parents appear to be, everyone else here, except the dreamer, isn't real?

It was an answer. Just not to your liking. Most new agers resent me.

Don't see why, you sound just like one of them.

I'm actually attempting to help you in this and my last post. However, your energy and attitude of mind is off putting.

I never asked for your help. I'm talking to you as an equal that has reached a different conclusion.

a reply to: kennyb72

Hi my friend, just saw your post to me now, sorry for not responding sooner. Thank you for taking the time and energy to communicate your thoughts. Your vibe is cool. I will respond more later, just stepping out for a bite to eat.

Hi involutionist, like your handle by the way!.

Thank you kindly! I have a feeling you're knowledgeable to what it implies. Actually, the name kind of ties into this topic as well and can act as a signpost.

As an example, the so-called descent of the Monad into matter means an involution or involving or infolding of spiritual potencies into material vehicles which coincidentally and contemporaneously, through the compelling urge of the infolding energies, unfold their own latent capacities, unwrap them, roll them forth; and this is the evolution of matter. – Gottfried de Purucker

Kind of like a macrocosm (process of mind) of astral projection of sorts except in reverse...

en.wikipedia.org...(esoterism)

I have never heard of "Pythagorean Hylozoics" but it sounds interesting based on what you shared in your previous post. I will go down that rabbit hole. Thank you for bringing that to my awareness.

Personally speaking, getting the stuffing knocked out of me daily as a child can open gateways of the mind usually not entered due to external distractions. Some of us attempt to escape the objective world only to discover something beautiful and just as real as physicality within the workings of mind.

There is not one thing "you" have experienced that has taken place outside of your mind. That may sound trivial, but deep down when understood at its core, will "unveil" much more.

Much respect.

a reply to: Involutionist

Personally speaking, getting the stuffing knocked out of me daily as a child can open gateways of the mind usually not entered due to external distractions. Some of us attempt to escape the objective world only to discover something beautiful and just as real as physicality within the workings of mind.

I am really sorry to hear that you where a victim of child abuse. I can’t even start to imagine what that would be like at least in my present life.

As a person sensitive to reality, you will be aware of the Law of Reaping and Sowing. Your experience could be a result of sowing from a previous life or the sowing by another human being, which will be returned as an unpleasant experience in the future, during this lifetime or the next. There are always profound lessons learned by both victim and perpetrator.

Over the course of tens of thousands of lives, we get to experience everything it means to be a human being both as man and woman,rich,poor,intelligent,strong,weak,slow,black,white,religious, atheist etc.

It is only by experiencing everything personally, that we also will become masters of life. Only after all of that, can we learn to love each other unconditionally. We don't remember our previous lives directly, but the degree of empathy we feel toward others is derived from the latent memory of our experiences. Our common sense also stems from deep memories flowing through our causal consciousness as a result of our multiple lives.

There is truth in the understanding that every one gets exactly what they deserve in life, good or bad. As you have been on the receiving end of a very bad experience, I can imagine and wish only good things for you in the future.

My warmest regards

originally posted by: kennyb72
Only after all of that, can we learn to love each other unconditionally.

Who is "we" and why do you think "loving each other unconditionally" is the goal?

a reply to: Involutionist
Thank you again. I have a few comments. I will answer in (parenthesis).**PHOTO AT BOTTOM

You: “I really like your "vibe" and what you have to share”
(The “vibe” is not mine alone. It is ours-both of us…that is evident we share it).

You: “You would be surprised who is silently reading along who might find a spark in one sentence that sends them down a rabbit hole that in turn provides them tangible experiences if pursued. Spread your seed and let the wind carry it wherever it chooses”.
(I have and continue to spread knowledge…just not all the time, and not to just anyone who seeks it. Being a “sensitive” my whole life…I can be a pretty good judge of sincerity and karma. I have been known to get up and move in a theatre, train, restaurant, in line etc. to put distance between myself and a negative person or persons or things. Antique and resale stores are especially un-nerving at times. I move out of areas quickly. It comes on fast, and I move away even faster.)

You: “Unfortunately, most of the insight either ends up in someone's blog post, coaching package, or in a book to be sold as if it came from their own personal experiences or simply dismissed. It still does not matter. Sow that seed anyway.”
(It does matter. I sow no seeds. To sow is to plant…if one leaves something growing as other parts of that field are to be harvested…its up to the outsider to find value to what is sown for the next season, or for what already has been harvested for use or sale. I leave some, as with you here…and I sow a few along the way constantly.).

You: “The imagination is that doorway to other dimensions. It is the veil.”
(Not necessarily and singularly so, as it is not the only way. Our reality around us day to day and how one perceives it, implies there are other dimensions above, below, to the left and right, in front, in back and inside of each of us. Some have the ability to move through, between and in and out of those dimensions and realities. I was a very young child trying to understand how I was projecting from the tops of telephone poles one to the other in my neighborhood…and why.

My 1st real experience with Astral Projecting was so sudden, unintended and mis-understood…I was startled. It was immediate, quick and I traveled far far up and away. Was I imagining I did it? OR did I really DO it? I determined I did do it on whatever plane or dimension of existence it was. I saw it, I felt it, I could describe it in detail.)

You: “Depending on how one understands the faculty of imagination will determine how soon they can experience many things falsely thought of as only fantasy and/or needing practice. More importantly they will discover more practical uses for here and now that goes beyond astral projection experiences”.
(I don’t believe my imagination delivers me facts, names, places and sights one second earlier I did not think about. The mind was clear, no pre-conceived notions, just empty space and WHAM…I arrived somewhere. Many years in the beginning, I let that happen…unplanned, no destinations in mind, looking for nothing or no-one special. It was after years of that I realized I could CHOOSE my destinations…so I practiced and achieved control. Was it imagination? Don’t think so.

Someone could ask me something about a place or person in time, and I could come back with an answer.* *Here is not the place to discuss the validity or accuracy of such claims…nor do I care to come here to sell or convince…or defend myself to anyone. The quest for truth should be up to the seeker. If they wish help in finding that road or roads, and I sense the purity of their intent, I will always help. If its for a blog, website or article, they can move along. What is known by myself and others is based in self-discovery. Its very hard convincing and explaining to someone how to “find themselves”. That is their journey.)

You: “…the experience becomes surreal to the point we find ourselves physically experiencing it as a distant location. Astral projection works something like that.”
(I disagree. It doesn’t not become or is surreal, but another form of REALITY. Astral projects me in full realization that while I am breathing with eyes closed sitting in the chair, I am at the same time, traveling to points pre-determined or unexpected. My “reality” is sitting in the chair, and also is moving about across or through the veil or curtain we spoke of. I sense both, and can change both at any time. I can stay or come back.
Salvador Dali painted things by interpretation of reality. He knew what was real…but painted how he saw things COULD be. We’re they “surreal”…or were they “real” things interpreted differently? He knew the reality and the surrealism he put forth. But he did know the difference.)

You: “Astral projection is akin to dreaming up a world and experiencing it objectively. There is no travel at all. No destination to be reached.”
(I disagree. As in my case, say I had no intention one second ago of traveling to any place in time or to see anyone or thing…and I immediately projected to someplace I hadnt been looking for, thinking about or planned. If it was dreaming up a world, it did it without intent and instantly without planning. I cant say I dreamed of someplace and I was there.)

You: “All is mind.”
(I agree to a point. There are places as yet not understood that although controlled by the mind…seem to be accessed through it, yet outside of it. Someday we will know for sure)

You: “When you dream at night, although all the people and places (including distance) seem three dimensional and separate, it is all being projected by your mind. You didn't go anywhere…”
(May I say, I have night-time dreams of places Ive never been or would know about…and can draw them, and even get into the car and drive to them. Right to the location I knew nothing of, and had never been to.”

You: “Again, cultivating the imagination can be done by all.”
(Correct that cultivating of the imagination can be done by all…yet not everyone can astral project. And that point alone defines astral projection as something OTHER than just originating in the imagination!)

30 years or so ago, I decided to “plan” visiting my past lives. Later, after the advent of the internet, I researched the information…some going back to the Crusader Knights in Wales in the 1100’s. All of the info….matched.



This photo I searched for after projecting into a past life. This castle exists today, along with chapel and crypt of ancestor knight from the 1100’s. 700 years later, two new extensions of the families owned the castle and grounds.
This all after a astral projection session with no previous info of the place, people, names, nor ancestors. All proved true. As I said, I don’t care to convince or argue points with anyone. I don’t have too. Everyone should seek their own paths, help those along the way, and share the maps of both sides of the veil with those who seek them honestly.)

Blessings right back to you! MS

originally posted by: kennyb72
Pythagorean Hylozoics as explained by Henry T Laurency, an immense body of work that takes a long time to fully absorb, although I have studied for a few years now there is still much to concretise in my own mind.

I just wanted to say thanks a lot for the recommendation! Obviously have just been reading it 2-3 days. But, I am pretty well versed esoterically, so I am familiar with many of the concepts. But this seems to really be elucidating things, making a lot of things clear which were vague or undefined before. Really great stuff so far. Brings a lot of stuff together. Makes a lot of sense.

a reply to: TheJourney

Laurency presents in a very scientific and intellectual way and doesn't come across as 'New Agey' or blithe.

His work has been presented at a high level of comprehension and is aimed at the scientific mind. I personally appreciate his style of writing because it forced me to read slowly which helped me to absorb the concepts.

Your background in esoteric studies will help you a lot, although I found the body of his work in the Philosophers Stone required me to re-read several times. I found the more I thought deeply just about every paragraph, I felt connections falling into place on so many levels. I posit that if you understand hylozoics, there would not be much mystery in life that you could not unravel for yourself.

My only caution is that, as intelligent as Laurency is, he does have an elitist streak that can be off putting, but I guess that is his style of explanation. There are concepts that I found very challenging to accept but again the more I considered the possibilities compared to my own experiences, I had to concede the likelihood of such a strange reality.

I am happy you have found it interesting.

I have experienced sleep paralysis numerous times. I started experiencing it when I was around 23-24 and I'm 27 now. I think some years it occurred more than others, but I would say it happens to me on average once every 4-5 months. I have never once experienced "demonic" feelings or seen "demons" or any of that sort of stuff that I have read about. For me, it always seems to happen in the middle of the day when I take a nap or dozz off on the couch. I've come to think it might actually have something to do with OSA (obstructive sleep apnea). I have noticed that each time it has happened that my body and head are positioned in such a way for my tongue to slid down and block my trachea more easily. I could be completely wrong, but this is just an observation I have made with my experiences. Also, when it happens I notice that it occurs in either two ways for me. Either waking from a really deep sleep or right as I am falling asleep. The feeling of not being able to breathe could easily be from OSA. When it happens to me, my body feels completely paralysed, while I can open my eyes and see everything around me in my field of vision. I have never experienced hallucinations, or beings, or any fear, other than the fear of not being able to move or breathe. Last probably 5-10 seconds and is absolutely horrifying. If I dozz off right after it happens I notice it happens again soon after. I have started to just get up and try to wake myself for 5-10 minutes and sleep somewhere else or in a different position. It always happens while I am lying on my back, again most common position for OSA. I have read a lot of stuff about how to snap out of it, or calming techniques, but honestly when it happens it is so unexpected and so horrifying, I rarely can calm myself to do any of the things I have read. What works best for myself is trying to take slow deep breaths, and try to shake myself as hard as I can until I finally break out of it.

a reply to: Woodcarver

do you really gotta come in here and nay say everyone and make yourself the center of attention?

do you have proof that the chemicals are the cause and not the result? they might be. how dare you utter the word science and then completely close yourself off to any alternate ideas??

Hi! I'm new to ATS and the reason I signed up is because I was hoping to find some open minded people whom I can share my experiences with and ask questions. I have nobody in my life who I can talk to about this without getting laughed at, ridiculed or attacked.
So I finally decided to screw that, open up and get in touch with like minded people, but after reading this whole thread I feel really intimidated and not really encouraged to share my personal experiences out in the open.
I dont want to have to argue or defend myself or "proof" anything, just want to share what I experienced and hopefully get some questions answered.

So my question go to TheJourney, mysterioustranger, UniFinity, Visitor2012 or others who are experienced with Lucid Dreams, SP and Astral Projection: is there any way I can send you a private message?

Thank you very much

a reply to: justbe

Hello Justbe, I think you are required to make 20 posts before the U2U function becomes available. Once you have that you can click the little man at the bottom of a users name and post a private message from there.

Welcome to ATS by the way

ETA: Don't be intimidated by closed minds, there are plenty here who are very open and helpful.