Judge Recognizes Two Chimpanzees as Legal Persons

a reply to: butcherguy

Didn't some dolphins get given a title and rights?.
Non human intelligent something or other?.
I think we have to understand some animals have the capability of self awareness..I think and therefor I am etc...but in chimp speech so don't those which are not just animals deserving of some basic rights?...
Great Apes.(well we are also Apes so...)
Dolphins.
And..














CATS!!!

Heheheeheehhehehehe (runs away fleeing).

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: Hoosierdaddy71

So chimps are people, but people who haven't been through birth aren't people.

This is why throat-punching idiots should be made legal.

That just made me go HA!

That was my laugh out loud.

So true, so true.

I suppose now that there will be no laws against people having sex with them and now the bestiality special interest groups will want to jump in on this one. Can you see it..in 10 years there are going to be people petitioning for marriage equality with chimps.

King Kong, a love story of a misunderstood ape and the homo sapien female he loved. A tragic end to a tragic life, so horribly victimized by society. He should have gotten a good lawyer and sued the City of New York.

originally posted by: Hoosierdaddy71

Next they will get the right to vote and of course the right to college educations.

No they won't. They aren't a corporation so they only get a couple human rights.

Habeas corpus is a legal petition that detainees use to seek relief from unlawful imprisonment, and by granting habeas corpus to chimps, Jaffe endorsed the idea that they deserve the rights of a human being with respect to being confined indefinitely and in less than humane conditions.

Advocates argue great apes are highly intelligent and self-aware beings with complex emotional lives that deserve basic rights, including the right to be free of inhumane treatment.

It just means we won't allow them to be imprisoned forever or be tortured. Heck that's better than what some of our own citizens get sometimes. Lucky Chimps.

a reply to: Hoosierdaddy71

WHAT THE EFF is your problem with this?

I copied this from the buzzfeed article:

Advocates argue great apes are highly intelligent and self-aware beings with complex emotional lives that deserve basic rights, including the right to be free of inhumane treatment.
A similar tack was taken by lawyers in Argentina last year when a court ruled that an orangutan kept at private zoo in Buenos Aires for the past 20 years should have some basic legal rights.
According to Nonhuman Rights Project (NhRP), which filed the habeas corpus petition in March in an effort to move the primates to a sanctuary in Florida, Jaffe’s ruling is a first for animal rights.

and you have some problem with this? You have some indifference to the existence of animals who are sentient, intelligent, sensitive, etc.?

So - do you think of animals as bugs? Dispensable creatures too stupid to live? APES are just as much PEOPLE as we are!!! So are elephants, dolphins, whales, cats, dogs, horses, .......

that you can be so cavalier about this turns my stomach.

Hoosiers. Did you contribute to the Memories Pizza place?

Good Gawd, you people are amazing. (And NOT in a good way.)
Flame at me all you want.

I'm utterly disgusted.

People who think that way make me literally nauseated......

a reply to: butcherguy

I didn't see any non-humans mentioned.

No? CORPORATIONS are NOT PEOPLE.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: Hoosierdaddy71

WHAT THE EFF is your problem with this?

I copied this from the buzzfeed article:

Advocates argue great apes are highly intelligent and self-aware beings with complex emotional lives that deserve basic rights, including the right to be free of inhumane treatment.
A similar tack was taken by lawyers in Argentina last year when a court ruled that an orangutan kept at private zoo in Buenos Aires for the past 20 years should have some basic legal rights.
According to Nonhuman Rights Project (NhRP), which filed the habeas corpus petition in March in an effort to move the primates to a sanctuary in Florida, Jaffe’s ruling is a first for animal rights.

and you have some problem with this? You have some indifference to the existence of animals who are sentient, intelligent, sensitive, etc.?

So - do you think of animals as bugs? Dispensable creatures too stupid to live? APES are just as much PEOPLE as we are!!! So are elephants, dolphins, whales, cats, dogs, horses, .......

that you can be so cavalier about this turns my stomach.

Hoosiers. Did you contribute to the Memories Pizza place?

Good Gawd, you people are amazing. (And NOT in a good way.)
Flame at me all you want.

I'm utterly disgusted.

People who think that way make me literally nauseated......

I thought all animals had basic rights. That's why I feed my dog every day.

Isn't that why we have the SPCA?

I remember when I was in school we had been taught that in a city, I think New York, that children's rights advocates actually used the SPCA to help children.

I can't find it now, but that is something I remember hearing in school...so many years ago.

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: Hoosierdaddy71

So chimps are people, but people who haven't been through birth aren't people.

This is why throat-punching idiots should be made legal.

Legal definitions do not mean what people think they mean.

originally posted by: butcherguy
a reply to: Hoosierdaddy71
I wonder what species will be the next to attain personhood?
I hope it isn't pigs.
That will screw my bacon supply up.

I think its Dolphins. But it all rather comes down to the fact that the naked ape called human. Seemed to have escaped its biological niche, by being able to think beyond the next food supply, then having done that, can have the time to think about lots of other fun things instead. But Dolphins and chimps still think, along with a lot of other persons we call animal, and can do very well in their biological niche. In fact ignore the fact that the body design, locks you into the biological niche, and the difference between us and them is minimal . They love their offspring, sense fear and pain, if we were a truly empathetic species we wouldn't kill and eat them.

a reply to: WarminIndy

I thought all animals had basic rights. That's why I feed my dog every day.

I feed my animal companions every day, too - and they, in turn, bring home offerings of birds, moles, mice, snakes, etc......others bark when a stranger comes into the yard, and still others keep their aquarium clean..... We share this "den". We watch out for each other.

We are PARTNERS, and we TRUST each other.

Isn't that why we have the SPCA?

Yes, it is.

I am simply astounded that anyone would feel it 'laughable' that great apes are considered "unworthy" of consideration.

Other than that (and I deleted a lot of this reply), (and just now deleted a lot of other thoughts again!), I would rather hang out with my animals (and plants) than I would with most people I know.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: WarminIndy

I thought all animals had basic rights. That's why I feed my dog every day.

I feed my animal companions every day, too - and they, in turn, bring home dead birds, moles, mice, etc......or bark when a stranger comes into the yard. We share this "den". We watch out for each other.

We are PARTNERS, and we TRUST each other.

Isn't that why we have the SPCA?

Yes, it is.

I am simply astounded that anyone would feel it 'laughable' that great apes are considered "unworthy" of consideration.

From what I have heard about chimpanzees, I wouldn't want one in my home. But I wouldn't be inhumane to them. My dad had a monkey before he and my mom were married. I don't know what kind, but it might not have really been legal at the time. But it was 1965 so who knows how he got it, and who knows where it went. He never told me that part.

This is Koko the gorilla playing with her kitten.


And not too long ago I posted a thread about the Muriquis:
Humans Would Be Better Off If They Monkeyed Around Like the Muriquis

Biologist Karen Strier has been studying these peace-loving Brazilian primates and their egalitarian lifestyle for decades


That said, they are still WILD ANIMALS.......
yet they make a colossal effort to get along with us, as long as we are civilized towards them.

I wanna see a Chimpanzee swear on the Bible now.

a reply to: Specimen

I wanna see a Chimpanzee swear on the Bible now.

I suppose you're being flippant with this remark.

At least apes have the sense not to fall for some bunch of humans' rewriiten versions of crap mythology that they try to pass off as truth.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

I doubt they would have the sense of awareness for deception, other when it comes to being eaten by something. Can an Ape swear on it with it right hand?

I'm fine with it. I want all apes protected. We are ignorant to their consciousness, but seeing Ape's use sign language changed how I see everything.

I haven't gone through the whole thread, so I don't know if this has been posted, but it's worth watching.

a reply to: Specimen

Can an Ape swear on it with it right hand?

An ape can raise its right hand if asked (and accustomed to human language), yes.

One of my dogs can "high five" whenever I ask her.
The other can "wink" whenever I ask.

Can they "swear"? No. They can't speak.

So - what is your point?

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Only if it taught, right? A human telling the Ape, this your right and your left, or left and right in that case.

Sure, animals don't communicate like humans, but animals can lie at times... even though they didn't say anything.

Its in the body language.

a reply to: Specimen

Yes, it is in the body language. I am perfectly well able to discern what my animal companions want by the way they express themselves using body language.

Twelve years ago, a huge tornado was headed right toward our house, and the horses freaked out; the alpha mare made SURE we humans were with her and the others, and 'herded' us down to safety in the bottom of the gulch.

Just will add to clarify that the elephants painting elephants are actually being controlled to do so, so it's not of it's own accord.
Refer back to this post of mine from an older thread about an even older thread. Painting Elephants Trick

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

True, some animals are openly playful while some are eager to show some serious body language, and I'm not being some egotistical moron comparing myself to other creatures with the lack of a thumb out feelings of being insecure. Animals(Except for Human bred, like toy dogs) are good at what they do, and in most cases is trying to survive

I think your not getting what I'm trying to point here about an Ape not being able to lie?