Woman gunned down, handcuffed by police after she shot estranged husband who tried to kill her

originally posted by: here4this
a reply to: Anyafaj
If I had shot someone who had broke into my home attempting me harm , and I heard a voice behind me say "drop the gun" I would have been very wary that it might have been an accomplice. Thanks to the Powers that Be she was not killed.

So what would you have done then? Please walk me thru your steps. Just curious is all.

originally posted by: hogstooth
a reply to: vonclod

why she didn't drop the gun?, she might of been in shock and not comprehended the command.

You ever fire a shotgun in a confined space without ear protection? Her ears were probably ringing so hard she couldn't hear him.

Right, exactly ..... thanks for sharing that very insightful, important info, as I (and probably others here) didn't think of that.... and combined with my post, just before your post, '"she was in a state of sheer fear for her life, panic, in 'fight or flight' survival-mode, unable to think clearly"... well., add ALL of that together with yours and there's the answer.

She wasn't trying to antagonize or overpower the cops. Intention is everything and that wasn't her intention. Again, she's a school teacher who spends her days with young children --- not in neighborhood drug-war zones and other threatening life-death environments -- complete opposite actually.

She is not experienced, conditioned or trained to think clearly under those kinds of life/death situations as LE is trained to do. She doesn't have that kind of training and experience that LE has to know to put the gun down even under great duress. Plus, as you shared the sound was deafening and she couldn't hear them or think clearly.

She is probably replaying that moment in her mind over and over, questioning her memory and recall of that traumatic moment. Another traumatized human being afflicted with PTSD for the rest of her life.

a reply to: Jana12

So the next time the cops come to a scene where they just heard a shot fired and there is someone holding a gun and when asked to drop it they instead turn to the cops with the weapon they should just let whatever may happen happen just in case it's a confused person holding the gun?
Nothing of what I just wrote has anything to do with how I feel for this poor woman..she is a victim.
Cheers.

a reply to: Unity_99

Right..... I agree, Unity, 'they shouldn't have shot so quickly'.... I think they could have realized she was in shock and trauma, shaking like a leaf on a windy day. He was also terrorizing her over a period of time before this even happened, so she was already living daily, in a place of fear for her life every day, before this even happened.

She was also fearful of a tragic school shooting, that he would bust into her classroom, armed, and kill her and her young students. Victims know full well what their abuser is capable of, especially long-term victims. Others may not know, but the victims know what others don't see or quite get.

a reply to: vonclod

vonclod - Didn't see your post until after I posted my reply to Unity.

No, vonclod I was agreeing with you... she is a victim. LE was kind of between a rock and a hard place, so to speak. But her intentions weren't to dismiss or disobey their orders or overpower them, she was in shock.


On another note, drowning victims have been known to scratch, punch and pound on their rescuer as they are being rescued/saved because they are in shock, seconds and inches away from death and cannot think clearly, logically and rationally. They actually punch and scratch the person who is saving their life, totally unaware of what they are doing.


I think we can agree she is a severely traumatized victim who should not be treated like the criminal she isn't.



EDIT TO ADD: I starred your previous post.

originally posted by: HawkeyeNation

You're a disgrace and pathetic. You're a damn behind your computer screen cop who knows everything about being one. You know what it's like to risk your life everyday...right. This is why we do reality based training's. You don't want to only survive the attack just to make a mistake when the police arrived. You need to plan. She knew the cops would be there. The police have no idea what her situation is, what her history is, they have no idea that she maybe she is the aggressor. You get a radio call that shots have been fired and that's it. You don't get the background check.

I'm sickened that our society sees it like this and I'm sorry OP to take my frustrations out on you but you have no #ing clue what it's like.

No, I don't know what it's like. But you also have to take into account she may not have heard the cops. You have to remember she just fired a weapon to protect her life. She didn't do it willy nilly. I'm not mad at all cops. My ex's cousin is a deputy in WV and a damn good one. He does a damn fine job and if he had fired upon this woman I would understand why he did it, but also understand why she did not hear the command to drop the weapon. I would also expect this to be investigated. She was protecting herself and her home, her mother possibly told 911 the danger her daughter faced from the soon to be ex, the restraining orders, etc..., as for whether that was relayed to the officers, who knows. I'm guessing not, considering the officers did not release the soon to be ex's information until the next day thinking it a regular home invasion. That tells me either mom in her panic didn't tell 911, or she did, and 911 didn't relay it. I would like to hope, if I ever am forced to protect myself, something like this doesn't happen to me.

a reply to: Jana12

Fully agreed.

Or when the police arrive after you have just shot someone don't point your gun at them. She wasn't shot for defending herself against her crazy husband.

originally posted by: Jana12
She wasn't trying to antagonize or overpower the cops. Intention is everything and that wasn't her intention. Again, she's a school teacher who spends her days with young children --- not in neighborhood drug-war zones and other threatening life-death environments -- complete opposite actually.

Are they mind readers that they should go by her intentions and not her actions?

I feel for the woman, but owning a gun is a serious responsibility, and she failed in part of her responsibilities.

How long did it take for the police to show up to PROTECT her?

originally posted by: vonclod
I don't think I'm going to get too too upset over this one..not sure the police knew exactly what happened..even then

"They demanded that she drop her weapon but when she turned toward them with the gun in her hand, at least one officer fired at her, wounding, but not killing her".

I think as sh$tty as it is for her I can't fault the cops..it's very unfortunate but not the typical overboard crap we see here so often...why she didn't drop the gun?, she might of been in shock and not comprehended the command.

At least they didn't empty their guns on her and looks like she will be ok.

Damn

^This^

Women, screen your life mates better!

a reply to: Anyafaj

I must call you out on your terrible assessment of the end result. Kudos for the lady for shooting the guy--seems like the type of human society can do without--but the officer didn't open fire on her for protecting her home, it seems it was because she did not drop her weapon and turned to face the officers with said weapon in her hand.

Now, the officer should have definitely shown more restraint, but your diatribe about getting shot because she was protecting herself or her home is ill-conceived and unnecessarily inflammatory as to the motivation of the officer.

originally posted by: SlapMonkey
a reply to: Anyafaj

I must call you out on your terrible assessment of the end result. Kudos for the lady for shooting the guy--seems like the type of human society can do without--but the officer didn't open fire on her for protecting her home, it seems it was because she did not drop her weapon and turned to face the officers with said weapon in her hand.

Now, the officer should have definitely shown more restraint, but your diatribe about getting shot because she was protecting herself or her home is ill-conceived and unnecessarily inflammatory as to the motivation of the officer.

I said I understand WHY he did it. But there's also a possibility this woman couldn't HEAR the officer as she just fired a weapon. We're not trained like cops are.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: Jana12
She wasn't trying to antagonize or overpower the cops. Intention is everything and that wasn't her intention. Again, she's a school teacher who spends her days with young children --- not in neighborhood drug-war zones and other threatening life-death environments -- complete opposite actually.

Are they mind readers that they should go by her intentions and not her actions?

I feel for the woman, but owning a gun is a serious responsibility, and she failed in part of her responsibilities.

I see your point but was referring to this; she's a victim and should not be treated like the criminal she isn't.

And, I agree gun ownership is a serious responsibility, but the reality is that many people who own a gun have never had reason to use it. I know I haven't, and I'd be beyond scared if I had to, not thinking clearly under those kinds of circumstances. The responding officers may not have known this, but he had been tormenting and terrorizing her before this happened and there were several restraining orders against him. If she had LE in her family they would have been aware of the situation and the restraining orders and she would have had the proactive protection she needed so it didn't escalate to this.

Years ago I lived in an affluent east coast community with a strong police presence. They knew the addresses of the residents with restraining orders against a violent person and that were considered 'high risk' and 'extremely high risk', albeit the Italian mafia lived in that particular community, hence the strong police presence and proactive stance.

I just think in this case with all of LE's training and years of experience under these circumstances they could have realized she was in shock and temporarily out of it, while also deafened by the sound of the gunfire and may have also possibly thought they were her husband's accomplices, not the police.

I just hope going forward she isn't treated by the system like the criminal she is not. I also hope going forward she is given all the attention, support, help and follow-up she needs to get through this tragedy.

a reply to: Anyafaj

I'll agree with that possibility, but I can't imagine the officers were being coy with thier demands. Luckily, she survived the shot, so at least we're not dealing with an innocent death, so there's that plus side.

originally posted by: SlapMonkey
a reply to: Anyafaj

I'll agree with that possibility, but I can't imagine the officers were being coy with thier demands. Luckily, she survived the shot, so at least we're not dealing with an innocent death, so there's that plus side.

No I don't think they were, and I admit they have to be concerned for their safety as well. As I said, her mother may or may not have told 911 about the restraining orders, and if 911 was told, they may or may not have told the officers. I'm thinking the officers were NOT told considering it was posted to the web the next day that they determined what the situation was and who the participants were, probably from interviewing the victim. I'm glad the woman didn't die, but I do suspect she will have bone problems in the hip from the gunshot. I have problems in my right hip from a fall 19 years ago, I can only imagine what a gunshot can do.

a reply to: vonclod

You're right, that's what I was going to say: she did NOT obey the officers orders in a quite delicate situation. She's lucky she's alive ..