Can anyone name a religion that DOESNT believe in reincarnation?

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: WarminIndy

How do you transmigrate your soul to another body? What is the mechanism for that?

To use your own Bible.....

And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment,

And he shewed me Joshua the high priest standing before the angel of the Lord, and Satan standing at his right hand to resist him.

2 And the Lord said unto Satan, The Lord rebuke thee, O Satan; even the Lord that hath chosen Jerusalem rebuke thee: is not this a brand plucked out of the fire?

3 Now Joshua was clothed with filthy garments, and stood before the angel.

4 And he answered and spake unto those that stood before him, saying, Take away the filthy garments from him. And unto him he said, Behold, I have caused thine iniquity to pass from thee, and I will clothe thee with change of raiment.

New clothes!

It's silly to argue over what kind of "new clothes" we'll get. The only thing that matters is the goal, eternal life, free will and spiritual freedom.

Uh huh. In heaven. That is the corruptible putting on the incorruptible. Yes, Paul taught that same thing. But it was in heaven.

I think we might be seeing what "the judgment" is. OK, to you the judgment might be transmigrating to another corruptible body.

For Christians, the judgment is the account of our life, before the Almighty God Himself, and whether we are to remain in heaven in fellowship with God or to the outer darkness of nothingness, apart and away from God.

I think that one way or another, you and I both believe in a judgment, but your idea gives you more chances to get it right (or become a horrible person in the next).

The dead will arise, physically, to heaven, and their corruptible flesh will be changed to incorruptible, as it was before Adam and Eve sinned in the Garden.

Is there anything wrong with getting it right once in this life to enjoy fellowship with the Almighty, Everlasting God forever?

originally posted by: WarminIndy
The dead will arise, physically, to heaven,

So if my house was unknowingly built over some ancient Christian burial site, I am kind of screwed when that time comes?

Okay, I understand you believe this, but how could this really work?

a reply to: bb23108

I keep thinking of John the Baptist and his many (pious forgeries) heads!

originally posted by: bb23108

originally posted by: WarminIndy
The dead will arise, physically, to heaven,

So if my house was mistakenly built over some ancient Christian burial site, I am kind of screwed?

Okay, I understand you believe this, but how could this really work?

Are you worried the Christians would haunt you?

BTW, I do believe that spiritual entities do haunt, I just don't believe souls transmigrate. But maybe some do, I don't know. The only thing I have defended in this thread is that Christianity does not teach reincarnation, we teach resurrection.

A ghost haunting is not reincarnation anyway. And the legend is if you build on Native American burial grounds, then you might really get haunted...but I think that is just urban legend.

Do you mean because the bodies will resurrect through your house? Maybe they might just come up through the walls and out the door before becoming physical again, but the Bible does say that it will happen in the twinkling of an eye, so you wouldn't have to worry about your house.

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: bb23108

I keep thinking of John the Baptist and his many (pious forgeries) heads!

Salome forged his head? She presented it on a silver platter, not a forged silver head on a platter.

a reply to: WarminIndy

LOL Not ghosts silly. The Zombie Apocalypse may erupt in her basement!

a reply to: WarminIndy

No.. it seems the precious head of John the Baptist turned up in a number of different places. If all those heads are really his, come Resurrection Day we're going to see a funny looking John the Baptist!

a reply to: WarminIndy
LOL! Right, I was wondering if they would wreck the place or even worse, I might be blocking their ascension!

Really, how does this make any sense what you said: "The dead will arise, physically, to heaven"?

Seriously, you must wonder about whether the Bible writers got this one recorded properly.

Reincarnation makes much more sense. Upon death, the spirit (Consciousness now only coupled with the subtle body) rises beyond the physical body through the core of the brain to whatever higher world one's life on earth (karma) dictates. After a certain period, their subtle body associates with another physical body, likely in this same gross physical world, to start the learning process over again.

What is there to learn? To transcend all these limitations, high and low, through constant whole bodily devotional communion with the Divine. Just as Jesus' commandments admonish. Only then is there freedom - but never achieved through any kind of believer's mind only.

Jesus, if he existed and I feel he did, was a true adept Spiritual Master who compassionately incarnated here to show the way to God. He gave both exoteric and esoteric instructions, and told his followers that the way to God was through him. He represents the gateway (the Morning Star in the Bible, also the blue pearl in Hindu esotericism) to the Universal Light and Unity of God Above.

If one truly moves above this gross plane, then rebirth back here may not be necessary. Regardless, such a realization is a profound spiritual rebirth beyond this physical world, that Jesus fully demonstrated and initiated his most prepared followers into.

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: WarminIndy

No.. it seems the precious head of John the Baptist turned up in a number of different places. If all those heads are really his, come Resurrection Day we're going to see a funny looking John the Baptist!

Blah, the Templars and pilgrims were only bringing parts of dead bodies saying they were saints. That is Orthodox Catholics who believe those body parts were really of saints.

Does sound kind of macabre though. Eww, dead body parts and Egyptian mummies, people really liked weird things.

John the Baptist's head was probably tossed out to the dogs.

originally posted by: bb23108
a reply to: WarminIndy
LOL! Right, I was wondering if they would wreck the place or even worse, I might be blocking their ascension!

Really, how does this make any sense what you said: "The dead will arise, physically, to heaven"?

Seriously, you must wonder about whether the Bible writers got this one recorded properly.

Reincarnation makes much more sense. Upon death, the spirit (Consciousness now only coupled with the subtle body) rises beyond the physical body through the core of the brain to whatever higher world one's life on earth (karma) dictates. After a certain period, their subtle body associates with another physical body, likely in this same gross physical world, to start the learning process over again.

What is there to learn? To transcend all these limitations, high and low, through constant whole bodily devotional communion with the Divine. Just as Jesus' commandments admonish. Only then is there freedom - but never achieved through any kind of believer's mind only.

Jesus, if he existed and I feel he did, was a true adept Spiritual Master who compassionately incarnated here to show the way to God. He gave both exoteric and esoteric instructions, and told his followers that the way to God was through him. He represents the gateway (the Morning Star in the Bible, also the blue pearl in Hindu esotericism) to the Universal Light and Unity of God Above.

If one truly moves above this gross plane, then rebirth back here may not be necessary. Regardless, such a realization is a profound spiritual rebirth beyond this physical world, that Jesus fully demonstrated and initiated his most prepared followers into.

Well at least you justify your belief.

We will all certainly know one day.

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: WarminIndy

LOL Not ghosts silly. The Zombie Apocalypse may erupt in her basement!

Zombie Apocalypse...I think there are zombies walking around right now. They are called public school students.

a reply to: WarminIndy

For Christians, the judgment is the account of our life, before the Almighty God Himself

Where does Jesus teach this? I know there's this:

John 5:24
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life

originally posted by: WarminIndy
Well at least you justify your belief.

We will all certainly know one day.

Only to be forgotten again with the next round here. Reincarnation is no consolation when you really consider it.

You asked earlier about what determines transmigration - the subtle planes have spiritual laws that govern these matters, just like there are physical laws here for this gross plane. It is all mechanical in some real sense - that is why it is all to be transcended in the Divine.

Many of us do have one thing in common - we truly trust the Divine. That is faith which is a heart matter, whereas belief is more of a conceptual matter. If one has real faith in Jesus (or the Divine Being of any religion), then their life changes because their hearts are open and intelligent in communion with the Perfect Lord who is completely present here.

If one simply believes because they think they have to, in order to get saved, they may very well not be heart-moved to commune with God, and therefore, no real transformation occurs and the pattern just keeps shifting and repeating itself - i.e., reincarnation.

a reply to: Involutionist

Of course it is. It is just too bad most haven't studied gematria and such to interpret that ancient literature correctly. This leads to mistaking allegory as historical fact.

I do understand your premise but also disagree with your premise. to my understanding there are too many variables involved with gematria.

You have probably heard all the pro and con discussions of this so there is no need to argue the case. I simply cannot rely upon the numerical value of a word to explain the meaning of that word when the word is really not verified as the intent of the author except as used in context. We have 39 Hebrew books of the OT written in two distinct languages of Hebrew and Aramaic with about 30 authors of those 39 books and over a span of about 970 years. To add to this we do not even have the original manuscripts of which to interpret the exact word.

With this uncertainty, I read with contextual understanding as best as my mind will understand and with the help of scholars of the languages. That includes a concordance of that particular translation. I don't wish to delve into the numerology world when I do not place any belief in the Babylonian concept whatsoever. I do however admire your intelligence which surpasses mine by a far greater source.

a reply to: Seede

I do understand your premise but also disagree with your premise. to my understanding there are too many variables involved with gematria.

I feel you and I agree re: too many variables. I personally learned to focus on metaphysical insight that I felt could be empirically weighed. In other words: If I cannot wield it to manifest $$$ or anything I strongly desired then it got placed in the intellectual ping pong bin.

I simply cannot rely upon the numerical value of a word to explain the meaning of that word when the word is really not verified as the intent of the author except as used in context.

I feel you again. I too subscribe to the same notion. Yet, I personally discovered a silver lining in all the variables that allows for my ego greed to be quenched. Again, I just lay out my understanding in a confident manner because I personally witness the fruits of my beliefs through synchronicity.

I don't try to convert anyone. Just sending the elevator back down that is all. None of my business if one does not want to get on.

With this uncertainty, I read with contextual understanding as best as my mind will understand and with the help of scholars of the languages. That includes a concordance of that particular translation. I don't wish to delve into the numerology world when I do not place any belief in the Babylonian concept whatsoever. I do however admire your intelligence which surpasses mine by a far greater source.

Thank you for your kind words. I will share something with you that you may or may not accept but, based on your intent to understand, it cuts through all the intellectual crap and will allow for it to be empirically weighed out.

realneville.com...

It is kabbalah magic spelled out simply without all the numerical nonsense. No need for rituals or summoning spirits when one discovers the forgotten corner stone...the philosopher's stone. The spiritual imagination.

"Imagination is everything. It is a preview of life's coming events" ~ Albert Einstein.

Have you ever read the esoteric story of how Einstein discovered the theory of relativity...or how Tesla came up with his ideas? Jung, Kant, Blake, Henry Ford, J.k Rowling, and many more understand how Einstein and Tesla did what they did...

Some of us use the insight to better the world and others use it to make heaps of $$$.

Bible is magical and I'm not being poetic. This is a conspiracy site right...?

Active Imagination

Role in scientific and mathematical discovery

Hadamard (1954)[21] and Châtelet (1991)[22] suggest that imagination and conceptual experiment play central roles in mathematical creativity. Important scientific discoveries have been made through imaginative cognition, such as Kekulé’s famous discovery of the carbon ring structure of benzene through a dream of a snake eating its tail. Other examples include Archimedes, in his bathtub, imagining that his body is nothing but a gourd of water, and Einstein imagining himself to be a photon on a horizon of velocities.

en.wikipedia.org...

“When I get an idea I start at once building it up in my imagination. I change the construction, make improvements and operate the device in my mind. It is absolutely immaterial to me whether I run my turbine in thought or test it in my shop. I even note if it is out of balance. There is no difference whatever; the results were the same. In this way I am able to rapidly develop and perfect a conception without touching anything. When I have gone so far to embody in the invention every possible improvement I can think of and see no fault anywhere, I put into concrete form this final product of my brain. Invariably my device works as I conceived that it should, and the experiment comes out exactly as I planned it. In twenty years there has not been a single exception.” - Nicola Tesla

inthemindseyedyslexicrenaissance.blogspot.ca...

I get it with my eyes closed. Lift up your eyes...

John Lennon and a few others caught hell for speaking such truths.

"Reality leaves a lot to the imagination" - John Lennon

Bless

a reply to: Involutionist

J.K. Rowling is an esoterist?

The problem with numerology people claim are in the Bible, then one is counting the value of words that were in a different language.

If Greeks used numerology in that manner, then I suppose one could find the same esoteric messages in The Republic.

The Sephirot is nothing more than just some guys applying attributes to random things. My brother that is Celtic Pagan always says that, the problem with "magick" is that it is human based, humans assigned attributes and characteristics to random or inanimate objects. He calls that "academic magick".

I don't understand why people believe that Solomon had a magic ring that he controlled demons with. Then they misconstrue his very name. I heard that people say it is Sol Om On, tying together three different languages into the Anglicized Solomon. The name in Hebrew is Sholomo, some Jewish people today say Shleimi, and it means peace.

That's the problem with English, anything can be mistranslated or misconstrued. I can do that and then "prove" Ganeesh was really the Indian god they claim...

Ele phant, El or ele in Hebrew or Arabic means God, and phant in Latin is huge. Therefore, the two words together are God huge, or giant God. And the only ones who worship an elephant god is the Hindus. So Ganesha is the name of Elephant God. But in Latin, ele means ARCH. And loosely translated. ARCH is associated the "dome of the earth" or what the ancients called heaven. The ARCHONS in the book of Enoch come from heaven, therefore the Latin root Ele is directly related to heaven, where God is at. He is the Lord of success and destroyer of evils and obstacles. He is also worshipped as the god of education, knowledge, wisdom and wealth.

Or I could say that the Hindus expressed the God of the Hebrews (because it was all one ancient civilization and religion) as the elephant Ganesha.

I completely made that up and took me only five minutes to get the information to do so. But would that classify as esoteric knowledge because I managed to take different languages, cultures and religions to add them together to "prove" Ganesha is God?

Anyone can do that, it is very easy. But is it true? Jordan Maxwell and his kind are always doing the same thing.

BTW, I made that up about Ganesha, so you heard it here first, WarminIndy did it first so if you hear or read of someone else later stealing my idea, make sure they reference WarminIndy, I'm claiming intellectual rights.

originally posted by: WarminIndy
BTW, I made that up about Ganesha, so you heard it here first, WarminIndy did it first so if you hear or read of someone else later stealing my idea, make sure they reference WarminIndy, I'm claiming intellectual rights.

You should immediately start a new thread showing off this brilliant discovery! I am sure Ganesh is pleased and you will prosper greatly!

originally posted by: bb23108

originally posted by: WarminIndy
BTW, I made that up about Ganesha, so you heard it here first, WarminIndy did it first so if you hear or read of someone else later stealing my idea, make sure they reference WarminIndy, I'm claiming intellectual rights.

You should immediately start a new thread showing off this brilliant discovery! I am sure Ganesh is pleased and you will prosper greatly!

HAHA, I made it up, that was no discovery.

But you, I will give you permission because you seem to appreciate what I said. But that was called "imagination" and thinking outside of the box.

I don't think it is a very pleasant thing to be in a Hindu temple that has elephants, they would poop everywhere. I know someone who sent me pictures of their temple elephant. I asked them why, they said that their elephants were venerated and sacred....to haul logs for the fire. So someone still controls their "god".

a reply to: bb23108
I want to add something more about reincarnation that I started in the above post. When the body dies, the core mechanism of attention that consciousness (awareness) is associated with, does survive. Attention is the root of the self-identity, and in most basic terms, is the mechanism that creates point-of-view.

Our most fundamental sense of separate self is the activity of creating a point-of-view that our being (awareness) identifies with, creating a sense of separation.

Thus, when we, as awareness associated with attention and the etheric body-mind, pass out of the physical body at death, attention is dissociated from the physical body, and moves toward a brilliant white Light. This is the Light Jesus was teaching about, and many NDEs have mentioned.

It is advisable to focus attention on this Light, even in the midst of all sorts of other lights and mind-forms appearing. This is a glimpse of the Divine Source of all conditions we are graced with at death. We want to stay in that Light forever, as it is absolute love-bliss unity, and the longer we stay focused on it, the better for our death transition.

However, unless one is fully capable to already reside in that brilliant white Light, invariably lesser conditions will appear, and our attention will become re-associated with lesser subtle conditions, and then a gross physical body - determined by our attention and what it gravitates toward.

Now if we are full of equanimity and our attention, energy, and body-mind are always turned to the Divine here on Earth (think of the two great commandments), then we are freer here than we would otherwise be.

This core state of equanimity, free attention, and love-communion with what is not form - i.e., the Divine - allows us to enter more benign realms after death.

If we are really bound up in unconscious and terrible habit patterns of body and mind here on earth, this greatly affects how free our attention is - in other words, it is not free. Such lack of freedom will cause attention to not be focused, and less than benign conditions will be what we will gravitate toward and be embodied in and bound by.

In fact, terrible conditions can be encountered, hell-like even. As we are on earth, so too will we tend to be in the afterlife. And in the afterlife, attention is not so anchored to a body, and can get flung around into terrible places, depending on our karmic choices here.

Like I mentioned earlier, these matters are governed by laws just like the earth is. It is mechanics, part of the great machine of the conditional worlds. It is just more subtle in these realms, but really fundamentally no different in terms of what is required - turn one's attention, energy, faculties to the Divine in real surrender.

This is why Jesus appeared, as other Spiritual Masters have, to teach people to turn their attention and energy to the Divine Source both in the afterlife and now. This is what he taught - to be born to here from Above.

If anyone is interested in further details about this, I can supply some references. Just u2u me.

Are there levels of the "Heavenly Abode" in any parts of Christianity? I understand the concept of Purgatory, but for many Christians it appears it is either Heaven or Hell. How could that work - all or none can't be right. What if someone misses the cut-off by just a decimal point? Anyone care to comment on how the subtle planes factor in, if at all, in any of the Christian variants?

originally posted by: WarminIndy
HAHA, I made it up, that was no discovery.

But you, I will give you permission because you seem to appreciate what I said. But that was called "imagination" and thinking outside of the box.

Oh dear, I guess you didn't know I was kidding. You did mention that you made that up in your post, so I was well aware of that when I posted my silly comment.

However, I did think your Ganesh game was clever.

But I am glad you didn't start a new thread!