What Exactly is MK-Ultra?

originally posted by: lostgirl

originally posted by: WarminIndy

As you can't mention the particular substance, I then have to wonder, as Timothy Leary encouraged the usage of, as well as The Beatles, could Timothy Leary have been part of the CIA through Harvard? Seems that if Leary and Kaczinsky were both at the same university, is there are correlation?

Sighhh....See, this is why we need to remember that we should do our research before trying to put conspiracy 'puzzles' together...

Yes, MKUltra and Monarch are true, but...

....Ted Kaczinsky wasn't even born when Timothy Leary went to college!!

None of this has anything to do with the Beatles.

The charges against Ayres were dropped, and he didn't even meet Obama until he was in his thirties, which was 1995 - over 25 years after the 'group' Ayers was involved with bombed anything!


Tsk...Google can be your friend, but not if you only use it to watch videos...

Don't you find it interesting that for some criminals, the charges are dropped or sentences were changed? Do you ever think of that?

I never said they went to college at the same time. See, that is soft language you just used to convince us of something.

Leary and Kaczinski

In yet another odd twist that shows why history is stranger than fiction, while Kaczynski was undergoing those humiliation experiments a young Harvard researcher named Timothy Leary was beginning his research career on psychedelics. In 1960 Leary returned from a vacation in Mexico with a suitcase full of magic mushrooms. Murray himself is said to have supervised psychoactive drug experiments, including Leary’s. According to Alston Chase, author of Harvard and the Unabomber, Leary called Murray “the wizard of personality assessment who, as OSS chief psychologist, had monitored military experiments on brainwashing and sodium amytal interrogation.”

a reply to: WarminIndy

You remember the big "to do" about the Unabomber forging his own likeness on stamps he mailed bombs with?

I do.

Think I met the kid in San Diego one night, introduced to me by some guy I never met before.

Weird night that one.

Anyway, point being...Kandinsky looked nothing like that guy on the stamps.

DUN DUN DUNNNNNNNNN!

a reply to: PorteurDeMort

The Beatles (themselves) had nothing to do with Manson, he was just obsessed with their songs -

- In fact, the song, "Helter Skelter" is actually referring to a thrill ride at a fair, Manson was just so screwed up he thought it was about an apocalypse scenario...

All the celebrity talk and conspiracy talk is not the info ur looking for if u want to know what it "is". Sure they prolly were on it, I would bet the farm on that for sure, but that's not really important info.

originally posted by: GENERAL EYES
a reply to: WarminIndy

You remember the big "to do" about the Unabomber forging his own likeness on stamps he mailed bombs with?

I do.

Think I met the kid in San Diego one night, introduced to me by some guy I never met before.

Weird night that one.

Anyway, point being...Kandinsky looked nothing like that guy on the stamps.

DUN DUN DUNNNNNNNNN!

I really don't remember much about him, only that the government said his brother had turned him in. I always wondered how the guy lived up there in that cabin and didn't even have a car and yet he was able to get to those places to plant bombs. The local post office didn't seem to be concerned about him sending bombs in the mail, I thought the postal service monitored for those things.

I mean, if the guy was so highly intelligent, how is it he forgot that he couldn't send the bombs by mail and thought he wouldn't get caught? I just really don't know what to think about him, but apparently he managed to save his manuscripts and blueprints.

Maybe he was a psychopath, but what he did doesn't make sense, why would he save his manifesto and blueprints, did he not know he would be caught eventually? Psychopaths maybe don't think that way, but he managed to have some career.

They do say, "there is a fine line between genius and madness". I really don't know what to think about him.

originally posted by: lostgirl
a reply to: PorteurDeMort

The Beatles (themselves) had nothing to do with Manson, he was just obsessed with their songs -

- In fact, the song, "Helter Skelter" is actually referring to a thrill ride at a fair, Manson was just so screwed up he thought it was about an apocalypse scenario...

Yes, we know this.

The point is this. Charles Manson who had spent most of his life in prison as a very bad loser in life, when he is released from prison, he suddenly becomes a "hippie guru" who knows how to smooth talk young people?

That is what I am referring to, the guy had no formal education, his mother was a prostitute and he was left to his own devices, and ended up in prison a lot. He was deeply impoverished all his life.

So how does a guy who has never been educated, never been in the military, spent his life ducking and dodging the law, become one of the most persuasive brainwasher in California history? How does this happen? He managed to connive several very well educated people, he was involved with several famous musicians and actors. So how did he do this?

Man, the guy must have an IQ of 300.

Do you really think that he loved the Beatles that much? No, he was using the young peoples' love of music to incorporate into a theology that he brainwashed them by it.

How did he learn to do that?

a reply to: WarminIndy

My thoughts on MKUltra is that it is trauma based mind control. Sometimes certain things can be so scary to that people consciously try to block it out, yet it still affects decisions and behaviours of people in different ways. Think about what use to be acceptable to view on TV and if it was to far out of the norm it was not allowed for public viewing. Same went for music. Now it seems like all shows are competing to have the most vile programs. It use to be a subtle slide, now it's considered normal. Same with the messages in music. And people allow the impressional youth to view or listen to garbage. Everyone is vulnerable because we are emotional creatures. These products are meant to jerk around your emotional state which can have long term health consequences, mental and physical. Think of Disney movies, many are very entertaining, but put in backwards messages, like when the cops in Wreck it Ralph beat the crap out of him, he is literally candy coated. It depicts that it is OK for hero's to steal amongst other deviant behavior. Icarly is ripe with bad messages as well. Certain ideas spread like a virus, not everyone will be directly affected, but many will have ideas planted like a seed in there mind just waiting to germinate. It also works for preconditioning the masses for predetermined events or agendas TPTB want to come to fruition will little resistance. I think mind control probably works better when people are unaware of it happening, and people just can't get enough of their PROGRAMS.
Long story short is, what use to be illegal, we now pay money for entertainment. And the internet gives people more access to these concepts. I myself tend to search for things that kind of unsettle my mind which in turn can evoke sadness and anger, but I am not afraid to cry because it helps release that pent up emotional energy. I still would rather watch something cute and happy though.

originally posted by: PorteurDeMort

originally posted by: Zcustosmorum
a reply to: WarminIndy


Makes you wonder what else they have been doing to us all these long years. It would seem that human behavior has changed, quite drastically over time. Kinda scary. Time to fit myself for a tinfoil hat.

And the interesting thing about tinfoil...

Tinnitus and RF

Apparently, RF hearing was first reported in the 1940s by people working with radar, but reports were dismissed as illusions or hallucinations. The phenomenon was investigated scientifically by Frey in 1961, who concluded that RF hearing is a real thing. It can be stopped, for example, by placing a piece of aluminum between the RF source and the ear.

As a long time sufferer of Tinnitus, I can verify that it is very real, but at the same time, I have actually heard RF frequencies. Believe me, it is pretty annoying sometimes to hear very far and distant radio or television when I am not near any source.

Seems that it can be evoked, and people who have Tinnitus might actually be hearing RF. Isn't that one aspect of MKUltra? The use of microwave or RF?

I have Tinnitus because when I was younger I had severe ear infections that scarred the inner ear. Doctors have explained that it is because the hearing is lost because of nerve damage, the brain compensates by creating sounds.

But apparently there is scientific evidence of the benefits of aluminum or tinfoil. Time to make myself a hat, I will see if it helps. And perhaps if MKUltra also uses RF to control people, I can see how it would work. A person can only take so much. But if you have RF that is sending vocal commands at such a low level that you can't hear it through the hiss or static, who knows what you are hearing.

I can see that technique being used.

a reply to: WarminIndy

Some kids under the influence of the right psycho-actives will believe any smooth-talking jive. Manson cultivated his charisma through trying to survive on his own. He was readily available in the know how of life on the streets to influence other new hippies during the Movement.

That's what they learned about certain drugs.
Influence and persuasion, suggestion and then brainwashing.

a reply to: Fireflysky

Betty Boop began as cartoon porn.

I don't think people realize that. The same thing with Shirley Temple when she was little, who was able to pay the most money to see her movies? Men.

I hate to say it, but the Baby Burlesque movies was child pornography. Think about why they called it "Baby BURLESQUE".

originally posted by: GENERAL EYES
a reply to: WarminIndy

Some kids under the influence of the right psycho-actives will believe any smooth-talking jive. Manson cultivated his charisma through trying to survive on his own. He was readily available in the know how of life on the streets to influence other new hippies during the Movement.

That's what they learned about certain drugs.
Influence and persuasion, suggestion and brainwashing.

Yes, that is true.

A perfect storm....

a reply to: WarminIndy

Except that coincidences exist and it is important to do research to rule them out...

Yes, Dr. Henry A. Murray was the doctor who conducted the 'human stress' experiments on Kaczyinski and was also interested in Leary's experiments with mushrooms (probably for future 'projects'), but that doesn't automatically equal Kaczynski and Leary having anything to do with each other...

I don't know how to embed quotes, but the following is directly from an investigative report by Alton Chase (the same author you quoted) in an article for "The Atlantic Monthly"...I put the underlines in..

"Kaczynski thinks that he was never given '___'. And after exhaustive research I could find no evidence that '___' was ever used in Murray's research."

Link: Alton Chase article

The paragraph I quoted from is about half-way down the page..

The '__' parts in the quote stand for 'you know what', I guess ATS automatically does that when you type those letters

originally posted by: lostgirl
a reply to: WarminIndy

Except that coincidences exist and it is important to do research to rule them out...

Yes, Dr. Henry A. Murray was the doctor who conducted the 'human stress' experiments on Kaczyinski and was also interested in Leary's experiments with mushrooms (probably for future 'projects'), but that doesn't automatically equal Kaczynski and Leary having anything to do with each other...

I don't know how to embed quotes, but the following is directly from an investigative report by Alton Chase (the same author you quoted) in an article for "The Atlantic Monthly"...I put the underlines in..

"Kaczynski thinks that he was never given '___'. And after exhaustive research I could find no evidence that '___' was ever used in Murray's research."

Link: Alton Chase article

The paragraph I quoted from is about half-way down the page..

To put quotes in, just copy what you want to post, then come here and click on the button " ,it is third left from the youtube button. The dialogue will pop up and just paste in there what you copied.

There are some things we will never find out, or maybe might take many years to learn about. But as long as there are questions, we should keep the questions in the front.

I just think it is kind of suspicious. I am always asking about things that don't make sense to me.

originally posted by: WarminIndy

Yes, we know this.

The point is this. Charles Manson who had spent most of his life in prison as a very bad loser in life, when he is released from prison, he suddenly becomes a "hippie guru" who knows how to smooth talk young people?

That is what I am referring to, the guy had no formal education, his mother was a prostitute and he was left to his own devices, and ended up in prison a lot. He was deeply impoverished all his life.

So how does a guy who has never been educated, never been in the military, spent his life ducking and dodging the law, become one of the most persuasive brainwasher in California history? How does this happen? He managed to connive several very well educated people, he was involved with several famous musicians and actors. So how did he do this?

Man, the guy must have an IQ of 300.

Do you really think that he loved the Beatles that much? No, he was using the young peoples' love of music to incorporate into a theology that he brainwashed them by it.

How did he learn to do that?

I agree with you on this, it's a distinct possibility...

...my post about the Beatles was in response to another member who said they didn't know if there was a connection to "Helter Skelter" and Manson...

Edit to say: thank you for explaining how to put quotes in - unfortunately, I also don't know how to copy and paste

Also - it's good that you get suspicious and question things...I was only trying to make the point that when something does seem suspicious, it's better to do your own research with actual 'sources' and not just look to conspiracy sites for answers...

a reply to: WarminIndy

Ha ha, I remember the Betty Book episode where they try to intimate Bosco. Wanna be a member? Wanna be a member? And they chase him around with a paddle to spank his bum while they are disguised and he's like NOOO, until the end when Betty Book takes off her cloak and then he' s like OK! Oh and if you get a chance watch Betty Boop's Old Man Of The Mountain, on YouTube, it's funny and naughty with a great musical sound track. (I like some of the old music, it's different and really great. Peace.

a reply to: Fireflysky

Initiate Bosco, not imitate. These auto adjusts for spelling stink about as much as my own spelling

a reply to: WarminIndy

I've never heard of baby burlesque. It sounds kind of repugnant. The things people do to get on tv is mind boggling.

originally posted by: Fireflysky
a reply to: WarminIndy

Ha ha, I remember the Betty Book episode where they try to initiate Bosco. Wanna be a member? Wanna be a member? And they chase him around with a paddle to spank his bum while they are disguised and he's like NOOO, until the end when Betty Book takes off her cloak and then he' s like OK! Oh and if you get a chance watch Betty Boop's Old Man Of The Mountain, on YouTube, it's funny and naughty with a great musical sound track. (I like some of the old music, it's different and really great. Peace.

a reply to: lostgirl

(left click on desired section, right click, press copy. Then paste by right clicking again. OR, the keyboard shortcuts)

Back on topic, Manson preferred The Beatles and yet Led Zeppelin was way less cryptic.

"You ain't no dancer"....Susan Atkins couldn't spell Helter correctly, she wrote "healter".

a reply to: WarminIndy


There's a great free E-book in the first bit of this thread which makes for some very interesting reading - the work of Dr Colin Ross is also well worth a look.

Operation Mind Control spoke truth to power as few books published in the past thirty years have done. That is why the government tried to destroy it. Years ago I had the opportunity to discuss these matters with John Marks, the brilliant author of The Search For The Manchurian Candidate: The CIA and Mind Control. Mark's volume somehow escaped the government's relentless campaign waged upon its predecessor. I highly recommend his book in addition to Operation Mind Control. Two excellent documentaries tell the sordid and shocking story discussed in these books. They are, Mind Control: America's Secret War, and Bad Trip To Edgewood.

Cheers.