Where did the White man come from?

We became white because the colors didn't like us.

Well, I made a stab at it anyway.

I don't buy into us being white because of living in caves either. They make up some stuff.

a reply to: coomba98

actually fur and hair are chemically the same. Most people make the difference between themselves and their pets.
But their is no difference chemically speaking. We humans say its different to separate ourselves from animals.
However like most or all humans were totally wrapped up in our own self proclaimed superiority.

No argument there, we just use the term "hair" as opposed to "fur," although we don't sport an undercoat as fur does. Fun fact, humans have as many hair follicles as Chimpanzees, just not the same thickness of hair - barring the occasional specimen of southern European...

i thought all humans started in africa and had black skin. as humans migrated throughout the world their skin/hair/eyes became different shades because of the melanin needed because of varying degrees of sun exposure/vitamin d.

a reply to: coomba98

Well you have proto European, and indo European.

Indo europeans came from over the caucasus mountains. They have a common ancestor with Africans /modern humans. Their migrations came long after Proto Europeans existed. They were not the original inhabitants of Europe.

Proto Europeans were always in Europe. It is entirely possible that they migrated INTO Africa before all the out of Africa migrations happened. They could have been the original populations of modern humans....they could have always existed in small numbers. THEY could be the common ancestor to modern humans instead of sharing one with other homosapiens as is suggested with the out of Africa models of migrations.

IMO, Proto Europeans were modern humans, which migrated into Africa, mixed with local populations, and then their mixed descendants became the dominant population there which then spread to other parts of the world, and then even back into Europe.

Thats my theory.

I also think that proto Europeans are a hybrid between neanderthal and another yet unknown hominid.

All this would have happened long before modern humans became the dominant hominid on earth thanks to African descendants spreading the new genes to all other parts of the world.

Proto Europeans are : The UK, Ireland, Spain, and most of France.

Worth a mention...most of these countries have histories of being prolific sailors. They may have just settled in Europe from other parts of the world MANY years ago.

originally posted by: coomba98
Zanti Misfit,
if that was the case then Eskimo's would turn white. But they havnt.

Distribution of Melanin is not solely decided by UV exposure. The UV exposure also correlates with Vitamin D production. When people, like the Inuit for example, have high levels of exposure to UV(which they do for half the year) AND have a diet high in Vitamin D, they maintain the level of Melanin in their skin that is currently exhibited.

cosmic66,
I agree they do have white people in their culture, but how many 100's years of interbreeding has occurred.

Caucasian appearing people have been in Persia for millennia

cosmic66,
Yeah i know of that empire, but again olive skin and black hair. Its not an opinion its fact. There are no
paintings or art that depicts white man being the prevalent race of that culture.
Also if a white family moves to these areas and have kids with another white person than that kid would be 'white' and their nationality would be where they were born. I think your picture examples lie in this area.

Huh?!?! You're talking about an Empire that spanned 3 continents from Egypt and Bulgaria in the East to the entirety of what was then the civilized world, across Babylon, into Bactria and north into Kazakhstan. Yet you think it was one homogenous looking people? Interesting.

Proper Irans/Persians have olive skin and dark hair. You cant use todays Irans/Persians due to families of all races intermingling.

I would implore you to read up a little more on Persian history if that's really what you believe.

Im an Aussie and im sure I can find you an Aussie that is Asian, African or Indian where their parents where born here and their parents. They are Aussies!

Rather poor comparison using a country that's what? 250 years old that started as a penal colony and a place to dump the undesirables and using it as a basis of comparison with a proud and currently homogenous country that's had Isolationist tendencies for thousands of years since the death of Alexander the Great.

Got any ancient pictures?

Blackmarketeer, Cuervo,
Yeah not looking at how white man became white, its obvious a whole culture evolved this way, but what was that culture?

What exactly is obvious here that you are so insistent that there must be a "white mans empire" hidden by the sands of time that you desperately want to call your own?

maxzen2004, my guess is the climate has been getting warmer and warmer for that last 12,000 years. Before that was an ice age where we no doubt evolved to grow more hair. Probably been happening for ever. We grow hair when needed and loose it when we dont. Plus having cloths could slow down or prevent this evolution from occuring.

Climate had very little to do with hominid body hair as clothing has been a staple for H. Sapiens since prior to leaving Africa 70KYA. Clothing has been in use since at least 83KYA and very likely as far back as 170KYA based on genetic divergence between head lice and the clothing louse, as gross as it sounds the science is there to back it up.

Neanderthal, Erectus and likely Denisovan all had roughly the same body hair on average as H. Sapiens Sapiens do today. The advent of controlled fire and use of tannic acid to preserve hides went a long way towards less body hair quite a ways back in our family tree.

I've got to ask again though... You keep going back and continuously making a point for a white empire to call home so what exactly is the impetus for this line of thought and what evidence leads you to believe this is the case? There is certainly a rich cultural history in Africa, Asia, with Aboriginal Australians, but outside of Australia, there is no ONE single culture or empire that began it all in the way you seem to be portraying things that necessitate this white homeland or whatever it is you're striving for. I'm just trying to understand your position better from an anthropological perspective.

a reply to: coomba98

I'm not sure how I became " white" ,: I know that in the summertime my skin is olive and under florescent light for a period of time my skin is light biege. I know some "white" folks who tan improperly look like oompa loompas and they turn orange.

My skin has never been white arugably a albino is not even truly white. Nor is a brown man black . I mean lets seriously entertain this idea . So I'm white right? and I want to commit a crime well instead of running till my lungs give out I'm just gonna run to the nearest white Honda civic and kneel and freeze, and they will pass me because I just blended with my natural camouflage like the #en predator.

Even better I'm black so I naturally only commit crimes at night because I fade away into the darkness. Are you serious?

We can't use solid colours to describe pigment because we are giving merit to our natural fallacy to put hard definitions equal to discrimination. You should rather ask why do we care what colour I most resemble when resemblence doesn't equal actuality ever?

originally posted by: FalcoFan
a reply to: coomba98

Space.
My honest opinion.

I agree with this post even though it sounds crazy. Actually, I partly agree. I remember some works of ancient wall art in China which depicts some White men in Spaceships, and I think I heard something about the MAYA or some other ancient culture which described some Gods who came down in Spaceships & "visited" whom were White. That being said, I don't think White people come from Space but there are "others" from Space who look just like White people. There are, of course, other depictions of spacemen with brown skin but that's for another thread.

I've always been partial to the explanation given in the Urantia Book, Paper 64: The Evolutionary Races of Color. It's a little far out (especially for people who have no idea what this book is about), but... it's as good as anything else I've heard, if not better:

6. The Six Sangik Races of Urantia

1. The red man. These peoples were remarkable specimens of the human race, in many ways superior to Andon and Fonta. They were a most intelligent group and were the first of the Sangik children to develop a tribal civilization and government. They were always monogamous; even their mixed descendants seldom practiced plural mating.
...
About eighty-five thousand years ago the comparatively pure remnants of the red race went en masse across to North America, and shortly thereafter the Bering land isthmus sank, thus isolating them. No red man ever returned to Asia. But throughout Siberia, China, central Asia, India, and Europe they left behind much of their stock blended with the other colored races.

2. The orange man. The outstanding characteristic of this race was their peculiar urge to build, to build anything and everything, even to the piling up of vast mounds of stone just to see which tribe could build the largest mound. Though they were not a progressive people, they profited much from the schools of the Prince and sent delegates there for instruction.

The orange race was the first to follow the coast line southward toward Africa as the Mediterranean Sea withdrew to the west. But they never secured a favorable footing in Africa and were wiped out of existence by the later arriving green race.

3. The yellow man. The primitive yellow tribes were the first to abandon the chase, establish settled communities, and develop a home life based on agriculture. Intellectually they were somewhat inferior to the red man, but socially and collectively they proved themselves superior to all of the Sangik peoples in the matter of fostering racial civilization. Because they developed a fraternal spirit, the various tribes learning to live together in relative peace, they were able to drive the red race before them as they gradually expanded into Asia.

4. The green man. The green race was one of the less able groups of primitive men, and they were greatly weakened by extensive migrations in different directions. Before their dispersion these tribes experienced a great revival of culture under the leadership of Fantad, some three hundred and fifty thousand years ago.

The green race split into three major divisions: The northern tribes were subdued, enslaved, and absorbed by the yellow and blue races. The eastern group were amalgamated with the Indian peoples of those days, and remnants still persist among them. The southern nation entered Africa, where they destroyed their almost equally inferior orange cousins.

5. The blue man. The blue men were a great people. They early invented the spear and subsequently worked out the rudiments of many of the arts of modern civilization. The blue man had the brain power of the red man associated with the soul and sentiment of the yellow man. The Adamic descendants preferred them to all of the later persisting colored races.

6. The indigo race. As the red men were the most advanced of all the Sangik peoples, so the black men were the least progressive. They were the last to migrate from their highland homes. They journeyed to Africa, taking possession of the continent, and have ever since remained there except when they have been forcibly taken away, from age to age, as slaves.

I'm not sure this answers the OP's question, but it's one hell of a read. I must warn anyone who clicks on the link that the books claims to be revelatory in nature, and that the different races of Earth (they call it "Urantia") were (somewhat) simultaneously developed through evolution guided by spiritual beings. These races were then infused with "pure" genetic-spiritual material that quickened both aspects of our evolution.

Just a different take on the whole thing.

Northern latitudes.

Fair skin helps with vitamin D absorption from the sun, which is in short supply at Northern latitudes that may also be prone to frequently overcast conditions and... it's cold so people are more covered. It's just an adaptation to get as much from the sun as we can get in those conditions. Generally, (although there are exceptions) the further north you go when looking at origin populations the more white skin is selected for, and the paler the general population becomes.

Edited to Add:

My husband liked the space theory. He says white people come from mars where the pale skin reflected more of the suns rays that came through the thinner atmosphere. The lower gravity also explains why we can't jump.

originally posted by: combatmaster
a reply to: coomba98
Im gonna throw a wild guess here and say.... Europe!

Insane ... i know!

I would use the term Eurasia myself.

a reply to: Sremmos80

I'll have to try and find the relative articles, but i remember reading multiple times in the last few years OOA is so cut and dry. It's more like several groups left then went back then left again.

As for the OP we're called Caucasians because we are supposedly from the Caucus region.

Africans are pure human
Europeans are a mix of african with a touch of Neanderthal
Asians are a mix of african with a touch of Denisovans
Lots of our dna is unaccounted for so perhaps a touch of Anunnaki who knows.

a reply to: glend

I know you didn't reply to me. But check this out, the other day I was having a beer talking to my mother and she had to ask me to move, because she lost my sillouette amongst the white drywall.we white folks ought to watch out for those milky walls.

I think we white people really did come from Mars, im no doctor or anything but the darker the skin the more protection from the suns rays right, the sun rays on Mars would be alot weaker so not as much protection would be needed.

originally posted by: redhorse
Northern latitudes.

Fair skin helps with vitamin D absorption from the sun, which is in short supply at Northern latitudes that may also be prone to frequently overcast conditions and... it's cold so people are more covered. It's just an adaptation to get as much from the sun as we can get in those conditions. Generally, (although there are exceptions) the further north you go when looking at origin populations the more white skin is selected for, and the paler the general population becomes.

Edited to Add:

My husband liked the space theory. He says white people come from mars where the pale skin reflected more of the suns rays that came through the thinner atmosphere. The lower gravity also explains why we can't jump.

And the leading epidemiologist agrees with you, btw Caucasian for very lite skinned folks is arbitrary it was coined by Johann Friedrich Blumenbach, simply because he liked the people of the area, any geographical area could have been okay, same with Negro/Negroid is simply a name for the river Niger, but black folks back in the day got their nomenclature from various locales.

originally posted by: Blackmarketeer
a reply to: calstorm

Yes, all primates - those in pictures you included have hair not fur.

Primates are mammals that share the following characteristics:

hair instead of fur
fingernails instead of claws
opposable thumbs
higher brain-to-body size ratio/high level of intelligence
prehensility (ability to grasp with fingers and/or toes)
padded digits with fingerprints
binocular vision i.e. both eyes focus on one object (depth perception)
reduced olfactory sense and dependent on vision more than smell

(source)

My post was not a response to you, what does hair have anything to do with me disputing the statement "All apes have black skin?"
The name of the poster whom I was responding to and his statement were quoted in my post.

originally posted by: NeoSpace
I think we white people really did come from Mars, im no doctor or anything but the darker the skin the more protection from the suns rays right, the sun rays on Mars would be alot weaker so not as much protection would be needed.

Congratulations on having one of the most ludicrous ideas yet!

a reply to: coomba98

This is linked to the study of tribal migration, all modern white (Melatonin deficient in that the skin cell's responsible for the pigmentation are mostly turned off causing a semi albino state) races can genetically and linguistically be traced back to the Caucasus mountain's and Eurasia.

All human being alive today genetically seem to share a common ancestry, all out of Africa and in east and southern Africa are actually more closely related than some groups in western and central Africa who have much more genetic variation and the genetic variance in African human's is greater than any where else on the planet showing it is a continent that plays host to many distinct human family's but importantly all these people are Human not some alien species and those differences even at there most pronounced are tiny.

Adaptation, in Africa were there is steady regular sun light black skin is essential to resist skin cancer.
in Europe and the northern deciduous zone were the weather is cold for six month's and warm for six month's sunlight deficiency can cause a lack of vitamin D which is essential to bone development in Africans living here but for Europeans there lack of melatonin is actually useful as there skin can produce more vitamin D from less light, other adaptations are that Europeans have slightly more small capillary's on average in there skin that can ward off frost bite and help to regulate skin temperature.
in the Sub Arctic, Asiatic people's such as the Inuit are adapted to extreme cold, they have more melatonin in there skin than Europeans and this can be explained by the phenomena of snow glare, they are also less likely to go snow blind or suffer from frost bite due to a far higher skin capillary count than even European's.
Native American's may have many origins including from ancient ice age Europe but the strongest genome is of Asiatic origin and the ancestors whom left this marker in there genes are believed to have crossed the baring straits during the last ice age when a land bridge and a series of close island's made it possible to do so from north eastern asia Siberia to Alaska north western America.
Maoris of New Zealand are a Polynesian people and are in some cases believes to at least at a cultural level have a link to ancient India.

A man with a short nose marries a woman with wide nostrils, there children inherit some of this and it is passed on, the village is small and over time all the people inherit this trait even as there population grows so that this people become distinct from other groups from whom they are isolated, another group has paler skin or wider eye's or is taller, shorter etc.

The thing's that makes them human remains though, thought, sentience, self awareness, identity but it is muddied by the sudden perception of there more distant relatives differences in appearance or culture, traditions or language and so they tend to gravitate to those they feel more alike to being blinded by there inherited tribalism that all humans have in common.

Where do we come from, well the spirit is one thing but physically we come from a tiny planet orbiting a mid sequence G2 yellow dwarf star about two thirds of the way out from the centre of a spiral galaxy on one of it's arms and the planet is called earth, though we may also come from elsewhere but that is another question, perhaps this is a prison planet for a defeated race from some ancient intergalactic war and various colonies were wiped out with there survivors shipped her and dumped in different places but then that is pure sci fi, still it would make a good tale.

Personally I actually believe we come from God but then I am a Christian.

a reply to: TechniXcality

lol, they should put bells around your necks yes!

Semicollegiate,
yeah thats where im thinking as well, any known empires or societies where white man was the prevalent race of that culture?
Deffinately dont believe the Sumerians where Caucasian. They are described as the black headed people and all depictions show olive skin.

rickymouse,
lol, in a comedic sense that is funny.

conspiracy nut,
yeah thats where we all originated for sure, Africa. Back then we were the one race though.

tadaman,
pretty sure its now confirmed we all came from africa and mated with other hominoid specied. White man has the most Neanderthal DNA in them, which is I think 5%. Been awhile since I saw that doco.
Shame the Sea People arnt described colour wise.

peter vlar,
Caucasian appearing people have appeared all through our the ancient cultures for millennia. But from where?
Quote "an Empire that spanned 3 continents from Egypt and Bulgaria in the East to the entirety of what was then the civilized world, across Babylon, into Bactria and north into Kazakhstan. Yet you think it was one homogenous looking people?"
Im not talking about the people and lands they conquered. Im talking about that specific society/culture. Obviously if say Persia invaded China and won and China became an extension of Persia, there would still be Chinese looking people in the conquered lands. That does not say that Persians now look like Chinese. Persians will still be Persians.
I do know Persian history and art, the vast majority show olive skin, black hair. Just because Hollywood pays white actors to play Persians or the like does not mean the Persians where white. Thats just Hollywood. Check out the Persian art work, yeah some show Persians with white skin but that few and far between, and said white man has Persian bone structure. Id say they were ones who shunned the sun. Even an olive skinned person can look pretty white if they stay out of the sun.

About finding African, Asian or Indian Aussies is not a poor comparison. Its todays comparison just like the photo examples provided. Intebreeding has increased since air travel which is what the last 100 years, but for the last what 2000 plus people have been travelling across the land and water and making other lands their home.
If one was to say Persians are white then why is their art work showing olive skin?

And yes their has to be a place where white man came from, just like Africans, Asians, Indians. All can pin point an origin. Why is this so hard to understand?

I only have basic knowledge in evolution so I can conceed that point as im ignorant. But gotta say if the climate gets warmer a species would evolve to suit that climate.Thats one part of evolution I understand but im not going to argue on that point.

Neanderthal, Erectus and likely Denisovan is 'believed' to all have roughly the same body hair on average as H. Sapiens Sapiens do today. This is an opinion by science and has not been proven due to their being no Neanderthal, Erectus and Denisovan specimens to compare.... Wait I think they found a Neanderthal in ice once.
Yes Otzi The Ice Mummy, but he was Erectus. Again no expert in decay of bio-material but pretty sure hair goes 1st.

Also im not looking for an empire to call home, I have Australia. Just one of thoughs burning curiosities I have had for a long time now. All other races can pin point their origin, why cant white man?

TechniXcality,
Did I call you a white man? Ive never met anyone at ATS in person so not sure why I would single someone out as being white.
Or are you refering to an accidental communal 'we'?
If its the communal 'we' im sure your big enough to get over it.
But if it helps, Apologies.
And black people commiting crimes at night!! you trolling? really?
My best friend is Zimbabwean and a lot of my mates are from other parts of Africa, they say that being black does not hide you from the dark as a white person, for some reason I dont understand they say that black people dont fade away into the night because they are black, in fact if you put a white person and black person in darkness the white person will be more invisible than the black. From what my African friends say anyway, never tested it.
thats gotta be the most stupid post ive read all week! no offence but re-read your post and think about it within the context of this thread.
Peace!

lostbook,
I have played with the thought pattern when reading the Enuma Elish, which i must point out is not a space battle but a land battle between 2 super powers vs many smaller powers. Re-read the Enuma Elish, take the Gods name for cities or empires and when a specific God talks its the ambassador of said city or empire. The space part only comes into it after the war. To me this talks of the winners degrading the loses into slaves whilst they took off into space most likely with use of their tech. So the winners went to space leaving behind God Kings to look after things, after awhile in space the winners turned white and came back and walla, enter the white man.
But again its only something I entertain thought wise and has no evidence to support it.

NthOther.
ohh crap someone brought the Urantia Book into the last thread on another forum. I tried reading that book but it just speaks of religious dogma. but thats my opinion. Sorry if i offend.

redhorse,
yeah im thinking the origin is the Northern latitudes area. But where and what was the cultures name?

SgtKman,
yeah im thinking that region as well, but cannot find any evidence to show ancient white man had a society.

glend,
i more like to think of it as Africans are more Homo Sapian than other races. I like to rub that 'fact' into racist people I come across. haha, damn their stupid people out there, the racists that is.
The Anunnaki..... I sure do love Sumerian myths. I like ZS translation but dont agree with some of his opinions.
Cant wait for the Anunnaki movie about Marduk that has been coming out for the last what 10 years lol.

Spider879,
glad you said that as I agree, was going to but I thought it might start an argument.
Although it appears white man came from Caucasia their is no definative evidence.

---
cheers all for contributing, excluding TechniXcality who seems like a silly person.

ohh and can anyone guess which race within the human race cannot grow facial hair?