Is Reincarnation Opt to the Person, Dalai Lama suggests it,or can be controled by Politics?

The Peace of God to all that Belong to the Light,
Dear Readers,

Reincarnation is one of the most mysterious aspects of Paranormality and at the same time one of the eldest beliefs in the religious traditions of the world.

In the western civilization, we have groups include the mainstream historical and contemporary followers of Kabbalah, the Cathars, the Druze and the Rosicrucians that accept this possibility. The historical relations between these sects and the beliefs about reincarnation that were characteristic of Neoplatonism, Orphism, Hermeticism, Manicheanism and Gnosticism of the Roman era, as well as the Indian religions, has been the subject of recent scholarly research.

The Greek Pre-Socratics discussed reincarnation, and the Celtic Druids are also reported to have taught a doctrine of reincarnation.

Concerning the Celts , In the 1st century BC Alexander Cornelius Polyhistor wrote:

“ The Pythagorean doctrine prevails among the Gauls' teaching that the souls of men are immortal, and that after a fixed number of years they will enter into another body. ”

Julius Caesar recorded that the druids of Gaul, Britain and Ireland had metempsychosis as one of their core doctrines:

“ The principal point of their doctrine is that the soul does not die and that after death it passes from one body into another..... the main object of all education is, in their opinion, to imbue their scholars with a firm belief in the indestructibility of the human soul, which, according to their belief, merely passes at death from one tenement to another; for by such doctrine alone, they say, which robs death of all its terrors, can the highest form of human courage be developed.

Reincarnation may have been commonplace among the Norse people since the annotator of the Poetic Edda wrote that people formerly used to believe in it:

Sigrun was early dead of sorrow and grief. It was believed in olden times that people were born again, but that is now called old wives' folly. Of Helgi and Sigrun it is said that they were born again; he became Helgi Haddingjaskati, and she Kara the daughter of Halfdan, as is told in the Lay of Kara, and she was a Valkyrie.

The Bible mentioned Reincarnation:

"Behold I will send you Elijah the prophet, before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord." (Malachi 4:5)

Matthew 11:7–14 declares, “Jesus began to speak to the crowd about John: ‘What did you go out into the desert to see? A reed swayed by the wind? If not, what did you go out to see? A man dressed in fine clothes? No, those who wear fine clothes are in kings’ palaces. Then what did you go out to see? A prophet? Yes, I tell you, and more than a prophet. This is the one about whom it is written: “I will send my messenger ahead of you, who will prepare your way before you.” I tell you the truth: Among those born of women there has not risen anyone greater than John the Baptist; yet he who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he. From the days of John the Baptist until now, the kingdom of heaven has been forcefully advancing, and forceful men lay hold of it. For all the Prophets and the Law prophesied until John. And if you are willing to accept it, he is the Elijah who was to come.’”

"And the disciples asked him, saying, 'Why then do the scribes say that Elijah must come first?' But he answered them and said, 'Elijah indeed is to come and will restore all things. But I say to you that Elijah has come already, and they did not know him, but did to him whatever they wished. So also shall the Son of Man suffer at their hand.' Then the disciples understood that he had spoken of John the Baptist." (Matthew 17:10-13)

The first-century Jewish historian Flavius Josephus wrote about the Pharisees being believers in reincarnation. Josephus wrote about the Pharisees' belief that the souls of evil men are punished after death. But the souls of good men are "removed into other bodies" and they will have "power to revive and live again."

A very similar phenomenon to reincarnation is the judeo-Christian belief in Resurrection of the body. However, the resurrection of corpses did not originate with Christianity or with Judaism. It originated with the Zoroastrian religion in ancient Persia (of Magi fame).

In the early years of the XX century Carl Gustav Jung, like Theodore Flournoy did before in his research with mediums, supported the thesis of reincarnation to explain some patients recalled memories of experiences they never had in their lives. His study was based on the research of cryptomnesia in psychism. Later Jung would emphasise the importance of the persistence of memory and ego in psychological study of reincarnation: "This concept of rebirth necessarily implies the continuity of personality... (that) one is able, at least potentially, to remember that one has lived through previous existences, and that these existences were one's own....".

The Buddhist concept of reincarnation differs from others in that there is no eternal "soul", "spirit" or "self" but only a "stream of consciousness" that links life with life. The actual process of change from one life to the next is called punarbhava (Sanskrit) or punabbhava (Pāli), literally "becoming again", or more briefly bhava, "becoming", and some English-speaking Buddhists prefer the term "rebirth" or "re-becoming" to render this term as they take "reincarnation" to imply a fixed entity that is reborn.

Dalai Lama of Tibet, one of the principals of Buddhism around the world has openly declared that he will not reincarnate anymore in his country, that is under occupation of China since 1950.

www.bendbulletin.com...#

The response of the Chinese Government has been drastic, but at the same time extremely curious, if we consider that comes from a Communist regime that by definition is atheistic, they claim that the Reincarnation of the Lama in territory controlled by China is unavoidable and will happen soon or later.

abcnews.go.com...
Moreover the Chinese reaction is going far beyond that point to say that the words of Dalai Lama profanes Buddhism by doubting his reincarnation.

Tibetan Buddhism holds that the soul of a senior lama is reincarnated in the body of a child on his death. China says the tradition must continue and it must approve the next Dalai Lama.

“Decision-making power over the reincarnation of the Dalai Lama, and over the end or survival of this lineage, resides in the central government of China,” said Zhu, formerly a deputy head of the United Front Department of the Communist Party.

Nobel peace laureate, who fled his homeland in 1959 after an abortive uprising against Chinese rule, has said he thinks the title could end when he dies.

He has also stated that he will not be reborn in China if Tibet is not free and that no one, including China, has the right to choose his successor "for political ends."


www.huffingtonpost.com...

The thread is open to discussion on what is the real scope of Reincarnation and everybody is invited to take part on it , Buddhists and no Buddhists.

Thanks,

The Angel of Lightness

Well, I completely believe in reincarnation. I do think you get to choose if and when you come back. And I believe you choose soul lessons to learn during that life. I also believe others can choose to help you, by coming back as well.

At the end of the day, he was taken from his family and named the deli lama . Of course its BS, and the Chinese should not even listen to it.

Why does he not come back as an american. After all him and other members of his family were on the CIA payroll for years

a reply to: Jay-morris

Well, it happen that His Holyness the Dalai Lama is not American, he didn't exile in this country, he has spent all his life after he escaped from His country in India, country that has offered to him full political asylum and protection as a honor guest. He is a religious leader so he is indeed an authority in Buddhism acknowledged by thousands of spiritual organizations around the world.

I don't want to contradict your point of view, but it does not sound so much arrogant that Politicians claim to have control to what happen even with the souls after death?

Of course China has been ruled since 1948 by a Marxist regime that is proud to be the truly continuator of Stalinism, a very extreme version of Communism that is of course totalitarian and inexistent in the rest of the world.

Thanks for your comment,

The Angel of Lightness

Is Reincarnation Opt to the Person, Dalai Lama suggests it,or can be controled by Politics?

The Dalai Lama can come back or not as he wishes. Unlike most of the rest of us, he is off the reincarnation wheel. Anyone who has reached enlightenment can chose to come back and help others, or stay non-incarnated. So yes, the Dalai Lama can decide not to come back if he thinks that it would not be helpful to be here under the heavy hand of the Chinese government.

The fact that China is trying to claim power over other worldly matters is ridiculous and desperate.

a reply to: The angel of light


Please read up on Tibet history. Yes, it was heaven on earth, if you were the deli lama and his cronies,. The the rest of the population it was starvation, slavery, rape, torture and murder.

China did not invade Tibet, they liberated Tibet, with only the ones who held power , running to India.

And they all got away with the crimes against humanity. The deli lama is an american puppet, and def not to be trusted.

a reply to: The angel of light

I firmly believe in Reincarnation, and I've read/heard about this conundrum with the Dalai Lama. If he is that one soul who has been reincarnating into new Dalai Lama's for centuries, then it is up to him to make the decision to cease coming back as the Dalai Lama. Especially if he is being persecuted or kept from teaching - which is his Soul's long-time goal or mission.

He will probably reincarnate in another body in another country, and continue his spiritual teachings with people more advanced spiritually, like him. Perhaps a new line of Lamas will start in Tibet with a younger Buddhist soul. And he can learn and grow along with Tibet. Perhaps the Dalai Lama will choose another worthy Lama soul while he is still alive, from his many disciples.

So even tho' I'm not a Buddhist - although I revere all Great Prophets - this sounds like a natural progression of things. Not a disaster.

Here's my dilemma with that notion: If we think of the Divine Creator as Ultimate Perfection with whom we strive to be united through perfecting ourselves as much as we can, then how can being reborn into this present terrible world that is in ever-increasing imperfection and decay not be too much of a challenge? Speaking for myself here, whereas I once felt in tune with the world and somewhat detached from materialism, I now am seeing too much horror and evil which is beyond my ability to ignore, prevent and overcome.

What I'm saying is that if I were to come back again, I fear and believe my experience would make me regress into complete bitterness against my fellow man. So no, I don't want to return. However I don't have the confidence to say like the Dalai Lama that I will be given a choice.

a reply to: Jay-morris

Nevertheless, Dear Jay, consider the declarations of the Chinese governor of Tibet, they don't have precedents in all the thousands of years of tradition of reincarnation.

This establishes a new level of control of the State over the individual never before claimed by any dictatorship in History, the rule of the political authorities over the person even through the Great Beyond!

Excuse me but that is too much!,

This Chinese functionary makes appear Napoleon Bonaparte, Oliver Crownwell and Ivan The terrible as the three magi visiting the baby Jesus in epiphany and Adolf Hitler as a divine Archangel.

The only freedom that no tyranny ever have touched in History is the interior one, the one of the spirit or soul, and this guy thinks he has the power to determine when is sent the soul of other person?!!.


Thanks,

The Angel of Lightness

EveryBody wants to go to Heaven but nobody wants to die...

To the OP- Did You notice in difference between the East/West on what One envisions at the time of "passing"? This is discussed by many that have experienced near death experiences. It is also discussed in the book "The Tibetan Book Of Living and Dying"-Rinpoche It differs from the original and way more arid "The Tibetan Book Of Dying" It explains what One thinks about as opposed to the FEAR of "death" How to transfer the Energy/Soul/The Animator to the next realm. (For the ET/UFO fans think of Mr. Phil Coppens saying it His own personal way 'reAL-M' ..rip Phil)

namaste

originally posted by: The angel of light
a reply to: Jay-morris

Nevertheless, Dear Jay, consider the declarations of the Chinese governor of Tibet, they don't have precedents in all the thousands of years of tradition of reincarnation, it establishes a new level of control of the State over the individual never before claimed by any dictatorship in History, the rule of the political authorities over the person even through the Great Beyond!

Excuse me but that is too much!,

This Chinese functionary makes appear Napoleon Bonaparte, Oliver Crownwell and Ivan The terrible as the three magi visiting the baby Jesus in epiphany and Adolf Hitler as a divine Archangel.

The only freedom that no tyranny ever have touched in History is the interior one, the one of the spirit or soul, and this guy thinks he has the power to determine when is sent the soul of other person?!!.


Thanks,

The Angel of Lightness

It annoys me that people turn a blind eye to what happened in Tibet. China has not been perfect in Tibet, but its a damn sight better than it was under lama rule.

You have to ask yourself why this has been left out of the media . You have to ask yourself why none of these people were brought to justice.

Its just makes me sick. Anyone who turns a blind eye to this are not peaceful, spiritual people. They are just jumping on the Tibet and dali lama band wagon.

But that's the kind of world we live in

a reply to: The angel of light

Nobel peace laureate, who fled his homeland in 1959 after an abortive uprising against Chinese rule, has said he thinks the title could end when he dies.

Yeah, it's the ultimate monkeywrench-move from the Dolly.

I had next to no respect for the guy til he pulled that one. Go Llama!

a reply to: Bybyots

Communist China may shun the Dalai Llama, but he brings in a lot of tourism ($) to Tibet. Which is a land-locked country that is difficult to reach, with difficult terrain. There are a lot of easier tourist destinations, just in China.

So to China it's all about commercialism, and making the Dalai Llama keep his reincarnation line going to bring in the bucks.

a reply to: Jay-morris

I would love to see a thread about this. I am one of the ignorant ones you speak about. So please consider a thread about it?

a reply to: The angel of light

We can quote scriptures and ancient texts all day long and still be left with hearsay.

Dead men tell no tales.

a reply to: aboutface

Well dear aboutface,

I think to understand fully this mystery of reincarnation one needs to think in a Iittle less selfish form, understanding that this only has sense if we consider the concept of mission, a person or soul has a mission to accomplish that is part of a great plan of improvement for the Universe, not only for the benefit of that individual in particular.

Other important aspect to consider here is the concept of Compassion, that gives us strength and balance enough to tolerate the horrible imperfections that exist in this plane.

So my suggestion is try to be less perfectionist and more compassive.

Now, the only way in which you can go ahead in life without letting the negativity of the world to damage you , and compromise the Light that exist in your soul, is by forgiving, in that aspect Buddhism coincides with other religions like Christianism.

Here a nice video of Dalai Lama where he explains how he has forgiven Chinese for all the evil they have done with him and his country.

www.youtube.com...

Thanks,

The Angel of Lightness

originally posted by: aboutface
a reply to: Jay-morris

I would love to see a thread about this. I am one of the ignorant ones you speak about. So please consider a thread about it?

I should not have to make a thread about it. I have already given you food for thought. Just go find out the real history of Tibet and not the western propaganda we are fed.

You have to ask yourself why many pro Tibet people don't know the real history, or choose to forget it.

How can anyone say China invaded Tibet and drove the lama away, when 90% of the population had know rights at all. Born only to serve these monsters.

Their torture methods were horrific. We are talking about skinning alive, eye gouging , cutting off body parts like hands. feet, tounge etc.

Go and look. Its all there.

originally posted by: The angel of light
a reply to: aboutface

Well dear aboutface,

I think to understand fully this mystery of reincarnation one needs to think in a Iittle less selfish form, understanding that this only has sense if we consider the concept of mission, a person or soul has a mission to accomplish that is part of a great plan of improvement for the Universe, not only for the benefit of that individual in particular.

Other important aspect to consider here is the concept of Compassion, that gives us strength and balance enough to tolerate the horrible imperfections that exist in this plane.

So my suggestion is try to be less perfectionist and more compassive.

Now, the only way in which you can go ahead in life without letting the negativity of the world to damage you , and compromise the Light that exist in your soul, is by forgiving, in that aspect Buddhism coincides with other religions like Christianism.

Here a nice video of Dalai Lama where he explains how he has forgiven Chinese for all the evil they have done with him and his country.

www.youtube.com...

Thanks,

The Angel of Lightness

The post above clearly proves my point about people knowing nothing about Tibet

a reply to: The angel of light

Here a nice video of Dalai Lama where he explains how he has forgiven Chinese for all the evil they have done with him and his country. 

Does the lama ever talk about the horrors of his own people under lama rule?

a reply to: Jay-morris

Jay, I don't know what are your sources, but judging for your avatar I would think that you are devouring tons of Communist Chinese propaganda that is written to justify an invasion of another country just for expansionist ambitions.

China didn't invade Tibet because they wanted to liberate other nation of a tyrannical rule, what ever have occurred in Tibet before they arrival is a joke aside of the dozens of millions of victims of the concentration fields arranged by Mao Tse tung either in the Civil war or in the purges of the cultural revolution.

www.youtube.com...

Tibet was a reservoir of genuine Buddhist virtues : tolerance, respect to every human being and care for animals, those were the values that they shared before to be attacked. At that same time millions of Chinese were dying of starvation working as slaves for a State that was taken away their lands.

China invaded Tibet because they needed disparately the land and resources of Tibet, a nation with very low demographic density but as large as south Africa or Colombia.

The red China of that moment was exhausted by all the terrible mistakes committed with the centralization of the economy, the collectivization of the agriculture and the constant pressure of an uncontrolled demographic explosion.

Tibet was the third chapter of the Chinese imperialism, the first two were the violent annexation of other two nations: Manchuria, and Inner Mongolia.

The invasion of Tibet was one of the most smart political moves of History, the Chinese appeared as friends, but their intentions were conquest. If that would not be the case why there was a general rebellion in 1959? The suffocation of that revolt is still today considered as one of the most cruel and coward massacres ever committed in History, hundreds of thousands of unarmed peasants of monks were murdered by one of the worst military machineries of the XX century.

www.youtube.com...

The Dalai lama is son of peasants, he is not a person born as a King, he never had luxuries or power when he was born, he understand better his people than any politician since he is coming from them, and so he has high sense of duty for them.

He got a vision one or two weeks in advance of he invasion of Chinese troops in 1959 that remains as an outstanding paranormal premonition. His escape from Tibet crossing Himalayas evading the Chinese surveillance was practically a miracle.

www.youtube.com...

Thanks,

The Angel of Lightness