Texas Bill to Make Filming Police Illegal

originally posted by: Realtruth
a reply to: WeAreAWAKE


Reread what she posted....very slowly.

She was not taking any illegal drugs, it was an assumption by the medial staff.

You may be correct. I can't say. She stated "loaded to the gills on prescription steroids" and I assumed "loaded" meant more than prescribed. If I was wrong...I take that back. But she didn't argue my statement in her response. Don't know.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

I was PRESCRIBED steroids by my doctor for walking pneumonia.

I was still suffering from walking pneumonia AND had sustained a fractured knee. Actually I didn't realize I was manic, I went to the ER to get my knee x-rayed. My admitting BP was 168/104 and I told them there was something seriously wrong and I needed a sedative or something....hence the drug addict assumption. And it was an ice storm, the ER was pretty much empty. So what's your excuse for them ignoring me for 2 hours? I used to be a nursing assistant. That BP is stroke level. Why didn't they come in and check my vital signs? It's illegal in the state of Texas for an EMT to perform direct patient care in an ER without a nurse or doc present...so that guy broke the law when he set foot in my room. In over 6 years as a CNA and over 6 years as a cop I never put anyone in a choke hold. So what's this guy's excuse for tackling a half naked female that is a foot shorter and 200 lbs lighter OFF A BED and choking her????

And you're right, I could have just left work. I went to every supervisor I could corner and begged them to let me go home. I told them I hadn't slept. I told them I was sick. I told them I was injured. They just gave me the brush off. If I had known then what I know now I WOULD have went AWOL and gone home. But at that point I HAD NEVER BEEN IN TROUBLE FOR ANYTHING. Not just as a cop. ANY job I'd ever worked.

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
Or do you think it would look like you were a bully, beating up on someone else? If you were an officer...and I have no reason to doubt that...you know what I mean.

I somehow don't think the solution to that issue is to criminalize recording or documentation of the officers involved.

In court, if your version of events conflicts with that of a LEO you are assumed to be lying, unless you're a judge or political figure. Being able to record your interaction with them evens the playing field. A little.

originally posted by: Bedlam

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE

But in all honesty, I have NEVER had a bad experience with a police officer. Granted, I usually follow the law and if I'm in trouble, I don't mouth off or cause trouble.

I have, though. More than once.

And I follow the law as well. Mostly. Hell, up until I was away too long I was the lead CSSO (that's the SCIF Nazi) at work, before that the lead FSO. It's not a huge place, and we all have to swap hats a lot. But the gubmint gave me the gold peanut of approval and slapped a badge in my hand, too. So it's not like I'm a meth salesman or sex offender.

But about half my relatives (including my late Dad) and not a few of my friends are LEOs of some stripe, and if you want a real adjustment of your expectations, hang around some cops when they let their hair down and listen to the tales.

Worse, go for some ride-alongs with different officers, you get the right one, sort of incite him a bit. Watch the result. It'll be enlightening.

Trust me, you don't have to be a pants-dragging miscreant to get their attention.

Different locations, different cops I'm sure will lead to different experiences. Not that it matters...but...I spent ten years developing software for mugshot imaging. I programmed, installed and worked in jails and police departments often. I've heard their stories from California to Philadelphia and many places in between. Again...never a bad experience and never a story that made me feel awkward. Sure...there was some less than exactly respectable talk and actions, but nothing I ever felt a desire to report to anyone.

And...for the record...this isn't the basis for my good experiences. I've just never been or known anyone that has been harassed any more than they dished out.

originally posted by: ladyvalkyrie
a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

I was PRESCRIBED steroids by my doctor for walking pneumonia.

I was still suffering from walking pneumonia AND had sustained a fractured knee. Actually I didn't realize I was manic, I went to the ER to get my knee x-rayed. My admitting BP was 168/104 and I told them there was something seriously wrong and I needed a sedative or something....hence the drug addict assumption. And it was an ice storm, the ER was pretty much empty. So what's your excuse for them ignoring me for 2 hours? I used to be a nursing assistant. That BP is stroke level. Why didn't they come in and check my vital signs? It's illegal in the state of Texas for an EMT to perform direct patient care in an ER without a nurse or doc present...so that guy broke the law when he set foot in my room. In over 6 years as a CNA and over 6 years as a cop I never put anyone in a choke hold. So what's this guy's excuse for tackling a half naked female that is a foot shorter and 200 lbs lighter OFF A BED and choking her????

And you're right, I could have just left work. I went to every supervisor I could corner and begged them to let me go home. I told them I hadn't slept. I told them I was sick. I told them I was injured. They just gave me the brush off. If I had known then what I know now I WOULD have went AWOL and gone home. But at that point I HAD NEVER BEEN IN TROUBLE FOR ANYTHING. Not just as a cop. ANY job I'd ever worked.

Thank you for clearing that up and sorry for the assumption. I read that wrong. Again...my condolences for your experience and I wish you well.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

It would have shown me telling her to leave multiple times. It would have shown me walking her to a taxi, her ALMOST getting in and then getting back out and continuing to yell and cuss. It would show me reminding her that she had just been given a criminal trespass warning and that she would be arrested if she failed to leave. It would show her still yelling an cussing and causing a scene. Then it would have shown me saying "That's it you're under arrest. Turn around and put your hands behind your back." Then as soon as I grabbed one wrist it would show her twisting and pulling. It would have shown me putting her into the wall to gain control and her still twisting and struggling. Then it would have shown me putting her to the ground at which point my cover made it to the struggle, we got her under control and she was cuffed without further incident.

And if you were to read her compliant you would notice that 4 pages out of 7 was complaining about the Greyhound ticket policy. You would also read where SHE states that I offered to give her a ride to the homeless shelter, which she declined. That I had given her the criminal trespass warning, and that I told her multiple times to leave.

Sometimes force is necessary. Sad but true. But you're supposed to only use just enough force to effect the arrest. No more.

If I was an officer? Google my name: Cat Lafitte I don't lie. Never have, never will.

originally posted by: Bedlam

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
Or do you think it would look like you were a bully, beating up on someone else? If you were an officer...and I have no reason to doubt that...you know what I mean.

I somehow don't think the solution to that issue is to criminalize recording or documentation of the officers involved.

In court, if your version of events conflicts with that of a LEO you are assumed to be lying, unless you're a judge or political figure. Being able to record your interaction with them evens the playing field. A little.

Yes...but in reality and life, you are judged like that officer in Ferguson. "Hands up don't shoot" when it never happened...when the kid was a violent punk. The poor cop not only had to live with killing a teen, but with a mob wanting him dead, publishing his address and phone number, the f'ing DOJ there to support them and their rioting. Yes...he was judged not guilty. But look at the cost to him and the sentence he has to serve.

If someone had recorded that...he would have gotten off more quickly. But do you think anyone there...anyone of those same people who later rioted would have turned that recording over? Maybe? It is kinda like internet comments about products. You rarely comment when you get what you expected, you always comment when you got crap.

But...just my opinion.

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
And...for the record...this isn't the basis for my good experiences. I've just never been or known anyone that has been harassed any more than they dished out.

I'm sure it varies by area as to what they're allowed to get away with traditionally.

But I've seen lots of stuff that was blatantly unlawful, and personally, like I said, I've had more than one encounter that was neither legal nor "asked for".

I'm not sure where you live, but you want to test it out, go to the front desk at the local PD and the local SO, ask for the form that you use to file a complaint against an officer. Don't say why. Just ask for the form. Dress casually. No suit, no draggy pants. Don't be rude, don't be subservient. Get a good photo of your face beforehand, though, I hear it helps the plastic surgeon.

eta: Don't tell them why, either. They'll ask. Just ask for the form again, politely, until you get it. Or you "get it".

originally posted by: ladyvalkyrie
a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

It would have shown me telling her to leave multiple times. It would have shown me walking her to a taxi, her ALMOST getting in and then getting back out and continuing to yell and cuss. It would show me reminding her that she had just been given a criminal trespass warning and that she would be arrested if she failed to leave. It would show her still yelling an cussing and causing a scene. Then it would have shown me saying "That's it you're under arrest. Turn around and put your hands behind your back." Then as soon as I grabbed one wrist it would show her twisting and pulling. It would have shown me putting her into the wall to gain control and her still twisting and struggling. Then it would have shown me putting her to the ground at which point my cover made it to the struggle, we got her under control and she was cuffed without further incident.

And if you were to read her compliant you would notice that 4 pages out of 7 was complaining about the Greyhound ticket policy. You would also read where SHE states that I offered to give her a ride to the homeless shelter, which she declined. That I had given her the criminal trespass warning, and that I told her multiple times to leave.

Sometimes force is necessary. Sad but true. But you're supposed to only use just enough force to effect the arrest. No more.

If I was an officer? Google my name: Cat Lafitte I don't lie. Never have, never will.

I'm not fighting with you...I already said I had no reason to doubt you. No reason to get angry with me.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

Oh and when you get done reading the media version of the events....brought to you by DPD. You can read my thread and get the WHOLE truth, with documentation.

The average person is powerless against the system. Being able to record interaction with the police is one of the very few tools we have left, if they manage to take that... well things will be even worse than they are right now and they're pretty darn bad.

Transparency in government is absolutely necessary. And even with straw man laws such as Open Records Act, they're still getting away with murder. Look at Hillary Clinton and her e-mails.

originally posted by: Bedlam

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
And...for the record...this isn't the basis for my good experiences. I've just never been or known anyone that has been harassed any more than they dished out.

I'm sure it varies by area as to what they're allowed to get away with traditionally.

But I've seen lots of stuff that was blatantly unlawful, and personally, like I said, I've had more than one encounter that was neither legal nor "asked for".

I'm not sure where you live, but you want to test it out, go to the front desk at the local PD and the local SO, ask for the form that you use to file a complaint against an officer. Don't say why. Just ask for the form. Dress casually. No suit, no draggy pants. Don't be rude, don't be subservient. Get a good photo of your face beforehand, though, I hear it helps the plastic surgeon.

Dude...I don't know where you live but it is nothing like that here in the Pocono Mountains of Pennsylvania or where I grew up in Southern New Jersey. Might be time to move if it is really that bad there. I don't doubt your words...I'm just very surprised how different, different areas can be.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

I'm not angry. I would love to tell what happened to me to anyone who will listen. It's painful for me, but that's one more person that knows the truth. And I'm the prime example of exactly why legislation like this is a dangerous precedent.

Like I said before, the ER security told me they gave the security footage to the Plano Police. But the Plano Police conveniently lost it. Then refused to talk to the only witness. I was the victim of excessive force at best, aggravated assault at worst and they charged ME. Then, 2 years later after the charge was dropped, did they charge HIM? Hell no. Did I get an apology? Hell no. If you end up on the wrong side of the system, you are screwed. Trust me, you need all the help you can get.

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
I don't doubt your words...I'm just very surprised how different, different areas can be.

So was I, the first time. Luckily, I was about 16 the first time and still innocent and trusting, they cured that # right off the bat, though.

I see it as a valuable learning experience. It informed a lot of my interactions with people later in life.

Sadly, though, my life ambition to have a local LEO come through the gate at work unescorted never came to pass.

In all seriousness, there are small towns down here where you would tote a beating. Even some bigger ones, if you go into an NOPD precinct and request a complaint form, it will not go well with you.

eta: A "for instance"...NOPD is very helpful if you're feeling bad. During Katrina, a black guy was having a heart attack, they couldn't get him to a hospital due to the wreckage. So they took him to a police checkpoint. Where the NOPD helped him out by taking him away, shooting him, and then burning him to death to get him over the cardiac problems. He hasn't had any further issues with his heart since.

Another anti-freedom pro-police state piece of legislation. Maybe they can combine this with Oklahoma's lawmakers bill to make politicians exempt from arrest and prosecution. see: Kevin Calvey (R – Oklahoma City) Lawmakers Trying To Pass Bill Exempting Politicians From Arrest And Prosecution For Corruption

Here is this lawmaker's name and address:

Jason Villalba (R-Dallas)
Capitol Address:
Room E2.404
P.O. Box 2910
Austin, TX 78768
(512) 463-0576
(512) 463-7827 Fax

District Address:
10210 North Central Expressway, Suite 220
Dallas, Texas 75231
(214) 363-8700
(214) 363-8701 Fax

Let him know how pleased you are with his politics.

originally posted by: Blackmarketeer
Here is this lawmaker's name and address:

I'll bet he's hunkering down at this point.

originally posted by: johnwick
a reply to: windword

None of this matters. Texas can't overrule the constitution. The supremes already ruled on this subject.

Citizens have a right to record public servants while they work at all times in public places.

No sorry attempt at blocking this by a state legislature can change this.

It is unconstitutional, and will be shot down like all the other retard crap these idiots keep trying to pull.

Can we make a law that would punish lawmakers if they made unconstitutional laws?

a reply to: Blackmarketeer

I recommend folks use snail mail. Which I will end up doing. I already posted my e-mail to his office earlier in this thread. I specifically requested to 'be sure and write back to me so I know you got this' and all I got back was a canned response.

Phil King's office gave a real bland answer, but at least it was actually written by a person.

And (drumroll) - the ones who asked Villalba for the bill are outed - Dallas Police Officers Association and FOP.

So it's a union sponsored bill, as I suspected. Cha-ching!

originally posted by: beezzer

Can we make a law that would punish lawmakers if they made unconstitutional laws?

Go you your room!

We'll have no logic and reason in the USA these days.

Can you imagine the nerve of beezzer even suggesting something like this?

a reply to: jude11

yup so true. Plus there are already laws in place that say you can't hinder police. That means this law is useless in the "driving goal" they want to uses it for. That also means they wanted for another reason, that reason can only be not being recorded at all.

AT 100 feet a camera not zoomed in has trouble backing out things such as faces or clear ID'ing markings. Also if the people stay around after the police to clear out an area around them it's under disobeying an officer once again another law already in place, further proof this is not why they need this law.

TX need to watch the people that are backing this law and are trying to push it forward, cause they are a great risk to everyone, not just TX.