NO reincarnation, " FOR YOU."

originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: Tangerine

Because this is huge for Buddhists. It would be as if Pope Francis were to declare that he had a terminal illness and that God had given him a vision that he was the fulfillment of Malachy's prophecy only bigger ... more as if an apparition appeared during a very public mass and declared that Francis would die and there were to be no other Popes.

I get that. I said that. Did you not get that?

I'm confused as to why you bother even posting. Why would you assume that the only people who would care would be Buddhists? Why are you so narrow minded?

I may be Christian, but this has huge implications spiritually for a lot of people. It makes my heart ache for them that they have to be caught out in this fight.

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: Tangerine

Because this is huge for Buddhists. It would be as if Pope Francis were to declare that he had a terminal illness and that God had given him a vision that he was the fulfillment of Malachy's prophecy only bigger ... more as if an apparition appeared during a very public mass and declared that Francis would die and there were to be no other Popes.

I get that. I said that. Did you not get that?

I'm confused as to why you bother even posting. Why would you assume that the only people who would care would be Buddhists? Why are you so narrow minded?

I may be Christian, but this has huge implications spiritually for a lot of people. It makes my heart ache for them that they have to be caught out in this fight.

I asked a poster why s/he cared to find out why s/he cared. If I had assumed that there was only one reason for caring I would have had no reason to ask, would I?

Huge implications spiritually. LOL. They've just been told by their spiritual leader that their belief system is a crock. I've always admired the Dalai Lama, alone, among all religious leaders and now I know why: he's the only honest one.

a reply to: Tangerine

Huge implications spiritually. LOL. They've just been told by their spiritual leader that their belief system is a crock.

No he didn't. He didn't declare that no one reincarnates. The followers of the Dalai Lama are Buddhist. The fact that the Dalai Lama has said that he will not reincarnate again, so don't go looking for him, doesn't change anything about their Buddhist religion or their faith in the Dalai Lama.

a reply to: AnuTyr

My post got cut in half again... What was missing from the first post is/was: "Yes" it was The Great Buddha Him(Self) who said the quote "If You see the Buddha in the road kill Him..." on the reason(s) He said it, I wouldn't/couldn't imagine as I'm not "there" (yet), it is 'pending' under "Ours not to reason why..."

What was also missing that in the book I mentioned, "The Tibetan Book Of Dying" is as arid as The Sahara, I'd recommend the other by Sogyal Rinpoche. It contains a 'key' in getting "Off the Wheel" (not having to or having the 'option' of re-incarnating. As I don't want to play "spoiler" •••Spoiler Alert••• It has to do with "attachment" and at the time of "passing" it has to do w/the "attachment to the Body" It was Jesus The Chris† who said "You are NOT Your body"...

You can't be ALL of them if You're One of them...

namaste

P.S. When Siddhartha Gautama became The Buddha what was the last thing He did????

a reply to: marg6043

Did You see that part of the deal is that He has to register with the Chinese Gov't? Maybe He has experienced "the other side" and to Him it "has to be better" than being under the thumb of the same guys that He blew of 56 years ago... I'm fine with anything He decides for Him(self) (I've even invited Him to go fishing but without hooks if He ever makes it to Flori-Duh)

"Perhaps it is better to Wake Up after all, even to suffer, rather than to remain a dupe to illusions in One's life"... Kate Chopin..

So The Dalai Lama says He has had His fill and The Pope says that RFID chips are 'great'.. Is this the time to tell folks to start looking inside? (where every answer 'lies'...)

I'd say it is "Mr. Yang" taking the patriarchal crap with Him and welcoming the Yin, The Devine Feminine...

Ours not to reason why...

namaste

Things are looking very grim when an esteemed religious figure announces he no longer wants to be a part of humanity.

Because this is huge for Buddhists. It would be as if Pope Francis were to declare that he had a terminal illness and that God had given him a vision that he was the fulfillment of Malachy's prophecy only bigger ... more as if an apparition appeared during a very public mass and declared that Francis would die and there were to be no other Popes.

Not really.

I am a Buddhist who does not believe in reincarnation.

The Buddha himself told his followers not to blindly follow his teachings and to achieve enlightenment, people would need to find their own path.

I pay very little attention to what the Dalai Lama has to say as he is just another Buddhist to me. The whole thing might be a bit more sensitive to those who practice Tibetan Buddhism, but outside of that community, I think it has more to do with individual beliefs within Buddhism.

As a Buddhist, you are not expected to take anyone's word as gold...not even the Buddhas.

They've just been told by their spiritual leader that their belief system is a crock.

No, we havent.

Buddhism's "belief system" is not very stringent in the first place.

It would also assist (it certainly wouldn't harm the flow of this discussion...) to know that The Great Buddha also wrote/said

"Do not believe in anything simply because You have heard it. Do not believe in anything simply because it is spoken and rumored by many. Do not believe in anything simply because it is found written in Your religious books. Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of Your teachers and elders. Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations. But after observation and analysis, when You find that anything agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of One and All, then accept it and live up to it"...

This and the earlier quote "If You see the Buddha in the road kill Him" This WAS The Great Buddha who said it. Did He say it in '3rd person' for a reason? Back before Google™ would "mine Your mind" I'd say (type) "Google™ these and You'd find 1,000 different thoughts on what they mean. But here is 'The Guy' saying "Don't blindly follow Me, don't believe Me just because it is Me saying it..."

"It'll ALL work out in 'The End' if it hasn't worked out, it isn't 'The End' I'll certainly broach the subject if/when given the opportunity..

namaste

originally posted by: Peeple

originally posted by: Stormdancer777
"There is no guarantee that some stupid Dalai Lama won't come next": Dalai Lama

LMAO

That's just mean and wrong. What he is trying to point out is how the traditions are getting actively weakened by china and whoever would be his successor wouldn't have been able to go through the same teachings and learnings as he and the ones before him did. Buddhist monks have to become violent and get beaten dead on the streets and you are laughing your arse off?
What are you heartless, brainless, or "just" without knowledge on how severe the situation for Tibetans is?

My understanding is that they have imprisioned another high lama, born in Tibet, and put up a fake in his place and are 'overseeing' the Panchen Lama's education.

HONG KONG: A Tibetan youth named by Beijing as the 11th Panchen Lama but reviled by many Tibetans as a fake made his first trip outside mainland China on Thursday as he is groomed to become the spiritual leader of Tibetan Buddhism after the Dalai Lama dies.

Gyaltsen Norbu, 22, was selected as a boy by officially atheist Beijing in 1995 as the second-highest figure in Tibetan Buddhism in its drive to win the hearts and minds of Tibetans.

Tibet's current spiritual leader, the Dalai Lama, had announced his own choice of a six-year-old boy, who was taken away by authorities and has since disappeared from public view, creating a crisis of legitimacy for devout Tibetans.

China reviles the Dalai Lama, who fled into exile in India in 1959 after an abortive uprising against Chinese rule, as a separatist. The Dalai Lama says he is merely seeking more autonomy for his Himalayan homeland.

www.thehimalayantimes.com...

This is purely political on the part of the Chinese. The situation for Tibetans in Tibet is dire (See "Cry of the Snow Lion").

Because Tibetan Buddism has had a diaspora and no longer can claim their homeland, the need for a 'head of state' for tibet is unnecessary. His Holiness has transitioned the Tibetan community in exile to a secular democratic leadership and as for his spiritual successor (s) they are in every corner of the world. A reincarnation of a Dalai Lama is not strictly needed any longer.

In Buddism everything is taken as temporary and traditions change and evolve. Tibetan buddhism is meerly evolving to include many other cultures.

originally posted by: Collateral


Not really.

I am a Buddhist who does not believe in reincarnation.

That's a new one for me - just how does that work?

Dependent orginination and karma over many lifetimes are central tenants for Buddists.

Interesting...

originally posted by: ladyinwaiting
Things are looking very grim when an esteemed religious figure announces he no longer wants to be a part of humanity.

"The Dalai Lama institution will cease one day. These man-made institutions will cease," the 79-year-old Tibetan spiritual leader told the BBC in a recent interview. "There is no guarantee that some stupid Dalai Lama won't come next, who will disgrace himself or herself. That would be very sad. So, much better that a centuries-old tradition should cease at the time of a quite popular Dalai Lama."

According to Tibetan Buddhist tradition, the Dalai Lama is a reincarnation of Avalokiteśvara, the bodhisattva of compassion. It is believed that when a Dalai Lama dies, a successor is born. The title goes back, without interruption, for more than 620 years.

But the current Dalai Lama -- the 14th in this unbroken line -- told the BBC that it’ll be “up to the Tibetan people” to decide whether or not to continue with this institution.

www.huffingtonpost.com...

a reply to: JimNasium

You are spoiling the ending .

Namaste

a reply to: Stormdancer777

It's something the Dalai Lama said long ago. Basically, the position is something that China wants for political reasons, they can claim anyone as the reincarnation and put someone friendly to their interests in the position. As a response the Dalai Lama has stated that when he dies he will choose to not reincarnate, and that even if he does he will choose a different area of the world such as Europe or the Americas.

Essentially, he is preemptively discrediting China's claim to the title once he dies.

a reply to: FyreByrd

The Central tenant of Buddhism is to minimise or eliminate suffering through a variety of Buddhist teachings, methodologies, etc.

The reincarnation or Samsara aspect had a lot to do with the region the Modern Buddhism originated from and this it was incorporated into Buddhism.
That is not to say that you have to believe in reincarnation to be a Buddhist.

Zen Buddhism essentially has nothing to do with reincarnation, for example.

I remember it said that this IS hi last.
and that was over 15 years aago.

The Dalai Lama took the bodhisattva oath so likely he will either choose to reincarnate in other places than Tibet or he will work from the beyond is what my guess would be.

originally posted by: JimNasium
It would also assist (it certainly wouldn't harm the flow of this discussion...) to know that The Great Buddha also wrote/said

"Do not believe in anything simply because You have heard it. Do not believe in anything simply because it is spoken and rumored by many. Do not believe in anything simply because it is found written in Your religious books. Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of Your teachers and elders. Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations. But after observation and analysis, when You find that anything agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of One and All, then accept it and live up to it"...

Some argue that's not a true quote. The real quote suggests people need to experience truth for themselves rather than accepting someone elses point of view.

This and the earlier quote "If You see the Buddha in the road kill Him" This WAS The Great Buddha who said it.

No, that was not said by the first Buddha, Gautama (as in a teacher buddha) but by a saint from Chan buddhism (Chinese buddhism) named Linji Yixuan. All this can easily be verified by a quick google search.

a reply to: windword

I agree, people have a misunderstanding, is more than one reincarnated Dalai lama, so it will be another one to keep the reincarnation.

Is not big deal actually beside that fact that they will not be able to find it in the traditional way due to problems in the Tibet.

And to read that the acting Dalai is not reincarnating for the Buddhist it means he has achieved enlightenment, that is not bad is a big thing and a good thing.

Some argue that's not a true quote. The real quote suggests people need to experience truth for themselves rather than accepting someone elses point of view.

So You're from the school that figures that is not a "real" quote? In what I typed You didn't get the message of NOT believing just because? ...That was why I typed it. NOT to trust anything, just because the Great Buddha said it or "might have said it" or what Pastor Dave's interpretation of what it "true/false" or "good/bad"...

What is the "real quote" and how does that 'differ'? Then "prove" it, prove that the quote You type is the "real one"...

It appears We are on separate paths, together. If We were on the same path at one time, that has changed. That "change" is constant and TheTruth is ALL that stays the same.

Any question(s) are rhetorical in nature and I'm only responding to the stimuli after reading that "People check Your thread replies, make the community work better" I'm paraphrasing and those aren't the "real words" but words to that effect.

May the wind be at Your back as You travel Your Way.

originally posted by: JimNasium


Some argue that's not a true quote. The real quote suggests people need to experience truth for themselves rather than accepting someone elses point of view.

So You're from the school that figures that is not a "real" quote?

I'm not of any school, but I have studied the Tripitaka and the different schools of Buddhism for years.

In what I typed You didn't get the message of NOT believing just because? ...That was why I typed it. NOT to trust anything, just because the Great Buddha said it or "might have said it" or what Pastor Dave's interpretation of what it "true/false" or "good/bad"...

What is the "real quote" and how does that 'differ'? Then "prove" it, prove that the quote You type is the "real one"...

Well what I meant is the quote is only a passage in the Kalama sutta and without the entire sutta might appear different to various readers. The kalama sutta can be found here: www.accesstoinsight.org...