RT -Russia ready to repel any nuke strike, retaliate – missile forces command chief

originally posted by: kitzik

I'm not reading RT comments section, it is full of antisemites from all around the globe lol

And yet mostly typing in Russian

originally posted by: kitzik
The average post in English is just this "average post in English", most of them coming not from Russians and certainly not for
Russians.

Well, we disagree.
While there are certainly some incredibly naive American's and Brit's who will side with Russia simply because of the distrust they have with our own governments, I do believe the majority of the propaganda and denials are from English speaking Russians working to try to change opinions and give the impression to Russian readers that they have allies across the western world.

The truth is Russia has very few sympathizers in Europe or the US. The vast majority of people know what's going on, and even though they might not trust their own government very much, they trust them more than a government clearly invading another country and pretending they haven't.

So, when a post appears on a news site comment section praising Russia and condemning the "Zionist controlled American Nazi government" (yes, I have seen plenty of posts saying exactly this in broken English) and then see ten others starring it or voting it up, it is blatantly clear to most people that this BS is being posted by a propaganda team.

Guaranteed you'll also see people getting stars and up-votes when they point out that the Russian propagandists have arrived to flood the discussion with BS

originally posted by: JonStone
a reply to: johnwick

I forgot to mention that air burst nukes (Bust way above ground) do more damage to the target, but spread far less radioactive material. FEMA expects this to be the most common type of detonation since it does the most kinetic damage. Most of the material is in the plume (Mushroom cloud) that is created when it hits the ground. If a person is prepared, or living in a community with decent leadership and people that help each other (They do exist!), their chances are pretty good. Oh, and beware of rains that have passed through affected areas, these can bring the fallout right on top of you. A geiger counter is probably a good investment for those that are really concerned, so you can check your food and water supply for contamination. Like I said before, growing up in the last cold war taught me a few things. Again, you'll need guns to hunt and protect you and your families supplies with. Refugees get desprate when facing certain death, protect yourselves!

BTW, Juricho was a good TV show, too bad they cancelled it. It was based on a simliar situation, and made many references to the guide I mentioned above.

I loved "Jericho", I saw every episode.

I liked the tank episode especially.

Was s good show.

originally posted by: JonStone
a reply to: Kapusta

please ! democratically elected ....right , just like here in the good old USA right ... a fair election ? right

Or like the people in Crimea and E. Ukraine democratically voted to become part of Russia? Please! At gun point maybe.

Just like Saddam was "elected" president every single time by 100 percent of the populous.

At gun point from their houses, at gun poi t in the voting booth.

a reply to: Rocker2013

So, when a post appears on a news site comment section praising Russia and condemning the "Zionist controlled American Nazi government" (yes, I have seen plenty of posts saying exactly this in broken English) and then see ten others starring it or voting it up, it is blatantly clear to most people that this BS is being posted by a propaganda team.

Why you are so sure, that this upvoting is coming solely from Russian RT shills ?

I see the same pattern here, tbh.

And let me repeat, RT is NOT for general Russian audience.
RT is not on the radar of average Russian leaving in Russia. Just check RT pages written in Russian, their comment sections are almost empty.

originally posted by: kitzik
a reply to: DeadSeraph

While the Russians are masters of propaganda and were certainly effective at it 30-40 years ago

While we are talking honestly about this subject, I'm not aware of any Russian propaganda in the West 30-40 years ago.
I know for sure there was American sponsored "Radio Freedom", which was openly stating every hour "This is radio freedom financed by the USA Congress" lol. Russians tried to silence those broadcasts, but I never heard that Russia had anything similar to RT in the Soviet time.
My point was rather, that even if they tried to have "Soviet Union Today" it wouldn't be popular

I meant more so that Russian propaganda was still very effective against Russians back then, just as American propaganda was effective with Americans (take the communist witch hunt that occurred in the 50's, for example).

This brings an interesting dynamic to our conversation though. In one sense, you can view American propaganda as being less effective on americans to a certain degree, while Russian propaganda seems to have remained somewhat effective on Russians. Could this be a result of how free the media is to express itself in each nation? I believe that to be the case.

It wasn't so long ago we had anti-Putin Russian journalists dropping like flies. Litvinenko being just one casualty during that period of oppression. While it would be erroneous to say that American media doesn't push propaganda on it's viewers, it is much more free to offer dissenting opinions.

I think it's very clear that the propaganda machines are churning on both sides. But it continually amazes me how effective the Russians are at it, as many of the most pro putin users here aren't even Russians, and reside in the U.S, Canada, Europe, etc.

Mind you, we can see clearly what happens to anti-putin activists in Russia, so I'm not so sure I view the silence as an endorsement. In most cases, a beating and a jail sentence is a luxury.

a reply to: Wookiep

I have a feeling the US would be using the same rhetoric/ tactics if the Russians were backing a coup/ civil war in Canada.

I was going to say Mexico, but that just wouldn't make sense...

originally posted by: Sparkymedic
a reply to: Wookiep

I have a feeling the US would be using the same rhetoric/ tactics if the Russians were backing a coup/ civil war in Canada.

I was going to say Mexico, but that just wouldn't make sense...

The Civil War in Ukraine is not the product of the United States. There would be no civil war were it not for Russia supplying arms/armor/vehicles/etc to the Ukrainian Separatists. Not to mention the flurry of rumors that regular Russian military are in Ukraine as well. "On Vacation" we're told.

a reply to: DeadSeraph

Saying things like ''Pro Putin'' is a form of propaganda also.

I rarely see anyone on ATS applauding Putin, those of a more balanced view are seeing that is more to the reality than western propaganda.

I don't consider myself ''Pro Putin'' or even ''Pro Russia'' but for that matter I wouldn't call myself ''Pro UK'' or ''Pro USA'' either as I have the insight to know that the MSM public face of politics, at local and International levels are mostly not as they seem.

Hence I don't buy any of the churned out spin and propaganda that seems to be pushing the public into believing in and supporting global war.

I say no thanks to that, I prefer peace and constructive societies, it is the 'leadership' and political structures of all of these nations that needs questioning.

People should stop buying into their ''them or us'' mentality, it is for the purpose of division and whilst there is division there isn't clarity or a consensus for a constructive way forward.

I think it's very clear that the propaganda machines are churning on both sides. But it continually amazes me how effective the Russians are at it, as many of the most pro putin users here aren't even Russians, and reside in the U.S, Canada, Europe, etc.

originally posted by: kitzik
Why you are so sure, that this upvoting is coming solely from Russian RT shills ?

When you have the majority of comments in English criticizing Russia, with others in broken English praising Russia, while those comments praising Russia get 100 stars compared to the popular opinion getting 10, it's pretty clear what's happening.

originally posted by: kitzik
And let me repeat, RT is NOT for general Russian audience.
RT is not on the radar of average Russian leaving in Russia. Just check RT pages written in Russian, their comment sections are almost empty.

RT, along with the vast majority of all Russian media, is state controlled. This is a reality regardless of those who want to claim otherwise. This is public, not a conspiracy, not a fantasy, it's on record for the entire world to see and it's not something that is in any way hidden.

I'm not talking about the pages of RT, I'm talking about the YouTube streams. Yesterday I checked out the live stream of the march on RT's YouTube, and the live comment section beside it was flowing at a fast rate with propaganda, claims of Nazis, claims of Zionists, attacking Jews, Liberals, praising the Kremlin, even openly praising the killing.

Like it or not, this is the image Russia is sending out into the world, and it reeks to high heaven of a country falling into a fascist regime where ignorance and extreme nationalism is fueled by the state.

Even if you believe that Putin was in no way responsible for this murder, you cannot get away from the fact and the reality that the Kremlin has fueled a rabid nationalism within Russia that is never easy to control. Either way, the Kremlin in responsible for this murder, because without that stoking of extreme nationalism this probably would not have happened.

a reply to: theabsolutetruth

Well I don't mean to dismiss you outright, but you clearly haven't read the bulk of the discussion on the crisis in Ukraine then, because there very clearly ARE "pro-Putin" posters on these boards who completely deny any of Putins injustices or lies in this tragedy.

I myself am not "anti-Russian". I have no problem with the Russian people. I come from a Russian/Ukrainian family on my mothers side, so I really don't have a proverbial dog in this fight. But I call it like it is, and there is a lot of pro-Putin BS pushed on this website, backed by a lot of people who seem to think that just because the west has a jaded past, Putin can do no wrong. That is sort of the issue we were discussing as far as how the dynamics of propaganda have changed between the two nations (the U.S and Russia).

a reply to: DeadSeraph

I avoid most of the politics boards but often comment on the current situation and I have been called ''Putin lover'' just because of my non Pro US stance on the matter and have seen others called the same despite just having a balanced point of view.

Whilst there might be those that are Pro Putin, I have seen mostly Pro USA on these boards.

The name calling is offensive, and beyond presumptive.

a reply to: DeadSeraph

The frightening thing I've seen in the recent past is that Russia has begun to isolate itself from the rest of the world and has systematically been either silencing or taking over all independent news and reporting organizations in it's borders. It has been carving off pieces of land for itself in recent history as well, from the 1992 Moldova conflict, the more recent Georgian conflict, and now the Ukrainian conflict; we see Russia pretty much acting with impunity in expanding it's own landmass. The illegal annexation of Crimea is just the latest in a series of landgrabs that unless confronted, will likely continue into other former soviet nations such as Belarus, Latvia, etc.

The trouble with confronting Russia on it's expansionist ideas is that they can simply threaten the world with Nuclear Annihilation to cow any concrete actions in stopping it's march. I seriously doubt Russia will make a move on any NATO ally, or any country with it's own nuclear arsenal. I only see it taking what land it can, and establishing a new Soviet Union.

That's only my opinion, of course.

originally posted by: theabsolutetruth
a reply to: DeadSeraph

I avoid most of the politics boards but often comment on the current situation and I have been called ''Putin lover'' just because of my non Pro US stance on the matter and have seen others called the same despite just having a balanced point of view.

Whilst there might be those that are Pro Putin, I have seen mostly Pro USA on these boards.

The name calling is offensive, and beyond presumptive.

I find that interesting, as I see most of the stars going to the anti-american side of the argument. Perhaps part of it is due to my own bias, but I don't believe so. I've been watching the subject closely here and elsewhere since the crisis erupted. I haven't seen a lot of "balanced" views, however. There are a few of us left, but mostly the dialog (if you could call it that) tends to be held between true believers on either side.

Just as you might find certain name calling offensive, some of us find the constant accusations that all Ukrainians who voted for pro EU ties are "Nazis" equally offensive. There is enough name calling to go around on both sides.

a reply to: theabsolutetruth

A very well reasoned and thought out response. I often get called an blind U.S. supporter because I lean toward the west in my opinion of the matter. I don't pretend to think the West isn't involved at some level in the Ukraine crisis. I know there's blame to dole out for both sides in the conflict. Trouble is (for me at least), is that I take issue with Russia because of it's support of North Korea, which threatens Japan pretty much on a monthly basis, and lobs missiles into the sea of Japan anytime someone coughs wrong.

a reply to: ScientificRailgun

That is not a matter of opinion. You know your history.

I would hope that not all Russians are compliant with these actions, but who can say in such a large country, where dissent isn't even tolerated? We have seen the same sort of social phenomenon in the U.S where large portions of the population do not support what the government chooses (for instance the Iraq war), yet the public does nothing. Time will tell if Russias foray into the Ukrainian crisis will be remembered as her "Iraqi invasion" (so to speak).

a reply to: Xcathdra

Abkhazia was in fact a land grab. South Ossetia was in fact a land grab. Transnistria was in fact a land grab.

These areas are not part of the Russian Federation, hence they cannot be termed as a land grab. There are RF troops stationed in these areas to maintain peace and order for the locals and give them protection from the hostile forces.

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun

originally posted by: Sparkymedic
a reply to: Wookiep

I have a feeling the US would be using the same rhetoric/ tactics if the Russians were backing a coup/ civil war in Canada.

I was going to say Mexico, but that just wouldn't make sense...

The Civil War in Ukraine is not the product of the United States. There would be no civil war were it not for Russia supplying arms/armor/vehicles/etc to the Ukrainian Separatists. Not to mention the flurry of rumors that regular Russian military are in Ukraine as well. "On Vacation" we're told.

OOOOKAAAAYYY...but my point still stands as NATO still exists and only exists as it sees Russia as a threat. But the logic is flawed, for as long as NATO does what it does (missile defense in Russia's backyard, at the very least - funding mercenaries - yes both sides are complicit in this, at the most), Russia will always be viewed as a threat, whether they are more of a threat than NATO or not. And simply, these nationalistic stances of tit for tat really falls apart when you throw the international banking cartels into the mix. Who's really pulling the strings here? I doubt Putin or Obama.

I'm not defending the rhetoric OR actions of Russia/NATO/US. I was simply just providing a mirror to the OP. And I don't think I am too far off the rails in assuming things would be similar if the roles were reversed.

Put yourself in their shoes. But again, I am not defending the actions/rhetoric of Russia...or the west. In my eyes they are equally reprehensible of the situation in Ukraine, and likely the rest of the world.

a reply to: Rocker2013

When you have the majority of comments in English criticizing Russia, with others in broken English praising Russia, while those comments praising Russia get 100 stars compared to the popular opinion getting 10, it's pretty clear what's happening.

No, it is not clear. You are implying that 100 stars coming from Russians, and my point is that 100 stars coming from ALL anti americans out there.
Broken English can come from everyone who is NOT native speaking English. I may be wrong, but this was my impression in that little time that I wasn't blocking RT comments. As for YouTube stream, I don't know, perhaps it also become the flocking point of all kinds of racists and antisemites. Few weeks ago I visited one american Neo nazi site and found out that Putin is praised there too. The logic goes like this. Putin is against jewish oligarchs, so he is good, almost like Hitler. Shame he is looking like half mongolian udmurtian and not pure arian.

a reply to: Sparkymedic

Well said. No party is blameless in the conflict. Thanks for clarifying your stance, I appreciate that.

originally posted by: DeadSeraph
a reply to: ScientificRailgun

That is not a matter of opinion. You know your history.

I would hope that not all Russians are compliant with these actions, but who can say in such a large country, where dissent isn't even tolerated? We have seen the same sort of social phenomenon in the U.S where large portions of the population do not support what the government chooses (for instance the Iraq war), yet the public does nothing. Time will tell if Russias foray into the Ukrainian crisis will be remembered as her "Iraqi invasion" (so to speak).

Well you see not all Russians believe that what Russia is doing is right.But a national fervor is sweeping through Russia hyped by media. And the term traitor gets applied to anyone not agreeing with Kremlin policies and do to the recent murder we see how dangerous that is.Sadly after the fall of the US SR murder and intimidation is part of politics. In time this will end as the cold war die hards like Putin lose power.
As far as Iraq Amaricans dud do something part of Obamas platform was end the wars. Unfortunately he lied and took 2 terms to do it.But the damage Bush did to republicans isn't over by a long shot sometimes for voices to be heard takes time. And i feel in Russia it will happen as well.