Modern high carbohydrate diet; let's discuss the science behind.

Huh, no carb is totally wrong and in fact if you dont eat carbs at all you will die. That is not debate. The question is if you will live 1 year or 2 years.

All healthy food contains carbs. If you type in google carbonhydrate you will get definition of it. And it says :
Carbohydrates are one of the main types of nutrients. They are the most important source of energy for your body. Your digestive system changes carbohydrates into glucose (blood sugar). Your body uses this sugar for energy for your cells, tissues and organs

BUT what is important is from where do you get your carbs. If it is processed food then it is a problem. Because not only your getting bad carbs, but you are also getting lots of sugar in your body.

I see you all love meat and that why you all say low carb or no carb diet is good. But do you know where from is this meat coming? Meat companies dont care about your proteins and your health, they want money. That why they must make sure their animals are healthy, in other words they give them all kind of medicine, needed and not needed, lots of antibiotics.

And only by knowing that i cant consider animal food healthy. If you need proteins you can get them from plants too.

I would like to hear someone who eats meat, to write something about meat sources. Do you even care if meat you are eating is clean from chemicals? How can you be sure that meat is clean and that animal died in happy way (in other word not releasing cortisol).

If we all are typing in this topic then i think we all care what we eat. So if Ketogenic is good diet, how and where you get clean meat? Or fish?

How can you be sure your fish is mercury free and i watch many food documentaries stating that they started to feed fish to grow faster as well.

a reply to: saadad

Our beef comes from a local farmer who raises organic grass fed beef. It is very good and I have seen their cows, they are healthy. Most of the fish we eat is caught locally from Lake Superior but I do get some wild caught Alaskan Salmon in cans. We do get some fish sticks too, they are highly processed though. The chicken we get is not usually organic but the eggs we get usually are organic.

I eat carbs, but I can't eat a lot at a time. It triggers me to make way too much insulin and I crash. Animal protein and vegetable protein are not the same, even the protein and lipid profiles from a different piece of muscle on a cow are way different. Round steak has way different chemistry than rib steaks. People do not understand that.

If I tried to live off of vegetables, I would probably go nuts. I have some genetics that makes many vegetables toxic if eaten too much. I prefer potatoes over pastas anyday, but egg noodles do not spike my insulin whereby spaghetti will. I also have a problem eating tomatoes often, once a week is not a problem though. Half the people in this country should not eat tomatoes as much as they do.

The hypoglycemic spins are not fun. I avoid high sugar foods and drinks. I mentioned in one of my posts that I do need some carbs to think good, I can't go with just eating fats for energy and still think properly.

a reply to: saadad

Huh, no carb is totally wrong and in fact if you dont eat carbs at all you will die. That is not debate.

This is one of the greatest myth of all time. Someone can live in perfect health indefinitely with no carb at all. Carb and fat are interchangeable, the requirement is to eat one or the other, but at least one! If you want some proof of it, do some historic reading on the North American fur trade and the use of pemmican as food.

The absolute requirement of glucose can be met ONLY by internal synthesis by a process called gluconeogenesis.

Don't believe all we can find using Google, I source my info from research paper, but anyway your mind is set, so my argumentations seem futile.

a reply to: PeterMcFly

He is correct. without carbs every now and then, or at least 30-50g/day in the long run, your kidneys will cease to work. The proteins are just more than kidneys are meant to handle, and you will go into renal failure.

A good tip is to keep an eye on your urine. If it begins being exceptionally foamy consistently....you may be needing to reduce your protein intake, or go on a carb binge for a few days.

Not to mention the benefit that all the extra fiber in carb rich foods can bring. One thing about low carb eating: its hard to get enough fiber without being very purposeful and methodical about it.

That said, i have spent the last 4 years eating less than 30g/day most of the time. I still take a week or two off every now and then to enjoy some good food and give my body a break. If i wanted to make it more natural, i would eat carbs during the spring/summer when fruits were in season, then go back to meats/fats/winter veggies during the cold season..

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

He is correct. without carbs every now and then, or at least 30-50g/day in the long run, your kidneys will cease to work.

Can you provide at least some evidence of what your saying as it seem that you persist at ignoring my argumentation?

Think of it for a minutes, how possibly can Inuits (the ancient ones before white man came) can survive for all their life under a diet of practically ZERO carb? What about people that lived many years with them adapting to their diet like Stenfansson? What about the Bellevue Hospital experiment where two subject lived for a long time under zero carb?

The concluding phase began in 1928 when Mr. Anderson and myself entered Bellevue Hospital to give science the first chance in its history to observe human subjects while they lived through the chill of winter and the heat of summer, for twelve months, on an exclusive meat diet. We were to do it under conditions of ordinary city life.

Very easy to spit disinfo in this thread, but I would like evidence to back what you said. I consider I provided ample ones!

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

I have found some for you. Here is a link that "warn" about the danger of low carb diet:
What Can Happen From a Lack of Carbohydrates?

This is an excellent example of an award-winning medical and nutrition "writer" that don't have a clue of what she said and parroting nonsense.

Hypoglycemia: This is precisely what we want with a low carb diet, ketone bodies take over the job of glucose.

Ketosis: This is the goal, mild ketosis is not a pathological condition, but a NORMAL metabolic state.

Weight Gain: Pure nonsense, if the diet is caloric balanced, no weight is lost or taken.

About the Author:
Jan Sheehan is an award-winning medical and nutrition writer, having entered journalism in 1992. She is a former contributing editor for "Parents" magazine. She has also written nutrition articles for "Self," "Fitness," "Ladies' Home Journal," "Health" and other magazines. Sheehan has a Bachelor of Arts in journalism from Purdue University.

Wow, no mention of any formation relative to dietetics, science or medecine, but a nice Bachelor of Arts in journalism from Purdue University

Education:
Purdue University

Summary:
Women's health, pediatric health, weight loss and nutrition. Jan Sheehan is an award-winning health reporter and medical writer with extensive experience writing SEO web content. She writes for lay readers, consumers, and medical professionals. Jan's magazine articles have appeared in Health, Self, Glamour, Cosmopolitan, Fitness, Parents, Ladies' Home Journal, Women's Health, All You and many other top-tier magazines. Her on-line articles have appeared on everydayhealth.com, CBSHealthwatch,and CNN.com. She has also written PBS television scripts.

If it's on TV, it must be true!!!

originally posted by: PeterMcFly
a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

I have found some for you. Here is a link that "warn" about the danger of low carb diet:
What Can Happen From a Lack of Carbohydrates?

This is an excellent example of an award-winning medical and nutrition "writer" that don't have a clue of what she said and parroting nonsense.

Hypoglycemia: This is precisely what we want with a low carb diet, ketone bodies take over the job of glucose.

Ketosis: This is the goal, mild ketosis is not a pathological condition, but a NORMAL metabolic state.

Weight Gain: Pure nonsense, if the diet is caloric balanced, no weight is lost or taken.

Yes mild ketosis, was probably the natural state of the human body during times where food was short .In the hundreds of thousands of years, that the human body has been developing, it would have learnt to handle times where food was limited , that's why we seem to be the sickest, in these times of this, "false plenty". Where the common ingestion of what would have been treats , a generation ago, is now the normal diet. Where the basic, elements are leeched and processed out, its no wonder, were playing catch up, to invent medicines to hide symptoms, instead of accepting the symptoms as a warning sign, of dietary imbalances.

As a point of interest most of our time living on the marine coastal plains would have secured a good food supply, most of the year, and contain most of the essential elements, but when moving inland and leaving the marine diet, (take modern Polynesians) i'm sure that's when the problems started, as the plants can grow with deficiencies in the 48 natural elements, our bodies are made of, but we require them for our health, they were once plentiful in a marine diet.

I strongly urge anyone to read carefully this excellent paper (available online) before advertizing loud and clear that human are not adapted to low carb eating due to their monkey ancestry.

Anthropological Research Reveals Human Dietary Requirements for Optimal Health

Otto Schaeffer, a specialist in internal medicine and director of the Northern Medical Research Unit at Charles Campbell Hospital, Arctic Canada, found that as long as the Eskimo lived on his native diet in the traditional manner, he remained in sound health and was practically free from degenerative diseases, especially those that afflict Americans. (42) He reports that with the adoption of the white man’s diet, which consists largely of refined carbohydrates (sugar, white flour), processed polyunsaturated fats, and other processed foods, the Eskimo is widely afflicted with all the degenerative diseases common to our modern society.

a reply to: PeterMcFly

in the last 10000 years human digestion has changed remarkably. It was only about 5-6000 years ago that we began working on being able to digest milk and wheat.

refined carbs are bad for you.

bleached white flour bad
whole grain flour good
warning many whole grain products have bleached white flour in them some more then the whole grain flour.

HFCS very bad
sugar bad for you
honey good

processed rice bad
brown rice good

You also have to look at the type of carbs.
high glycemic carbs bad
low glycemic carbs good.

You can lower the glycemic index of high GI food by including lower GI ones. Fibers (Nuts, Vegies, Fruits), fats (Rice Bran Oil, Fish Oil, Olive Oil, Nuts), and food acids (vinegar) will reduce GI effects.

Or to make things simple. Everything that grows from soil is good and everything that comes from factory is bad.

a reply to: anonentity

Yes mild ketosis, was probably the natural state of the human body during times where food was short .In the hundreds of thousands of years, that the human body has been developing, it would have learnt to handle times where food was limited...

Sometime I wonder (pure speculation here) if ketosis is not part of a defense mechanism; when the hunter cannot hunt or grab some fruit, it is because he is sick, then the ketosis kick-in. This idea come from the discovery I made that it seem that ketone bodies have strong anti-bacterial activity. Someone with a persistant and chronic UTI get rid of it within couple of days when going in ketosis. Following that discovery, I have found research papers confirming the anti-bacterial activity.

originally posted by: PeterMcFly
a reply to: anonentity

Yes mild ketosis, was probably the natural state of the human body during times where food was short .In the hundreds of thousands of years, that the human body has been developing, it would have learnt to handle times where food was limited...

Sometime I wonder (pure speculation here) if ketosis is not part of a defense mechanism; when the hunter cannot hunt or grab some fruit, it is because he is sick, then the ketosis kick-in. This idea come from the discovery I made that it seem that ketone bodies have strong anti-bacterial activity. Someone with a persistant and chronic UTI get rid of it within couple of days when going in ketosis. Following that discovery, I have found research papers confirming the anti-bacterial activity.


I'm pretty sure your bang on the money, if a dog isn't feeling well or anybody else for that matter, they go off their food . Then when feeling better start to feed again, that's sounds a bit counter intuitive , as you'd think that eating for energy would be the cure, but apparently it might be the opposite.

originally posted by: ANNED
refined carbs are bad for you.

bleached white flour bad
whole grain flour good
warning many whole grain products have bleached white flour in them some more then the whole grain flour.

HFCS very bad
sugar bad for you
honey good

processed rice bad
brown rice good

You also have to look at the type of carbs.
high glycemic carbs bad
low glycemic carbs good.

You can lower the glycemic index of high GI food by including lower GI ones. Fibers (Nuts, Vegies, Fruits), fats (Rice Bran Oil, Fish Oil, Olive Oil, Nuts), and food acids (vinegar) will reduce GI effects.

Yes but just a warning about honey, now and again its probably great, but I know for a fact that if you sweeten your beverages with it on a regular basis your blood sugar will skyrocket, Especially if you have a mild type 2 condition. I am pretty sure that's why I was diagnosed with type 2. Its like a super glucose shot. Since knocking of the dairy and honey the Blood sugar and Blood pressure is normal.

originally posted by: ANNED
refined carbs are bad for you.

bleached white flour bad
whole grain flour good
warning many whole grain products have bleached white flour in them some more then the whole grain flour.

HFCS very bad
sugar bad for you
honey good

processed rice bad
brown rice good

You also have to look at the type of carbs.
high glycemic carbs bad
low glycemic carbs good.

You can lower the glycemic index of high GI food by including lower GI ones. Fibers (Nuts, Vegies, Fruits), fats (Rice Bran Oil, Fish Oil, Olive Oil, Nuts), and food acids (vinegar) will reduce GI effects.

Yes but just a warning about honey, now and again its probably great, but I know for a fact that if you sweeten your beverages with it on a regular basis your blood sugar will skyrocket, Especially if you have a mild type 2 condition. I am pretty sure that's why I was diagnosed with type 2. Its like a super glucose shot. Since knocking of the dairy and honey the Blood sugar and Blood pressure is normal.

Yes, there are also studies that fasting can cure cancer and when we fast we enter ketosis. I fast 2 days in a week. So hmm what do you say, m i entering ketosis? I dont eat or drink for 24h, total 48h in a week.

Inuits, people that are on low carbon diet are not living long, yes they life expectancy have raised with modern world, but they are still below average people. Example is Canada.

Anyway, i do eat carbs diet, healthy carb diet, but this 2 days in a week i m surely entering ketosis. Something like i m hunting for food but i didnt catch anything. Haha.

originally posted by: saadad
Yes, there are also studies that fasting can cure cancer and when we fast we enter ketosis. I fast 2 days in a week. So hmm what do you say, m i entering ketosis? I dont eat or drink for 24h, total 48h in a week.

Inuits, people that are on low carbon diet are not living long, yes they life expectancy have raised with modern world, but they are still below average people. Example is Canada.

Anyway, i do eat carbs diet, healthy carb diet, but this 2 days in a week i m surely entering ketosis. Something like i m hunting for food but i didnt catch anything. Haha.

You will know when you have reached ketosis, because your urine will smell of acetone.

a reply to: saadad

Yes, there are also studies that fasting can cure cancer and when we fast we enter ketosis. I fast 2 days in a week.

I'm a little sad to tell you that my extensive experience with ketogic diet have made me learn that we need at least 2 days to consume our glycogen store in the liver, that mean that after a two days fasting, you are just starting to be in ketogenic mode !!!

You need Ketostix strip to confirm that you are entering in ketogenic mode...

If you have any question about this subject, don't hesitate to ask.

a reply to: saadad

The info I have about Inuit are that they were of very good health and longevity. Please check the book from the experience of Stefansson with the Eskimo 'STEFANSSON, V. (1960). The Fat of the Land' This is an incredible work of anthropology. I garantee you won't loose your time reading it, but the last couple chapters may be a little boring. Read this book, you will not regret it!!!

a reply to: anonentity

You will know when you have reached ketosis, because your urine will smell of acetone.

No need to guess, there is commercial urine strip that do the job of quantitative measurement of ketone bodies for a very low price:

Ketostix

I strongly suggest that guess are to be avoided when your health is on the line !!!