Nasa to Officially Announce Mission to Europa This Spring!!

Wait isn't that the moon they warned us about in the movie 2001? .

originally posted by: EternalSolace
a reply to: stirling

So much money and resources wasted and we haven't even had a human orbit Mars. If I'm not mistaken, Apollo 17 was the last lunar mission and it was in 1972. That makes 43 years now we've not even seen a human leave near earth orbit.

I really want to see NASA succeed, but not like this. Time, money, and effort needs to be in manned exploration. Not more satellites and telescopes.

NASA is a SCIENCE organization.

There has been less and less a reason for humans to be present doing science in space.

And those probes and telescopes could reveal that we're not alone. No humans playing golf on the Moon or Mars are likely to do that.

The moment we find life in our solar system (and Europa is a GREAT target since it has probably the largest ocean in the solar system) or if we find it on via a telescope on an exoplanet the funding for all the human missions to Mars, etc will be opened up.

Human missions are expensive and without a good reason to do them most taxpayers say no way.

originally posted by: boymonkey74
Wait isn't that the moon they warned us about in the movie 2001? .

Close. It was the sequel: 2010

By the way there is another very good movie on Netflix about a (very unlikely) human mission to Europa called "The Europa Report". I just watched it on Sunday.

I thought it was excellent and i am highly critical of most sci-fi. The science was pretty much solid as was the story. Check it out if you have a chance.

originally posted by: Mogget
Good luck finding the engines needed to boost a 450 ton space station out of Earth orbit, all the way out to Mars, and then slowing it down to enter Mars orbit. Having said that, it would be an awesome sight to behold!

The ISS has nothing in the way of the type of radiation shielding it would need for that trip if it were even possible. Which of course it is not.

People clamouring for a human mission to Europa need a reality check.

#1 Chemical rockets are too slow to get there in any acceptable period of time.

#2 Faster methods to get there could be developed but would take decades. Why wait? There could be life there now. Let's go find it and study it!

#3 The mission NASA is talking about is most certainly an orbiter. Europa may have been caught spraying water out into space. The idea is to fly the probe through these jets, collect the water and test it for signs of life. What would good would human do exactly?

#4 If we find life on Europa or anywhere else there will be a space race well beyond the one in the 1960s.

#5 Jupiter has radiation belts which make the Van Allen belts look like a day sunning at the beach. Even if we COULD send humans to Europa the question of why bother when we'd have to shield them with a heavy radiation shield would come up.

We have to have a moon base to explore the rest of the system....period.
Other than that we need a manufacturing base in orbit.
Its that simple people....the practicality of such explorations depends on that need......
Whats being done about it? Not a helluva lot....

originally posted by: stirling
We have to have a moon base to explore the rest of the system....period.
Other than that we need a manufacturing base in orbit.
Its that simple people....the practicality of such explorations depends on that need......
Whats being done about it? Not a helluva lot....

So are you willing to raise taxes to give NASA the 200 billion dollar budget it would take to do all of that?

If not, why not?

originally posted by: stirling
We have to have a moon base to explore the rest of the system....period.
Other than that we need a manufacturing base in orbit.
Its that simple people....the practicality of such explorations depends on that need......
Whats being done about it? Not a helluva lot....

I think what you're talking about is infrastructure in Space, and you're right, we don't have much of it. I like JadeStar's idea of sending probes out to find life. As she said, finding life would spark a Space Exploration revolution that would dwarf the Space Race of the Cold War era. I know a human mission would be nearly impossible with today's tech but a guy can dream can't he?

Projects to inspire the masses would, in fact, do wonders to boost our Space program.

Personally, I would rather them go to Enceladus rather than Europa.

With Saturn's moon Enceladus, we know that its ocean water contains organic molecules, because the Cassini probe was able to analyze the water from Enceladus' ocean after that water was sprayed into space by Enceladus' geysers. We really don't have that level of positive evidence that Europa's ocean contains organic molecules (although it probably does).

Plus, because that ocean water is being sprayed out, those organic molecules are (relatively) easily accessible in space or falling back to Enceladus,where they are being deposited directly to the surface of that moon. Unlike a mission to analyze a sample of Europas' ocean, there would be no need to bore through the ice.

Researchers have discovered a deep saltwater ocean on one of the many small moons that orbit Saturn, leading scientists to conclude it is the most likely place in the solar system for extraterrestrial life to be found.

Source:
Ocean discovered on Enceladus may be best place to look for alien life


NASA astrobiologist Chris McKay even proposes a sample-return mission that would gather the organics and water streaming from Enceladus' geysers could be undertaken. That would not require a landing. The craft would fly through the plume of water, collect samples, then return those samples to Earth.

...[McKay says] “The fact that this water is being vented into space and is mixed with organic material is truly remarkable, however. It is an open invitation to go there. The place may as well have a big sign hanging over it saying: ‘Free sample: take one now’.”

Collecting that sample will not be easy, however. At a distance of 1bn miles, Saturn and its moons are a difficult target. Cassini took almost seven years to get there after its launch from Cape Canaveral in 1997.

“A mission to Enceladus would take a similar time,” says McKay. Once there, several years would be needed to make several sweeps over Enceladus to collect samples of water and organics. “Then we would need a further seven years to get those samples back to Earth.”

Such a mission would therefore involve almost 20 years of space flight – on top of the decade needed to plan it and to construct and launch the probe. “That’s 30 years in all, a large chunk of any scientist’s professional life,” says McKay.

McKay and a group of other Nasa scientists based at the Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena are undaunted, however. They are now finalising plans for an Enceladus Sample Return mission, which would involve putting a probe in orbit round Saturn. It would then use the gravity of the planet’s biggest moon, Titan, to make sweeps over Enceladus. Plume samples would then be stored in a canister that would eventually be fired back to Earth on a seven-year return journey.

Crucially, McKay and his colleagues believe such a mission could be carried out at a relatively modest cost – as part of Nasa’s Discovery programme, which funds low-budget missions to explore the solar system. Previous probes have included Lunar Prospector, which studied the moon’s geology; Stardust, which returned a sample of material scooped from a comet’s tail; and Mars Pathfinder, which deployed a tiny motorised robot vehicle on the Red Planet in 1997.

Source:
NASA says that Enceladus, Saturn’s largest moon, is a good bet for alien life in our solar system

A mission to Europa that could actually get to its ocean just to analyze it would be very complex and very expensive. I doubt NASA would be undertaking any mission such as that in the near future. A mission that could return a sample of Enceladus' ocean water would be far less costly -- although would take a while until the sample gets back.

a reply to: Soylent Green Is People

Yes, Enceladus!! As I mentioned a long time ago here on ATS, I once asked an OUIJA board if there is life in the solar system and it said yes.......On the Moon Enceladus! The board said that there are Dolphin type creatures which live in the oceans there.

However, Europa is a Jupiter Moon and Enceladus is a Saturn Moon. While it may take about 20yrs to get to Jupiter and back, a Saturn mission may be around 30-40 years. Don't quote me on those numbers; my guess may be a little excessive.

This is exciting news , I have been waiting for this announcement for years.

Europa is by far the most planet in our Solar System, I bet there is life on, complex life.....i imagine shrimps like creatures...jelly fishes

a reply to: lostbook

This is great news...thanks for the thread!


There is ONE thing that puzzles me though....


Why is it dangled that we would be going here for water...to obtain water....for our own needs. Spending millions and billions of dollars to do so...


When IMHO we should be spending that money on desalination efforts of our own water here on earth ?

originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: stirling
We have to have a moon base to explore the rest of the system....period.
Other than that we need a manufacturing base in orbit.
Its that simple people....the practicality of such explorations depends on that need......
Whats being done about it? Not a helluva lot....

So are you willing to raise taxes to give NASA the 200 billion dollar budget it would take to do all of that?

If not, why not?

How about we quit spending 100's of billions fighting wars in some place where no one cares about, and spend some of that defense budget on NASA.

There is more of a reason than ever to have humans continue to explore space. Probes do not cut it. How do you expect to make contact or research life, physically study life on Europa when we can't even get to Mars? Simple fact is, probes can only do so much.

Hubble Telescope Communication Breaks Down, Plot Thickens

Flat out! Rosetta probe runs out of battery power just two days after touching down on comet...

Crippled Mars Rover is Chilled, But Still Alive

Three examples of broken multi-million dollar equipment. Yep, that's a great way to spend millions and billions of dollars. Maybe if we had spent a few more millions of dollars, humans could be out there fixing it.

a reply to: JadeStar
I don't think it has to be an orbiter. Drilling through the ice on Europa is not practical with conventional drilling equipment. The issue is whether a laser could be developed that could drill through the ice using heat. If that could done, then perhaps a probe could be actually placed into the ocean that could communicate with the landing craft that could send picture back as well as data.

I strongly agree, humans would not help at all. There dead bodies would only get in the way. The temperatures on Europa range from - 270 to -350. Along with the radiation, it is hard to imagine a human being able to function on the surface in any meaningful manner ever. In my proposed laser drilling idea, I am thinking it could take weeks or months to accomplish drilling through the ice. Developing a workable mission to launch by 2020 to 2025 should be doable based on our current technology.

To the posters that crave human missions to Mars. It will happen someday, but, I doubt it will happen in the next 50 year. Dead astronauts are no Bueno. Too much bad publicity leads to no funding and no more missions. If a rover can get a plant to grow on Mars, it will happen. If it can't, you are talking about spending billions to ship a couple hundred pounds of food every 6 months to keep the astronauts alive. I don't see that happening soon.

Get to the moon first, if you can demonstrate this is possible the impetus for everything else would come quickly.

We want to see it in HD realtime with humans living on it for years and having no big time problems.

This appears to be way too hard to figure out, but they do not recognize that action brings more action.

Secrecy only destroyed the dream, and has slowed advancement to a crawl.

originally posted by: EternalSolace

originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: stirling
We have to have a moon base to explore the rest of the system....period.
Other than that we need a manufacturing base in orbit.
Its that simple people....the practicality of such explorations depends on that need......
Whats being done about it? Not a helluva lot....

So are you willing to raise taxes to give NASA the 200 billion dollar budget it would take to do all of that?

If not, why not?

How about we quit spending 100's of billions fighting wars in some place where no one cares about, and spend some of that defense budget on NASA.

There is more of a reason than ever to have humans continue to explore space. Probes do not cut it. How do you expect to make contact or research life, physically study life on Europa when we can't even get to Mars? Simple fact is, probes can only do so much.

Hubble Telescope Communication Breaks Down, Plot Thickens

Flat out! Rosetta probe runs out of battery power just two days after touching down on comet...

Crippled Mars Rover is Chilled, But Still Alive

Three examples of broken multi-million dollar equipment. Yep, that's a great way to spend millions and billions of dollars. Maybe if we had spent a few more millions of dollars, humans could be out there fixing it.

Mmmm...THIS...

And while were at it, lets have ALL other
nations do the same. Add all this "money"
in a project to have mankind travel the
universe, exploring, colonizing etc etc.

And, NOO this is NOT sarcasm....

It CAN be done.

a reply to: lostbook

NASA public program ?

Who cares, that is just wool over our eyes. Ask about NASA the secret part

a reply to: RebelBear

My point was that instead of blowing money on more probes, money ought to be spend getting humans back out of low earth orbit.

originally posted by: lostbook
I can't wait for this mission...! I wonder if it's going to be robotic or a human mission....? It should be a human mission but who would go in their right mind for what probably would be a one way trip? Even if you did return, by the time you got back something like 20yrs would have passed. Still cool though. What says ATS?

finance.yahoo.com...

Pretty sure they will send a robot like this:
www.youtube.com...

More on this here in this TED talk: www.youtube.com...

I watched a better docu on europa but I cant seem to find it now.
edit: I think it's "aliens from the deep"