Clueless who to vote for in the the UK GE?

a reply to: valiant

I completely agree with your thinking and feel the same, however if everyone voted for who they wanted instead of tactical voting it would remove the race for centre ground the main three are desperately striving for.

When people buy in to the race for the centre-ground then all you get is static state, revolving door politics where everything is the same and any idea contravening those already deemed acceptable is either automatically discredited as loony left or racist right.

originally posted by: blupblup
Here's another one google just turned up.... try this.


It's far more in-depth and may take some time.


voteforpolicies.org.uk...

Well that was unexpected...!

Immigration = Cons
Europe = Lab
Crime = BNP???
Education = BNP???

Wont be voting BNP. Weird how even if you agree someone 90%, it only takes that 10% to negate all the rest.

I'll try the others now

It looks like we are on course for a three party coalition for the next government.

Which if you ask me is a good thing.

I will be voting UKIP as I believe we will see a UKIP / Lib Dem / Conservative coalition.

Korg.

Voting is a tricky business, made more so because people don’t take the time to actually get to grips with the policies of any specific party.

We get side-lined by sound bites and character, and ultimately, most end up voting for a candidate, or on a single policy.

The thing is, choosing a party to vote for doesn’t need to be complicated, but it does need to be done from an educated point of view.

A point in case is UKIP.

So many people voting for them because they agree with their “policy” on Europe and immigration. What about education, social issues, crime and punishment, the economy, defence…I could go on.

Worse still, they’re voting for Farage, because “he likes a pint”!

The truth is, most people (not all) inherit their vote, and stick with it. You grow up in a socioeconomic environment that steers you towards a specific political frame of mind, and you stick with it, not wanting to “forget where you came from”. Even if things change to the point where the “party” in your mind, is no longer the party in actuality.

This has happened to both of the main parties, neither Tories nor Labourites from the 1970’s would recognise their parties today. (From policy alone, they would probably identify with Green and BNP)

I have some, quite right wing views, and some, very leftist views and none of the parties will be able to satisfy my political requirements. So, for example, this year one of my questions to self is; is educational policy more or less important to me than European policy?

The only advice I would offer, (not that I am particularly qualified to offer ANY advice on the subject) would be to pick the policies that are most important to you, see which party agrees, and then weigh up the disadvantages of the policies you disagree with against the opposition stance. The chances are that in most cases the differences are in the minutia, and you may find that that one thing that seems so important is actually nothing compared to all of the minor differences in the remaining policies.

I’m sure I probably started writing this with a point in mind, but I seem to have lost it 

a reply to: crazyewok

UKIP

Blaming immigrants for everything? Well that's not right sure, however. The current situation with immigration is pathetic and it starts there with a lot of jobs lost to you, your family and friends. Allowing for minimum basic jobs to such lower caring workers like immigrants does not push companies to give better more rewarding jobs. Another is that immigration at the moment is allowing threats into our country, I am talking with the current uprise of ISIS and dishonest uncaring dormant 'peaceful' muslims resting in this country should be a cause for concern to ''everyone''. I for one want to see this country reclaim its stability again and doing so, you need to clean up the mess.

UKIP all the way for me, Nigel is the only guy that has the right view when it comes to a Great Britain. It's the Alright Britain at the moment.

I just hope others turn to him, the news is a paid shill to make sure people think he bangs on about immigration too much, he isn't, if anything he is not talking about it enough.

UKIP are currently trying to oust Farage after his repeated calls to privatise the NHS.

That's them sunk then.

How anyone would vote for a Party who call their own manifesto 'a load of rubbish' is beyond me. Even they admit they don't have a clue how to run the country.

originally posted by: bastion
UKIP are currently trying to oust Farage after his repeated calls to privatise the NHS.

That's them sunk then.

How anyone would vote for a Party who call their own manifesto 'a load of rubbish' is beyond me. Even they admit they don't have a clue how to run the country.

They are a joke.... but sadly we wont be laughing when people who like "Good old Nige and his beer" vote for these morons.
Whatever your frustrations and whatever your disillusionment with mainstream politics... UKIP are not and will never be the answer.

People will be in for a shock if they actually got into power....

originally posted by: idmonster
Voting is a tricky business, made more so because people don’t take the time to actually get to grips with the policies of any specific party.

We get side-lined by sound bites and character, and ultimately, most end up voting for a candidate, or on a single policy.

The thing is, choosing a party to vote for doesn’t need to be complicated, but it does need to be done from an educated point of view.

A point in case is UKIP.

So many people voting for them because they agree with their “policy” on Europe and immigration. What about education, social issues, crime and punishment, the economy, defence…I could go on.

Worse still, they’re voting for Farage, because “he likes a pint”!

The truth is, most people (not all) inherit their vote, and stick with it. You grow up in a socioeconomic environment that steers you towards a specific political frame of mind, and you stick with it, not wanting to “forget where you came from”. Even if things change to the point where the “party” in your mind, is no longer the party in actuality.

This has happened to both of the main parties, neither Tories nor Labourites from the 1970’s would recognise their parties today. (From policy alone, they would probably identify with Green and BNP)

I have some, quite right wing views, and some, very leftist views and none of the parties will be able to satisfy my political requirements. So, for example, this year one of my questions to self is; is educational policy more or less important to me than European policy?

The only advice I would offer, (not that I am particularly qualified to offer ANY advice on the subject) would be to pick the policies that are most important to you, see which party agrees, and then weigh up the disadvantages of the policies you disagree with against the opposition stance. The chances are that in most cases the differences are in the minutia, and you may find that that one thing that seems so important is actually nothing compared to all of the minor differences in the remaining policies.

I’m sure I probably started writing this with a point in mind, but I seem to have lost it 

Good post mate

a reply to: blupblup

Sadly too true. How will introducing uniforms for taxi drivers, scrapping the NHS, maternity leave and having the army patrol the streets is help the UK or non-millionaire?

But idiots will still vote for them because he poses with a pint for the press.

a reply to: bastion



Plus taking cyclists off the road... and taking 6 million cars off the road by stopping those who claim benefits from driving.

Just came across this on the Cycling Thread on my main website (not sure of accuracy or authenticity, but this is terrifying if true)

a reply to: blupblup

Wow - I've not seen that before and I have to cycle/walk everywhere after being hit by a hit and run driver which made me disabled so no longer eligible to drive. It takes me over three hours to get the bus to work on what is a 15 minute cycle ride.

So they don't want people on welfare -i.e pensioners, people with kids or the disabled to be able to drive and want them on buses instead, yet don't want buses on the road and call it common sense.

Bunch of nutters.

Another party intent on blaming all the countries ills on immigrants, the elderly, poor and disabled instead of the hundreds of billions lost from banks, defence and multi-corporate tax evasion. *headdesk*

originally posted by: crazyewok
with the UK general elections coming up Im at a loss.

To me not voting achieves nothing as there will all ways be someone who does vote and that means a goverment will be elected not voting just makes you irrelevant.

But the option are so depressing....

Conservatives: Ok my local MP is ok and some of the newer generation MP are ok. But I despise the old school torys. George Osborne is the embodiment of of a pure etonite , I detest Theressa May with every atom of my body and think she is a bitter old battleaxe who likely gets off on NAZI porn, Iain drunken Smith is a class A twat and Cameron himself a spineless buffoon who who makes statements he cant back up or which are not practical and is a puppet of the super rich.

Labor: God NO! There last government nearly bankrupted us and nearly turned us into another broke EU country!
That is unforgivable on its own.

It was Labour that did it and not the banks, is that wht you are saying? Presumably when all other western countries went into meltdown AT THE SAME TIME as a consequence of Gordon Brown's policies?

FYI, prior to the banking crisis UK PLC was in a better state than it had ever been since 1979 when Thatcher took the reins (ref : national statistics). It was thatcher who lifted the restrictions on the banking sector that allowed them the "freedom" to do what they did. have you conveniently forgotten this ?

Why the selective memory ? If you hate Labour fine, even on ideological grounds, no problem. But to state it was Labour who got us into this crisis is wrong plain wrong and you damned well know it. It was the banks. The UK debt as % of GDP increased by 20% simply due to bailing out the banks which the Tories agreed with at the time. Prior to that the debt had wavered between 30-40% which is low compared to other western economies. Even Germanys debt was higher than that before the crisis (70%). So you are clearly not making any sense whatsoever.

There is no way in hell anybody anywhere can get solutions to problems whilst the true causes of problems are lied about.

If you have principles then vote Green, go ahead, read their manifesto if you have the time. It is not a one page A4 like the UKIP manifesto! it is in depth and will take an hour or so to read, which is 59 minutes longer than the Daily Mail.

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: valiant
I but realistically I will probably vote Labour, the lesser of two evils and all that!

1) Broken Economy!
2) Iraq war!
3) Selling out to the EU!
4) Tony fecking Blair!


come on!

Remember!

Really voting with that logic is why nothing will change in the UK!

I honestly believe Ewok, that if we were under Tory rule during Labours years, the outcome would have been the same. The economy would still be broken, we would have gone to war with Iraq and we still would have sold out to the EU. The only shining light is that we wouldn't have had Blair, but i'm sure that the Tory leader in this imaginary scenario would have ended up being as equally despised.

The outcome will always be the same, because they are the same.

a reply to: yorkshirelad

I think many of us, and I include myself there, seem to forget sometimes that it was the banks and their greed and incompetence that got us in the financial mess we are still paying the price for.

Thanks for the reminder.

And as for Thatcher......I can't think of one of her domestic policies that has proven for the best long term.

originally posted by: yorkshirelad

originally posted by: crazyewok
with the UK general elections coming up Im at a loss.

To me not voting achieves nothing as there will all ways be someone who does vote and that means a goverment will be elected not voting just makes you irrelevant.

But the option are so depressing....

Conservatives: Ok my local MP is ok and some of the newer generation MP are ok. But I despise the old school torys. George Osborne is the embodiment of of a pure etonite , I detest Theressa May with every atom of my body and think she is a bitter old battleaxe who likely gets off on NAZI porn, Iain drunken Smith is a class A twat and Cameron himself a spineless buffoon who who makes statements he cant back up or which are not practical and is a puppet of the super rich.

Labor: God NO! There last government nearly bankrupted us and nearly turned us into another broke EU country!
That is unforgivable on its own.

It was Labour that did it and not the banks, is that wht you are saying? Presumably when all other western countries went into meltdown AT THE SAME TIME as a consequence of Gordon Brown's policies?

FYI, prior to the banking crisis UK PLC was in a better state than it had ever been since 1979 when Thatcher took the reins (ref : national statistics). It was thatcher who lifted the restrictions on the banking sector that allowed them the "freedom" to do what they did. have you conveniently forgotten this ?

Why the selective memory ? If you hate Labour fine, even on ideological grounds, no problem. But to state it was Labour who got us into this crisis is wrong plain wrong and you damned well know it. It was the banks. The UK debt as % of GDP increased by 20% simply due to bailing out the banks which the Tories agreed with at the time. Prior to that the debt had wavered between 30-40% which is low compared to other western economies. Even Germanys debt was higher than that before the crisis (70%). So you are clearly not making any sense whatsoever.

There is no way in hell anybody anywhere can get solutions to problems whilst the true causes of problems are lied about.

If you have principles then vote Green, go ahead, read their manifesto if you have the time. It is not a one page A4 like the UKIP manifesto! it is in depth and will take an hour or so to read, which is 59 minutes longer than the Daily Mail.

1)I was not alive in the era of thatcher
2)i never defended the torys, we are not dumb americans that have support one or the other
3) labour spent billion on stupid projects, even in times of plenty a goverment should not piss away crash
3) they could of revocked thatcher banking deregulation, as such labour are just as guilty
4)they were the goverment in chsrge ehen they bailed the banks out, the fact the torys voted just make them guilty aswell
5) labour sold our soverignty out to the EU and US with unfair lop sided treatys
6) THE IRAQ WAR
7)piss on the greens as they would ruin my right to drive and my love of international travel by destroying the UK sir industry

originally posted by: skitzspiricy

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: valiant
I but realistically I will probably vote Labour, the lesser of two evils and all that!

1) Broken Economy!
2) Iraq war!
3) Selling out to the EU!
4) Tony fecking Blair!


come on!

Remember!

Really voting with that logic is why nothing will change in the UK!

I honestly believe Ewok, that if we were under Tory rule during Labours years, the outcome would have been the same. The economy would still be broken, we would have gone to war with Iraq and we still would have sold out to the EU. The only shining light is that we wouldn't have had Blair, but i'm sure that the Tory leader in this imaginary scenario would have ended up being as equally despised.

The outcome will always be the same, because they are the same.

Likely which is why I dont like the torys.

I won't be voting. Not worth my time. Why? Because nothing will change until this whole system is taken down. It's like being executed and choosing who will pull the trigger to kill you.

Who wants to continue the help for the disabled - Miliband.

Who has promised to take on the Energy Companies - Miliband.

Who wants to protect the NHS - Miliband.

Who wants to tax the corporations - Miliband.

Who is looking into immigration - All of them.

Who is trying to destroy our trade within the EU - Farage.

Who wants surveillance on everyone - May (therefor Cameron).

Who wants to privatise every institution we've worked so hard for since WW2 - Cameron & Farage.

Who's being "character assasinated" - Farage & Miliband.

Who actually deserves that criticism - Farage.

Who has William Hague & Theresa May in their party - Conservatives.

Who are lap dogs to their masters - Lib Dems.

Who glosses over everything with "immigration" - UKIP.





On all the important issues Labour get my vote without a doubt.

Miliband doesn't need to "stand up to America" that's what our Elite Troops, GCHQ & MI5/6 are there for.
& that's how every PM we've had has stood up to their hegemony.



Let's face it...
When tabloid rags of emergency toilet tissue need to judge a man by how he eats a Bacon sandwich...
You've found a winner...
The demonised always have something to offer that certain people do not want in power...


You may think he comes across as a pushover, to me Milliband battles that with integrity & maturity.

When they started talking about how his father "hated Britain"...
I knew who my vote was going to...
I've watched him carefully since then and I've been impressed.




People will talk about the Crisis...
It's fair to say that's gonna play on people's minds...

But that was under a different leadership...
& the Tories or anyone else would have done the same thing at the time.

This is in no way the same Labour that Tony Blair designed & handed over to Gordon Brown.




Can I say that Miliband will keep his promises...
Of course not...
But the promises he's made are far and above what is being offered by the equally, if not more untrustworthy opposition.





Vote with you brain, not your heart...
If I went with my heart, I wouldn't even vote.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs


Vote with you brain, not your heart...

And I have the brains to remember Labors track record between 1997-2010.

Just because Milliband SAYS he will do something does not mean labor will do it.

If politicians did what they said the world would be a a lot brighter place.

But they dont. A PM is not a dictator, has little to no executives powers and is still at the whims of the rest of his party.
Millband may be a stand up guy, I dont know him. But even if he was and honestly wanted to do what he says he will do, he still has to go through the rest of his party.......and they still consist of many of the corrupt evil bastards that were in power through 1997-2010. The same ones that followed Blair and brown.

Labor will never be a viable choice until ALL those MPs have been replaced.


Labour and the torys are not viable choices based on track records.

Insanity is doing the same thing over and over. As such voting for labour or the torys is insanity.

Ewok,

You do know that It's either going to be Conservatives or Labour in Power after the next election, or some whacked out coalition of Conservative plus 1 or Labour plus 1?

Whether Labour did this or Conservatives did that, it's just going to be one of those two parties pulling all the shots.

There is no other choice sadly. People can vote UKIP or Greens all they like, but Conservatives or Labour will be the one with the victory.

I will hedge a bet that it will be Labour this time round. It seems to be a common pattern. One party is in power, screws everything up over a period of time, people then vote for the opposition when they have had enough. Many people have already had enough of the Conservatives. Rinse, Cycle, Repeat.

I guess the thing people need to work out is which are the lesser of two evils when it comes down to their own personal core principles on what they feel needs to change this time round.

My principles lay between Labour and the Greens. I will vote Greens but Labour is the likely candidate to win. Should i vote Labour? I don't want to really, but it's likely we'll have to put up with them for the next 5 years.