Islamic State throws men off building for ‘being gay’

a reply to: UnBreakable

The article put the number at 800k who apparently were for the Hebdo killers. That's apparently half the Muslim population which is a little more than the scant minority.

Are all bigots as ignorant of such basic math as you?

you posted this on the page before and again say its half in this post

Just remember, it's only a minority of the Muslims who condone violence, only 800,000 out of 1.6bn. Last I checked, 50% isn't a minority.

On what planet is that half or 50%?

Whats happened to ATS and its members, you have all lost your minds like I have?

originally posted by: InhaleExhale
a reply to: UnBreakable

The article put the number at 800k who apparently were for the Hebdo killers. That's apparently half the Muslim population which is a little more than the scant minority.

Are all bigots as ignorant of such basic math as you?



you posted this on the page before and again say its half in this post

Just remember, it's only a minority of the Muslims who condone violence, only 800,000 out of 1.6bn. Last I checked, 50% isn't a minority.

On what planet is that half or 50%?



Whats happened to ATS and its members, you have all lost your minds like I have?

That's not fair lumping all bigots together as not possessing basic math aptitude. There's very few of us bigots lacking basic math skills.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Actually you are right about that post of mine being ignorrant. I was confusing the countries. I was referencing africa and not the americas. Central and south america have other problems that contribute to their problems.

The point still stands clearly that when you view the world wide stats the christian countries are more safer to live in vs muslims countries. As you have pointed out there are exceptions to the rule.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: deadeyedick

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

a reply to: ElohimJD

Nice cop out, but at the end of the day, regardless of what you believe and practice, there are MANY Christians who use those verses to spread hate and intolerance.

Hate and intolerance is not the same as killing people.



If they spread a false message of christianity then that can be fixed without death.

Same can be said for the Muslim religion.

Except if you say it about the koran then you are a liar or ignoring the text itself.

originally posted by: PorteurDeMort
Nothing about this situation sits well with me. If as you claim the moderates are the ones gathered around to watch these men plummet to their deaths, how can they just stand by and watch such a brutal execution method. I don't claim to understand the islamic religion but is murder tolerated? You don't see Catholics, or Jews killing people for being homosexual. Do you? The savagery and depravity of the Islamic State is beyond measure. They are a cancer. They are tainting a religion that 1.6 billion people follow. If I were religious and fanatics were dragging my religion through the mud with their actions I would be up in arms. I don't hear a whole lot of condemnation coming from said moderate Muslims.

What would you say of those who watch beheading videos on youtube? They're doing the same thing that crowd did. Watching something doesn't indicate support of an action.

a reply to: deadeyedick

So my examples all come with nice little caveats. It's not the religion that's at fault, it's other situations. I mean it's not like the Knights Templar drug cartel is a religious organization or anything. Nah they aren't really Christians in your eyes. But when a few Muslim extremists decide to be a bunch of assholes, they are just following the quran. Even though they are an EXTREME minority of Muslims doing it.

Then you justify this insane opinion with your poorly read quotes that you've sniped from anti-Islam websites instead of going directly to the source (the actual quran). No surprise there really, thinking about all the discussions we've had about science. Apparently, you think you are an expert in Muslim theology despite being a Christian and NOT a Muslim. THEN you think you know more than ACTUAL Muslims who disagree with you. There may be no helping you...

a reply to: Krazysh0t

wtf
i am talking about the scriptures of the koran telling followers to kill others. It is a fact!

Now i am begging you do tell us all more about this conspiracy of yours involving the knights templar and drugs.

i think you should put together a thread if you have some info.

it is the first i have heard of it.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: PorteurDeMort

Nothing about this situation sits well with me. If as you claim the moderates are the ones gathered around to watch these men plummet to their deaths, how can they just stand by and watch such a brutal execution method. I don't claim to understand the islamic religion but is murder tolerated? You don't see Catholics, or Jews killing people for being homosexual. Do you? The savagery and depravity of the Islamic State is beyond measure. They are a cancer. They are tainting a religion that 1.6 billion people follow. If I were religious and fanatics were dragging my religion through the mud with their actions I would be up in arms. I don't hear a whole lot of condemnation coming from said moderate Muslims.

What would you say of those who watch beheading videos on youtube? They're doing the same thing that crowd did. Watching something doesn't indicate support of an action.

Actually watching things does have some support for them and there effect on people if you do not condemn it outright but even more so watching and cheering has huge effects. That is why i did not attempt to post any videos of the events.

originally posted by: deadeyedick
a reply to: Krazysh0t

wtf
i am talking about the scriptures of the koran telling followers to kill others. It is a fact!

Scripture that you picked out from an anti-Islam website that interpreted or even translated the scriptures for you.

Now i am begging you do tell us all more about this conspiracy of yours involving the knights templar and drugs.

What is there to tell? It's a real drug cartel.

Knights Templar Cartel

a reply to: Krazysh0t

no do not keep spreading your lies.

the scripture that tkdrl posted show the calls to kill others.


eta thanks for the link to the knights drug running
it looks like a joke

originally posted by: deadeyedick
a reply to: Krazysh0t

no do not keep spreading your lies.

the scripture that tkdrl posted show the calls to kill others.

But I also posted scripture from the Bible that commanded Christians to kill others. Though your scripture seems to come with a nice caveat that it doesn't apply anymore despite being the word of god and all.

If you are going to call the quran into question for its violent passages and hold Muslims accountable for it, then you need to do the same for the bible and the jews for the torah.

While the Koran Calls for Violence, The Bible Is Even Worse … Calling for Genocide

Religion historian Philip Jenkins decided to compare the brutality quotient of the Quran and the Bible.

“Much to my surprise, the Islamic scriptures in the Quran were actually far less bloody and less violent than those in the Bible,” Jenkins says.

Jenkins is a professor at Penn State University and author of two books dealing with the issue: the recently published Jesus Wars, and Dark Passages , which has not been published but is already drawing controversy.

Violence in the Quran, he and others say, is largely a defense against attack.

“By the standards of the time, which is the 7th century A.D., the laws of war that are laid down by the Quran are actually reasonably humane,” he says. “Then we turn to the Bible, and we actually find something that is for many people a real surprise. There is a specific kind of warfare laid down in the Bible which we can only call genocide.”

It is called herem, and it means total annihilation. Consider the Book of 1 Samuel, when God instructs King Saul to attack the Amalekites: “And utterly destroy all that they have, and do not spare them,” God says through the prophet Samuel. “But kill both man and woman, infant and nursing child, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.”

When Saul failed to do that, God took away his kingdom.

“In other words,” Jenkins says, “Saul has committed a dreadful sin by failing to complete genocide. And that passage echoes through Christian history. It is often used, for example, in American stories of the confrontation with Indians — not just is it legitimate to kill Indians, but you are violating God’s law if you do not.”

Jenkins notes that the history of Christianity is strewn with herem. During the Crusades in the Middle Ages, the Catholic popes declared the Muslims Amalekites. In the great religious wars in the 16th, 17th and 19th centuries, Protestants and Catholics each believed the other side were the Amalekites and should be utterly destroyed.

***

El-Ansary, who teaches Islamic studies at the University of South Carolina, says the Quran explicitly condemns religious aggression and the killing of civilians. And it makes the distinction between jihad — legal warfare with the proper rules of engagement — and irjaf, or terrorism.

“All of those types of incidences — [Sept. 11], Maj. Nidal Hasan and so forth — those are all examples of irjaf, not jihad,” he says. According to the Quran, he says, those who practice irjaf “are going to hell.”

***

In the end, the scholars can agree on one thing: The DNA of early Judaism, Christianity and Islam code for a lot of violence. Whether they can evolve out of it is another thing altogether.

Of course I'm sure you've prepared some nice rationalization on why this is acceptable in the bible but the violence in the quran (defensive) is reprehensible.

eta thanks for the link to the knights drug running

it looks like a joke

It isn't a joke. They are a REAL drug running cartel.

Crusaders of Meth: Mexico's Deadly Knights Templar
Knights Templar Cartel: Mexico's 'Cult Cartel' -- A Bloody, Violent Meth-Trafficking Secret Narco Society

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Again you ignore the death of my savior and the price he paid on the cross. Any twisting of the christian religion to say that killing should happen is a false stance. If you stand up and try to preach the oldtestament killing or slavery as being valid you will be shown how you are misinterupting he verses.

The koran clearly calls for killing and there has been no reformation to the korans calls for death.

Do you accept that in christanity reformation by way of the cross took place?

That is a universal truth unlike the messages in the koran that can be interputed and twisted to suit the occasion.

You are allowed to have the opinion that christianity calls for death but you are not just wrong if you say that you personally would be a liar because you have been shown the difference.

jihad is murder! it is called for in the koran

the bible clearly tells us that it is a great sin to take a life and it says not to.

a reply to: deadeyedick
Self defense is not murder. The ones I posted are clearly about self defense.

originally posted by: deadeyedick
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Again you ignore the death of my savior and the price he paid on the cross. Any twisting of the christian religion to say that killing should happen is a false stance. If you stand up and try to preach the oldtestament killing or slavery as being valid you will be shown how you are misinterupting he verses.

See, I knew it. It's ok in the bible to talk about violence, but any other book has to account for their messages of violence (even if that call to violence is basically an old fashioned stand your ground law).

The koran clearly calls for killing and there has been no reformation to the korans calls for death.

So you don't think that someone should be able to defend themselves against acts of violence?

Do you accept that in christanity reformation by way of the cross took place?

Here's some more gems for you.
Cruelty in the New Testament

Mathew
Jesus strongly approves of the law and the prophets. He hasn't the slightest objection to the cruelties of the Old Testament. 5:17
Cities that neither "receive" the disciples nor "hear" their words will be destroyed by God. It will be worse for them than for Sodom and Gomorrah. And you know what God supposedly did to those poor folks (see Gen 19:24). 10:14-15
Jesus condemns entire cities to dreadful deaths and to the eternal torment of hell because they didn't care for his preaching. 11:20-24
Luke
"Except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish." 13:3, 5
In the parable of the talents, Jesus says that God takes what is not rightly his, and reaps what he didn't sow. The parable ends with the words: "bring them [those who preferred not to be ruled by him] hither, and slay them before me." 19:22-27
John
People are damned or saved depending only on what they believe. 3:18, 36
Acts
Peter claims that Dt 18:18-19 refers to Jesus, saying that those who refuse to follow him (all non-Christians) must be killed. 3:23
The author of Acts talks about the "sure mercies of David." But David was anything but merciful. For an example of his behavior see 2 Sam 12:31 and 1 Chr 20:3, where he saws, hacks, and burns to death the inhabitants of several cities. 13:34
Romans
Homosexuals (those "without natural affection") and their supporters (those "that have pleasure in them") are "worthy of death" - - along with gossips, boasters, and disobedient children. 1:31-32
God punishes everyone for someone else's sin; then he saves them by killing an innocent victim. 5:12
Hebrews
God will not forgive anyone unless something is killed for him in a bloody manner. 9:13-22
Those who disobeyed the Old Testament law were killed without mercy. It will be much worse for those who displease Jesus. 10:28-29

Most are about God or Jesus being especially nasty, but there are a few in there (like Acts 3:23) that a human would be able to interpret as a call for violence.

Looks like the New Testament isn't clean of violence either. Though, I'm sure you can justify these acts of violence or calls for violence like you did the genocide in my last example.

That is a universal truth unlike the messages in the koran that can be interputed and twisted to suit the occasion.

HAHAHA! Do you honestly believe that the very same thing doesn't happen to the bible? Are you serious? Your double standard is getting WAY out of hand.

You are allowed to have the opinion that christianity calls for death but you are not just wrong if you say that you personally would be a liar because you have been shown the difference.

I don't think you know what the difference is.

jihad is murder! it is called for in the koran

the bible clearly tells us that it is a great sin to take a life and it says not to.

Fifth Greater Sin: Murder

Murder

The fifth Greater Sin is the murder of that person whose execution has not been ordered by Allah (S.w.T.) and the Holy Prophet (S). Traditions which confirm that murder is a Greater Sin have already been mentioned at the beginning. Moreover the verses of the Holy Qur’an mention clearly the Divine punishment for the murderers.

“And whoever kills a believer intentionally, his punishment is Hell; he shall abide in it, and Allah will send His wrath on him and curse him and prepare for him a painful chastisement.” (Surah an-Nisā’ 4:93)

Five types of punishments have been ordained for those who kill the believers. First, Hell; Second, Eternal abode in Hell; Third, involvement in the Divine wrath; Fourth, being the accursed by Allah (S.w.T.); Fifth, the Great Chastisement.

originally posted by: TKDRL
a reply to: deadeyedick

Self defense is not murder. The ones I posted are clearly about self defense.

death is death

i do get the moral difference you are refering too but in the end a dead man is dead

this goes against what christianity teaches us about death

and just as you illude to there are many other references in the koran about killing but i will not use that site i did to show them.

there are well over a hundred references to killing for different reasons that are all worded in a way that can be argued from several angles but in the end it calls for death and not to just have faith and forgive

a reply to: Krazysh0t

you just buried yourself in bs

it is not even something i can respond too givin the way you present it

if you are serious then take it a bit slower and try to keep it simple because i am slow


acts3:23 And it shall come to pass, [that] every soul, which will not hear that
prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people. ... from the King James Bible
...
from what i could gather from your post this is your big example of the new testament calling for death.

That is false statment you are making as you can tell if you read the verse

The rest is about GOD and Jesus killing folks on our behalf and that is 100% true

i make no claims that the two are understandable or seem fair
they will use violence quickly and often will even use non believers as there hand. This is the main reason why christ taught us to have faith in GOD'S judgments. Everyone will answer to them even justin beiber

a reply to: deadeyedick
Anyone comes after me or mine, and I will kill too. Morons seem to only understand the language of violence, and that is a language I have learned to speak fluently.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: deadeyedick

a reply to: Krazysh0t



no do not keep spreading your lies.



the scripture that tkdrl posted show the calls to kill others.

But I also posted scripture from the Bible that commanded Christians to kill others. Though your scripture seems to come with a nice caveat that it doesn't apply anymore despite being the word of god and all.

"being the word of god and all"

...........and therein lies the problem. The Bible (or Quran or any other 'holy' book) was written by man, who wrote in accordance with their times and laws. Since men wrote them, there has to be imperfections as man is imperfect. Who knows the writers mindset at the time? They might've had anger issues (ya think)? God didn't sit down with pen in hand and wrote the words. But fundamentalists be it Christian or Islam or (pick your religion) don't buy this. They haven't evolved the book(s) into the 21st century. Until they evolve there will always be violence, from all sides.

a reply to: deadeyedick

Why don't you take it slow and go over piece by piece exactly what I said? Feigning inability to understand my points doesn't automatically negate my points. The fact of the matter is that the bible calls for MORE violence than the quran does, the quran ALSO condemns murder, and you have completely deluded yourself with a made up version of reality.

a reply to: UnBreakable

I agree, that is why I find it HIGHLY intellectually dishonest to pretend like the quran justifies violence and that the bible doesn't. Both have been used to justify violence in the past and even presently (yes even the bible). But violent people will be violent regardless of their motivations. The holy books are just convienent excuses to justify their behavior.

Like I've been saying from the beginning, judge the individual, NOT the group. Extremist Muslims are no more indicative of all Muslims than extremist Christians are indicative of all Christians.