The American Nazi state

Personally I don't think it's any different then any other point in history, except the technology.

I don't think it's as bad as people make it out to be. Heck we are still here talking about this stuff on ATS. most countries you would go to jail or be killed for that.

City and state police are not subject to the tides of political elections, even if elections actually mattered. They are part of an unaccountable bureaucratic monstrosity that shifts only according to the whims of the establishment...the warrior class of the elite. The existence of a separate government-controlled warrior class has caused crisis and catastrophe all throughout human history. Invariably, this warrior class ends up exalting itself as superior to the functions and values of the citizenry, rather than maintaining a sense of duty to the citizenry. The claim that the average American is not capable of proper self-security or community security is perhaps the most successful lie of the past century. This is not to say that true warriors do not exist... see Anonymous.

originally posted by: Vaedur
Personally I don't think it's any different then any other point in history, except the technology.

I don't think it's as bad as people make it out to be. Heck we are still here talking about this stuff on ATS. most countries you would go to jail or be killed for that.

It certainly is as bad as people make it out to be, even worse. This is what the german people of WW2 would say in response to "rumours" of jews being rounded up going house to house. That "it is not as bad as people make out out to be" and well... we know how that story ended don't we?

Because the idea that elected leaders cant be capable of such atrocities is doe to the conditioning you had your whole life. Since childhood, pledge your allegiance to your nation trust your leaders for it is a nation under the grace of god. So you naturally reject this notion, society itself is suffering from Stockholm syndrome on epidemic levels. We have been hoodwinked and led to believe a lie. The first step is the hardest step and that is acceptance of what has transpired. Remove the wool from your eyes and it all starts to actually make sense. It is brilliant yet diabolical what these people have done , however they have not learned from history for history teaches us it does not end well for them. This is why they are trying everything to put it's death grip on us with all the mass surveillance, the usurping of all constituted laws. But they have yet to see our master stroke... interesting times indeed.

Yes were are talking about this on ATS ... for now. They have a plan for that in the cards too hence the ending of net neutrality.

a reply to: DarthFazer

They do not have or need a plan for it, everything is set in stone, the T+C are already here and utterly can stomp on anything labeled as outside a certain parameter for talking.

This place will likely survive easily, as it has absolutely no effect on the outside world.

Any further control of this type will only cause people to ACTUALLY get bored, and they do not want that.

No, I do not think anymore could come of it, lest their OWN demise.

a reply to: oldetimehockey4

Yeah, it doesn't reavela any valuable info. At least, that what many studies have found.

Dishi.

As I have thought, and actually heard today on CNN, we are just as bad, if not worse, than the very enemies we are clashing with. CNN was actually questioning if we are "becoming just as bad as them" in regards to the current CIA torture uproar. Really? That has to be questioned? It's not a matter of us becoming just as venomous as the enemy, it's a matter us, having already been this malicious for quite some time, putting a stop to such behavior. I almost chuckled at hearing someone questioning this. We aren't becoming just evil. We already have been. It's obvious.

a reply to: Ensinger23

...in preparation for who knows what.

Because they can read the tea leaves of electronic chatter with all of the technology discussed in your post and they know there is a critical mass of awareness and anger that, once reached, will require them have all those weapons at their disposal and a true event (rather than one which was contrived and controlled based upon one particular officer interaction by various power mongers) will occur and they hope to come out on top.

Hey OP, the Nazi's didn't lose, they saw the writing on the wall, and pulled a Hydra...

If I remember aright, Heracles had to cauterize each stump until he got to the last head. We need some of his calibre now with the ability to turn these same tools of oppression back at those who use them for such.

originally posted by: FamCore
I'm sorry to say it, but based on your comments it would seem you are one of the people OP mentioned that are loudly applauding, based on propaganda being spewed by the 4th branch of the g0v (AKA the media). Maybe you should look into some of the cases of misuse of these recent measures TPTB have put in place, which have hugely impacted AMERICAN CITIZENS - our drone strikes have even killed Americans abroad. No repercussions, no accountability. How many attacks have Americans have died at the hands of ISIS? I can ASSURE you that the number is nowhere near how many have died at the hands of our own g0v

and a reply to: neo96

I agree as well.
When are the ones making these policies and those that support them going to have skin in the game?
As long as it does not effect them nor do they have to pay for it they are all for it.

originally posted by: crazyewok





You decry big goverment on one hand yet you want to give them the power to bypass due process and commit torture on the other. YOU MAKE NO SENSE!!!!

They love Big Government in everyone else's business across the world and even in the citizens own lives. They love Big Government for Corporations and Banks. They hate Big Government for the individual citizen. That is the definition of Fascism. They want the Big Money Powers at the Banks and Multinational Corporations to run everything and not have any skin in the game from the policies that pass off to their puppets. Everyone else is on their own.

Fascism should more appropriately be called Corporatism because it is a merger of State and corporate power."

Benito Mussolini, Fascist dictator of Italy

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: buster2010

It's time for the American empire to come to an end like all other empires.

Works for me. I'd love nothing better to see those social engineering programs go byebye.

I guess some people never thought of what really pays for them.

Boot out the Banking and Corporate Lobbyists out of DC that approved of "Free Trade" with Commie China and there will be no need for "social engineering programs"

The lobbyists need to have skin in the game and feel personal consuquences from the policies they pass off on to their puppets.
They have none.
Instead they are rewarded for it. There is no downside for them and they make everyone else pay for it.

a reply to: jacobe001

Is there even a way to eliminate lobbying & campaign donations?

a reply to: Helious

Some of this i agree with, and am very upset with our current state of affairs. I work as a fire alarm/ Security engineer. What has concerned me is the recent push to eliminate analog CCTV ( Closed circuit television; IE. Surveillance cameras) and switch over to IP (Internet Protocol/address) Cat5e cameras which further gives the government more ability to watch our every move. I feel this overhaul and its unintended consequences may be far reaching. Its interesting the things that offer convenience to the user, also offers unsolicited monitoring and invasion of our privacy. A brave new world, indeed.

a reply to: Eunuchorn

Sure there is! Just not a realistic one... It involves making people think

You are spot on with your post. I just happened to see a photo, officially released from the White House, which shows Obama stepping on the seal of the United States, stepping particularly on the olive branch on the seal.

www.whitehouse.gov...

It's the second photo in the stream at above link. It's a really creepy photo -- it shows no children's faces, just their legs in Christmas striped stockings, and Obama legs and feet, stepping on the olive branch of the U.S. seal.

I do think this image is directly related to the Nazification you speak of, as it seems to indicate a reliance on symbolism to indicate a "war footing."

Perhaps this photo deserves its own thread, it is quite astonishing that the White House would release such an image!

a reply to: Helious

Howdy Pastor,

Long time-no see. You delivered a wonderful sermon here. It is very thought-provoking, as sermons should be. It was short, sweet, concise, and to the point. I certainly hope your parishioners are as lucky as we are.

what is happening is so out of control, so egregious and so blatant it is only being done on purpose.

Unfortunately, truer words have never been spoken. A great deal of what is happening seems to strengthen the US vs. THEM mentality of the domestic police departments. As you say, they are being armed to the teeth whether they need it or not. And, perhaps, whether they want it or not. One of the problems with having such high-tech "toys" is the excitement, and anticipation of using them against the enemy. And the enemy is whoever the government deems to be the enemy that day.

And, by strengthening the US vs. THEM mentality of the local police forces, it makes it much easier for these "boots on the ground" to enforce unjust laws and constitutional violations on their friends and neighbors. These local armed forces simply need to buy into the propaganda. It's much easier to shoot your next door neighbor, in good conscience, if you are led to believe that he is the enemy and he will kill you if you don't get him first.

I would say that doesn't give us any right to then stoop to the same level if we can in good conscious call ourselves the "good guys".

I don't often consider the moral implications of war. I generally believe that once the "dogs of war" are unleashed, we need to shield our eyes and let them do what is necessary to attain the goal of victory. But, war should be the final option, and not the first.

While I am not particularly religious, I will expand on the religious metaphor. I would have to say that we are fighting Satan on his own terms. The current enemy du jour commits atrocities, without remorse, in the name of their religion. The "Great Deceiver" has hijacked their faith and turned it against them, and us as well. There are many that would say that "we must use those same tactics against them. After all, they started it. Their religion is of the Devil!" However, in doing so, are we not also secumbing to the same deception as our so-called enemy? Perhaps we should really ponder the meaning of WWJD, rather than just putting it on a bumper sticker to proclaim our association with the American Religion.

They have created the problem, used the problem to scare the public and created a solution that robs us all of civil, social and essential liberties mostly to the thundering applause of a bunch of morons

I must say that I have been thinking, and fearing, the same thing for the last few days. So your post is quite timely. You and I may not always agree on every topic, but I think we can both see where these events are headed. The NAZIs used similar tactics leading up to WWII to rally the public behind their actions. Genocide, total war, and the establishment of a police state all stoked by the fires of nationalism and fear. And all critical thinking weakened by the diminution of education; and the provision of modern day "bread and circuses" to distract the masses from the real problem.

If they are torturing people oversees now, it is only a matter of time the use those techniques right here in the US on other "people" they want information from.

Perhaps this is the most poignant part of your sermon. For some reason, until I read your post, this had not occurred to me. If this behavior can be tolerated, even applauded, for today's declared enemy, what is to stop them from committing such atrocities here in this country, to American citizens. All the "Great Leaders" need to do is to declare a new domestically-based enemy, and these heinous tactics will be turned inward. Then there will be no further opportunities for dissent.

For some reason, I keep having a dream, where I see myself sitting in a police interrogation room. I have committed no crime. After some significantly harsh questioning by the local authorities, without the benefit of counsel, several men walk into the room. The local authorities demure to the new arrivals, and promptly exit the room. The lead man walks up to me and shows me his identification; then he says "I am from the government." The question is: Is this Germany in 1939 and the ID says Gestapo? Or is this the US in 2015 and the ID say Department of Homeland Security? The end result is likely to be the same.

If you approve this behavior because you deplore terrorists, you are a small minded lunatic. This torture, this behavior is not only deplorable and disgusting but if you think it's justified then you can absolutely not call yourself a "good guy".

While I agree with the sentiment, the question remains: How do we fight such an intractable enemy? I agree that this enemy was probably created specifically for the purposes as stated above. But the fact remains that they are now a threat to our way of life. Their crimes against humanity are so heinous, or so we are led to believe, that it is difficult for me to believe that this is actually occurring in the 21st century.

In summary, let me say that I don't necessarily agree that any one political party is more to blame than the other. Every single one of these political parasites is a bought-and-paid-for shill. The election of our government officials is a farce at best. I feel I have no representation in government for the issues that concern me the most. I am so dispirited by the political process that I missed voting in the last national election. This was the first time I missed an election in nearly 20 years. I did not necessarily do it on purpose, but voting was not particularly high on my agenda that day. I was travelling and didn't arrive at the polling location in time to cast my meaningless vote.

As I said, I believe there is more than enough blame to go around in the hallowed halls of government. However, I think blaming Obama is not necessarily a fair statement. Most of the changes that we are seeing at the national level started under the previous administration. Obama is little more than a weak pawn in this game of political dominance. While George W. Bush was in office I felt the same about him as you do now about Obama. However in the intervening years, I have come to realize that he was also little more than a pawn in the same game.

Thanks for the new insights. As I said once before: You are one of those cool preachers!



dex

a reply to: jrod

I have to say that I never considered the difference between an Orwellian and Huxleyan state. Though it may already have been addressed in more detail, I'm not able to read the entire thread right now.

For those interested, here is an interesting essay comparing and contrasting the different perspectives: Orwell, Huxley and the Emerging Totalitarianism


dex

ive been telling ppl for years this country is going down the # hole...nazi germany part 2. thats what happens when you bring in nazi scientists on operation paperclip. america have lost ww2. germany and the nazis ate at us from within