La Raza Promotes Washington Post Guide On Where People Can Vote Without An ID

originally posted by: sheepslayer247

That's funny because I know many illegals. They all have ID's and social security numbers. Even illegals can easily get an ID, so how is this going to prevent fraud?

I have no doubt that the illegal, social-service leeches that you pal around with have SSNs....they just happen to belong to other people.

There is no legal avenue for an illegal alien to request a SSN.

Social Security Numbers For Noncitizens

What you may be mistakenly referring to as a SSN may be an Individual Taxpayer Identification Number (ITIN) from the IRS for tax perpetration purposes. Individual Taxpayer Identification Number (ITIN)

It is not uncommon for illegals to request an ITIN from the IRS (remember the IRS cannot share the fact that an illegal is requesting an ITIN with ICE) take that ITIN number and slap it on to a counterfeit SS card for employment purposes. Unless the employer is required by the state to use eVerify then there is a reasonable chance that none will be the wiser. They illegal's fake SS card is photocopied, placed in their personnel file and off to work they go.

States Requiring the use of E-Verify 2011

Oh and the source article may be from 2006, but i found these snippets interesting:

The Social Security Administration is legally barred from sharing information with immigration or law enforcement agencies, or from telling the rightful owner of a Social Security number that someone else is working under their number, said Mark Hinkle, a spokesman.

Marti Dinerstein: "Falsely using a Social Security number is a felony. Our own federal agencies are working against those laws. The IRS says privacy laws prevent them from sharing information. So we know who the guilty employers are...The IRS knows who the guilty employees are. And nothing's being done about it."

In 2000, using data from the Social Security Administration, the Utah attorney general's office found that the Social Security numbers of 132,000 people in the state were being used by other people, far more than the state could prosecute.

NYT Article

Oh, back on the topic of eVerify, it doesn't prevent the hiring of individuals who steal/purchase/borrow the name and SSN of another person and I here's you a nifty 'How-To' guide for scamming the Feds for the purposes of EIC's and Child Tax Credits:

Example for a married couple:

Husband works 2 jobs, using different SSNs for each, while the wife works and uses a third illegally obtained SSN. They have 3 kids. What they do is both claim married on their W-2/W-4's and 8 dependents. By claiming married and 8 dependents next to nothing is withheld for federal taxes.

So between three low income jobs and next to no taxes withheld from fed and state this couple will gross about $60,000. When April 15th rolls around they toss 2 of the 3 1099's in the trash and file a 1040EZ, claiming an income of ~$25,000 while the wife stayed at home. What you get is a household well below the poverty threshold, EIC and Child Tax Credits and a tax return of $3-4,000 with nearly nothing in federal taxes paid.

Oh and that ~$60,000 has even more purchasing power when you take in to account

You do not need a SSN to get a driver’s license, register for school, obtain private health insurance, or to apply for school lunch programs or subsidized housing.

Social Security Numbers For Noncitizens

Besides all of that, there is a pretty sizable number of dependents of illegal aliens that receive food stamps; AKA 'Anchor Babies'. Now that ~$60,000 household only has to feed 2 out of the 5 mouths with their own money.

On a sidenote, imagine trying to audit a family that is *tear* living in the shadows *tear* More likely the legitimate owners of the stolen SSNs will have their door kicked in and get flashbanged and shot by some IRS SWAT team looking for the real tax cheats that are living 20-deep in a two bedroom apartment 5 states away.

a reply to: Lipton

The Social Security Administration is legally barred from sharing information with immigration or law enforcement agencies, or from telling the rightful owner of a Social Security number that someone else is working under their number, said Mark Hinkle, a spokesman.

I remember how pissed I was when I first heard of this!
These illegals can get away with anything, while an innocent person gets screwed royally. As I often say..."This is NOT the America I grew up in!"

I have heard of people who have had their identities stolen and the hell they had to go through.

There was a video on youtube where some illegal was claiming a lot of kids when he only had one. He was claiming nephews and nieces from another damned Country and received a hell of a rebate. I have known illegals personally and no matter how nice some of them were, they all knew these tricks, were deceitful and screwing the system. Like, what the hell?

originally posted by: sheepslayer247
It is important. No doubt about it. But there is no right given to such an act in the constitution. That's left to the states to decide what rights and qualifications a voter has. But apparently you didn't know that.

You do understand that constitutional amendments are part of the Constitution, right? No...really...they are official parts of the Constitution, every single one of them. So, while websites like this one talk out of their bum, the fact is that amendments exist--like the 15th, for example--that specifically state that:

Section 1. The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of race, color, or previous condition of servitude.
Section 2. The Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.

Emphasis is mine, of course. So, does my comment about the Constitution giving us the right to vote make more sense when you actually understand how the Constitution works and what it says? I hope so.

I never said that it wasn't worth asking for an ID. Our system, as it's designed, already requires an ID to register to vote. My problem lies with the political and agenda-driven motives of those that wish to pass further government intrusions because of a problem that doesn't exist at the level they claim.

Existence at the level "they" claim is irrelevant--it exists, plain and simple. Numerous news organization and investigative reporters have uncovered a LOT of non-citizen voting problems. The fact that the DOJ opts to ignore this and not prosecute is not a bullet point you should use to pretend it doesn't happen on a relatively large scale.

If you were knowledgeable, you would know that I am the first to confront such asinine conspiracies and inject fact/truth in to the debate. I've done that in this debate, but it appears that the nutbag conspiracy that voter fraud is a real issue is winning the day......despite evidence to the contrary.

See above. And again, that whole use of Google/Bing I mentioned last time that you claimed to do...

I never claimed anything to the contrary. What I said is that it does not exist at the level claimed by the partisan politios that wish to drive opinion of the uneducated and biased to believe that it is a widespread problem. Those that regurgitate the talking points and agenda of these people have fallen prey to outright propaganda and are trying to implement bigger government for the sake of their political ideology.

I find that to be hypocritical and contrary to a conservative, constitutional stance and I will continue to dismiss it until real facts and evidence can be presented that actually prove there is a voter fraud issue beyond the statistically rare occurrence.

When you ignore said "real facts and evidence" and argue that it isn't happening, nothing can change your opinion. Either you are choosing to ignore it or properly research it. In any event, you're using an arbitrary "not-at-the-level-they-claim" argument to pretend that the problem isn't a major issue. I absolutely believe that voter fraud, no matter how small or large or common or uncommon is still a problem that needs attention. You don't wait for the few small holes letting water into your boat to become a giant hole breach before you start fixing the issue, so why ignore 'smaller' voter fraud problems until they become big ones? Your logic escapes the intelligent person.

With this statement, you have exposed yourself. You are an anti-Obama, anti-democrat person that is not interested in a logical debate. Your goal is to bash those that disagree with your ideology, without regard for facts or common sense.

It has been my "job" to expose those that lack the ability to look past the partisan politics to come to logical conclusions based on fact. I also study propaganda and can spot it a mile away. So you better step-up your game if you want to get past me.

I'm not about to let you or anyone else continue to perpetuate the agenda of those that wish to compromise our democratic process.

LOL.

First, you don't "let" me or anyone else do anything, so there's that.

Second, you're right, I don't like Obama and I haven't ever since I voted for him in '08 and he turned out to be the exact opposite of everything that he claimed to be and for which I voted (plus, I was tired of the way Bush was running things, and McCain, IMO, is going senile and has too much baggage). In 2012, I voted for Gary Johnson because the Republicans don't know how to find good candidates and it was readily apparent that Obama is not a good president--good politician, but not good president. Not that I need to defend myself to you, but there's a little history of my recent voting for you. Oh, and I voted for Rand Paul and Thomas Massie, because they're as close to intelligent people that I can find in politics right now that appreciate our Constitution (amendments and all).

Your cute little immature tactics of challenging me to "step up [my] game" or that I've "exposed [myself]" with comments is ridiculous, as I never claimed to be anything before to you, you just made apparent false assumptions that made yourself look silly.

At any point, spinning around on this merry-go-round with you is dulling down my intelligence level...I feel like I'm a surprise guest on "The View" or something. In any case, good luck with your "job," but if I were your boss, you'd be fired by now because you're not very good at it--you're using partisan politics to claim that you're fighting dissenters to your opinion that you claim base their arguments on partisan politics. But, hey, keep it up if it makes you happy, but I have more intelligent things to do with my time.

originally posted by: muse7
But illegals aren't voting though.

Did you completely miss Night Star's post?

Or, let me guess, you don't believe this report, or you think it's a stand-alone instance, or whatever other reason you can come up with to dismiss it as a problem...

If you're going to bring an argument to the table, don't use the recipe of a 2-to-1 ratio of ignorance to ideology.

a reply to: muse7

a reply to: muse7

Your identity is not vetted. California does not require and ID to register to vote. A utility bill works...

I registered at the Library, never got asked for an ID and never had to provide one at a polling station.

registertovote.org...

So ... let me get clarity on this ... when the so-called "lamestream media" claims something that fits the Right's political agenda, it's suddenly a credible source?

Good to know.

a reply to: raymundoko

I know you're not talking specifically to me, but I wonder if I could ask you a couple of questions anyway.

Do you have a California Driver's License? Is your ID information in government data systems that could be used to establish your identity?

a reply to: Gryphon66

I don't have a problem with mainstream media, I never have.. I actually really appreciate the US media network.

However, nice deflection. Perfect way to ignore evidence.

Like I said, I've personally witnessed it many times and have even called the police. When a guy can't even speak English and uses a piece of paper with a printed name and address as his way to identify himself I call BS.

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: sheepslayer247

That premise is rediculous.

It's common sense that if we check the identity of anything it should be voting. Our voting process should be under massive scrutiny. My god where is the common sense?

Watch out for those who are clearly devoid of common sense. Because its really not a lack of common sense if you get drift.

This idea of no evidence is about the same as someone telling you that you are paranoid if you lock up your house when you go to work because you have never been robbed. Say what? Yea go ahead and keep the keys in your car because auto theft is virtually nonexistent around here.

a reply to: raymundoko

What did I deflect, exactly?

Did I comment on the content of the video? No? Then your comments make no sense.

I'm sure your anecdotal evidence is important.

Just like, I heard a guy saying the other day that Republicans have to keep control of State governorships so that they can continue to control the elections process.

a reply to: Gryphon66

Yes, and I know where you are going with that, but that doesn't change the fact I wasn't asked for an ID to register to vote like two people in this thread have so far claimed.

Even if they can look me up in a system after I fill out the papers does not mean I am necessarily the one who filled out the papers.

a reply to: Gryphon66

Only I actually have a police report I could probably redact and upload to prove mine...[Edit: A police report I literally had to force the officer to provide]

And you deflected by attempting to pull the whole "OHHHH NOW YOU SUDDENLY LIKE MAINSTREAM". It was a pointless statement attempting to belittle people in this thread.

originally posted by: raymundoko
a reply to: Gryphon66

Yes, and I know where you are going with that, but that doesn't change the fact I wasn't asked for an ID to register to vote like two people in this thread have so far claimed.

Even if they can look me up in a system after I fill out the papers does not mean I am necessarily the one who filled out the papers.

It doesn't mean you aren't, either. How much more government interference do you want in your life?

On the other matter, when you voted, what did you have to do at the polls? Are you saying you just smiled and waved and walked to the machines?

originally posted by: raymundoko
a reply to: Gryphon66

Only I actually have a police report I could probably redact and upload to prove mine...[Edit: A police report I literally had to force the officer to provide]

And you deflected by attempting to pull the whole "OHHHH NOW YOU SUDDENLY LIKE MAINSTREAM". It was a pointless statement attempting to belittle people in this thread.

Belittle people in this thread, how so? What did I address to other people in this thread?

I asked a question about the media, nothing more.

Wow, you guys are getting thin-skinned ...

a reply to: Gryphon66

The thin skin isn't from me. What was the point of your comment if not to belittle? Your comment was completely pointless and simply a way to make the report seem unimportant. That is the definition of belittle...

More Illegal voting:

Source

a reply to: raymundoko

Several media reports have been used as evidence in this discussion.

Asking when the media can be trusted IS relevant whether you think so or not.

/shrug

a reply to: Gryphon66

When the Media actually goes and confronts the people and has it on film, I am pretty sure they can be trusted...

a reply to: raymundoko

Was that "confrontation" the only claim of fact that was made in the report?

No.

Ergo, my question.

How is it that folks do not trust "the media" until it serves their agenda?

You've given your response. Others, however, may have different ideas.

Why are you trying to answer for everyone or shut down a straightforward inquiry?

Oh, and by the way, did you have a response about how you were checked in at the poll?

Or ...