Gottfried Helnwein & Satanic Ritual Abuse

a reply to: Tangerine

Agreed. There's a mountain of Christian-based fear mongering out there in Conspiracy Land, where EVERYTHING involving a triangle or proposes a different perspective on spirituality gets eeeee-vile stamped all over it. So whether there's an actual spiritual element attached to the subject of ritual abuse or not, it doesn't matter as intention and devotion produced by the follower of any given religion.

I no longer prescribe to anything involving the Judaic entity that refers to itself as "God". Rather, I view reality from a neutral perspective where quantum physics sort of ties everything together. Seems that reality is influenced through ones mental and emotional state that the ritual and practice places the individual in, not the ritual itself, which is why prayer appears to produce results in ALL religions and the so-called one true religion has and never will be settled upon. This ties into what Einstein's bud, physicist Max Planck referees to as kind of energetic grid.

With that said, it seems like occult ritual would fit this concept. While it's understandably easy to sustain mainstream religion through the concept of faith, claiming answers will be provided to the non-skeptical when they die, I've always wondered how result-based belief systems have survived for so long. It all comes down to will and consent in conjunction with one's mental and emotional state. So, most religions are essentially all correct in the sense that we all agree that love feels awesome! But for whatever reason we get mixed up in the details of it all.

For me, I see too many elements coming together that points to practitioners of an old school practice with a long history, to which I say, f**k these guys and their disgusting practices. It's too unnerving to sit idly by when it's practically rubbed in our faces. I just want to retain the hope that the world can see beyond the surface and come together to shut every last psychopath down.

originally posted by: 2x Helix
a reply to: Tangerine

Agreed. There's a mountain of Christian-based fear mongering out there in Conspiracy Land, where EVERYTHING involving a triangle or proposes a different perspective on spirituality gets eeeee-vile stamped all over it. So whether there's an actual spiritual element attached to the subject of ritual abuse or not, it doesn't matter as much as the fact that are devotees in every single belief system that are completely convinced that their practices produces results.

I no longer prescribe to anything involving the Judaic entity that refers to itself as "God". Rather, I view reality from a neutral quantum aspect, where it appears that it all boils down to the mental and emotional state that ritual and practice places the individual in, not the ritual itself, which is why prayer appears to produce results in ALL religions and the so-called one true religion has and never will be settled upon.

With that said, sure, it seems that occult ritual fits that concept. While it is understandably easy to sustain mainstream religion through the concept of faith, calming answers will be provided to the non-skeptical when they die, I always wondered how result-based belief systems have survived for so long. It all comes down to will and consent, hankering back to the quantum element of mental and emotional states. So if a small group people believes hard enough that abusing a kid gives them some kind of energetic result, then unfortunately it will continue so long as results are produced.

Add to this the fact that most people are temptingly easy to control, combine it with fear and threats, then you have a mob-like power structure that can get away with these kind of shenanigans, while most subdued individuals that catch on await Jesus to swoop in and save the day.

For me, I see too many elements coming together that points to one of these before mentioned mobs, to which I say, f**k these guys and their nasty ass practices. It's too unnerving to sit idly by when it's practically rubbed in our faces. I just want to retain the hope that the world can see beyond the surface and come together to shut every last psychopath down.

I understand your position but aren't you jumping to the conclusion that the artist is promoting or endorsing abuse when he may be trying to provoke revulsion against it?

I think we can pretty much find whatever we're looking for in our interpretations of art and other things and make associations that don't actually exist (ie. organized hordes of people engaged in secret, evil practices). Are there people who do horrible things? Without doubt. But it's still a great leap to suggest organized Satanic abuse on a large scale. It requires hard evidence.

a reply to: Tangerine

I'm more concerned about the minds of the posters (not yourself) who see Satanic influences in everything. It seems that they're attracted to this sort of imagery and seek it out but feel compelled to justify that attraction by condemning it--and then finding more to look at.

that's why some of us call it "FEAR PORN"

hear that..
..but people aren't interested in "good" things anymore..
like the half-dozen bible passages i couldn't help but think of as i read all this
(didn't click the links...)
(seen enough bad # to know it's real)
(just going off all the responses here)
and it's funny how memory works like that..
..i mean, it's not like i had to focus & recall the passages
they just "came to me"
/shrugs

that would be the whole issue here.. what "comes" to people when they see this stuff?

and maybe people SHOULD walk out of art exhibitions like this
# the artists "sensibilities" if he/she's not concerned about mine
if i held an art show & everyone "walked out"
maybe that would "tell me something"
(hurp)
and i might "think about it"
(hurp)

let us pay to see crucifixes immersed in piss
because it's somehow "art"
but whatever you do
don't hurt these precious little darlings feelings..

..because they'll probably go home and take it out on the neighbors cat

where EVERYTHING involving a triangle or proposes a different perspective on spirituality gets eeeee-vile stamped all over it.

you should read some of the threads i've posted..
..i sometimes do circles & stars too

a reply to: Tangerine

My apologies. I notice I did a total info dump in my first post and lazily implied, here, piece it all together. I didn't mean to come off as one sided or imply that provoking revulsion against it wasn't a logical possibly to be factored into the equation. It then asks the question, is the subject matter depicted meant to draw attention and activism to a real crime or is it meant to be taken metaphorically? Either way, the artwork does feature familiar themes and symbolism that many within the esoteric community would recognize as being congruent with the topic known as trauma based mind control or MK Ultra. A large scale Satanic abuse ring? I certainly hope not. But with it's recognizable themes, I was surprised that no one out there had commented or posted a comparison breaking down this material. I don't want to come off as conclusive, but instead gather feedback from the community to find out if this material actually leads anywhere.

Hey I'm pretty glad I didn't look at the links.

originally posted by: 2x Helix
a reply to: Tangerine

But with it's recognizable themes, I was surprised that no one out there had commented or posted a comparison breaking down this material. I don't want to come off as conclusive, but instead gather feedback from the community to find out if this material actually leads anywhere.

To me this art work is trying to bring attention to the occult rather than support it, I have no idea if these occult's a mutually exclusive to satanic ritual.

I did a little research into it. Like it's interesting to note that the baby in the Nazi pictures most likely represents Hitler, a bunch of blonde haired Nazi's stand around him as if to say he was deliberately chosen. Well I was looking around trying to understand what the art was saying I ended up on a website for the Ordo Templi Orientis or O.T.O. Interestingly they use Illuminati symbolism.

So I think it's all about mass mind control and secret societies. Maybe it's not all just a conspiracy theory like we have all been made to believe.

originally posted by: 2x Helix
a reply to: Tangerine

My apologies. I notice I did a total info dump in my first post and lazily implied, here, piece it all together. I didn't mean to come off as one sided or imply that provoking revulsion against it wasn't a logical possibly to be factored into the equation. It then asks the question, is the subject matter depicted meant to draw attention and activism to a real crime or is it meant to be taken metaphorically? Either way, the artwork does feature familiar themes and symbolism that many within the esoteric community would recognize as being congruent with the topic known as trauma based mind control or MK Ultra. A large scale Satanic abuse ring? I certainly hope not. But with it's recognizable themes, I was surprised that no one out there had commented or posted a comparison breaking down this material. I don't want to come off as conclusive, but instead gather feedback from the community to find out if this material actually leads anywhere.

Why don't you ask the artist what response he intended to elicit? His answer isn't proof, of course, that that was his intention but it's a start. People often read intention into artists' work that simply wasn't there.

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa

originally posted by: 2x Helix
a reply to: Tangerine

But with it's recognizable themes, I was surprised that no one out there had commented or posted a comparison breaking down this material. I don't want to come off as conclusive, but instead gather feedback from the community to find out if this material actually leads anywhere.

To me this art work is trying to bring attention to the occult rather than support it, I have no idea if these occult's a mutually exclusive to satanic ritual.

I did a little research into it. Like it's interesting to note that the baby in the Nazi pictures most likely represents Hitler, a bunch of blonde haired Nazi's stand around him as if to say he was deliberately chosen. Well I was looking around trying to understand what the art was saying I ended up on a website for the Ordo Templi Orientis or O.T.O. Interestingly they use Illuminati symbolism.

So I think it's all about mass mind control and secret societies. Maybe it's not all just a conspiracy theory like we have all been made to believe.

Occult is a very slippery word. It simply means hidden information but you probably know that.

What's the evidence that the OTO uses Illuminati symbolism?

a reply to: Tangerine

There website has a pyramid with the eye of providence in the middle, which is obviously always associated with the illuminati.

JESUS christ!! Have you read some of their material? Some of their metaphors imply rape...

According to their schedules they are directly allied with the Freemason lodges

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa
a reply to: Tangerine

There website has a pyramid with the eye of providence in the middle, which is obviously always associated with the illuminati.

Perhaps you're unaware that the OTO grew out of Golden Dawn which grew out the Masons who use the eye. Of course, you'll simply claim that the Masons are Illuminati -- absent any evidence, of course.

originally posted by: Ridhya
JESUS christ!! Have you read some of their material? Some of their metaphors imply rape...

According to their schedules they are directly allied with the Freemason lodges

Some of whose materials and what does it have to do with a Christian deity? Oh, wait! Maybe that's the BIG secret.

a reply to: Tangerine
Um I never said it had to do with god? OTOs writings are #ed up. Seems to be about subservience of women

I don’t know why, but since my early childhood I was obsessed with the idea of justice. When I learned what people of my country did to innocent people during the Nazi-regime, and how mass-murderers got away after the war and made big careers – everything stopped for me right there. I lost my trust in the world of grown-ups and their system of values. In a child the full potential of humane values and virtues, of innocence, trust, love, compassion and creativity is intact. Children are sacred. But they are vulnerable and defenceless and depending on our fairness. And it seems that adults tend to betray that trust. In the sixties, long before mass media ever mentioned child-abuse in Germany, in my research into that subject, I saw hundreds of police-photographs of dead children’s bodies, fragile, skinny, broken and sometimes deformed beyond recognition; tortured to death – often by their own relatives. These pictures travel now with me and I can’t get rid of them. My work is about the struggle of human existence and children are the heroes of my visual narratives.

I will withhold my the comment I originally intended to leave here after reading this.
....I suppose it would only be fair to revisit it in this context, no?

Not saying the guy is telling the truth.....just sayin'. For the sake of being fair about it and all.

a reply to: Tangerine

So we can then assume that the masons obviously practice monarch mind control. That's what the disney imagery represents, dissociation though childhood trauma.

There are some very dark people out there with far to much power. They may consider themselves as enlightened, but in reality they are just primitive animals.

a reply to: Jakal26

Thanks for posting the quote, Jakal26. This was the exact one I was looking for. I had come across it awhile back and while the text does justify the reasoning behind the artwork, the specific of indicators of trauma based mind control are still present and are not directly mentioned by Helnwein himself. This practice of mind control is accredited to the research of infamous Nazi physician Josef Mengele. Browse through various sites and there seems to be indicators that this practice is still occurring. Sites like Vigilant Citizen post some very thought provoking articles that point to this being the case. If so, why? Is it effective and what are the results produced?

There is also the subtle yet eye-catching themes and symbols surrounding the artist and his affiliations: the Eye of Providence, Helnwein's pentagram bandanna and 'El Diablo' hand sign while wearing a pyramid ring, Manson's association with Lavey's Church of Satan, Schwarzenegger's admitted former admiration for Adolf Hitler after years of denial, the Geldof's affiliation with the Crowley-inspired O.T.O., etc. Conclusive, no. But suspicious for sure. It's a delicate area and if highly organized sects like this actually do exist, it makes it difficult to take an individual at their word. Sometimes one has to follow the signs to see where it leads and luckily there are communities like this where people can come together to collaborate, research and generate discussion.

originally posted by: Ridhya
a reply to: Tangerine
Um I never said it had to do with god? OTOs writings are #ed up. Seems to be about subservience of women

I was joking in reference to you starting your post "Jesus Christ!!!".

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa
a reply to: Tangerine

So we can then assume that the masons obviously practice monarch mind control. That's what the disney imagery represents, dissociation though childhood trauma.

There are some very dark people out there with far to much power. They may consider themselves as enlightened, but in reality they are just primitive animals.

OK, then how about proving this claim? I know there are some very dark people out there and some of them have power, but you're making a specific claim that requires evidence. Can you cite some? By the way, so-called primitive animals don't do that sort of crap.

originally posted by: 2x Helix
a reply to: Jakal26

Thanks for posting the quote, Jakal26. This was the exact one I was looking for. I had come across it awhile back and while the text does justify the reasoning behind the artwork, the specific of indicators of trauma based mind control are still present and are not directly mentioned by Helnwein himself. This practice of mind control is accredited to the research of infamous Nazi physician Josef Mengele. Browse through various sites and there seems to be indicators that this practice is still occurring. Sites like Vigilant Citizen post some very thought provoking articles that point to this being the case. If so, why? Is it effective and what are the results produced?

There is also the subtle yet eye-catching themes and symbols surrounding the artist and his affiliations: the Eye of Providence, Helnwein's pentagram bandanna and 'El Diablo' hand sign while wearing a pyramid ring, Manson's association with Lavey's Church of Satan, Schwarzenegger's admitted former admiration for Adolf Hitler after years of denial, the Geldof's affiliation with the Crowley-inspired O.T.O., etc. Conclusive, no. But suspicious for sure. It's a delicate area and if highly organized sects like this actually do exist, it makes it difficult to take an individual at their word. Sometimes one has to follow the signs to see where it leads and luckily there are communities like this where people can come together to collaborate, research and generate discussion.

Can you link Manson, LaVey, Schwartzenegger, Hitler, Geldof, and Crowley together in any meaningful way involving Satanic Child abuse? Several of these people are alive and, although I'm not a fan, you're implying that they're involved in heinous crimes involving children. Proof?

a reply to: Tangerine

Not Satanic child abuse specifically, but these groups are associated with the darker spectrum of occult practice. If the goal of the artist and his work is meant to raise awareness and protest occult ritual abuse, it does seem odd that there are many occult related indicators surrounding the artist himself, outside of the artwork.

I just stumbled upon some additional connections that includes Helnwein's connection to Scientology, in which founder L. Ron Hubbard and his son admit the churches affiliation with Aleister Crowley, occultist and the most famous member of the O.T.O. (Ordo Templi Orientis). Food for thought.

Helnwein & Scientology