NSA says it has 'lost' its non-redacted UFO files.

Posted a few days ago (September 12th) thought this was an important article from researcher Alejandro Rojas about the ongoing disclosure of contents from the hundreds of redacted National Security Agency UFO documents accessed by researchers in the 1990's.

Thing is, now it seems the N.S.A has lost them all.

It's a bit of a long article but there's also some interesting reading about the mysterious 'Yeates affidavit' and John Greenwald Junior's attempts at a Mandatory Declassification Review.. as well as related info concerning 'UFO lawyer' Peter Gersten's CAUS organisation suing the National Security Agency back in 1980 because it 'refused' to release its UFO files (according to a U.S. District Court Judge who wasn't even allowed to read the files 'The continued need for secrecy far out weighed the public's right to know').

NSA says it has lost its non-redacted UFO files

UFO and government secrecy researcher John Greenewald has been petitioning to get the National Security Agency (NSA) UFO files that were released in the 90s further declassified. When they were released, after a legal battle, much of the information was redacted. There are large swaths of information that have been blacked out or covered with white out. However, the NSA recently told Greenewald they could not find even one original of the hundreds of pages UFO files.

Greenewald received this information in response to a request for a Mandatory Declassification Review (MDR) of the NSA’s UFO files. MDRs require that the agency re-review previously released redacted files to unredact information that is now declassified. This is a similar process that was used to reveal the name of Area 51 in CIA documents last year.

The MDR was fulfilled for an affidavit related to the lawsuit asking the NSA to release its UFO files in 1980, called the Yeates affidavit. As for the rest, the NSA writes, “With the exception of the enclosed document, we cannot locate unredacted copies or the original documents that were previously reviewed and released to the public.”

In the late 70s, the Citizens Against UFO Secrecy (CAUS), headed by lawyer Peter Gersten, sought to get UFO files from several government agencies released using the Freedom of Information Act (FOIA). The NSA refused to release their files, so CAUS sued.

The NSA had a large amount of UFO files, not necessarily because they were investigating UFOs, but because they monitor communications worldwide as part of their regular duties. These files are called communications intelligence (COMINT). Among this large amount of data, there were hundreds of files referring to UFOs. However, the NSA felt they should remain classified.

In 1980, Eugene F. Yeates, chief of the Office of Policy for the NSA, submitted a 21 page document to the judge overseeing the case, Federal Judge Gerhart A. Gesell, as to why these files should remain classified. This is the Yeates affidavit. However, this document was also classified.

Although Gesell did not have the clearance to read the documents in question, the Yeates affidavit convinced him that the NSA files should stay classified. He wrote, “The public interest in disclosure is far outweighed by the sensitive nature of the materials and the obvious effect on national security their release may well entail.”

When the Yeates affidavit was released, it was heavily redacted. UFO researcher Stanton Friedman shows a page from the document to demonstrate government UFO secrecy, and as he says, this goes over well on television where a simple image can be very effective when making a point.

Eventually, in 1997, due to laws making it more difficult to keep files over 25 years old classified, the NSA released a less redacted Yeates affidavit, and 156 UFO documents. As Friedman puts it, the affidavit was originally about 75% blacked out, the second version was only about 20% blacked out. However, the UFO documents are heavily redacted.

The NSA must have seen Friedman’s talks or television interviews, because instead of mostly blacking out the text, this time they largely whited it out, making it much less visually poignant..

Greenewald writes, “In essence, the ‘originals’ were destroyed or lost when they blacked out the records many years ago — and now in 2014 — they are missing and can not be further reviewed for declassification and release. The history, whatever it may be, is lost forever.”

Link

Video:

See 7:10

The NSA claims that it cannot locate the non-redacted versions of its UFO files.

For folks new to this subject (or who just haven't heard of him) then John Greenewald Junior mentioned in the article above gave a presentation quite a few years back which is well worth a watch as he basically proves the contents of the 'USAF UFO Fact Sheet' are completely untrue just by citing the U.S. Government's own documents (he also makes some very good points about NORAD CIRVIS UFO reports).

For nearly 9 years, John Greenewald, Jr. has been exploring the archives of the U.S. Government for undeniable proof of the UFO Phenomenon. In those nine years, he has created the largest online archive anywhere in the world.

Likewise Peter Gerstein has been quite a persistent chap over the years and here he is with Project Bluebook's Dr Hynek discussing UFO documents which are not meant to exist (particularly ones from the Defense Intelligence Agency).


See 0:40

On June 24,1980 Gersten brought suit in the same District Court against the National Security Agency but this time on behalf of his own recently formed organization, Citizens Against UFO Secrecy (CAUS). His objective was 135 UFO related documents the NCI had refused to release. On November 18, 1980, based upon a NSA top secret affidavit which Gersten was not allowed to see, US District Court Judge Gerhard A. Gesell dismissed the lawsuit stating that 'the continued need for secrecy far out weighed the public's right to know.'

Cheers.

I literally lol'ed when I read the title to this thread. It figures and it's disgusting IMO.

They lost these files about as much as Louis Lerner lost her's. It's funny how stuff like this just seems to disappear while something they deem important to use against any person of the public seems to be set in stone for all eternity.

It's hard to keep files over 25 years?? So throw the ones about Jim Bob trying to marry his cousin away and keep the important ones. It's not that difficult. This story is what is difficult. Make some of the folks you pay to listen in on sex calls transfer them to something that takes up less space. Surely they won't miss much by doing so.

You will NEVER have the NSA say they lost recordings of you making death threats to someone.

You will NEVER have the IRS forgive your debt because they can't find the proper paperwork.

You will NEVER catch a break like these folks seem to do at every turn.

If anyone outside of the government sector lost only HALF as much as these people seem to.... they would be standing in the unemployment line before the sun set on another day.

The game is rigged. Those who seek disclosure will only get it when the alien life forms (if they exist) come down and introduce themselves to you personally. Don't hold your breath for anything less.

The thing that pisses you off most is.... they really think all of us are just that stupid. They piss on you and tell you it's raining all while smiling and tipping their hats.

Now I am going to go finish the video aspects of your thread.

S&F

I am willing to wager when the Kennedy files are ready to be released they will have mysteriously disappeared as well? Any way good thread S&F!

FANTASTIC THREAD !!
I mean, really good and right up my alley
as far as my own research.

Isn't the whole "oh those records?" "Yeah we um lost them"
game entirely so overused and obvious at this point ?
Even when looking for basic information
in very specific areas regarding say the 509th composite at RAAF
for 1947 info is Tough to come by.
Yes it's nuclear secrets but all the papers ?
Well then,
Why do I now know more about the Manhattan Project
than I do as to what was served in the mess hall at Roswell Army Air Field ?

Or what about people that everyone should be curious of like
known spook in 1947 Kenneth Arnold or Fred Lee Crisman ?
Oh you mean the Sporting goods sales man?
No..I mean the spook Kenneth Arnold.
Fred, spook as well, saw a disc in 1947
and collected debris in the Pacific Northwest,
which was the Maury Island incident.
Surely Coincidentally.. a couple decades later,
the very same Fred was called in by Jim Garrison in the JFK assassination trial
as the grassy knoll shooter.
COME ON !!!
That's a slap in the face of truth that those two aren't known for
who they really were 60 years later.
People in this field should be able to see through things like these.
For me, obvious silence or protesting too much are hot spots of guilt.

a reply to: karl 12

Now THAT is some alpha class, top notch, one hundred and ten percent pure, WIFI connectivity compatible, weapons grade BS.

Ok...

Let us assume for a moment, that an agency whose ENTIRE existence is predicated on the basis of collecting, securing, and storing masses and masses of data, on everyone, and everything that happens on the face of the planet, has indeed lost arguably the most important and potentially paradigm shattering documents, that any organisation has ever possessed.

That would make them the most inept, utterly useless bunch of cretins EVER BORN TO THE EARTH! We are talking, if this is true, about a group of people for whom having their brain pans emptied at a thousand yards, would be no hinderance to their intellect or ability to function. They would literally have to be the most dull eyed, slack jawed, halfwitted, intellectually vacant group of individuals ever to come into existence, to misplace data of that value and importance.

And furthermore, if that is indeed the case, if they have lost these documents, and in fact ARE an organisation exclusively comprised by the idiot, lab grown secret progeny of George Bush and Sarah Palin, then I am deeply concerned for the status of the national security of the United States of America, and indeed allies of that nation, who are often asked to act on such data as the NSA can actually keep their hands on long enough to relay to other nations.

This organisation advises the President. How can ANYONE trust what this organisation says or does, if it cannot keep its own paperwork in good order, and to hand? It is not as if the NSA are in the habit of sharing data over much, certainly not with a large number of agencies external to itself, so how is it, exactly, that such documentation as exists, has managed to slip their grasp? The chances are that the documents in question, have had a single secure location since they were first delivered to the agency, so how exactly is it possible to lose something of that importance, when by its very definition, it is rarely seen, and labelled "So secret, I had to kill myself after filing it"?

Personally, I buy this crap at about the same exchange rate that I buy that IRS Lois Lerner crap. In fact, given how well that has worked out so far (in that still, no one actually knows what really happened with those emails, and no solid data has been made public), I would, were I a betting man, be willing to lay significant odds, that the NSA saw that trick and realised how extensively they have been over doing the whole secrecy angle.

I can see it all now...

"Hey! Hey Jeff! You seeing this? They just, they just straight up told everyone the emails were lost! Its not even a good lie! I think we could save ourselves some money here! Hey, phone the boss, and tell him he is going to be in drones and blacksite budget surplus for about ten years!"

This is the most utterly unbelievable crap, that I have EVER heard!

originally posted by: Kangaruex4Ewe

The game is rigged.

Kangaruex4Ewe, appreciate the reply mate and couldn't agree more with your comments - you'd think that if these NSA UFO documents were so important that a Federal Court Judge wasn't even allowed to read them then they'd be a little more careful when it came to storage.

Certainly isn't the first time either and there are plenty of other examples of Government UFO files, sensitive military UFO reports, official UFO footage, gun camera photographs, radar tapes, satellite data, Military pilot transcripts, Control Tower tapes, Naval log books, official UFO meeting minutes, security footage, physical trace evidence samples and official UFO investigation records being withheld, missing, stolen, destroyed or confiscated here.

The article also reminded me a bit of Poland's official files going 'missing' a few years ago but unfortunately it seems that story has now been removed from the internet (although there are snippets at the thread).

Poland's UFO files go missing.

The Polish air forces gather and analyze PRL reports on the pilots' meetings with unidentified flying objects. In the folder named "The Unknown" gathered dozens of reports. In the 1990's Invaluable data disappeared.

This is an Interview with Col. Ryszard Grundmanem. Col. Grundmanem was the former head of "Air Traffic, Air Force and Air Defense", who gathered reports regarding UFOs...

Link

ATS member Trueman also made a bloody great thread a while back and it seems that Peru's official UFO documents were even stolen.

We all know Peru is one of the hottest areas regarding UFO sights, so we can imagine all the work these group of people had and all the interesting material they had to analize.Witnesses were required to fill a 17 pages document. All the cases were digitally saved.

Strangely, in 2004 someone “stole” the computers from their office and part of the classified records were lost. “It is well known that there are classified documents that are hidden and Anthony Choy confirms it, however he regretted the theft of important material in 2004. "All had been stolen, then I understood that it was all a fraud, or that formed an office as a sort of screen to the public but at another level we were investigating, we were there".

One Example of How UFO Disclosure is Also Controlled

Whatever the case I think this statement made by astrophysicist Jacques Vallee just about sums things up.

"Governments took notice, organizing task forces, encouraging secret briefings and study groups, funding classified research and all the time denying before the public that any of the phenomena might be real. The major revelation of these Diaries may be the demonstration of how the scientific community was misled by the government, how the best data were kept hidden, and how the public record was shamelessly manipulated."

Dr. Jacques Vallee, astrophysicist, computer scientist 1992

link

Cheers.

originally posted by: UnderKingsPeak
FANTASTIC THREAD !!
I mean, really good and right up my alley
as far as my own research.

Isn't the whole "oh those records?" "Yeah we um lost them"
game entirely so overused and obvious at this point ?
Even when looking for basic information
in very specific areas regarding say the 509th composite at RAAF
for 1947 info is Tough to come by.
Yes it's nuclear secrets but all the papers ?
Well then,
Why do I now know more about the Manhattan Project
than I do as to what was served in the mess hall at Roswell Army Air Field ?

Or what about people that everyone should be curious of like
known spook in 1947 Kenneth Arnold or Fred Lee Crisman ?
Oh you mean the Sporting goods sales man?
No..I mean the spook Kenneth Arnold.
Fred, spook as well, saw a disc in 1947
and collected debris in the Pacific Northwest,
which was the Maury Island incident.
Surely Coincidentally.. a couple decades later,
the very same Fred was called in by Jim Garrison in the JFK assassination trial
as the grassy knoll shooter.
COME ON !!!
That's a slap in the face of truth that those two aren't known for
who they really were 60 years later.
People in this field should be able to see through things like these.
For me, obvious silence or protesting too much are hot spots of guilt.

Check out Fredd chrisman as one of the bishops of the orthodox catholic church....Several key spooks were bishops in the church of which edgar hoover was a board member......very complicated stuff....and no congregations...just bishops....

originally posted by: Kangaruex4Ewe


You will NEVER catch a break like these folks seem to do at every turn.

If you had the means to blackmail anybody and everybody, you'd probably catch any break you wanted.

a reply to: karl 12

Looks like some folks are trying really, really hard to keep the truth from getting into the public domain. So what might that truth be?

Perhaps it might be a society game changer, perhaps that doesn't suit those that own society.

If we are expected to believe that ALL of the UFO reports were top secret aircraft, that's difficult to believe in itself, but if they were then why not just say it, acting suspiciously with them is just going to bring a lot more scrutiny.

I don't buy into the "society couldn't handle it" aspect, unless it truly is something I haven't considered, something beyond my comprehension, how bad could it be?

They are being very careful about saying, 'Lost' don't you think? They could have done a barnstormer and just said all that gear was in WTC7 and Kaput after WTC7 burnt and collapsed as a convenience, the NSA had offices there as did the CIA and FBI.... But, that was at a time no-one talked to one another..Ahem!
Anyway, the raw files have to be still on the secular Intra-net somewhere.

Unfortunately for us, they are in control, and they can "lose" whatever they want.

The very act of concealment and subterfuge in government UFO data should alert even the most die hard UFO skeptic to ther fact that they are flogging a dead horse, and are fueling the secret governments agenda.

Or perhaps they already know that

originally posted by: karl 12
The article also reminded me a bit of Poland's official files going 'missing' a few years ago but unfortunately it seems that story has now been removed from the internet (although there are snippets at the thread).

The story is not gone yet.

sigsno.org...

Kind of sad to think I have better data retention policies than standing governments.

You can find it under: "Unidentified Objects (UOs) and Transients (UTOs) → Government Information / Involvement → Poland"

a reply to: karl 12

I honestly don't understand why they'd even announce this news. There's a reason why, but what is it?! What factor dictated this move?

Secret documents can be sealed for decades until the information in them is no longer contentious, explosive or liable to generate civil litigation. Why wouldn't they just shut their mouths and announce in 20/30/40 years that the files were lost or destroyed? That'd be the intelligent path imo.

Instead, we're left with the fascinating possibility that the files have been destroyed due to a current event or change in policy. A possibility that coincides with the MoD's similar claim that they also 'lost' a lot of files from the early days of UFO reports. I think they released that news through Dr David Clarke circa 2006 and were seen as rather banal and unimportant...not worth the expense of storage.

a reply to: karl 12

NSA says it has 'lost' its non-redacted UFO files.

I think I've found them !!

Fancy the NSA leaving them there
Not surprised to see John Greenwald's name in the article , his efforts to obtain FOIA files over the years has been second to none , I used to have draws full of them thanks to the black vault , top bloke and one of the good guys

to me....this is the proof we've all been waiting for.......as has been expressed in the previous posts, the NSA "losing" files on such an important topic as "other world contact" is so unbelievable that it can mean only one thing...they're real...no government worker, not even an incompetent, half-witted government worker, would possibly do that, it's just too important and historic......just as don't believe in the tooth fairy, I don't believe they "lost" the files, they gave us the "BIG REVEAL"

The best way never to lose anything is to never announce you had it in the first place. I guess they didn't read the handbook.

originally posted by: Kandinsky
a reply to: karl 12

I honestly don't understand why they'd even announce this news. There's a reason why, but what is it?! What factor dictated this move?

Secret documents can be sealed for decades until the information in them is no longer contentious, explosive or liable to generate civil litigation. Why wouldn't they just shut their mouths and announce in 20/30/40 years that the files were lost or destroyed? That'd be the intelligent path imo.

Instead, we're left with the fascinating possibility that the files have been destroyed due to a current event or change in policy. A possibility that coincides with the MoD's similar claim that they also 'lost' a lot of files from the early days of UFO reports. I think they released that news through Dr David Clarke circa 2006 and were seen as rather banal and unimportant...not worth the expense of storage.

Interesting thread mate. It's puzzling as well.

Why are the files now missing?

What is the reason behind the announcement?

Unfortunately, because most people are led to believe UFO researchers are a bunch of nutters or have no interest in the topic, this is so low on the radar that almost no one will care either.