Did we exist before becoming human?

By request, a thread to elaborate on the human experience and reincarnation. The content and discussion will focus primarily on what I know from my own personal experiences with reincarnation, out-of-body experiences and in the bigger picture, the human experience. The resources for the material will not come from any book and I will cite from memory entirely thus preserving my own interpretation of how my understanding is shaped into this point-of-view. I've managed to pull a lot of memory into this current life, and as a child struggled with the dying process in a past life. I've had thousands of out-of-body experiences which have allowed me to further explore these hard questions if so much to only answer my own curiosity. Take it or leave it at face value, I am simply passing along my interpretation of many non-physical experiences in a textual summary.

If we existed before this life as something else, why the hell would we ever incarnate as a human?

If we do in fact "Incarnate" the very notion of this implies that a part of us post-human existed prior to the current sojourn that we are having now. Much of the focus of our local religions and beliefs are that we do not exist before birth. For some we die and go to an after-life. For others we just die. Many religions have tried to tackle this enigma and as most are very old and ancient transcribe with rich metaphors and archetypes within a colourful language mixed with assumptions, superstitions and beliefs.

So let's get to the meat of it. If we existed before this life, why would we leave this "other" reality to embark on a journey into this reality? The most basic answer to this fundamental question of why stems from an interest our desire for new experiences. I'm actually jumping ahead chronologically as to when I was able to remember my pre-human self rather then touch on the past-life memory as I feel this is far more significant in answering the question. By the time that I got to this answer, I had already had hundreds of out-of-body experiences and was picking apart fragmented memories of several lifetimes not just the one that strongly haunted my child hood memories. Being in the out-of-body state, or as I like to call it, "being self-aware when the body is asleep" opened doors to many forgotten memories.

When the opportunity to travel through what can be best described as a memory stream of one's self post-human, like hitting rewind and snapping back to a single perspective what I encountered of my post-human self was that I was very, very bored with the current state of my existence. Not that existing itself was a problem rather it was not very exciting nor dynamic. What was it that I remembered of this part of myself? In tracing back to this reference point, what I encountered was an awareness that existed in non-physical information system that for the most part seemed more fractal and geometric like living in a Mandalbrot set.

The problem was, like any fractal awareness the patterns although interesting were repetitive and as that was largely all I knew at that time, made me restless and bored for new experiences. Compared to Earth, it really wasn't anything to gawk at. It was a very primordial experience, although in it's own right beautiful and interesting, just not a lot of change. Something, and I really don't know what or how brought my attention to this particular system which at that time seemed like a hyper mesh of fractal patterns as it seemed very much like a globe of light but really complex patterns emerging and it had an excitement about it.

Well, it enticed my curiosity and I wanted in. I wanted to know what the buzz was all about. How could this place be any better than the old place I was already in? So it was my curiosity and desire for new patterns of experience that drew me in. Was there rules, regulations, important details upon entering? I don't know, I just dove in with absolutely no expectation or knowledge of what was here.

So how did that happen? How do we go from "there" to "here"? Again from experience there is a portal which is really like the Entry Station to Earth. It's a very elaborate system, has beings that assist you to pick and choose what you want, or if you don't know they just toss you into something. I've gone back there several times in the out-of-body state to watch people pick their human characteristics, even go in as couples and groups to have an experience.

From that perspective, it's not a big deal you project your awareness into the portal, it feeds you a very powerful information stream which I will elaborate further on, and you literally integrate your awareness into that stream of information thus locking you into the larger global information system that Earth represents. Very much like a matrix if you will. The information stream compartmentalizes and partitions your awareness so that the former self memories are nicely locked away so that your current life experience is a pristine fun adventure here on Earth.

In many ways, movies like "Total Recall" and the "Matrix" do remind me of this system because while we are down here as an individual having the human experience, we are actually still back there partitioned into different aspects of our conscious and unconscious self which no doubt if you go out-of-body you will encounter the being of light, think it's some other dude when in reality it's just another branch of yourself, but still fundamentally you.

Needless to say, what I was able to explore made it clear. We were not reincarnating because of some Karma debt. Earth represents a very wide range of deep fully immersed interactive experiences that are new. If you were like me, just a boring awareness with very little dynamic change in one's reality, coming here was like completely mind-blowing material. It still is...

Now what makes all of this so interesting is, when we become this "human" avatar so to speak, we forget that we were once this other awareness (which is still us but post-human) and what I discovered is that when we become "locked in" to the "human personality" which we grow into, when we die as you might expect you emerge with all the expectations, beliefs and experiences of that current personality. So guess what... it makes the next step choice as to what you do next (as it's still you but now a little mind fkd. So it wants to be rich because that life was poor, or it wants revenge against the person who killed it's child, or it wants to see what it's like to be a woman or a man... lots of more things to experience and the system don't care, it just slaps you back in and off you go.

For me, it was the previous life where perhaps maybe I was starting to get a little tired of the death/rebirth cycle having now died in a war and emerging into this apparently new reality (which actually is far more old and ancient than one might think as it pre-dates Earth). And well, I didn't want to go back and be human again. There was this being of light, that insisted that I go back and this time it would be different and despite my kicking and screaming so to speak, it won and I woke up in a new body. As I grew up from the ages of 2-5 all of these memories not only scared the hell out of me as a child, but haunted my dreams, I'd even go out-of-body at that young age and complain about being sent back.

cont...

So who knows, maybe some law of free will was violated and the emotional tug-a-war for my own freedom was fought breaking the mechanism that forces us to forget. I do think it was the fight I put up to not come back and be human which dragged all of this here. Well, 42 years later I am not complaining as these memories are a boone, not a curse even if the locals don't jive with the crazy talk of existing before human life. And why should we, I'm probably breaking character and achieving "Chim" so to speak.

In a nutshell, that is what brought me here. What scared me even more was in trying to trace my origins believing that somehow I was created I followed while out-of-body a memory stream of myself past the pre-human stage and what shocked me, and I don't know why it kind of terrified me was the realization that I could find no beginning to myself, only the fact that the patterns I was were constantly changing but death like we see on Earth was likely irrelevant to that part of myself. It's like tasting eternity and then realizing what ever historical archive of the self resides within this non-physical system likely has no beginning nor an end. And the haunting thought of eternal boredom once again crept in. Who wants to be stuck in a endless while loop? Not me.

But there is more to it. Human experience is just a small fraction of the potential experiences out there for us to have. Just like an arcade has lots of games and a movie store has lot's of movies. What ever this larger-reality system is takes all of that potential and actually does something with it for example... creating a planet called Earth in a Universe where the Universe that we think is so astronomical and big is really just one reality simulation of many universe simulations. However it evolved, with us as a part of it, the larger reality is way bigger than what we believe this Physical Universe is. The need or desire to have new experiences has motivated us all to participate in what really can be best described as a co-created multi-verse.

I'll have to come back and elaborate more on some of the other mechanics relative to things such as dreams, thought and how we are evolving new reality experiences as part of the bigger picture.

a reply to: YouAreDreaming
As I expect you wish to have a conversation I can reply by commenting that conversations are difficult when the first speaker speaks for a long long time.

I'll have to come back and elaborate more on some of the other mechanics relative to things such as dreams, thought and how we are evolving new reality experiences as part of the bigger picture.

Back from a break, ready to elaborate on the information stream that we are being fed that describes our physical existence. Like "Neo" plugging into the matrix, when we incarnate into human life what that really entails is a very well thought out and organized data-stream. So let me explain how this data-stream works and how you can see it in action within your own life.

To get there, we need to start at this data-stream from a non-physical experience and the best example of information at work forming a reality simulation is dreaming. When we fall asleep and start to dream, our ability to dream produces very real experiences regardless of the fact you wake up from them, they regress into memory and even amnesia. Dreams are real world examples of how you as this awareness system can take thought and organize that thought into a vivid 3D simulation you call a dream.

So what are dreams? What makes a dream? The answer lies simply in "thought". Dreams are a type of thought process where instead of thinking in a verbal language we think in every detail of the dream setting. Dreams are a thought process which demonstrates our innate ability to organize our thoughts into a much more complex language system where what we think renders out into a dream experience that simulates for that time, a micro virtual reality. As our awareness is compartmentalized and partitioned, dreams are a communication channel from one aspect of our self, and we can call it the unconscious to the other part of ourself we are more familiar with and call that the conscious part. Dreams are not only thought but they are a form of communication within this larger array of who each of us are as a much more evolved system of awareness.

Now take the mechanics of this process as a means by which we program the reality package that the dream represents and evolve that process into a much larger Universal thought process where we communicate with a larger information system, like Earth. Where instead of having a simple dialogue between yourself and other aspects of your larger awareness. The Earth as an information system that you plug into takes this same mechanic evident in dreaming but at a more Universal scale sending you a data-stream of thought which you then render and interpret as your human experience.

You interface with this data-stream, interact with the data and the larger system takes the feedback syncs it with all the other participants so that we have an objective world. On the surface we are unaware of this process so we don't see it as evident as it should be, that our reality is composed entirely of organized thought subjected to much more rigorous constraints and rules which simply describe the human experience we are having.

What that suggests is that our physical reality is really just another type of "dream" so to speak, and we are now subjected to a dream with a much more rigorous rule-set. But for those of you who have this type of experience, the relationship between dreams and reality can emerge within your life and appear as a type of deja vu linked to dreaming known as deja reve, or precognitive dreams. If you have ever had a dream during sleep that you wake up from and have some measure of memory then later on in life, that dream comes true... you are really just more aware of this deeper underlying thought-process of which I am describing.

The larger reality system is like a universal super-computer sending you a data-stream of organized thought and you also send feedback in your own thoughts (dreams) which that larger system then acts on. When you are in sync and seeing the creative process this feedback in the form of a dream that later comes true is an opportunity to see in action, the co-creative process that I bring up.

It's very clever because unless you actually can remember precognitive dream information, you'll likely not ever see in action this covert relationship between dreams and reality, ergo thought and reality. That thought does in fact create reality. Perhaps it's a secret, but now it's out on the table for discussion as I know some of you will relate to at least that part of this system.

It's through evolving the quality of this thought aka dreaming aka reality simulation that we see how we are literally evolving the content of our physical reality and quite likely not even aware of it. It is where the programmer of the matrix finally forgets he programmed it and is now playing along as one of the avatars within that system. We are quite literally in such a system even if it's so super-imposed in how the final rendered output appears to us as our physical world. Most of us are locked in to the "rendered output" oblivious of the behind the scenes mechanics driving the output of reality.

But if we want to understand more mechanically how an awareness such as we are can produce a reality simulation we must look at how dreams play into this role, and especially if you have precognitive dreams, how your are seeing in first-person view this covert mechanism at work.

The Entry Station is just an interface to a very complex program organized by thought. You render the thought and voila... brain in the vat it literally is. Our reality is a virtual reality simulation where awareness is the computer system that programs the data and organizes the patterns of experiences. Based on your own level of experience with this, you may already be seeing a fraction of this within your own life, through your own dreams via the precognitive anomaly that it produces.

Thus when we die in this reality, we are really just switching from one stream of experience to another. It all breaks down to thought, communication and an information system that has evolved the means by which awareness (your awareness and everyone else's) can produce reality simulations as vivid, chronological and real as what we see in our human life, as the human life itself.

It's also why death is like waking up from a dream. Those metaphors play out every time we sleep if we look at sleep as a mini-death aka, a break away from the larger data-stream of reality and now having a smaller micro stream of the dream reality. But it's all information that awareness is producing so that awareness can have an experience with itself, and it has been going on this way for what seems to me to be an eternity. We just have gotten really good at hiding this little secret so that the reality experiences become more intense and vivid.

originally posted by: TerryMcGuire
a reply to: YouAreDreaming
As I expect you wish to have a conversation I can reply by commenting that conversations are difficult when the first speaker speaks for a long long time.

Well, feel free to pick a point and jump in. I'm finished my major points now

a reply to: YouAreDreaming

Well ok. Do you suppose that finding that which is true is found neatly tied up in a bundle or gathered pieces at a time?

originally posted by: TerryMcGuire
a reply to: YouAreDreaming

Well ok. Do you suppose that finding that which is true is found neatly tied up in a bundle or gathered pieces at a time?

In the beginning for me at least, it was very fragmented. For example, the previous life memory although extremely vivid in my child hood presented itself in a lot of broken pieces of memory. I often muse at it as being put through the blender.

As I grew older and started to have lucid dreams which lead to spontaneous out-of-body experiences those experiences were also teasers of what was to come. It was over many years of going back to the fundamental memories and experiences which the combined sum presented that a more literal pattern of knowns started to emerge. Where one could say they stripped off beliefs with very valid experiences.

But I think given that all we have is existence and time, those fragments do align to a big bundle. I can see from these experiences a type of clever intelligence egging me on towards seeing the bigger picture of being something that exists in a larger reality than what is often presented locally.

And no doubts about it, I still have a lot of ground to cover but at least there is a baseline that stretches past the usual beliefs adopted when we lock into our human life. Learning and observing the truth is an ongoing process as there is so much other misinformation one has to weed through to get to those little grains of truth.

The best method is always answering your own questions through first-person experience.

a reply to: YouAreDreaming

as there is so much other misinformation one has to weed through to get to those little grains of truth.

If I take all you say as given, how does this misinformation come about which seems to override those little grains of truth?

originally posted by: TerryMcGuire
a reply to: YouAreDreaming

as there is so much other misinformation one has to weed through to get to those little grains of truth.

If I take all you say as given, how does this misinformation come about which seems to override those little grains of truth?

It's very much the result of localized belief-systems that we adopt when we arrive into a new life. We are culturally influenced by our [insert regional cultural religion/belief] and as in my case my parents (particularly my father) didn't believe in what I was trying to process based on the experience which presented that point-of-view.

My father to this day has a localized belief-system where he is a JW and believes that there is a God, and Afterlife with both heaven and eternal damnation. The whole idea that we exist before becoming human is pure blasphemy to him. Even precognitive dreams because he cannot process any of those experiences outside his belief-filter.

So, either I reject what my own personal experiences are presenting and adopt some other belief, or do what I did and examine them, explore them and learn as much as I could in a way that allowed me a lot of personal freedom for such exploration. The challenge is we have to face a lot of unknowns and replace belief with knowledge.

When you come into metaphysical experiences such as remembering a past life where those memories are your personal property, or even an out-of-body experience or a precognitive dream don't expect much support from the locals. It's up to you to decide based on the information presented in those experiences if any shred of truth exists.

Once you actually know something however, regardless of the millions of opposing points-of-views and arguments they cannot strip away hard-earned truth. I think of it as a school where the hard questions and exams are left for your to figure out and answer. Sure people can tell you their version of a truth but how can you really know it's nothing more than just another belief without any personal experience to back it up.

See what is inside of you already as a part of you and find those internal answers, I believe each of us have the potential to become much more aware of what we really are in relation to this reality through self-exploration and learning to remember and overcome amnesia. (The waters of forgetfullness as the Gnostics believe).

Wow, deep stuff. It really hits the center of my experience. I had died before in this life and I suddenly became aware of the entire universe "so to speak'. It was like a fish tank in a dark room without the light on. Then the light is clicked on in the tank and you instantly become aware of everything in the tank at once. Right after that I had this massive data stream, as you call it, just download information into my mind at a rate where I couldn't even consider analyzing it. It was so massive it was like all the data in the world of Earth every few seconds. That is the "information stream".

When I was a little kid up to about 5 or 6 I had psychic abilities that caused a lot of concern for my parents. I would answer questions they were only thinking and describe the insides of buildings and the people in them that I was never in before. I also kept appearing before a group of 12 elders. They wore white robes, had long white or grey hair and beards and I was always in the center of a V shaped table they sat at. I do not recall what they were telling me, but it was important, or I feel it was anyway. This occurred repeatedly almost every night for several hundred times. Now I wonder if I was fighting the reentry into this world. I also recall dying in a war, but right here in Vietnam. Since I was born in the middle of that war, I always had a feeling that I was back here again. I know a lot of folks won't be able to relate to these experiences and will probably think I need psychiatric help lol. But, I have never came across any information as you have posted here. I actually died twice, clinically which I have discussed in other threads before. I won't digress here.

Oh, and I also have those precog dreams. Usually of natural disasters, but I also had others that came true. Some I dreamed of while they were occurring and woke up to find it on the news. I believe the dream state taps into another 'data stream' which is tied to what we know as the 6th sense. I believe that as we grow in this world we lose that ability due to the overload of information into the other five senses. In other words, those five senses are what we mainly use in this reality and slowly we lose the ability to use our 6th sense as we could be capable of had we not been overloaded with audio/visual, etc. information into the consciousness.

Anyway, it is about time for me to get into the dream state, but I had to reply to this thread!
Great stuff!

a reply to: YouAreDreaming

Your thought process has a major setback.

Jesus died on the cross for mankind. If we get to keep coming back...reincarnation...(what a joke) ..... then there would be no reason for Jesus to come and give up his life would there? But he did .......

You get one chance at life not as many as you like.

Reincarnation is not in the bible.

Yes people believe they will becoming back.......it is called the resurrection NOT reincarnation.

Reincarnation is a lie.

a reply to: YouAreDreaming

I agree with your thoughts here, there is one thing that has allways puzzled me and would like your take on it.

As the population on earth is ever expanding, doubling, tripling even in relatively short time spans, are there an infinite number of available beings wishing to have this experience? Or is it a finite pool and as our population expands some other population on some other world dies off?

Interesting thread btw.

a reply to: YouAreDreaming

Salvation from what? This is the question:

Psalm 68

17 The chariots of God are tens of thousands
and thousands of thousands;
the Lord has come from Sinai into his sanctuary.
18 When you ascended on high,
you took many captives;
you received gifts from people,
even from[h] the rebellious—
that you, Lord God, might dwell there.

He took many of the captives (not all) back where they originated.

Ephesians 4

7 But to each one of us grace has been given as Christ apportioned it. 8 This is why it[a] says:

“When he ascended on high,
he took many captives
and gave gifts to his people.”

9 (What does “he ascended” mean except that he also descended to the lower, earthly regions[c]? 10 He who descended is the very one who ascended higher than all the heavens, in order to fill the whole universe.) 11 So Christ himself gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the pastors and teachers, 12 to equip his people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up 13 until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.

Earth is a refinery. The refined are taken in salvation to another place. Chariots are devices that can travel between. We get caught in a loop of rebirth, paying a debt of sin (karma). Waking us up from the experience, God eventually comes to get us. This is ascension, or reaching back out for the one that brought us here. Read the WIKI on involution and evolution. Seek God and he reveals the truth. Visitation is when God returns. It's a Garden. Things grow.

Involution and Evolution (Baptism into Water / Rising to New Life)

edit on 4-9-2014 by AlephBet because: (no reason given)