Ukraine 'agrees truce' with Putin

a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed
I quite agree - the BBC are horrific, having been found numerous ties to go as far as fabricating stories from nowhere to meet the agendas of Westminster or even Washington. It seems people here dislike RT just as much, but they are pretty unbiased in my opinion - they are quite "young" I guess in the media world, but I actually rate the quite highly given the alternatives.

a reply to: Adaluncatif

And even that source puts the casualty figures at 2,600. Me thinks you misread the number and it includes all civilian and rebel casualties, where they can be ascertained.

a reply to: Adaluncatif

"I guess for the Ukrainian military this gives them a chance to regroup after recent military setbacks, and bide time to see what NATO and the EU delivers over the next few days in terms of deterrents to Russia for further intervention. In the past we have seen Moscow looking to talk/sending peace signals just before important EU/G7/NATO meetings, and presumably to weaken momentum towards sanctions/countermeasures."

And where exactly does it say the Ukraine military was defeated on the battlefield, because a setback is far from defeat, it may help to learn the difference.

And yes the only ones who think that Ukraine has been defeated are the pro Russian supporters that we have here.

a reply to: Adaluncatif

regroup? They lost the war in a blitzkrieg Russian operation.

What they can do now is withdraw the troops. And yes, I agree, consolidate their positions within the remaining Ukraine's territory.

We still don't know the terms of Putin that Poroshenko agreed on.

Anyway, that impossible peace only 2 weeks ago, today marks a big turn in world's politics.

a reply to: TheRisenPeople

If you genuinely think RT is "unbiased", you're incredibly naive.

If you think the BBC as a "state run" media outlet, compared to RT it is nothing. At least the BBC is run at arms length via the BBC Trust and is held to account for any perceived bias (from any side) whereas RT is a wholly owned, state-ran organ of the Kremlin.

I'm not saying the BBC is perfect, far from it, but to sit there with a straight face and claim RT is "unbiased" is just astoundingly naive.

Anyway, I'm not sure why people are attacking the source for this story - the facts are there.

a reply to: TheRisenPeople

It seems people here dislike RT just as much, but they are pretty unbiased in my opinion - they are quite "young" I guess in the media world, but I actually rate the quite highly given the alternatives.

Then you must have missed this from RT...

Russia Today’s “Genocide in Eastern Ukraine”: Sick, distorted and deleted

The Kremlin should surely investigate why Russia Today, the TV channel it lavishly funds took so much trouble to produce a ‘Truthseeker’ programme on the ‘Kyiv junta’s’ alleged ‘genocide in eastern Ukraine only to remove all trace of it from its site. Why if, as it claims, eyewitnesses have spoken of “unarmed civilians being systematically massacred – village after village, town after town - all under complete mainstream media silence”, has Russia Today followed suit ?

khpg.org.ua...

They rate high on the propaganda scale when it comes to Ukraine and what they report.

a reply to: tsurfer2000h

Quite - facing sudden and unexpected Russian incursion to the South, where there had been no fighting, the Government troops were in no position to fight and withdrew in good order. They were outflanked, it's simple tactics.

Hardly a defeat.

Elsewhere, the rebels are still holed up in Donetsk with no advances to speak of, having been taking a beating in recent weeks.

a reply to: tsurfer2000h
I am not a Russian supporter. Ukraine lost all positions to the overwhelming Russian forces in only 1 week. The defeat was so apparent, that the day the Russian troops entered Ukraine, Putin offered to the Ukrainian soldiers "humanitarian corridor" from the surrounded areas. The truce is meant to save the lives of the soldiers who still don't surrender. And above that, to STOP Russia's further gains on the West. Whether the ceasefire will achieve that, is too early to say. We don't know any conditions of it.

a reply to: stumason

Sorry but Washington Times reported on that day the Russian tanks entered, the Ukrainian troops refused to shoot at the incoming Russian tanks in PriAzovsk...(whatever the name) and in total disorder boarded available public transportation to escape to Mariupol...

a reply to: 2012newstart

"Lost all positions".....

Care to elaborate? They are still on the outskirts of Donetsk, laying siege to the city.

They got outflanked from the South after Russia sent troops in, so they withdrew to Mariopol along the coast. Elsewhere, Government troops hold the line and were only forced out of Donetsk airport a few days ago after a mass Russian tank attack.

Hardly "losing all positions".

I'm not attacking the source really - was just agreeing with another comment. All I can say is that I've yet to see evidence of RT's alleged bias, whereas I have witnessed the BBCs warmongering firsthand. Take for example them digitally changing the voice of that nurse... or was it another ambassadors daughter... who was travelling with them anyway, not from the hospital in Syria when there was a chemical wepaon/napalm/chemical weapon/napalm attack...
I am always open to another viewpoint, don't take this as an attack on anyone, even the BBC for that matter, I just regard the as no better than the Daily Mail to be honest. Daily Mail with a blanker government cheque.

a reply to: tsurfer2000h
It was removed due to it's graphic content and many complaints from opposers. I do have a full length copy of said video if we are talking about the same one. Although I was honestly unaware that Truthseeker put it out in the first place. I was aware that it was being pulled from media everywhere, which is why our team were sent a copy to try and share.
As far as I know it i still on our LiveLeak channel

a reply to: 2012newstart

Actually the Washington Times reports on an apparent New York times reporter who spoke to someone who said "some Troops were in chaotic retreat riding on City buses"....

“Some troops were in a full, chaotic retreat: A city-busload of them careened past on the highway headed west, purple curtains flapping through windows shot out by gunfire,” The Times said.

Read more: www.washingtontimes.com...
Follow us: @washtimes on Twitter

Some troops? So one busload is seen retreating from the Russian surprise attack and you've leapt to the huge conclusion that the entire Ukrainian Army is no in full retreat and has been defected? Righto.

originally posted by: stumason
a reply to: Adaluncatif

28,000 dead?

Me thinks you're making stuff up now. Not even pro-Russian sources have been claiming this - most independent casualty counts, such as from HRW for example, estimate the figures to be around 2,600, so I think you've just added an extra zero for some reason.

I was mistaken. The 28,000 includes wounded too. The DNR press office tweeted that Kiev lost in Donbass 43,000 soldiers. Of these 27,850 were killed or wounded. Taken prisoner was 1,650 and 13,500 deserted.

Either way this is good news right?.

originally posted by: tsurfer2000h
a reply to: Adaluncatif

"I guess for the Ukrainian military this gives them a chance to regroup after recent military setbacks, and bide time to see what NATO and the EU delivers over the next few days in terms of deterrents to Russia for further intervention. In the past we have seen Moscow looking to talk/sending peace signals just before important EU/G7/NATO meetings, and presumably to weaken momentum towards sanctions/countermeasures."

And where exactly does it say the Ukraine military was defeated on the battlefield, because a setback is far from defeat, it may help to learn the difference.

And yes the only ones who think that Ukraine has been defeated are the pro Russian supporters that we have here.

The people who think Ukraine has been defeated are the Ukrainians.

a reply to: stumason

People The Jig Is Up

I am Ukrainian, I don't live there now, I live in Germany but I travel to see my parents and do business every 4 months.

The winter is coming, Ukraine is completely out of gas soon. The new government would have a revolution in winter if Russia cuts the supply. The damn Europe won't help and never planned to help. They just want to stoke the fire.

Secondly

Pro-Russia separatists are not losing, they won't give up.

new government in Kiev is almost about to lose our support, for doing things so poorly, and for giving promises it can't keep

Future is not with Europe anyway, Europe is broke. Things in Germany have gone to hell in the last 10 years.

originally posted by: TheRisenPeople
a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed
I quite agree - the BBC are horrific, having been found numerous ties to go as far as fabricating stories from nowhere to meet the agendas of Westminster or even Washington. It seems people here dislike RT just as much, but they are pretty unbiased in my opinion - they are quite "young" I guess in the media world, but I actually rate the quite highly given the alternatives.

it is just the modern media in general...they are all paid actors and really bad ones at that.....and they all fall over themselves trying to be first to get the story out regardless of the facts..

a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed
There's something I can agree with, and have in fact been victim of myself. The only reliable media is from the mouth of the bystander - something I am trying to work towards - I have a couple of such sources but desperately seeking more.

originally posted by: Adaluncatif

originally posted by: stumason
a reply to: Adaluncatif

28,000 dead?

Me thinks you're making stuff up now. Not even pro-Russian sources have been claiming this - most independent casualty counts, such as from HRW for example, estimate the figures to be around 2,600, so I think you've just added an extra zero for some reason.

I was mistaken. The 28,000 includes wounded too. The DNR press office tweeted that Kiev lost in Donbass 43,000 soldiers. Of these 27,850 were killed or wounded. Taken prisoner was 1,650 and 13,500 deserted.

twitter.com...