Now they can run us over too!!!

Not normally a defender of the police but imho hardly visible bicyclists have no business on roadways where 3,000 lb + vehicles roam at much faster speeds. I've nearly been run over on my motorcycle many times and I've damn near ran somebody else over. People are expecting to see other cars when driving and can sometimes look right at somebody on a bicycle and see right through them. Not saying it's right but a little common sense should come into play.

a reply to: Zaphod58

The outrage comes from the fact this was a POLICE OFFICER. People expect crimes to happen everyday with nobody to blame/convict. Murders/rapes/muggings/etc. happen everywhere all the time with no resolution. But when we know who did it and even worse, the circumstances behind it IE typing on a computer while driving, it just makes things 1000x worse. I honestly didn't know that many people were charged with minor offenses after hitting cyclists and I'm appalled by that as well. But this is a cop, whose duties include traffic violations, like writing tickets for texting and driving or even just talking on the phone while driving, and he gets some paid time off and no charges. It's just another in a long line of abuses of power that cops don't have to deal with because they have special immunity in the legal realm of this country.

a reply to: tsingtao

When I lived in Alabama, a couple was riding across country for charity. They were wearing vests, riding in a group, on the shoulder, when a woman who was distracted plowed into them, killing at last one, and injuring several. No charges, and I don't think she even got a ticket.

a reply to: Zaphod58

I just can't see how somebody who killed somebody didn't at least get charged with involuntary manslaughter. That just blows my mind, was the DA on vacation that week or something? Unbelievable.

Here is another example of a man who killed two and was not charged.

www.floridatoday.com...

I am sure the officer received discipline from his department. If not he should.

a reply to: thov420

It happens every day. They claim that it's extremely hard to prove intent in these cases, so they don't even try.

originally posted by: TorqueyThePig
I am sure the officer received discipline from his department. If not he should be.

Just curious, what would an interdepartmental discipline look like? A bad mark on his record, a pay reduction, or just a slap on the wrist with a "don't do that again" word from his supervisor?

a reply to: Zaphod58

But isn't that the difference between murder and manslaughter, intent?

Just found this, don't know the credibility of it: NOLO

Manslaughter (in some states called third degree murder) is an unlawful killing that does not involve malice aforethought. The absence of malice aforethought means that manslaughter involves less moral blame than either first or second degree murder. Thus, while manslaughter is a serious crime, the punishment for manslaughter is generally less than it would be for murder.

a reply to: thov420

Yes, it is. You would think it would be pretty easy to prove manslaughter at least, but it's pretty routine to not even try to.

I used to think it was an easy one too, but after that Alabama incident I read some articles about it that just made me sick. Short of being so drunk you can barely stand, if you kill a cyclist, there's a damn good chance you won't even get a ticket.

I've read cases where they were texting or talking on the phone, looked away from the road, etc. all with no charges.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: thov420
...it's pretty routine to not even try to.

Maybe I'm confused, but isn't that the DA's job? I mean they can decide to charge someone for a crime even when the victim doesn't want to press charges but somebody's death isn't worth their time? I mean WTF? Totally confused here.

a reply to: thov420

I know. It's what they're supposed to do, and yet they don't. It's why cycling groups are pushing hard for better laws about it all over the US.

a reply to: Zaphod58

I gotta be honest, I kinda get upset when I see cyclists riding down the road around here, but that's only because we have miles and miles of dedicated bike trails here. At the same time, I would hate to see any of them get hurt because someone wasn't paying attention while driving. Everybody's gotta share the road. This thread has really opened my eyes though.

ETA: Just curious, is that NOLO site a good legal website?

a reply to: thov420

It would depend on different factors.

Generally speaking suspension without pay, retraining, suspension from driving (desk duty), if another accident of any kind that was caused by the neglect of the officer termination could occur.

Any combination of those could occur. An at fault officer definitely is punished more then a citizen in the same situation.

I would bet this officer received some kind of punishment.

At my department any kind of serious accident is investigated by an outside agency (Florida Highway Patrol).

There was a time when an officer was enroute to a call and made a left hand turn in front of a person causing an accident. The call was important, but not lights and sirens important so the officer was found at fault.

He was written a citation by FHP and had to perform mandatory retraining. If it happens again he may lose his job.

I agree that we need to be extra cautious and follow all traffic laws. We are not only enforcing the laws but setting an example.

That being said we are humans and make mistakes. We also drive more then most people. I work 12 hour shifts and am on the road a lot. The chances for us being involved whether at fault or not in an accident is pretty high.

He was responding to a deputy who was inquiring whether the fire investigation had been completed

Why the eff are they sending/responding to emails to find out if an investigation is completed? Don't they have radios any more? Hell, taking a phone call would've been safer.

Senseless!

originally posted by: TorqueyThePig
a reply to: thov420
I agree that we need to be extra cautious and follow all traffic laws. We are not only enforcing the laws but setting an example.

Thanks for that explanation, I mostly agree with what should be done but rarely do we, the public, see those disciplinary actions put to use. Mostly we read about officers getting paid time off and at most a slap on the wrist. So if I see a cop driving and texting or using his computer what can I do? I know I can file a complaint but that's going to be dismissed 99% of the time as the officer was "performing his duties" but doing it while driving down the road means his attention isn't on the task at hand, driving.

a reply to: Apollumi

...bicyclists have no business on roadways where 3,000 lb + vehicles roam at much faster speeds...

Well, in this case it was reported that "Deputy Andrew Wood was apparently distracted by his mobile digital computer when his patrol car drifted into the bike lane, running over cyclist Milton Olin Jr."

This guy WAS IN A BIKE LANE...and a pretty wide one too by the looks of the picture. That's some pretty dangerous "roaming" ... if this cop roamed and hit your car while you where in another lane and he was emailing would that be OK? I bet not.

Here's a screen shot of the road from g maps...


cords to the exact spot on Google Maps

a reply to: thov420

It seems to be. This is the first I've encountered it, but reading some of the links on there it matches up with other sites I've used.

The police are people too. Accidents happen to everyone.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: tsingtao

When I lived in Alabama, a couple was riding across country for charity. They were wearing vests, riding in a group, on the shoulder, when a woman who was distracted plowed into them, killing at last one, and injuring several. No charges, and I don't think she even got a ticket.

Now THAT'S outrageous!

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: thov420

It happens every day. They claim that it's extremely hard to prove intent in these cases, so they don't even try.

In that case they should have terms agreed upon as a condition of acquiring the license. Just like refusing a sobriety test automatically loses you your license because you agreed those terms CONTRACTUALLY.

It should go something like "Distracted driving resulting in death automatically earns you a criminal charge of vehicular manslaughter and/or loss of driving privilege for minimum 1year."

a reply to: 8675309jenny

The only thing I would add to what you said is the fine should be double for police officers because they are supposed to enforce/uphold the laws of the land.