President Obama signs $8.7 billion food stamp cut into law

originally posted by: macman
So, double and triple dipping is okay then??

The system is designed for you to double and triple dip. Each program helps with a specific issue. We could consolidate it all but when that has been attempted it's been shut down by people opposing big government.

And again, how is that my responsibility to feed you?

You're choosing to live in society, part of the responsibility of a society is providing for basic necessities for all citizens. Another aspect of society is to minimize crime (safety for the citizens and all). Crime declines sharply when people have something to live for and a few basic necessities.

originally posted by: Aazadan

Are you really ready to imprison 15% of the population because they're robbing people for food money?

Most wouldn't be set to prison, because a fair amount of robbers would more than likely be shot, and justly so.
I will not be beholden to people at the threat of violent criminal behavior, just so they can steal from me via Govt to provide the same outcome. Therefore it's in societies best interest to ensure everyone has these because aside from quality of life issues it's a cost saving measure.

Most wouldn't be set to prison, because a fair amount of robbers would more than likely be shot, and justly so.
I will not be beholden to people at the threat of violent criminal behavior, just so they can steal from me via Govt to provide the same outcome.

That depends, if I were going to commit a crime expecting someone to be armed I would go in prepared to shoot, actually I would specifically hunt you down in your house and kill you before attempting to steal anything. That way there's no witness and no surprises. I also wouldn't have anything to lose by doing so because if the situation is bad enough that I can't be fed on the outside in a prison I'm guaranteed meals.

But my mistake, you weren't advocating mass imprisonment to deal with all those pesky people without jobs, you would rather just execute them. That would come out to around 70 million total deaths, those are Mao numbers.

BTW, if you execute all the poor you stand a good chance of needing to execute yourself, once all the poor are gone there's fewer people consuming which reduces demand for business, which puts a few more out of business, which then makes those people poor and in line for execution. It's a chain reaction.

So let me get this straight..
I should reduce my lifestyle, so that more of my money, that I earned, isn't taken from me to give to others...and life off of others as well??

You have got to be kidding me.

Well, you just said you were tired of working your ass off so someone can mooch. You can work less hard and the moocher can become a worker. That sounds like a great deal to me. When it comes to your lifestyle productivity is currently at a point where we cannot have a 40 hour week and keep everyone employed. If we want to solve the unemployment issue we're going to have to take a long hard look at that. Dropping from 40 to 30 hours would create 33% more jobs but income expectations have to change with that.

Aside from that what do you expect from people? You don't want to help them, you don't want them to mooch, but you also don't want to open up employment for them.

Yeah, I don't glorify, nor do I condone stealing from some to give to others. YOU on the other hand do and that is where your moral compass has gone broken.

I don't see taxation as stealing. I see it as the price you accept for choosing to live in a particular area. If you don't like the taxes going to provide for public good maybe you should just buy a private island and retreat from society?

originally posted by: blindlyzack
Maybe people will start thinking before bringing children into the world with no financial stability.
Maybe this will encourage the average citizen to pursue an actual career, not just burger flipping.
Maybe this will let the average, everyday person know that there shouldn't be any hand outs.

Doubt it though.

That actually happens when upward mobility is high, it has nothing to do with welfare benefits. If a person has a good shot at having a better life in 3, 5, or 10 years they'll wait on having kids. If that's not a possibility they won't.

Considering the majority of those collecting food stamps, especially those who collect food stamps over long periods of time, voted for Obama thinking if anything he would give out more food stamps, I do find some humor in this.

This is not going to fix anything in the US. The inequality is still growing so a bill that takes away some crumbs for the needy while ignoring the fact the extremely wealthy keep getting tax breaks, favorable laws, and other gifts for big government.

The US is a mess. Radical changes are needed withing our government.

a reply to: macman

No you are NOT working your ass off so others may live. You are working your ass of to make someone else extremely wealthy and then believing the lies that they tell you, like they can not afford to give you a raise because poor people demand too much.

Way to contribute to the class warfare mentality

originally posted by: Aazadan

The system is designed for you to double and triple dip. Each program helps with a specific issue. We could consolidate it all but when that has been attempted it's been shut down by people opposing big government.

The system is designed now to take from me to give to others.

originally posted by: Aazadan

You're choosing to live in society, part of the responsibility of a society is providing for basic necessities for all citizens. Another aspect of society is to minimize crime (safety for the citizens and all). Crime declines sharply when people have something to live for and a few basic necessities.

At what point was it okay to hijack the term "society" and bastardize it into meaning I have to provide for others??? Just wondering.
So, this whole crime thing. Yeah......I am not going to be threatened by others. This BS line of if there will be crime everywhere if the Govt doesn't give out the free stuff is just that....BS. Unless you truly believe that the poor will turn into criminalistic animals. But, that is probably no truer statement for you.

I say bring it on. Someone tries to rob me.....I have something for them.

originally posted by: Aazadan

That depends, if I were going to commit a crime expecting someone to be armed I would go in prepared to shoot, actually I would specifically hunt you down in your house and kill you before attempting to steal anything. That way there's no witness and no surprises. I also wouldn't have anything to lose by doing so because if the situation is bad enough that I can't be fed on the outside in a prison I'm guaranteed meals.

So bring it then.

originally posted by: Aazadan
But my mistake, you weren't advocating mass imprisonment to deal with all those pesky people without jobs, you would rather just execute them. That would come out to around 70 million total deaths, those are Mao numbers.

Ohhh how i love the dramatic styles of the Progressive. Going from me saying criminals being shot in the course of doing criminal activities to me saying to "execute" someone. Do you embellish the truth as often in real life, as you do here?

originally posted by: Aazadan
BTW, if you execute all the poor you stand a good chance of needing to execute yourself, once all the poor are gone there's fewer people consuming which reduces demand for business, which puts a few more out of business, which then makes those people poor and in line for execution. It's a chain reaction.

Other then you...who said anything about executing the poor?

originally posted by: Aazadan

Well, you just said you were tired of working your ass off so someone can mooch. You can work less hard and the moocher can become a worker. That sounds like a great deal to me. When it comes to your lifestyle productivity is currently at a point where we cannot have a 40 hour week and keep everyone employed. If we want to solve the unemployment issue we're going to have to take a long hard look at that. Dropping from 40 to 30 hours would create 33% more jobs but income expectations have to change with that.

So again, I MUST reduce my lifestyle, and not EARN as much to stop the Govt from taking more from me...
May I suggest life in Cuba for you??
Why is it that every Progressive pushes to make America like every other 2nd world crap hole, all in the name of "fairness"?
If that is what you want, I will gladly reach into my wallet, the same one that is supplied by MY hard work, and purchase you a one way ticket to what ever Progressive/Socialist utopia of your choosing.

originally posted by: Aazadan
Aside from that what do you expect from people? You don't want to help them, you don't want them to mooch, but you also don't want to open up employment for them.

And yet again and blatant lie.
Where have I stated I don't want to open up employment??
Is lying a normal for you?

originally posted by: Aazadan

I don't see taxation as stealing.

Well, that is obvious.
In any other instance in life, it is theft. But since the Govt does it, under the fictitious guise of "helping" others, you don't see it as such.

Funny, as if I reached into your wallet, took 30% of you money, and gave it to someone else, I would be arrested.

originally posted by: Aazadan
I see it as the price you accept for choosing to live in a particular area. If you don't like the taxes going to provide for public good maybe you should just buy a private island and retreat from society?

So, I need to leave a country that was designed for the individual, not for a Progressive Collective..

The sad truth....is even if I did go to a private island, you and other Progressives would slime your way there and force me to capitulate to YOUR way of life.

That is what you and other do.

a reply to: jrod

Really??? You know my financial earnings, what company I work for and the business that I own???


Geez, since you are so far up into my rectum, can you please describe what I had for lunch yesterday??

Seeing that I don't have the Progressive animosity towards the business owner, like you, I have no problem with working for the company I work for. It was started by someone that worked their way up. And now they profit from their hard work.

a reply to: macman

No. Not true at all.

All you are is regurgitating the lies that have been told by those who want to keep their riches. You work to make someone else money unless you an elitist. The little guy, the small business owner and the hard working types get taxed the most, while the investment bankers whose computers pick and choose the winners make billions and get taxed a lot less than you. Yet you blame the poor on the inequalities and your tax burden.

The poor are NOT getting your money and reaping the benefits of your labor. It is the extremely wealthy who are. This is why since 2008 about 95% of the gains in the economy, the "Recovery" has gone to the top 1% income earners.

It is not the poor who is ripping you off!

a reply to: macman

Okay. So you are intentionally spreading lies about the economy to maintain your status quo as a successful business owner.

More handouts are given to corporations that the poor in the USA.

It is obvious your only intentions posting on this thread is to demonize poor people. Please get a grip on reality.

PS:

The Pitchforks are Coming!

originally posted by: poncho1982

originally posted by: ArchPlayer
This isn't the Desi Arnaz 1950s America anymore. Folks who are stuck in downtrodden areas are just that...STUCK. Not everybody has the means to up and follow jobs, I think the shutting down of the American industrial sector taught us that back in the 70s and 80s.

Sorry, but nobody is stuck anywhere. Maybe if they would save up their money, instead of buying frivolous material things to impress their friends, they could move to where the opportunities are. You know, $175 for some Air Jordans is a little ridiculous when you can get shoes for $30 that do the exact same thing, but won't impress your friends much. Might even get them made fun of, but anyone with drive to better themselves wouldn't care about that.

The simple fact of it is, WHY would they do that? When life on welfare, and food stamps is so care free, why would they WANT to take a risk?

That's what we conservative minded folks are screaming daily. you take away someone's motivation, and guess what? they are (SHOCK!) unmotivated.

Welfare was intended to be a crutch, not a permanent solution. Working in trade for social benefits is a great start in fixing this mess. I have known quite a few welfare recipients in my days, and most if not all of them have all said, in one way or another, "Why should I work, when the government supports me if I don't?"

If you do not believe this to be the case, you are part of the problem.

Yes, some folks do want to get out of poverty, and try to make a better life for them and theirs. But they are a minority who have been taught pride and self reliance by their parents. This is a lesson that the poor do not get at home anymore, except in these rare occasions.

No mention of race in this post, because this isn't a racial thing, it's a mentality thing We are fostering the wrong way of thinking with the way we endlessly support those unwilling to work and contribute something to society, other than a demand for more and more, for nothing.

Sorry, but people ARE STUCK and in some very unhospitable places. Are we in the same country? How can you expect people to save, when basic food and water, rent, and heat, especially in a city like Chicago is taxed to the hilt? Chicago has water tax, sugar tax, salt tax, produce tax, flour tax, dairy tax, meat tax ON TOP OF everything else that is taxable and some items are considered luxury taxes by the state. Tell me how are they supposed to save? Illinois cut LINK/SNAP in 2009 waaay before anybody else, and it is more than a notion to even be able to qualify. Get unemployment, forget it. Get a part time job, you make too much. Rent alone up there is 1200 on up, and that is in neighborhoods where bodies are dropping left and right. So yeah, people are stuck out of circumstance. So what, some urban kids may want Jordans or Lebrons being pressed on to them that if they acquire them they have WEALTH. That is the media influencing them. How about spreading that condescending blame on to them, huh? Don't know when the last time you been to Chicago, but Payless doesn't live up to the name there anymore, nor do airwalks last long. So let's see, spend 100 bucks on some name shoes, or 40-50 on some airwalks you have to replace every 30-45 days? Sounds like cheap chinese labor has people doling out money either way it goes.

The simple fact of it is, MOST CHICAGO FOLKS DONT HAVE WELFARE. News flash, welfare ended officially in 2009. If you weren't on the dole then, you couldn't get on. Hence why I said, it DEPENDS ON WHERE YOU LIVE AT. Also news flash, in Illinois, most recipients are WHITE WOMEN. Oooh shocking. WHY would they do that? When life on welfare, and food stamps is so care free, why would they WANT to take a risk? Because they moved out to the isolated burbs in white flight and/or their families did, and now they ARE STUCK.

This has nothing to do with taking away somebody's motivation. NYC is the KING of the hustle, and those folks are barely getting by, when the cost of living for a 300 sq ft apartment is 2200 a month! You totally don't get the fact that people are born into environments that trap them, that is what conservatives FAIL to see DAILY.

Welfare was intended to be a crutch, to get people hooked on the government dependence as a permanent solution. There is no more "working in trade for social benefits" when the jobs have left! We didn't have all these "welfare queens" syndrome when people could go to the Firestone plant, or the Steel Mill, or the JC Penny Mill and get a job and work. You can't say make people work in trade, when there IS NO WORK!!!! Between outsourcing, technological dependence and eradication of human labor, where are these millions of trade jobs going to come from? The crack of Obammy's ass? Think not. People want to work; what they don't want is to have to do it for the same wage as their forefathers in an inflationary economy. Why should I have to work for 4 bucks an hour because Jorge the immigrant illegal will? I was born here, went to school here, speak the language and got degrees here, but Jorge is willing to take that hit. It's bull#!

If you do not believe this to be the case, you are part of the problem.

No one chooses to live in poverty. But you are expecting people to "pull themselves up by the bootstraps" when they can't afford to buy the boots! What you want is a fantasy Evans family from Good Times, willing to pinch and scrape and pray to almighty Jezuz to help them up out the ghetto, while ignoring the harsh realities of it.

Yes I brought up the Evans, but not playing the race card. The mentality here is that you conservatives refuse to look at the entire picture, instead picking and choosing convienent examples of the isolated "one you know" syndrome and thinking it applies to everyone. Yes, people abuse the system, but the fact of the matter is, it isn't as depicted. The government and LBJs Great Society set up a social net designed to break down families, and then systematically decade by decade took away labor jobs, infused drug and disease epidemics, and left riot towns like DC in shambles with no infrastructure. People born of those zones grew up as products of their environment. Until your mentality changes, EXPECT FERGUSONS with much more strong arm police militarized force coming soon near you.

originally posted by: MoonBlossom
a reply to: poncho1982

Sorry, but nobody is stuck anywhere. Maybe if they would save up their money, instead of buying frivolous material things to impress their friends, they could move to where the opportunities are. You know, $175 for some Air Jordans is a little ridiculous when you can get shoes for $30 that do the exact same thing, but won't impress your friends much.

I am pretty certain that those living paycheck to paycheck have much bigger worries than Air Jordans. And they cannot afford the $30.00 shoes either. *eyeroll*

Fact of the matter is that there are people who REALLY ARE stuck - when their "frivolous extras" amount to food, and money CANNOT be saved because there simply isn't one dime extra to be had...in some cases, this is true even AFTER working 2-3 jobs.

In that scenario, with what funds do you propose people use to move themselves? It's America 2014 last I checked - people cannot simply take a backpack, walk to a new state (with no food nor money) and miraculously afford first and last month's rent - all BEFORE netting a job. Get real.

And don't forget background check, credit check, income from employment over previous 2 years check, valid bank account check, and making sure your salary allots you 25% of salary for said rent. Get real indeed.

originally posted by: poncho1982

originally posted by: MoonBlossom
a reply to: poncho1982

Sorry, but nobody is stuck anywhere. Maybe if they would save up their money, instead of buying frivolous material things to impress their friends, they could move to where the opportunities are. You know, $175 for some Air Jordans is a little ridiculous when you can get shoes for $30 that do the exact same thing, but won't impress your friends much.

I am pretty certain that those living paycheck to paycheck have much bigger worries than Air Jordans. And they cannot afford the $30.00 shoes either. *eyeroll*

Fact of the matter is that there are people who REALLY ARE stuck - when their "frivolous extras" amount to food, and money CANNOT be saved because there simply isn't one dime extra to be had...in some cases, this is true even AFTER working 2-3 jobs.

In that scenario, with what funds do you propose people use to move themselves? It's America 2014 last I checked - people cannot simply take a backpack, walk to a new state (with no food nor money) and miraculously afford first and last month's rent - all BEFORE netting a job. Get real.

Perhaps you missed the part where I said save up their money. I've done it. I grew up dirt poor, and my mother and I didn't get any help because she happened to make $50 more than that magic poverty line of income. We lived paycheck to paycheck. You know what that did? Showed me that I need to rely on myself.

I went to inner city schools, and learned how the culture is. If you didn't wear the "right" brands of clothes (especially shoes), you were picked on mercilessly. I was, because I didn't. Material objects were more important than character. It's only gotten worse since the 80's

So, go preach to someone else. I've lived it.

Even those who use to go to the thrift can't afford it anymore. Their prices are just as high as going to Marshalls or TJ Maxx. Just because you made it, and I'm willing to bet you were born back in the day, doesn't mean it is as simple or logical now. Count yourself fortunate to grow up in an era where saving was still able.

a reply to: misskat1

BLM is working with Big Oil and Big agriculture to make sure they have land to drill/frack and plenty of land for their subsidized GMO plants and hormone fed live stock.

The farm subsidies do little to help the small family farmer. They are essentially a gift to the Big agriculture industry.

originally posted by: jrod


No. Not true at all.

All you are is regurgitating the lies that have been told by those who want to keep their riches. You work to make someone else money unless you an elitist. The little guy, the small business owner and the hard working types get taxed the most, while the investment bankers whose computers pick and choose the winners make billions and get taxed a lot less than you. Yet you blame the poor on the inequalities and your tax burden.

What is not true??? And what lies???
The last time I checked my bank, and investments and my personal business, All were growing.
What is not true??
Yes, my business is heavily taxed. Yes the Corporation I work for takes advantage of Tax laws........that are available to everyone else.

I blame the Govt for the heavy tax burden. The poor are just the base they are pandering to. And companies like GE.
Both kinds of welfare are wrong and corrupt.

originally posted by: jrod
The poor are NOT getting your money and reaping the benefits of your labor. It is the extremely wealthy who are. This is why since 2008 about 95% of the gains in the economy, the "Recovery" has gone to the top 1% income earners.

It is not the poor who is ripping you off!

When the poor are living off of the taxes I pay into, then yes....they are reaping those benefits.
And it seems that the "evil rich" are the ones that control the Progressive based Govt....the same one that reaches into my pocket, only to hand it out to others.

a reply to: jrod

What lies????

Dude, you really need to get your crap together.

My business that I own is actually very very successful. Our products typically run from $2300 to $3300 each, and are wants based, not really need based. I am 5 months back logged as well.

The company I work for is geared towards a specialty based company setting, was started by a couple of people, and has grown leaps and bounds. We hired 250 people last year and are hiring close to 500 this year.

Sooooooooo, you keep demonizing those evil rich people and hang out with the poor.

I will continue to work for those rich guys, provide a product to them and build my wealth.

Lets see next year how things are going for each.

He had to feed all those people on a mountain top in Iraq.. that's where the money went. /sarcasm

a reply to: macman

I am not demonizing rich people at all, did you even check out the "Pitchforks are Coming" link to an old thread?

Many rich people understand the inequality in the US is a very bad thing, many are simply blinded by their own smug. I really do not care about your business success. If anything it has left you with a feeling of entitlement and arrogance.

Hard working smart people fail in their business ventures everyday and when this happens they are thankful there is a welfare safety net to fall back on. One thing I have noticed about a lot of successful people is they fail to realize how much luck plays a factor is one's success financially. On a personal level, being successful financially is independent from being successful on a personal level. Many extremely wealthy are sad and sorry human specimens.

You make it seem like poor people on food stamps are stealing your hard earned money, when if you look at the actual facts one will see it is the upper echelon of income earners who have managed to make their fortunes off squeezing the hard working guy for all his spare change. They then sell the idea that the inequality of the economy is because poor people do not work hard enough. This is a complete lie. Over the last 40 years the low-middle income workers has had to work more to make less money, while the elite have made huge gains on their fortunes.

They way the tax bracket in the US is set up is backwards. Trickle down economics has obviously failed.

Oh yeah, this is gonna go over real good with everyone that voted for him...

originally posted by: macman
a reply to: jrod

What lies????

Dude, you really need to get your crap together.

My business that I own is actually very very successful. Our products typically run from $2300 to $3300 each, and are wants based, not really need based. I am 5 months back logged as well.

The company I work for is geared towards a specialty based company setting, was started by a couple of people, and has grown leaps and bounds. We hired 250 people last year and are hiring close to 500 this year.

Sooooooooo, you keep demonizing those evil rich people and hang out with the poor.

I will continue to work for those rich guys, provide a product to them and build my wealth.

Lets see next year how things are going for each.

Working for the enemy and getting "rich" will equal you being in the same shape as the poor one of these days...money is only paper and the alliances you make while you think it has value will bite you in the ass, in the end.

a reply to: jrod

I said that the Govt steals from me. It just happens to then turn around and give it to others.

The gap in wealth and income is due to 2 factors. The Govt and those taking from the Govt.

a reply to: ArchPlayer

So now we are on the whole paper money thing.

Is that all that you have?