Just my opinion.

Hi,

I just read a thread written by a member of ats who obviously sides with HAMAS or the fighters in the Gaza Strip. How someone feels towards the murders being committed in the Middle East is his or her business I'm not here to judge.

As we all know it takes two to fight.

The people who refuse a cease fire are the people we should blame for the deaths of innocent civilians. If the people in charge truly cared they would stop killing, they would stop fighting.

I have been following this ridiculous “war” for quite a while. There are no obvious good guys or bad guys. Sure most people take sides but how do you side with a terrorist?

What we have is a bunch of people who think it’s okay to kill to get their point across.

People from the rest of the world should learn a lesson from this mindless battle. Every person who thinks ‘an eye for an eye’ is a good concept should rethink their ideology. There is a lot of revenge killing going on and it defies logic.

I don’t pray but those of you who do should pray for peace.

If there are intelligent people running the show I hope they can agree to disagree in a more civilized manner?

Peace.

a reply to: minusinfinity

The people who refuse a cease fire are the people we should blame for the deaths of innocent civilians. If the people in charge truly cared they would stop killing, they would stop fighting.

Gaza conflict: Israel rejects truce 'as it stands'
www.bbc.co.uk...

What we have is a bunch of people who think it’s okay to kill to get their point across.

Israel?

I have been following this ridiculous “war” for quite a while. There are no obvious good guys or bad guys. Sure most people take sides but how do you side with a terrorist?

And how do people take the side of a country running an open air prison killing innocent children?

People from the rest of the world should learn a lesson from this mindless battle. Every person who thinks ‘an eye for an eye’ is a good concept should rethink their ideology. There is a lot of revenge killing going on and it defies logic.

Agreed nothing but hatred from both sides.

I don’t pray but those of you who do should pray for peace.

The pope asked for everyone to do that and people here are calling him a monster.

If there are intelligent people running the show I hope they can agree to disagree in a more civilized manner?

At this stage I don't think there is an intelligent person running any country on earth.

youtu.be...

"Islam: What the West needs to know" it's not just about Gaza or Israel!

originally posted by: minusinfinity

The people who refuse a cease fire are the people we should blame for the deaths of innocent civilians. If the people in charge truly cared they would stop killing, they would stop fighting.

So that includes both sides then...

I'm more of the opinion that the blood is on the hands of those who actually drop the bombs.

I have been following this ridiculous “war” for quite a while. There are no obvious good guys or bad guys. Sure most people take sides but how do you side with a terrorist?

What do you consider a terrorist? As they say, one man's freedom fighter is another man's terrorist.

Hamas may be considered a terrorist organisation by some, but many could also perceive Israel as a terrorist state too.

What we have is a bunch of people who think it’s okay to kill to get their point across.

Indeed...

People from the rest of the world should learn a lesson from this mindless battle. Every person who thinks ‘an eye for an eye’ is a good concept should rethink their ideology. There is a lot of revenge killing going on and it defies logic.

This isn't really an 'eye for an eye' though, is it? Rocket fire is not the same as shelling and air strikes.

I don’t pray but those of you who do should pray for peace.

Indeed. I bet those on the ground (on both sides) are praying. Too bad their god hasn't answered them yet...

If there are intelligent people running the show I hope they can agree to disagree in a more civilized manner?

Peace.

As do i, as do i.

Mahmoud Abbas seems to be the only leader, somewhat involved in this conflict, who has has a cool head. He's not firing rockets or air striking buildings. He's calling for peace.

a reply to: sosobad

Several times Israel accepted a cease fire on humanitarian grounds but Hamas violated the cease fire.

It's not a one sided conflict.

The ideology of Hamas is not logical, they are fanatical in regards to their hatred for Israel and the Jews. Their leaders have made incredibly inflammatory remarks in regards to destroying Israel. Their continuing purpose is to further that end, and they deliberately store their weapons in places (hospitals, schools, masques, etc.) which will incur large civilian casualties if struck. There is no negotiating with this level of fanaticism, and their refusal to accept and willful disregard for accepted cease fire offers, proves this. Israel has dropped millions of leaflets urging civilians to evacuate, but Hamas tells them to proceed to the places which will be attacked, and "...bare their chests to the enemy"...

Hamas is a death cult hell bent on the destruction of Israel, and their is no logical base from which to negotiate for peace. Any peace agreement or cease fire is agreed upon with an alternative motive, and used as time to rebuild and regroup for the next push, wherein any such agreement will be instantaneously and willfully violated as soon as possible.

Benjamin Netanyahu (Prime Minister of Israel) is doing what is necessary to protect his people, and removing the continuous threat from their borders (which is the chief responsibility of any "good" government).

War is never a pretty thing, it's not a nice thing, it's terrible and horrific, but when other means of diplomacy fail, if you wish to protect yourself, there is little choice in the next course of action.

Can see this thread going round and round in circles but here goes...

I think people should be worrying about a way to safely get the civilians of Gaza out of harms way rather than who's in the wrong or right, only Israeli claims can back up that Hamas use human sheilds and why would you take the word of any government about their enemy as 100% fact when they are currently 'at war' with them. They clearly don't use schools and hospitals as much as the news makes out because they have a $1.25 billion tunnel system to use, there's probably loccations they go that Israel don't even know about, and the fact hospitals and schools have been demolished and only civilian deaths have been reported..

For me, I really can't understand why Israel uses air strikes, tanks and missiles (all things with a big blast radius) in a populated area like that...They MUST know how many people there are who live there, in comparison to the probable thousands of Hamas members. Don't have to be a genius to work out that it's a bad f*cking idea. Solution: Send in the troops, at least they can see who they are aiming at before shooting (Not that it would stop civilian deaths indefinately but would cut them down drastically)

Also, I think people forget that the civilians clearly don't want all this death or conflict yet rope them into Hamas's evils or can justify the 1000> deaths...But what war isn't a war without civilians being used and killed to sway a political agenda or gain profit?

a reply to: minusinfinity

Israel and US have violated ceasefires in the past, what's your point?

a reply to: minusinfinity

I want to compare the situation in Gaza to a lion or tiger hunt. First they beat the bush driving the animals into the open, then corner them and finally shoot them dead. These hunts have no seeming purpose other than to satisfy the ego of the great hunter who executes his quarry with a rifle bullet from a safe distance.

One can hardly call that a war on tigers.

Now imagine using combined land sea and air forces to kill tigers in their caves using artillery and bombs.

Kind of overkill isn't it? In the land of Gaza, they are using sledgehammers to swat gnats.

Thats hardly a "war on terror".

a reply to: daaskapital

I never named a terrorist group.

Just because Hamas doesn't have the same technology doesn't mean Isreal isn't allowed to use their weapons. (rolling my eyes.) If we got into a fight and I'm bigger then does that mean I can't hit you as hard as I can?

Then why fight?

a reply to: intrptr

Perhaps but all Hamas needs to do is surrender. Not even surrender just stop attacking then the U.N. would jump on Israel to stop attacking.

a reply to: Royalkin

and their refusal to accept and willful disregard for accepted cease fire offers, proves this.

Gaza conflict: Israel rejects truce 'as it stands'
www.bbc.co.uk...

Israel has dropped millions of leaflets urging civilians to evacuate, but Hamas tells them to proceed to the places which will be attacked, and "...bare their chests to the enemy"..

Jeremy Bowen's Gaza notebook: I saw no evidence of Hamas using Palestinians as human shields The BBC's Middle East editor reports from Gaza.
www.newstatesman.com...

Hamas is a death cult hell bent on the destruction of Israel, and their is no logical base from which to negotiate for peace

"Hamas hadn't fired a single rocket since [2012 Gaza conflict], and had largely suppressed fire by smaller jihadi groups.
forward.com...

wherein any such agreement will be instantaneously and willfully violated as soon as possible.

The current escalation in Gaza is a direct result of the choice by Israel and the West to obstruct the implementation of the April 2014 Palestinian reconciliation agreement."
www.nytimes.com...

a reply to: minusinfinity

Several times Israel accepted a cease fire on humanitarian grounds but Hamas violated the cease fire.

"One day after an Egyptian-brokered cease-fire accepted by Israel, but rejected by Hamas, fell through, the terrorist organization proposed a 10-year end to hostilities in return for its conditions being met by Israel, Channel 2 reported Wednesday.. Hamas's conditions were the release of re-arrested Palestinian prisoners who were let go in the Schalit deal, the opening of Gaza-Israel border crossings in order to allow citizens and goods to pass through, and international supervision of the Gazan seaport in place of the current Israeli blockade."

Rejected by Israel

www.jpost.com...

Also, I think if you want a little more insight into why this is happening; Then you should read this

Althought it is just another theory...with a lot of credible sources and facts...

a reply to: sosobad

Sure Hamas proposes ridiculous cease fire deals but why should Israel agree they're winning.

originally posted by: minusinfinity
a reply to: sosobad

Sure Hamas proposes ridiculous cease fire deals but why should Israel agree they're winning.

Hamas rejected the original offer because they were not involved in the process at all, then came up with counter proposal and Israel didn't even acknowledge it. What was ridiculous about the counter proposal? What exact bit if you don't mind me asking? To have their boarders open instead of being in a prison? To control their sea port? For Israel to stand by the Schalit deal they made? Which one?

originally posted by: minusinfinity
a reply to: sosobad

Sure Hamas proposes ridiculous cease fire deals but why should Israel agree they're winning.

Winning what? Ground? Resources? Allegiance? Body count?

Well, maybe the last one…

a reply to: minusinfinity

Perhaps but all Hamas needs to do is surrender. Not even surrender just stop attacking then the U.N. would jump on Israel to stop attacking.

I understand your desire for fair play. But that view point is not proven. What is proven is that every couple years Israel cooks up another reason and kills scores, hundreds of "Gazans" and the world stands by and watches.

If there ever were a prerequisite to run the usual Humanitarian intervention excuse for invading another country. Seems with Israel thats never going to happen, though.

a reply to: minusinfinity

I have been following this ridiculous “war” for quite a while. There are no obvious good guys or bad guys. Sure most people take sides but how do you side with a terrorist?

Terrorists wage campaigns of warfare against civilian targets with the objective of spreading fear. Most, if not every well organized military down through history has done the same. The only difference, "terrorist groups" tend to kill civilians in far smaller numbers in most attacks as opposed to the collateral damage of guided ordinance or air dropped bombs. While I do not support the killing of civilians in any conflict, the terrorist label is misleading and hypocritical. My nation (the U.S.) has a long and blood drenched history of using selective military strikes in population centers--which they often deem righteous punitive measures. The truth, my opinion of course, is that a terrorist and a soldier, once engaged in war, are one and the same, seeking to achieve the same objective, which is physical or psychological victory by violence. The only difference between IDF forces and Hamas, is political and media spin.

If there are intelligent people running the show I hope they can agree to disagree in a more civilized manner?

Civilized is an interesting word. A word often used to describe the policies and societies of first world nations. And yet, these beacons of enlightenment, technology and "highly" evolved human rights annually expend tons of high explosive ordinance in the killing of their fellow men. They impose sanctions that kill tens of thousands and like gods determine which among the poorest nations of the world get a cut of their spoils, and which will go without.

Further, "intelligent people" seem to build the most effective killing machines, an act which in turn creates an overwhelming need to test them out on perhaps less well funded people or whomever can be made look like the bad guys of the month.

The way I see it, there's been a cold, calculated intent driving every war since the stone age. In the case of the Israeli Palestinian conflict, one side's calculated intent is fully funded and armed and justified to the rest of the world by the most powerful nation on its surface. That makes all the difference to me. If Israel were an island cut off from all possible aid and forced to devise and construct its own military industrial complex in order to defend its borders against multiple aggressors attacking it with the same level of technology, I might see her in a different light.

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: minusinfinity

I want to compare the situation in Gaza to a lion or tiger hunt. First they beat the bush driving the animals into the open, then corner them and finally shoot them dead. These hunts have no seeming purpose other than to satisfy the ego of the great hunter who executes his quarry with a rifle bullet from a safe distance.

One can hardly call that a war on tigers.

Now imagine using combined land sea and air forces to kill tigers in their caves using artillery and bombs.

Kind of overkill isn't it? In the land of Gaza, they are using sledgehammers to swat gnats.

Thats hardly a "war on terror".

You forgot the part about the Tigers shooting rockets right? It's always the pesky rockets Tigers love those things. I've heard they are made from plumbing parts at the local hardware store, but the park ranger knows better plumbing parts don't fly 50 miles. While you're hunting those tigers how do those pesky rockets fly out of the cave? Why wouldn't you hunt Tigers at a distance they have those pesky rockets, darn if they don't have some of those same rifles that shoot at distance. Those Tigers, the furry little creatures that they are, willing to eat you at a moments notice, ripping you to shreds for their next meal. Carnivores that love fresh bloody meat.