Ukrainian Su-25 fighter detected in close approach to MH17 before crash - Moscow

a reply to: sosobad

Thank you...

Russia has offered proof that there was a Ukrainian plane in the area after the Ukraine denied there was.

...This was the point of the thread!!!

Peace soso!!!

Has anyone considered the SU may have shadowed the civil airliner to avoid the BUKshot?
Perhaps with several plaNES AND CHOPPERS BEING SHOT DOWN LATELY....THE PILOT THOUGHT IF HE WAS CLOSE TO THE AIRLINER THE SEPARATISTS WOULDNT Launch? Just a thought....

I just don't know what to believe anymore. Both sides lie to the hilt. My head hurts.

The pro-russians have offered excuses up to and including WHO zombie biowarfare conspiracies now we are to believe a ground attack aircraft that cant even get to 33000ft is responsible,it wont be long before aliens are responsible on RT.

Well if RT said it then it must be true. Not like they're an organ of the Russian state intelligence service or anything.

... oh. Wait.

a reply to: khnum
a reply to: Painterz

Eh guys you do realize that this evidence was offered by the Russian military not RT right? Just because they reported doesn't mean they made it up, where is the US's evidence? You got anything to prove this evidence wrong?

Evidence can be tempered with, and i believe that was major concern that is what will happen, because area was in control of separatist.

I don't trust Russian or Putin anything...

i still believe the initial stories when the rebel leader owned up and even boasted in shooting down a plane on his twitter accounts and then hastily removed it after realizing it was a civilian plane they've shot down.

everything else afterwards are propaganda and lies including this made up evidence

a reply to: sosobad

Well Australia got its resolution through the security council of the UN for full access and the pro-Russian goons not to interfere the former head of our airforce,federal police and other experts will be on scene shortly and Australia does have a good track record in such cases we caught the Bali bombers and brought them to justice,they'll find out what happened this isn't a turd that the hat will cover forever,bringing the culprits to justice however may be difficult but we will find out who they were,my comments were just an observation of how ridiculous the pro-Russian spin has become.

I see RT removed the radar cap 'showing' the fighter near MH-17 from the article.




Translate of the letters from the image of the B777 with an ID 351.





It appears to be Singapore 351

Singapore 351 was flying in the area around the same time. Flightaware shows it cruising at 35k feet in the flight.

So that was proof of a fighter approaching MH-17.

a reply to: roadgravel

Good call.





Or is it, not sure now?

Well it certainly doesn't show MH-17. Given it's gone from the article, what does that imply.

Kiev left Buk-M1 behind intentionally for rebels to take.

Then they sent Su-25 near MH-17 to encourage shooting

Before hand gave direct routing to smoothen the set up

Buk-M1 took the bigger target

Rebels and Russia are made to look bad

Wonder why media is focusing so much on MH17 rather than Gaza

In Gaza 500+ already killed, thousands injured, lots of homes blown up, mess still going on

Am very scared of what Ukraine issue can lead up to

a reply to: khnum

Have to be pretty naive to believe that commercial aircraft are safe against Russian fighters. Ukraine has the R-60 missile which was developed by Russia in 1974 to achieve a service ceiling of 66,000 feet.

en.wikipedia.org...(missile)

All I can say is Pukin the "chess master" isn't doing so well on the chessboard.

For all the Russian-worshippers aka bootlickers, they should try living there for a while and see how they like it. Everything is controlled. Even the billionaires can't speak out agains Putin, and they are worried sick about the next sanctions that will hurt Pukin's cronies. Go live there and let us know how u like it, comrade.

If Russia has nothing to hide they should let the international investigation proceed post-haste, including allowing access to the bodies for proper return to the families and burial. THAT should be their main focus, not propaganda. If they didn't do it there will be evidence, not some scenario that is a conspiracy theory at best and total garbage at worst, probably garbage.

a reply to: CharlieSpeirs
you know, the Russian Government propaganda machine has fabricated so much BS in the last few days I'm not sure I'd trust them to tell me if it was day or night - and this looks suspiciously like more of their duck shoving.

originally posted by: victor7
Kiev left Buk-M1 behind intentionally for rebels to take.

cough - except he "Buk" they "left behind was a vehicle, with no missiles on board, and itself a wreck that couldn't move, and is apparently still in the same place they left it.

but yeah - apart from that it is obvious....

a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

If you have an outlet you trust 100% then please share it...

By the way, I like your Anatole France signature especially, reminds me of Western Media ;D


Peace Aloysius!!!

a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

In that case there should be no denial that Ukraine itself shot down the MH17 using its own Buks and blame it on the rebels........cough!!

It has been reported that Kiev had its Buks in the area of the crash.

They intentionally sent the Su-25 to make a case that rebels were trying to shoot down the Su and missile locked into the 777.

Nevertheless, I do not blame Kiev Junta totally for this crash it is the WH and Pentagon which is criminally responsible for all the crimes being committed in Ukraine, Syria, Gaza and now...........again in Libya.

Unless such events are brought into their living rooms, they will keep on with their sadist agenda on vulnerable people around the world.

originally posted by: victor7
a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul
In that case there should be no denial that Ukraine itself shot down the MH17 using its own Buks and blame it on the rebels........cough!!

feel free to make some sense.

It has been reported that Kiev had its Buks in the area of the crash.

Yeah - by the Russians.....and we can see in this thread what BS they provide.

In fact the claims show missiles in an encampment - RT.com article, alongside a whole lot of other vehicles and then NOT THERE on eth 17th......

and also photos of a BUK 50km SOUTH of Donetsk - miles away from the crash site.

They intentionally sent the Su-25 to make a case that rebels were trying to shoot down the Su and missile locked into the 777.

Says you and the Russians - so I'm going with more BS. Especially in light of het "radar screen" that shows no such thing!!

I also note the discussion above about the max ceiling of a Su-25 - and note that the Russians don't even claim that the a/c was AT that height - they say it was "climbing" - which straight away says that it was NOT at that height.

also a basic error in geography - the Russians say the Ukrainian BUK was:

Buk missile defense units in Zaroschinskoe, 50km south of Donetsk city and 8km south of Shakhtyorsk, on July 17, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense Ministry

Well here's Zaroschinskoe relative to Donetsk - does it look 50km south to you? 'cos it sure as heck doesn't to me - it is 8km south of Shakhyorsk, so they can't claim they don't know which way south is!!

Nevertheless, I do not blame Kiev Junta totally for this crash

lol - that's very good of you

.....it is the WH and Pentagon which is criminally responsible for all the crimes being committed in Ukraine, Syria, Gaza and now...........again in Libya.
Unless such events are brought into their living rooms, they will keep on with their sadist agenda on vulnerable people around the world.

laughable.

and pathetic - if it wasn't so tragic that people like you are prepared to let Russia get away with this - the myopia that everything has to be the fault of the USA is actually quite insulting to Russia at one level!!

the Su-25's operated by the Ukraine airforce can carry the R-73 AA missile, which has a 20 mile range - but only a 7 kg warhead - and it is IR aimed - so would go for engines - and would not destroy the whole aircraft.

When KAL007 was shot down it was "hit" by 2 Kaliningrad Ka-8 missiles - each with a 40kg warhead! And they didn't destroy the aircraft in flight - they damaged hydraulics and other systems and the aircraft kept flying for more than 5 minutes!

Lastly, there is no such thing a "a civil air corridor" as claimed by the Russians - all airspace is controlled unless designated otherwise, and military aircraft using airspace are controlled by het same controllers as civil aircraft - the words are meaningless and apparently designed to do nothing more than sow confusion........plus of course the Su-25 (if it existed) was NOT in the same airspace as MH-17 and COULD NOT HAVE BEEN because it cannot fly that high!

the story is so full of OBVIOUS holes as to be worthless.