Malaysian 777 Passenger Airline Shot Down Over Eastern Ukraine

originally posted by: TDawgRex
Currently, I am leaning strongly in the opinion that the Rebels shot down MH17. Why?

- Because they have already shot down Ukraine aircraft in the area.
- They are rebels, and as such are not as disciplined a force.
- They have gained weapons through capture and have also been supplied weapons from Russia. This has been documented.
- The rebels have no air capability to speak of, especially in regards to the size of a Boing 777. So it make absolutely no sense for the Ukrainians to down a aircraft that was close to leaving their airspace anyways.
- The captured messages between the rebels, indicate that some one screwed up.

Any one with a ounce of common sense would realize that if this was to played out as a false flag op (PSYOP) would realize how bad it could backfire.

I think that this is nothing more than a case of a trigger happy rebel with tragic consequences.

This this this 10x.

There's no conspiracy here...well, kind of. The Russians won't admit their own supporters in Ukraine royally screwed up. The patterns leading up to this event (shooting down of Ukraine aircrafts) support the proof that this was caused by Pro Russian rebels.

The conspiracy is that the Russians will cover this up to the end of days unless Putin has a change of heart or he knows the truth will get out in one way or another. I'm going for the latter, although we all know Putin simply does not care what anyone thinks or him....invading Crimea showed just that.

a reply to: AstralTrespass

ha...ha...ha...cannot count to five. I love when people attack typos or spelleing....

I was pointing out how Russia has returned to the world stage with a bang...literally. They are pushing us at every angle and we as an 'administration' are turning our back on allies we promised support to. The Red line in Syria..Israel...Eastern Europe as well as The Arab Spring the MSM does not concern us with but lets us know Jay Z will be dining at the White House. You cannot continue to make threats and not back them up or you will get your ass kicked. It is not about being a bully but trying to keep the peace.

Russia could simply turn off the natural gas and Europe is in a huge pit of trouble. It has been threatened and To me these are all chess moves in a large game the US is not playing.

a reply to: JanAmosComenius

Not at all. Commercial flight schedules are pretty easy to find, but MH17 was 30 minutes behind schedule at take off. It would be easy to mistake the two, especially for someone who trained on the system by trial and error, such as learning by manual. It wouldn't be the first time something like that happened, and I'm sure it won't be the last.

a reply to: matafuchs

It has been threatened and To me these are all chess moves in a large game the US is not playing.

Right, America is not playing the game.......

ha...ha...ha...cannot count to five. I love when people attack typos or spelleing....

I probably wouldn't have if your post wasn't so annoyingly biased and ignorant.

Btw, is it hard to spell spelling?

I think what we all need to do is wait for more facts to come out before we start blaming certain groups of people. The US media has been on the warpath against Russia over this and outlets like RT are blaming Ukraine.

It's pretty sad that I agree with China on this issue.....wait, be calm and review the facts as they as provided. Anything else is dangerous speculation.

Btw, any news about the alleged Ukranian fighter escort of flight MH17 that I missed?

a reply to: Zaphod58

I suppose Buk radar system incorporate Doppler radar, hence speed off captured object should be probably most accurate of values coming out of the system. Am I right? Is An-26 capable to develop speed even similar to speed of 777 at 10.000 m?



Now I realize that such values are relative to direction of moving object and observing radar. But still ...

I see "breaking news" (on yahoo) that Obama is now saying there was at least one American on board.

WTF?? How can the citizenship of the passengers even be a question at this point? Shouldn't we have a list of names and countries that is pretty cut and dry? We've known from the beginning the huge number of Dutch on board, and other countries as well.

Now... all this time later, he announces there is "at least one" American. Ridiculous.

a reply to: JanAmosComenius

If you aren't trained to read the speed by doppler, then you're not going to be able to tell the difference that way either. It's not a matter of simply reading a book and doing it. It takes training and practice to do it, and even be close to accurate.

a reply to: VegHead

One?

Last I heard it was 23.

Much is based on the passport used.

According to Yurij Streukov, russian separatist, who had straight reports from the site of the crash - some of the bodies were dead already long time ago and looked "bloodless"

The whole interview in russian you can find here

I'm not a supporter of Russia, but I thought this might bring some new thoughts for conspiracy buffs...
From my point of view -there is something fishy in this whole situation, something, which made me look to the both sides of this conflict....
RIP innocent victims....

a reply to: VegHead

They got to make it where we should care about it. Since it had some americans on it otherwise people will forget about this sooner then they want. With american lives lost they can beat the war drums longer.

Malaysia is dispatching 62 people from their military, government and Malaysia Airlines to assist in the investigation and recovery. They are currently unable to confirm the status of the recorders. The Ukraine has guaranteed a safe corridor to the crash location.

www.flightglobal.com...

a reply to: AstralTrespass

The misspelling was sarcasm but can you spell "by the way?"

America is not playing the game as it once did and we have shown it many times. With any administration in the last 20 years the actions Russia are taking would not be allowed to occur. Remember though what Obama said before re-election...



We as an administration are allowing these things to happen to bring about another larger scale war instead of trying to prevent it.

Someone needs to be held responsible for the deaths of these innocent people whether they were flying in an area that is a war zone or not but alas I am sure it will fade to the back pages in a few days like the Mexican border crisis..etc...etc...

a reply to: TDawgRex

** yes i agree. Putin would not do this !! he is too sensible a man (man), and a peace preferring christian, NOT a "communist" !!!, unlike satanic usg MIC, fronted by a pervert with a male for a "wife", anxious to bomb anything (including his own citizens) that argues with them. Putin has played great chess for 2 years keeping Syria confined, but due to CIA selling arms to rebels there as well, its now out of control, and ww3 likely even next month ... (will be started by same jews / cheney who planned 911 against Iran). probably MH17 was downed by trigger happy rebels with Buk equipment they should never have been allowed to get hold of... such are the consequences of selling arms left and right all round the world. they probably didnt even identify the aircraft, just thought it was "russian" and decided to fire their toy at it ... its crazy for ANY airline to fly over a war zone known to be using missiles. what sort of idiot flight controllers authorised that ? same type who still cant find MH317 !!! planet of assholes. leave them to it, go have a beer PS, china are not "communist" either !!! (in case you didnt know, due to lapping up BBC crap) they are very progressive socialist committee-governed state. go to Shanghai and have a look, go all round China and be amazed at the culture, cleanliness, friendliness, and the million millionaires busy producing half the worlds goods, no time for attacking everyone. if not for Beijing pressure, the Nokos would have gone berserk last year as well. do not consider Russia and China as enemies !!! they are your only hope after the dollar has collapsed, All mexico has emigrated to Texas, and Canada joined the Amero, all 3 saying FU to the world that one of them tried to destroy by plundering and genocide (+ thanks be to "god" who supervises it all !!!) kaman.

a reply to: Zaphod58

Zaph, honest question. Many of us have seen the footage of the impact (filmed at a distance) and other footage filmed immeditely after.

Why can we not see a smoke trail of the aircraft as it went down? Would not that still be visible? Even if it did break up after the impact of the missile?

Statement by ICAO/IATA.

ICAO says “it is always the responsibility” of member states to issue warnings or airspace and ceiling restrictions “based on what they consider to be potential threats to civilian air services in the airspace under their sovereign control”, says a spokesman. “ICAO does issue these warnings under extraordinary circumstances, for instance where States may not be able to due to command and control breakdowns, or possibly where a State does not have good diplomatic relations with the States who need to receive the safety advisory and it asks ICAO to do contact these adjacent States on its behalf.”

The route over Ukrainian airspace where the incident occurred “is commonly used for Europe to Asia flights,” says Malaysia Airlines. “A flight from a different carrier was on the same route at the time of the MH17 incident, as were a number of other flights from other carriers in the days and weeks before.”

Route approved by Eurocontrol

originally posted by: TDawgRex
a reply to: VegHead

One?

Last I heard it was 23.

Obama: Plane shot down by missile, 1 American dead
news.yahoo.com...

AP story on his press conference...




We know there were 80 children plus 3 infants. My mind cannot even wrap around that horrible detail. It is too awful. Yet we still don't know exactly how many Americans were on board?
I just can't figure out why this isn't more straightforward.

a reply to: matafuchs

The misspelling was sarcasm but can you spell "by the way?"

No, I have no idea how to spell "by the way".

So what do you want your gov. to do? Start an all out war with Russia?