Malaysian 777 Passenger Airline Shot Down Over Eastern Ukraine

a reply to: roadgravel

I know. Kind of feeble.

"Because of the technical complexity of the SA-11, it is unlikely that the separatists could effectively operate the system without assistance from knowledgeable personnel. Thus we cannot rule out technical assistance from Russian personnel in operating the systems," she added.

a reply to: negue

It's called a: WAR ZONE!

Not an ordinary area like Shanksville, PA.

a reply to: Xcathdra

Please.

Did it work when it brought the plane down? Yup

Have any FACTS to back that up?

. . . I have a Ukrainian official who says otherwise.

again:

"What are your thoughts that Ukraine officials are saying separatists didn't have functional Buks?"

I think this demonstrates that although military of various governments are funded by people for the said protection of those people and their interests, the issues of the regular people don't count. Corporate and political gain is top priority and a given. Innocent people killed senselessly by military fighting for political gain are just rubbish and mean little.

These people do not even have enough honor to allow bodies to be collected and others do not have the strength to say it will be done. War, what is it good for.

a reply to: ~Lucidity

Has there ever been any real doubt that Russia has been supporting the rebels with advisers, equipment and intelligence? The rebels are the proxy army for Russia. He is attempting to use them to accomplish his goal of conquering Ukraine without the ramifications of an invasion by Russia. Although that mindset apparently only worked during the cold war but hey..

The use of the BUK to bring the plane down is a lose lose for Putin, which is most likely the reason he is once again pushing the all sides must stop mantra. His behavior / body language for this incident is unusual as well. Mix in the rebels destroying the crime scene, which makes absolutely no sense if they did not bring it down, and we end up with more questions / fingers pointing at the rebels / russia.

I think the corpses being looted perfectly demonstrates the mentality of the pro russian rebels. If they are willing to do that then there is no telling just how far they will go.

a reply to: roadgravel

War, what is it good for.

''A view widespread in Poland is that Western leaders simply lack the imagination to understand Russian aggression, and the courage to do anything serious about it''

fullcomment.nationalpost.com...


interesting read.

what happens if the rebels are eliminated in order to secure the crash site? how would Russia react?

a reply to: SurrenderingAmerica

I have a Ukrainian official who says otherwise.

No what you have is a Ukraine official that was quoted out of context.

a reply to: madaliceseason

You could be right. There is little profit in this one so no one in a position to do something will. The lack of action shows what political leaders really think about the people who pay their way and trust them.

a reply to: madaliceseason

The crash site has been compromised for too long most of the evidence is probably now in Russia,but if someone wanted to secure the crash site and waste a bunch of these neanderthals Id be all for it.

originally posted by: tsurfer2000h
a reply to: SurrenderingAmerica

I have a Ukrainian official who says otherwise.

No what you have is a Ukraine official that was quoted out of context.

How?

Perhaps you should go back & read my comment:
My comment w/ links & quotes

. . . If it's out of context, perhaps you can shed some light on some personal conversation that you've PERSONALLY had w/ Ministry of Defense of Ukraine & Ukrainian Interior Minister Anton Gerashchenko.

Care to share?

Is it true that Ukraine authorities recovered both 'black boxes' of MH17?


There's so many conflicting reports -- what is the latest?

a german expert made a report about the boeing and its bad news for poronesko, whatever he is called (the kiev president) is not allowing germanics to take part in the investigation now (holland)....

link

so its very clear, what kind of investigation mr poronesko wants, the "internaltional one"... But its a lost cause, they failed again. Even if USA comes and say : russia did it... allready the half world proves the oposite... so poronesko allready smells bad with all these things...

I am going to bet there are threads on this website that say TWA flight 800 was shot down too, even though it's been proven it wasn't and there was never any evidence that it was, just like this thread.

19.07 militia channel internet radio zello report junta morning airstrikes killed at least 44 and wounded 216 also reported the junta bombs and place of the crash, also reported a strong smell of corpses half an hour after the crash, according to Defense Minister Igor Strelkov of Donetsk Peoples Respublic some passengers died a few days earlier

if they emptied the airplane and added corpses inside, I may pray for this innocent humans, because, KIEV have the reputation of slatering humans and german doctors taking their parts...

they wont let them escape is it? Someone may release some pics from sattelites, who knows... if they emptied the airplane, maybe russia have some material, who knows...

Lets say that they did that... What about the pilot and the crew, they accepted to be with dead corpses? for a tour? It sounds crazy a bit, is it? Or they used some ISIL fatatics (for the horde!!!) ready to die, pretending of being the crew... thats a conspiracy, spicy!! Can the airplane take off robotic?

originally posted by: AstralTrespass
a reply to: Xcathdra




I guess you missed that.

Yes, they miss a lot.

I don't know what happened to you, but your inquisitive mind and calm perseverance will also be missed by myself and all those who love peace and truth.

This is a lost cause anyways.

Good luck to you and yours.

Ploutonas, trick substitute airplan radio-controlled drone (and all modern Boeing have the opportunity of getting control of the land earlier than 2001), the CIA planned in 1962 against Cuba

Putin Is A Pariah — He Must Now Be Treated As Such

For the past two decades, many around the world have been in denial. Russia was changing, they insisted. And so it has. It has embraced money, private jets and super yachts. For a fleeting few years in the early 1990s it toyed with democracy, only to conclude that this course was synonymous with chaos. Out of this new experiment of bling with brutishness came Vladimir Putin.

Six months into the crisis in Ukraine, the shooting down of the Malaysian airliner marks a defining moment in the West’s approach to Russia. Or at least it should.

Putin is a pariah. He must now be treated as such.

The terrible loss of MH17, with passengers from a dozen nations on board, was tragedy enough. The stories of Dutch families obliterated, scientific experts on their way to a conference in Australia, and Newcastle football fans making the extraordinary journey to New Zealand were heart-rending. Initially, as the facts remained a little unclear, the Russian President could, just could, have salvaged what remained of his international credibility in his response to the crash. He could have expressed his horror at the military escalation in eastern Ukraine, vowing that the perpetrators of the crime would be brought to justice. Then, in time, he might have called for a conference on the future of Russians in Ukraine and ensured that they secured greater autonomy. He would have been able to trade on some goodwill, alongside the power that comes with Russia’s dominance of energy supplies to Europe. Machiavelli would have approved.

Instead he reverted to thuggish type. As state television produced its now familiar diet of propaganda, the president insisted that the Ukrainians only had themselves to blame. Meanwhile, rebel leaders in the crash site area threatened journalists and investigators who tried to piece together the facts. The idea, from the very start of the Ukrainian insurgency, that the balaclava-clad forces in Crimea and the east of the country were a spontaneous reflection of local sentiment was laughable. They have been armed and coordinated from on high, from the Kremlin. Now the order has gone out to eliminate the incriminating evidence. This will be difficult, but Putin’s hope is to muddy the trail just enough that it will allow some European politicians to argue that further sanctions and other repercussions be toned down.

For sure, Putin did not want developments to unfold in the way they have done. The rebels had, shortly before the Malaysian airliner was downed, just boasted about their prowess in picking Ukrainian military planes from the sky. They ended up picking the wrong target. Their minders in Moscow will be furious with them, knowing that the events of the past 48 hours will set back the rebels’ cause.

Read more: www.businessinsider.com...

Click link for remainder of article

Wow looks like we just trailed off into fantasy here on the thread. see people were seen bording the plane it took off and was along its flight plan. So this whole scenario is entering the absurd might as well say pixies were on board the plane makes just about as much sense. If your refuting the fact that passengers boarded the plane do you have any evidence? What am i saying of course you dont your whole theory relies on playing on people paranoia. I noticed Russia media isnt trying to dispute evidence either they just want to say Ukraine did it. Problem is thats very unlikely given the range of the Buk or as i learned the gadfly. The range would be about 20 kilometers max meaning they had to be within 20 kilometers of the impact. That means it was fired from within separatists territory since obviously that area is still under there control though i suspect Ukrainian military is going to make it a priority to take the area.

I figure expect them to take the area within the next day for them it will be a priority they will want to stop the destruction of the sight. For them an international investigation is top priority. They have been making claims of Russian involvement but the west has been shall we say reluctant to admit it. With this incident the international community will be forces to admit Russian direct involvement. With that guarantee military aid is coming quickly something Ukraine would need to fight Russian agents in Ukraine. Even though Russian military is still outdated its 10 times better than what Ukraine has.