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originally posted by: orangetom1999
Good grief Rex282!! You were doing fine until this point...
It has no bearing on the Truth" which version of the "bible" is the most accurate.The bible is formulated into the doctrines of man in the same fashion as the Talmud
I think this should read.."The Bible is formulated into the doctrines of God....not of man.
Whos's interpretation of the "doctrines of God"or of what was "written…..yours ,Jims, Gail Riplinger's,,etc etc…The conflation is infinite because it is impossible for everyone to be right and nobody be wrong when they are all in confliction.
originally posted by: orangetom1999
Also ..to my limited knowledge...neither Jesus nor any of the prophets taught from the Talmud.
Yes you are correct that Yahoshua never "taught" from the Talmud….nor the old testimony..because he wasn't "teaching" he was "proclaiming" in statements of Truth.This is the core of Christianity.They "believe" Yahoshua was "teaching" them "how" to live to be a better person etc etc…yet he ONLY spoke in parables and he clearly said he did so that those that thought they heard and saw would not hear or see.If he was "teaching that was a very poor method since none (including the disciple) understood wht he meant.
However it was given ONLY to the disciples(and after the fact) to "know" what he said by "revelation" not "teaching from books.The abundance of evidence is that has not changes and that the religious man is even more deaf and blind.They "believe" the doctrines of men(which are legion) which they have extrapolated from the "bible" which was assimilated by "men" in the same "fashion" as the Talmud.
originally posted by: orangetom1999
The Talmud, even before it became written down into a system, is an abomination to God. It is a system of rules which allows one to get around the rules...and without many, not trained in the Talmud, knowing it is happening. The Talmud is a dual system of confusion. Rule keeping.Lots of people out here are Talmudic...dual systems in operation but never identified ..so that most do not know or see it is happening around them. This is of the counterfeiter...the god of this world.
….and that is exactly what many have done with the bible.It is IMPOSSIBLE to know what "all" was written in the scriptures yet many believe they "know"it is "the word of God" so they vivasectioned their bible and created their doctrines of men(and their God).Nothing has changed except there are MANY more people who believe in their doctrines of men and all claiming to "know" the truth because they have the correct translation, they know the correct interpretation, then they teach others to do the same thing.That is exactly what the Pharisees,Saducees and scribes did.That is the definition of insanity ….. doing the same thing over and over expecting different results.
The fact is NONE know ALL of what is written in the scriptures because they are "lost" to time.Even when Yahoshua "quoted" from the scriptures he never quoted passages only what was testifying to the Truth he was proclaiming.The scriptures were completely corrupted by then and he knew it.That doesn't mean they didn't testify of the Truth.The majority of all of what now exists of the old testimony is the twisting of the Truth.The Israelites then the Jews saw God as the most evil monstrous being there is.Their" God "commands" them to invade countries and slaughter it's inhabitants in "the name of God".Their revered leaders are the most ruthless people in history yet they are praised for being men after the heart of God (King David).
Did the Israelites and Jews "historicaly do"(real events) what is written?…Yes.they were a ruthless people that justified all they did in the name of their God and it was documented..however they twisted the accountability part onto their "God"..God told us to do it!!Nothing has changed .Christians did and still do the same thing..all in the name of "their" God.They have made the "living word(which is not the bible or even the scriptures) void…meaningless…they have trampled it under foot and made it a perversion.
……and THAT is what the "God" of this world has done…and that God is the religious carnal mind of man…satan…however there is no being "Satan".That Satan is an extrapolation and in the modern sense of the word"scapegoat" for all the evil man does.The most evil thing they do is in the name of "their religion".The religious carnal mind is the seed of all strife of mankind because it is their nature.The religious carnal mind is in complete enmity with the creator God YET believes the opposite!!Their God is precepts from a book and nothing more.There are no "correct translations" or "Interpretations" because those will always only be the doctrines of men.
Yahoshua didn't "teach" those doctrines nor did the apostles.They "proclaimed" statements of truth that was "revealed to them by the creator God the Father.The books are used to justify and agenda ..nothing more.To establish "biblical authority" a man need only say"it is written" then extrapolate their interpretation…because The word of GOD says" Unless you believe blah blah blah….."it is not consider for a nano second what it means only the enforcement" of the doctrine matters.A person only "believes" what they want (will) to believe.That is NOT the Good News.
The scriptures were "written" for one purpose only..to be a testimony (witness) that testifies of Yahoshua(Yahweh the creator God is deliverance).That testimony has testified and been established however NOT by Christianity or ANY Christian believer all they can do is believe the doctrines of men..The TRUTH can only be established BY the creator God.For those that "hear" the Good News it brings great joy that ALL of mankind will be delivered from hades…the realm of the death and imperception through the Son of the creator God who is the SEED of the Father.THAT and only that is the Good News the crux of EVERYTHING Yahoshua the Son of the creator God(the seed) said and did.
edit on 7-8-2014 by Rex282 because: (no reason given)
originally posted by: Xcouncil=wisdom
a reply to: Rex282
(Luke 4:16-21) 16 He then went to Naz′a·reth, where he had been brought up, and according to his custom on the Sabbath day, he entered the synagogue and stood up to read. 17 So the scroll of the prophet Isaiah was handed to him, and he opened the scroll and found the place where it was written: 18 “Jehovah’s spirit is upon me, because he anointed me to declare good news to the poor. He sent me to proclaim liberty to the captives and a recovery of sight to the blind, to send the crushed ones away free, 19 to preach Jehovah’s acceptable year.” 20 With that he rolled up the scroll, handed it back to the attendant, and sat down; and the eyes of all in the synagogue were intently fixed on him. 21 Then he began to say to them: “Today this scripture that you just heard is fulfilled.”
Who says Jesus didn't use the scrolls/O.T. in his teaching?
X
Below are samples of the many verses saying that Jesus was teaching.
He was not teaching.
HELPS Word-studies
In the NT, 1321 /didáskō ("teach") nearly always refers to teaching the Scriptures (the written Word of God).
originally posted by: Rex282
originally posted by: Xcouncil=wisdom
a reply to: Rex282
(Luke 4:16-21) 16 He then went to Naz′a·reth, where he had been brought up, and according to his custom on the Sabbath day, he entered the synagogue and stood up to read. 17 So the scroll of the prophet Isaiah was handed to him, and he opened the scroll and found the place where it was written: 18 “Jehovah’s spirit is upon me, because he anointed me to declare good news to the poor. He sent me to proclaim liberty to the captives and a recovery of sight to the blind, to send the crushed ones away free, 19 to preach Jehovah’s acceptable year.” 20 With that he rolled up the scroll, handed it back to the attendant, and sat down; and the eyes of all in the synagogue were intently fixed on him. 21 Then he began to say to them: “Today this scripture that you just heard is fulfilled.”
Who says Jesus didn't use the scrolls/O.T. in his teaching?
X
In the very scripture he was quoting it clearly states he came to "preach(proclaim the statement of truth) of what his purposes was.He was not teaching.He read the scripture and said it had been fulfilled(summed like an equation).He clearly stated after the parable of the sower of the seed when his disciples asked "why don't you speak "plainly" he said I speak in parables so those(everybody) that THINK they can hear won't hear .The fact is he was NEVER teaching he only proclaimed Truth he heard from the Father not from reading and studying the scripture.That is as true today as the day he spoke it.
Mani a Persian Mystic taught that Jesus, Buddha and Zarathushtra had all been saviours or perfect Masters of their time, but that the way to God lay through a living teacher
originally posted by: orangetom1999
Did not Jesus accept worship??
Something to think about.
originally posted by: chiram
According to the classification of the emotions, we have five negative one’s which we should always try to control, Anger is a NEGATIVE EMOTION. Of the five positives, Love is a POSITIVE EMOTION and is therefore beneficial. I think you are getting your emotions a little mixed up.
I would like to point something out about Anger, it’s classified as a disease of the mind. Let me tell you how this disease manifests by a set of symptoms:
1. Thinking ill of others.
2. Taking offence easily.
3. Criticising the actions of others.
4. Lecturing or discoursing on the mistakes of others, either to the person himself, or to others about him.
5. Chronic fault-finding or pointing out the defects of character or conduct of others, making them out to be really bad.
originally posted by: orangetom1999
I don't worry to much about the classification of emotions...but rather the fruit they produce.
Notice something here..
15 KJV So hast thou also them that hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitanes, which thing I hate.
Notice this is a proof text that God Hates....also is angered.
originally posted by: nenothtu
originally posted by: orangetom1999
Did not Jesus accept worship??
Something to think about.
Not that I am aware of - perhaps you could point out something I've missed.
originally posted by: roth1
Jesus never in the bible said he was god. He always claimed to be the son of god. If the had claimed to be god gov would have killed him much sooner. The Jews would not have had to beg to have him executed. Where did this come from? The church not the bible? Remember the bible says that god said not to worship any before him. Isn't this against the bible? I don't know for sure if this is a conspiracy, but some group propagated this for some intent.
originally posted by: chiram
originally posted by: Jim Scott
Beware of the Bible translations since the King James Version. These false texts have taken out scriptural truths. There is a lot of information about this on the internet, so no need repeating it all here. Here's a good starting place: www.bibleprobe.com...
People who dismiss the KJV Bible version have no clue as to how perfect it was done, or the extremely highly qualified and numerous scholars used. For example, one was fluent in 15 languages, as well as a specialist in the original languages of the Bible. The only translation you can trust in English is the KJV. I do not mean the New KJV, or any other version of the KJV.
And the KJV and Bibleprobe.com shall set you free hahaha. It’s real purpose is a propaganda and hate site, anti-muslims, anti-freemasons, anti-bible unless its KJV of course, anti-u-name-it. Gimme a break, this websites been promoted on ATS for many years and seeks to stir up people. Did anyone check their domain, its operating on a proxy, now I wonder why???
originally posted by: Akragon
originally posted by: nenothtu
originally posted by: orangetom1999
Did not Jesus accept worship??
Something to think about.
Not that I am aware of - perhaps you could point out something I've missed.
Actually he did, but that does not make him God... Only Gods son as he said...
Through out the gospels people came to worship him... not as God but as messiah...
originally posted by: nenothtu
originally posted by: Akragon
originally posted by: nenothtu
originally posted by: orangetom1999
Did not Jesus accept worship??
Something to think about.
Not that I am aware of - perhaps you could point out something I've missed.
Actually he did, but that does not make him God... Only Gods son as he said...
Through out the gospels people came to worship him... not as God but as messiah...
But having people come to worship him is not the same thing as accepting that worship. He seems to have been pretty clear on where he thought worship ought to be directed - at least the way I'm reading it. No reason to presume that he accepted or promoted the worship of the masses directed at himself.
I reckon it may be one of those things where interpretation is everything - the same verses where I point out that he said "there is none good except my Father in heaven" and "it is written thou shalt worship only God" will be used by the Jesus-was-God proponents to make the claim that he was saying that he WAS God in those same places.
They are welcome to their interpretation of those events, and I will retain mine - in the end, I guess we'll figure out which is the correct one.
originally posted by: Akragon
it seem the verses most commonly used are ones where Thomas says "my lord and my God"... I am more of the opinion that when Thomas said that (IF he actually did) he was referring to both Jesus and God... Not just Jesus himself
Backed of course by... "IF you've seen me you've seen the Father" which also is not a direct reference to him being God... More like the essence of God... the Personality of God...
OR... "I and my Father are one"... of course this doesn't mean One and the same... He meant one in essence
Those who are of the opinion that Jesus was God overlook one thing... HE did not ever say I AM GOD... this is something that John brought into the mix, yet was never uttered by Jesus
Not something HE would leave out of his teaching if he actually thought that he was God... therefore Saying Jesus called himself God inadvertently makes him a liar by omission
Thomas said this "to him", so both titles were directed to Jesus, as not just his Lord, but as his God.
it seem the verses most commonly used are ones where Thomas says "my lord and my God"... I am more of the opinion that when Thomas said that (IF he actually did) he was referring to both Jesus and God... Not just Jesus himself