Palistine is the Problem Not Israel

yes, I get it.

You don't think any sides in the conflict are "more responsible" but you titled your thread: "PALESTINE IS THE PROBLEM NOT ISRAEL"

Palestine is not the problem.

Israel itself is not a problem.

Zionism however is a problem.

a reply to: buster2010

Israel is not a terrorist state.

Hamas is the duly elected government of Gaza. If you apply the same things to Israel then the Israeli government is cowards and should be put in jail for terrorism.

Hamas is known worldwide as a terrorists organization.

have you been in the military? Do you know how to triangle a target? Because if you did you would understand why these schools are getting hit - it is because these Hamas cowards are standing next to them when they fire their rockets.

Is this what you call a man? I call this a coward.

You say nothing about the Israeli settlers that use Palestinians for target practice. like when they shot a little girl in the head while she was walking to school even though they had an escort by the IDF the IDF stood by and did nothing they let the Settler just walk off.

This is simple. It is called murder and those who did this should be held accountable.

a reply to: Jesuslives4u

What absolute and total rot.

Palestine has no effective official military or police force to capture and expel terror groups with, precisely because the Israelis have fought every effort on their part to actually create such a force. Furthermore, the nation with the most money, international power, and intelligence agency support in a given conflict, is the one which shoulders the responsibility to ensure minimal civilian casualties. In this case, that would be Israel.

Israel's offensives have long created more terrorists than they have killed, and that is the fault of their leaders, who continue to bomb entire streets rather than actually formulating assault strategies that are surgical and effective. Just as going to war in Afghanistan to wipe out AQ was wrong (and did not actually WORK) because hunting terrorists with drones and armies is foolish, the Israeli method of battling terror in the Gaza Strip is wrong because it is equally ineffective, and rather like the war in Afghanistan, makes more problems than it solves.

If the only people getting hit by fire from Israel were genuine targets, actual terrorists, then no one would complain, and new terrorists simply would not be created every time a missile lands on Palestine. As it is however, the wanton and idiotic methodology applied to this issue by the Israeli government ensures that it will be necessary to re-visit this territory again, and again, and again. Nothing will change until they develop their counter-terrorist war planning to the point where 99.9% of casualties, are in fact, enemy combatants.

Now, not Palestine, not its "government", but the individuals responsible for launching the pathetic, ineffective, rocket assaults against Israel, are to blame for their role in this matter also. They are barbarians of course, and so they do not care where they fire their rockets from. But they do not represent the Palestinian people, because all the majority of Palestinians are after, is somewhere to raise a family that is not constantly on the brink of total and utter madness, fire raining from the sky, a place to put a crib or a dinner table that is not likely to be blanketed in the thick, acrid smoke of a white phosphor detonation, that is not likely to be blown up with a hellfire missile, launched from the most sophisticated helicopter known to aviation, which none the less hits the wrong building for some reason.

Innocent Palestinian people, have no method by which to remove the terrorists from their midst, they are literally caught between the thugs on one side of the wall, and the thugs on the other, and in equal danger from both.

However, I look at it this way. If there is a hostage situation in a roadside dining establishment, and the perpetrators are ducked down behind the counter, and order all the patrons to stand up and block the view of the armed response team and the hostage negotiator, the commander of the armed police is not permitted, nor is he likely, to give the order to hose the entire diner down with lead until the threat is neutralised! Why? Because there are innocent people in the way. That is right priority to place upon ALL innocent life. All behaviour which involves any other set of priorities is wrong.

It could not be any simpler. Israel are the more powerful of the players in this, and therefore it is on them to do the right thing by the innocent bystanders.

a reply to: Jesuslives4u

I agree. I couldn't kill a child either. The soldiers in that part of the world are desensitized. I saw a video a bit ago on Reuters that showed a little boy with big brown eyes, looking confused and dazed, walking through the chaos of the Protests in Palestine. This is the reality these people grow up in. The longer it goes on the more ingrained into the cultures it becomes. Which insures it will continue indefinitely.
I'm aware of the same happening with Israeli children being killed by such fire so it's happening on both sides.

The Vietnamese would send their kids to US soldiers, with a bomb strapped on, as a way to bait them. Who was more wrong - the one who put the bomb on the child or the soldier who shot the child so he wouldn't be blown up? War is never right.

Therefore, stop picking sides is what I say and focus energy into a solution. If two people are fighting and each has a bunch of people cheering them on does this perpetuate more fighting? Yes.

originally posted by: jheated5

originally posted by: Jesuslives4u

originally posted by: jheated5
Yeah Palestine is the problem because they're in the way of the Israeli settlers who want to build condos on their gravestones... Those women and children terrorists that have killed 0 Israelis with all those rockets are the problem too!

Hi,

Actually I think both sides are wrong. Like I stated in my original post - Hamas and other terrorist fire their rockets in "safe neighborhoods" and then run - leaving the innocent people within that neighborhood to pay the ultimate price. To me this a coward.

What is the ultimate price they are paying exactly? Street cleaner fees? I doubt Hamas would have ever been elected if the Israeli's never encroached on their land. They don't have a standing army, airforce, or navy... How exactly are they supposed to defend themselves from invaders?

HI

Not by being a terrorist. That is the wrong way to handle this it only throws wood on a growing fire. Now Israel has even more international backing since Palestine voted a terrorist organization into their government.

originally posted by: Jesuslives4u

originally posted by: DarknStormy
a reply to: Jesuslives4u

I think they are more pissed off that Zionist death squads intimidated and murdered their ancestors whilst booting them out of their homes and then bulldozing them. The Zionist occupation wasn't green grass and clean water, it was an act of terrorism which was accepted by the international community and the man who created Hamas went through every moment of it.

Hi

I think both sides are guilty. I understand the Zionist are squeezing the Palestines but you know what the Torah says don't you. (I know you do) Joshua took that land from the Palestines with the permission and support of their God a couple of thousand years ago. BUT lets not get religion involved.

Thanks for your posts.

So what would you say if I told you that my religion has a holy book, and in that book it states that "God" gave my great grandfather permission and support to take your land and property.

Do I have the right to claim your land and property...because my book says so?

originally posted by: Jesuslives4u
a reply to: buster2010

Israel is not a terrorist state.

Hamas is the duly elected government of Gaza. If you apply the same things to Israel then the Israeli government is cowards and should be put in jail for terrorism.

Hamas is known worldwide as a terrorists organization.

You say nothing about the Israeli settlers that use Palestinians for target practice. like when they shot a little girl in the head while she was walking to school even though they had an escort by the IDF the IDF stood by and did nothing they let the Settler just walk off.

This is simple. It is called murder and those who did this should be held accountable.

I don't think Hamas are the "good guys" or anything but worldwide is worldwide.

Israel, the United States, Canada, the European Union, Jordan, Egypt and Japan classify Hamas as a terrorist organization

Hamas is not known worldwide as a terrorist organization.

originally posted by: Jesuslives4u

originally posted by: jheated5

originally posted by: Jesuslives4u

originally posted by: jheated5
Yeah Palestine is the problem because they're in the way of the Israeli settlers who want to build condos on their gravestones... Those women and children terrorists that have killed 0 Israelis with all those rockets are the problem too!

Hi,

Actually I think both sides are wrong. Like I stated in my original post - Hamas and other terrorist fire their rockets in "safe neighborhoods" and then run - leaving the innocent people within that neighborhood to pay the ultimate price. To me this a coward.

What is the ultimate price they are paying exactly? Street cleaner fees? I doubt Hamas would have ever been elected if the Israeli's never encroached on their land. They don't have a standing army, airforce, or navy... How exactly are they supposed to defend themselves from invaders?

HI

Not by being a terrorist. That is the wrong way to handle this it only throws wood on a growing fire. Now Israel has even more international backing since Palestine voted a terrorist organization into their government.

Well what is your solution then? Should the people in the region just sit back and be killed and expelled from their land and homes? The only reason I pick sides on this issue because I see the cause/effect of the situation, nobody fired on anybody without a cause..

originally posted by: demus
yes, I get it.

You don't think any sides in the conflict are "more responsible" but you titled your thread: "PALESTINE IS THE PROBLEM NOT ISRAEL"

Palestine is not the problem.

Israel itself is not a problem.

Zionism however is a problem.

I meant with the current issue of rockets being fired from Palestine. You see Israel has an army who has been trained by the Americans on how to triangle someone's position. So when these terrorist are next to schools and hospitals and they fire their rockets seconds later the Israel computers calculate from where the Hamas rockets were fired from and they return fire automatically - in most cases.

This is why Palestine is at fault. They should stop Hamas and other terrorist from using humans as shields. This to me is a coward.

Palistine is the Problem Not Israel

The leadership of both are the problem. The Israeli government AND Hamas. Both. It's impossible to say that one side is innocent and not a problem. And, neither the Israeli government nor Hamas really want peace. If there were peace then the 'aid' money would stop flowing in to them both, and the leadership of both sides would lose a lot of it's power.

a reply to: Jesuslives4u

Israel is not a terrorist state.

Yes it is. It uses violence to get what it wants just like terrorist.

have you been in the military? Do you know how to triangle a target? Because if you did you would understand why these schools are getting hit - it is because these Hamas cowards are standing next to them when they fire their rockets.

Yes I am a Veteran. But why do you choose to overlook that Israel purposely targets civilians? Many times they have bombed homes with no evidence of any rockets being fired from there.

Is this what you call a man? I call this a coward.

I see a small strip of land that is being invaded by a hostile force. Desperate people do desperate things. Yes Hamas does do bad things but to simply say Palestine is the problem not Israel just shows your ignorance on the matter.

This is simple. It is called murder and those who did this should be held accountable.

Then why aren't you complaining about them instead of just accusing Hamas?

Many of us were not around when the U.N. granted Israel its statehood back in 1948. Do you know how Palestine looked in 1948? Why don't you research it. When Israel and its people moved back they found the land given to them filthy, the waters were infested and the land was barren. The Palestine government found it funny and laughed and made jokes until after a few years of hard work and sweat from the Israelites the waters cleaned up and the land became fruitful once again. Once the Palestines saw this they wanted the land back. Does this sound right to you?

No that doesn't sound right to me, on two points: Firstly the Arab leaders rejected the partition in the initial resolution and were vocal about this in quotes dating from October 1947, so I doubt the idea they changed their minds after a couple of years. Plus even before the partition the United Kingdom had a mandate over the area so I would put some responsibility of conditions over to them. Secondly, the idea that Israel were granted their statehood back sounds wrong to me, before 1948 there was no state of Israel, ever. The Land of Israel was never a state, just an area described in the Bible.

originally posted by: Dianec
a reply to: Jesuslives4u

I agree. I couldn't kill a child either. The soldiers in that part of the world are desensitized. I saw a video a bit ago on Reuters that showed a little boy with big brown eyes, looking confused and dazed, walking through the chaos of the Protests in Palestine. This is the reality these people grow up in. The longer it goes on the more ingrained into the cultures it becomes. Which insures it will continue indefinitely.
I'm aware of the same happening with Israeli children being killed by such fire so it's happening on both sides.

The Vietnamese would send their kids to US soldiers, with a bomb strapped on, as a way to bait them. Who was more wrong - the one who put the bomb on the child or the soldier who shot the child so he wouldn't be blown up? War is never right.

Therefore, stop picking sides is what I say and focus energy into a solution. If two people are fighting and each has a bunch of people cheering them on does this perpetuate more fighting? Yes.

Hi

Thanks for your post.

I would elect you to run the government because you use logic and common sense. This is how I think too.

Must are children die to make a point?

a reply to: Jesuslives4u

Hi. My feelings are, the religion itself is extraordinarily racist. Read the Babylonian Talmud once. Then ask any who are a part of that religion how they feel about Palestine and the people there. Asking hard questions left me with uneasy answers, and the impression that genocide is clearly the goal. Look for words implying others are sub human, or different in the unworthy connotation.

For a people less than 3 generations ago, who were allegedly genocided themselves... their actions I must admit, make me question the validity of that claim. It would be like putting your hand in a fire, getting burnt, then placing your other hand into the same fire, knowing the results beforehand.

They do not belong there. The problem is Israel. Even the people I suspect are members of our intelligence community posting here, are trying to tell you that.

Rome obliterated Israel in 70 ad. They were conquered, and kicked out. That is just the way it is. Does Greece today have claim to all the lands Alexander the Great received from his conquests? No. And that is far more historically probable and accurate, than a book of fiction telling me one race of people is God's chosen. Not many have the audacity to claim that. It is called chutzpah for a reason.

Israel's free pass without questioning is over. They need to assimilate into our world. They need to learn to coexist. If they are unwilling, that is their problem.

Status as of 2012

The vote was a historic benchmark for the sovereign State of Palestine and its citizens, whilst it was a diplomatic setback for Israel and the United States. Status as an observer state in the UN will allow the State of Palestine to join treaties and specialised UN agencies, such as the International Civil Aviation Organisation,[49] the Law of the Seas Treaty and the International Criminal Court. It shall permit Palestine to claim legal rights over its territorial waters and air space as a sovereign state recognised by the UN. It shall also provide the citizens of Palestine with the right to sue for control of the territory that is rightfully theirs in the International Court of Justice and with the legal right to bring war-crimes charges, mainly those relating to Israel's unlawful occupation of the State of Palestine, against Israel in the International Criminal Court.[50]

map

Can you imagine having to be in the West Bank by tomorrow afternoon, after leaving Gaza three days ago? There is no safe passage from one boundary to the next. And they call these plots of land a sovereign state!

There is story on internet of pro-israel doctor that went to palestine to try help the poor. She isn't pro-Israel anymore. Thats the problem with many here that believe palestians are the problem. If you actually took the time to investigate the subject you'd realize that palestians are being tortured and exterminated like the jews were done by nazi's.

EYE-WITNESS TO SABRA-SHATILA MASSACRE
Dr.Ang Swee Chai

"The slaughter of unarmed children, women, the aged and the infirm was shocking. For me, I was doubly outraged that I had to discover the truth about a brave and generous people only through their deaths. Until then, I never knew Palestinian refugees existed. As a fundamentalist Christian, I had been a supporter of Israel, hated Arabs and saw the Palestinian Liberation Organisation as terrorists to be loathed and feared."

www.inminds.com...

The Israeli State keeps taking more and more land that was never theirs to begin with from the Palestinians. The NATION of Palestine has been turned into a massive prison camp. The Israeli State and all its allies are 100% the problem.

a reply to: buster2010

Hi again

You make a valid point but let me ask you a question. If the rocket firing from within Palestine stopped do you believe Israel would also stop firing back?

a reply to: TrueBrit

Hi TrueBrit,

I have not forgotten to answer.

I will get back to you on your post.

My 3 year old grandson just stopped by a visit.

a reply to: Jesuslives4u
How the Jews Treat Christians in Israel - It's Serious!





Israel loves us all!Watch how these holy people start beating this guy for no reason at all except he is "different".