Group Representing Half A Billion Christians Says It Will No Longer Support Fossil Fuels

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: manna2

It isn't outlawed where I live. It's the natural way that human beings have used fire for millenia. Nevertheless, at my last home (where we installed the wood stove 20 years ago) - the cost was $1000.

We have looked into fireplace inserts, as well. For now, we are not required to have one. We are burning wood instead of fossil fuels to heat our home.
Woodsmoke isn't the same as fracking, mining, drilling, processing, gasoline combustion, etc.

these are federal MANDATES that incremently go into effect in 2016 i believe. In nevada fires are allready being outlawed and phased out. You will not be allowed campfires soon.

a reply to: manna2

She is adhering to a top down UN policy that is hypocritical to the core. Agenda 21 is at work here.

Oh for God's sake. Give it a rest, will you?
Please?

Here we were agreeing on something, and you had to go and do that thing you do. (Hating on me, and misrepresenting me.)
And the Kardashians make me sick, I only know them by sight on crap magazines in the check-out aisle at my grocer's. I haven't turned on my TV in days, and I turn my AC to cooler only at night - because being menopausal, I can't sleep in a hot room. You don't know me at all - and worse, you're not trying to.
Climate change is real.
We are not helping, we are accelerating it.

a reply to: manna2

these are federal MANDATES that incremently go into effect in 2016 i believe. In nevada fires are allready being outlawed and phased out. You will not be allowed campfires soon.

Says you. That's two years away. And I'm not an Agenda 21 proponent (nor even a believer that it is a conspiracy). If ANYTHING, the agenda to discontinue traditional fireplaces/camp fires ENHANCES the use of fossil fuels.

a reply to: BO XIAN

I thought you'd read enough to know that the oligarchy plays all sides against the middle toward chaos, anarchy & disorder . . .

so that

they can more easily build on the ashes of the old order.

Yes, I am aware of "divide and conquer" strategy, and yes, it is working.
Unfortunately, there are some members who no matter WHAT I SAY attack me as being some sort of ghoul. So - I guess the oligarchy's strategy is working. Even though I try to find common ground with others, I am demonized. Apparently, I never learn, never change my opinion, and never listen.

Even though those things are totally untrue.
So, BO, what should I do?

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

I had a maple tree when I was 5 years old that was a kind of sacred place for me where I didn't worship the tree but did commune with God and read books in my childish way. I still deeply cherish trees.

But they are not god to me.

I doubt they are to you, either.

They are to some 'greenies.'

The prophecy has come true that folks forsake the worship of Creator God to worship the creation.

I suppose my best suggestion, encouragement to you would be to never give up seeking THE TRUTH . . . and supporting THE TRUTH . . . regardless of how much THE TRUTH turns out to be at odds with presuppositions and biases, or not.

I have traveled that route. It can be frightful at times. But I don't know a better one.

I have some significant confidence that seekers of THE TRUTH . . . will find HIM, in due course . . . just as those who persistently consciously SEEK HIM will find HIM. I know that the former is not per se a Scripture. I just believe it to be His character to show persistent seekers of THE TRUTH,

THE TRUTH.

. . . in His way and His timing.

I also believe that it's much better for you to be passionate about your convictions than to be passive or wimpy.

However, I also won't roll over and play dead about mine, on your threads.

I will continue to respect you as a person created in His image . . . and, as a personality with some flavors that I mostly enjoy. LOL.

originally posted by: rickymouse

originally posted by: manna2
In the epa's eyesyou are polluting. Most likely your stove is going to be illegal when thenew laws come into effecta reply to: rickymouse

Actually new...real evidence...shows that burning wood does not release more carbon than is released by the trees rotting in the woods. Now this would apply to burning dead wood already, not clear cutting down new trees. The oil companies scientists made up the crap about wood burning being non Eco friendly. It had little real evidence to back it yet it was believed by so many. The carbon that causes the problem is carbon that is buried deep in the earth. It brings up the ratio in the atmosphere and seas slowly but surely changing climate.

Do you have some information on that on the new evidence? In Ca we have laws based on the numbers of gas and particles released by wood stoves and the harm they cause?

a reply to: BO XIAN

I just believe it to be His character to show persistent seekers of THE TRUTH,

THE TRUTH.

. . . in His way and His timing.

I also believe that it's much better for you to be passionate about your convictions than to be passive or wimpy.

However, I also won't roll over and play dead about mine, on your threads.

I will continue to respect you as a person created in His image . . . and, as a personality with some flavors that I mostly enjoy. LOL.

Thank you.

I am seeking THE TRUTH. I am not an atheist, either.
I don't expect you to roll over and play dead, but I DO expect you to speak to me without resorting to childish insults regarding my intelligence or knowledge.

a reply to: manna2

You will not be allowed campfires soon.

there are very few places that still allow summer camp fires for a long time now, just to dry. Camping is not what it used to be.

What the church needs to do also is to encourage the use of birth control pills. Birth control pills are not abortion. To me, there should be a universal agreement in not having kids above the replacement level. You need land and houses to live in, and without controlling the population, inevitably, the land will need to be cleared to make place for humans. To me, 1 billion of each race should be enough.

Also, you don't want to preserve the forests just for the sake of preserving the forests. You want to make it as beautiful and lively as possible. What I recommend is that we import the White Lions(and other rare animals, but unfortunately, they'll probably kill each other) and put them into those jungles. What you want to do is make it a place for people to visit(on buses of course).

a reply to: Char-Lee

there are very few places that still allow summer camp fires for a long time now, just to dry. Camping is not what it used to be.

Yes, it has been too dry.
We honor the fire-warnings, and never, ever burn when there is danger of wildfires. We keep a water source handy, and monitor everything we do. We've had quite a lot of rain this year, too. It makes me sick that the Colorado River doesn't even reach the sea anymore.

People in deserts do NOT need "green lawns."
My yard is a mixture of grass (from before I moved in) and clover, violets, moss, vinca, Creeping Charlie, and other ground covers. I keep my mowing to a minimum, and work WITH my property to maximize natural processes. I don't use pesticides or weed-killers. I cooperate with my ecosystem.

a reply to: np6888

To me, there should be a universal agreement in not having kids above the replacement level. You need land and houses to live in, and without controlling the population, inevitably, the land will need to be cleared to make place for humans.

Just this morning I was reading about "depopulation conspiracies"...

NO government (world or local) can survive without people. Capitalist systems can certainly NOT continue without stabilized, growing populations. There are enough food and land resources to shelter and feed every person on this planet.
If we do it wisely, instead of recklessly, we will be all right.

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

Incorrect. It does not take 14.5 seconds to power the world. It takes massive infrastructure, resources, and man-hours to implement a plan of action to utilize a fraction of the energy received from the sun.

I'm sure you like to believe it was worth it, and in some instances it is, but the reality is from a practical stand-point, it's a last resort and only makes economic sense when there's no other way to easily get power to a given location.

Ask anyone who's bothered to try to implement solar on their house. They are operating at a loss, especially when you consider the government subsidies (which come out of taxpayers pockets anyways).

It's something that might make you feel good to think about, but price parity is simply not a reality for solar in comparison to dirties sources of energy.

a reply to: pl3bscheese

It's something that might make you feel good to think about, but price parity is simply not a reality for solar in comparison to dirties sources of energy.

It COULD be, though...don't you think?

We looked into solar panels, but because we DO have trees, it would have to be one that we can turn on and off as needed.
So far, we haven't found anything that isn't too expensive - for us, now - but we do our best to limit our use of fossil fuels.

I think the R&D required to make it work IS being suppressed, which makes me sick. We could do it if people weren't so focused on money and expedition.

I think we have to try to make the environment look like this:

www.youtube.com...

I think what we should consider is domesticating the young tigers and lions(and feed them lots of food so that they can repopulate faster), then release them when they're older, that way they can't kill us.

originally posted by: theMediator

We need to stop finding excuses to sill rely on fossil fuels!

Finding excuses? No. Dealing with reality? Yes. You realize that it takes massive fossil fuels to make solar panels, right? You realize that they must be maintained with parts from fossil fuels, right?

Look at the price of computer chips. There's hundreds of millions sold each year, and yet the prices are still high, because it takes a lot of money for them to be produced, period. Economies of scale is certainly an aspect to be considered, but you'd be fooling yourself if you thought it wasn't already being applied to solar panels. This isn't something exotic that requires a small manufacturing site. There are millions of panels that are produced each year.

You don't think governments have considered economies of scale when assessing the feasibility of various energy technologies for future use in infrastructure?

We need technological breakthroughs, that don't require 6N purity aluminum, and silicone, for starters. We need increased efficiency, and lower manufacturing costs, regardless of economies of scale.

Like I said, that will eventually be a reality, but by the time this happens, we'll be so far into decline of energy resources that the cost reduction will be offset by rising prices of petroleum to implement it. Sure as heck hope I'm proven wrong.

a reply to: np6888

Okay now I wonder if you're being serious.

Are you in South Africa? I'm in North America - dead center of it.
We don't have tigers and lions - but cougars (mountain lions - big cats... well, medium cats, if you want to go by scale) are being seen more often. Not sure what you mean about "can't kill us". Like they would be people-friendly? Is that what you mean?

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

I don't know that my writing will ever guarantee that some will not be OFFENDED.

That doesn't mean that my satire or whatever was written with a desire to PERSONALLY OFFEND or insult any given individual or group.

I can be given to hyperbole and satire as a style to make a point . . . not to be personally assulative.

Some folks PERCEIVE and RECEIVE OR INFER a personal assault when one was not there and/or not intended.

I'm not going to take full responsibility for ALL such inferences and feelings.

I think you're better than average on such scores but you do seem to have some hyper sensitive thin-skinned areas here and there.

I do try and avoid personal pronouns like "you" etc.

And when I castigate groups, I try and do so without insisting that every person in the group is exactly as I'm describing.

.

a reply to: BO XIAN

I think you're better than average on such scores but you do seem to have some hyper sensitive thin-skinned areas here and there.

LOL!!
Call it Reactive Attachment Disorder, then, BO. I was marginalized and bullied as a kid - (NOT by my parents or family - by schoolmates) it was quite traumatic.

I haven't been on here that long - to grow that "thicker skin" I hear spoken about - and yeah, some days I'm more thin-skinned than others. I'm honestly a very nice person, and willing to listen to anyone who isn't insulting me.


Human!!

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

I was a marginalized, bullied social isolate as a child at school through high school, mostly, as well . . . as well as in my extended family.

I suspect I know the feelings.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: np6888

To me, there should be a universal agreement in not having kids above the replacement level. You need land and houses to live in, and without controlling the population, inevitably, the land will need to be cleared to make place for humans.

Just this morning I was reading about "depopulation conspiracies"...

NO government (world or local) can survive without people. Capitalist systems can certainly NOT continue without stabilized, growing populations. There are enough food and land resources to shelter and feed every person on this planet.
If we do it wisely, instead of recklessly, we will be all right.

We differ here. There is a difference between sustained population and over population.

When population need is measured by consumer need, that is a problem IMO.

Just an interesting article: www.vice.com...