US General: Freed Bergdahl May Face Investigation

originally posted by: Advantage
a reply to: Xcathdra


Hey Xcat

He wrote a letter when HE WALKED AWAY and deserted. It is claimed in the letter he said he was "ashamed" to be an American and disillusioned. He walked away... and I question his "capture". I think it was more of a surrender and join personally.

IMO.. he should be executed.

Right. He'd get a proper trial first though, right? How about the presumption of innocence until proven guilty? Mister Bush suspended Habeaus Corpus in Gitmo, do you think the same should happen within the more accepted boundaries of your country, sir?


I have no personal opinion about the man who has recently been returned home...no wait, yes I do. I could not blame him AT ALL for feeling disillusioned with the war in Afghanistan, which was a crock of corruption, torture, lies and waste almost from the get go. Sure, IF he deserted, then perhaps it warrants a fair and unbiased trial, given the constraints of military law, contractual obligations blah blah blah.


Remember: "innocent until proven guilty." Somewhere way back then that was important to Americans.
IF he deserted, then I'd have to say that this is one man who possessed courage behind his convictions, and wanted no part in it. War does incredibly strange things to people. These things are not always barbaric.

a reply to: marg6043

I want to point something out that some people might be missing.

The fact we are seeing members of the military, some who are still active, speaking out publicly against this action speaks volumes since they can be charged with a crime for doing it (For officers its UCMJ - Article 88 - CONTEMPT TOWARD OFFICIALS).

Any commissioned officer who uses contemptuous words against the President, the Vice President, Congress, the Secretary of Defense, the Secretary of a military department, the Secretary of Transportation, or the Governor or legislature of any State, Territory, Commonwealth, or possession in which he is on duty or present shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.

I'm not dismissing the fact that he left his post in war and is a deserter.
Wanting to speak to the Taliban is where it becomes odd though, was he trying to make peace, did he perhaps want to join them, sell out? We don't know.

I saw on tv earlier that others in his squad said he was reading a 'weird' book about education for Afghan girls, like because he had sympathy and empathy he was weird among his fellow soldiers - like that is somehow negative?
It seems the media and military are doing a good job of painting this guy as crazy or a traitor or 'something'

He could have witnessed a really serious incident or atrocity committed by US troops and decided he had to get out and tell the world, maybe he thought the Taliban would hear what had happened and they would let him announce it to the world.
And then they didn't, he was naive, they kidnapped and tortured him or converted him.

That is as plausible as any other theory, knowing what we do about these things, there have been a few cover ups

Or maybe this guy had some issues - got to war and saw some bad things, mistreatment of locals by his fellow soldiers, running over kids in Armored vehicles and laughing etc and decided, right or wrong, that he couldn't do it any more.

He had said to a colleague that if he got to the point where he'd had enough, then he'd just walk off into the mountains.
The guy was clearly having a crisis of conscience and the horrors of war and the lie that was the war on terror were probably eating him up.

To say that he 'joined' the Taliban and that he should be considered a terrorist, imo, is awful.
It's clearly a very strange and divisive issue and one that we may never know the truth about.
We really don't know at the moment so anything is possible, but to just believe the MSM who are painting him as an evil 'turned' terrorist is not good, wait until more info is out.

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: Advantage

Volunteers were killed looking for him. Looking after his senior leaders already knew he had deserted. We all knew he deserted. But remember: our military is a volunteer military. They are there to voluntarily take orders.

I do think he shouldn't have ramifications. But us murdering him under the guise of officialdom is just not going to cut it for me.

I guess I should add: i am a horrible rules follower. Despite being "in charge" of company policy enforcement. Strange juxtaposition there.

Rules. What do they mean if your country isn't what you thought when you enlisted?

What do they mean, if they're changed when convenient? What do they mean, after all, when they only apply to some, dependent upon the paradigm, the political atmosphere, etc….

a reply to: Xcathdra

Yes you are right, I was talking earlier to my husband about this, it seems that some military active duty are forgetting that is rules and regulations when it comes to the military code of conduct or they just don't care and are fed up with what is happening this days in the military.

The stories of Bergdahl being a deserter have been going around for a few years, especially here in Idaho in the papers. What surprises me is that the media never did much with the story. The guys who were with him in Afghanistan said he just walked off. It always seemed like the stories were intentionally squashed.

a reply to: stargatetravels

Still he was not a civilian he was a military man and he have a chain of command to follow even if he was unhappy about the military he has to abide by the rules.

As a wife of a retired Marine that sat in many occasions during court martial cases I can tell you that while some may find the Military a brain washing "thing", it is not, however some soldiers do have mental issues that happen to go unnoticed until something goes wrong, but even in the civilian world happens too.

I am sure that Bergdahl will be evaluated for all kind of signs before he is court martialed to make sure he is fit for trial.

originally posted by: marg6043
a reply to: Xcathdra

Yes you are right, I was talking earlier to my husband about this, it seems that some military active duty are forgetting that is rules and regulations when it comes to the military code of conduct or they just don't care and are fed up with what is happening this days in the military.

I could see it go both ways.

A possible counter argument though would be troops being able to refuse an illegal order. The Commander in Chief broke the law in this situation.

Obama has relieved Generals / Admirals for lack / loss of confidence in their ability to command.

While the legal technicalities can be argued I think this incident opened a floodgate and I think we are now seeing the beginning trickles of water with a very loud noise behind it.

a reply to: Watcher777

I think it is by design / non written agreement among media for situations like this.

The position of the US, until last week, is we don't negotiate with terrorist. Taking into account the hostage may very well be an innocent bystander with the right citizenship, if the media constantly covers it, it brings the situation, without any possible resolution to light.

It keeps the situation in the news and the only winner from all the coverage are the terrorist. They get free media which is used as propaganda to further their cause. They argue that the American media portrays the terrorists as untouchable while demonstrating the US government has no spine. The terrorist argue that the American government ignores the will of the people in these are as, etc etc etc.

If the US government has no means / intentions of negotiating, the media coverage only places the hostage in increased danger. The media coverage is purely the cherry on the parfait of propaganda coups for the terrorists..

a reply to: Libertygal

Why do you care if Robert Bergdahl is Muslim? I thought he only grew out his beard for his son.

Anyway if he is Muslim, why do you and all your Neo con buddies assume that he is working with Taliban and a threat to America?Perhaps it was his decision to change religion to understand it more.

I know plenty of white American Muslims and Mideast Muslims and they all condemn the thinking of the Taliban but not the people.

Blame the ideology, not the Guy with the grenade launcher

a reply to: 200Plus

I'm thankful for your service to the country, but what I was trying to get is maybe he wanted to see life on the other side without an agenda like the CLIA, and got taken hostage as a person is wont to do in a dangerous place.

am I saying he went willingly no. Am I also saying he must have caught a case of Stockholm syndrome? No.

I believe he walked off in frustration, caught in a bad place by the Taliban, and became our bait.

also to add, I had to chuckle when I saw Oliver Iran-Contra North toss in his 2 cents on the news.

Is he a deserter or a P.O.W. hero?

U.S. Army Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl at one point during his captivity converted to Islam, fraternized openly with his captors and declared himself a "mujahid," or warrior for Islam, according to secret documents prepared on the basis of a purported eyewitness account and obtained by Fox News.

The reports indicate that Bergdahl's relations with his Haqqani captors morphed over time, from periods of hostility, where he was treated very much like a hostage, to periods where, as one source told Fox News, "he became much more of an accepted fellow" than is popularly understood. He even reportedly was allowed to carry a gun at times

The documents show that Bergdahl at one point escaped his captors for five days and was kept, upon his re-capture, in a metal cage, like an animal. In addition, the reports detail discussions of prisoner swaps and other attempts at a negotiated resolution to the case that appear to have commenced as early as the fall of 2009.

www.foxnews.com...

Well he sure the hell is not a 'hero'.

A 'POW' gets to carry guns ?

Sounds like they were watching him the entire time for the last 5 years.

Goes on:

Clarridge told Fox News his group enjoyed a subcontract from U.S. Central Command, or CENTCOM, headquartered at MacDill Air Force Base in Florida, from November 2009 through May 31, 2010, and that after the contract was terminated, he invested some $50,000 of his own money to maintain the network of informants that had yielded such detailed accounts of Bergdahl's status.

Sounds like they left the guy for dead there.

AT Clarridges own expense he continued intelligence operations.

Clarridge further told Fox News that by the end of 2010, he had furnished at least 13 of these detailed SITREPs, or situation reports, that his network generated about Bergdahl to Brig. Gen. Robert P. Ashley Jr., who in April 2010 was named director of intelligence, at the J-2 level, at CENTCOM. Clarridge said Eclipse SITREP # 3023, dated Aug. 23, 2012 -- in which a member of the Haqqani network, said to be close to Bergdahl's captors, reported that the American prisoner had declared himself a "mujahid" -- was among the reports provided to Ashley.

Read the rest :

www.mediaite.com...

a reply to: TheToastmanCometh

I read his article and is a fact that the ransom was truth but as how much of it was part of the deal that Obama administration pay along with the 5 terrorist is still to be addressed.

originally posted by: marg6043

however some soldiers do have mental issues that happen to go unnoticed until something goes wrong, but even in the civilian world happens too.

I am sure that Bergdahl will be evaluated for all kind of signs before he is court martialed to make sure he is fit for trial.

Marg,

You hit the nail on the head.

I have some close friends who lost it in Iraq. And were diagnosed with Bi-polar/psychosis, basically they had complete mental break downs, and couldn't even reason the simplest tasks. And these guys were people that you would have never expected, nor even contemplated would lose their minds.

When I heard this guy walked off his post in a hostile territory this is the first thing that came to mind. Who in their right mind would walk off their post, in a hostile area, and leave a babbling note?

Someone who came apart at the seams.

originally posted by: Xcathdra

The position of the US, until last week, is we don't negotiate with terrorist

X,

We looked like spineless idiots. 5 for 1 even.

All I can say is this is a F'ing mess.

All the ex-military people I know are sick to their stomachs with this ordeal.

There are a lot of things that people are over looking. He walked off his post , but returned all of his important tools to the military. He's accused of fraternizing with the enemy, but he made a run for it and escaped at some point during his captivity. He was recaptured, but if he left his post to be with the enemy why would he escape in the first place? If you wanted to live, how far would you go to stay alive. Would you be cordial with the enemy? Would you learn their language? How would you react if you saw an American vehicle run over a little girl, then watch the operator of the vehicle insult the parent of said little girl to their face and make fun of the fact they they don't know you're insulting them?

There's a great article in therolling stone written in 2012 about this cat.
,
Don't fall for the bait and immediatly make up your mind about this guy and his family. If your son were kidnapped, how far would you go to make sure he was returned to you safely? People get worked up about how the senior Bergdahl looks not with standing the fact that he looks like he could fit in with the duck dynasty crew. Search for the truth.

There is no honor in endangering your military cohorts, but there is also no honor in making up your mind before you know the good information........end of rant.....for now

a reply to: doclec

Sounds like Lee Harvey Oswald and his defection to the Soviet Union only to come back a few years later with open arms.

Yo people.

Has anyone thought about this ?

After 13 YEARS of war.

After 6 YEARS of not wanting to call it a WAR.

In ALL THAT TIME there has been only 'one pow'.

And he is being called a 'POW' because it's a GD White House talking point.

Seems someone does need investigated.

And they need to start at the WHITE HOUSE.