FBI: More People Killed with Fists & Hammers than Rifles & Shotguns

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

mr, i'm replying to you in this thread www.abovetopsecret.com...

a reply to: thisguyrighthere

i'm concerned about safety, of course, i'm explaining that a long this thread: www.abovetopsecret.com...

Im not against you but i believe you omitted handguns on purpose.600 people probably died in Chi, DC, and Richmond from handguns alone. I am pro gun, but your thread title is misleading.

My pro gun argumemt would be that most people who die from gunshots are jackasses or thugs who chose that way of life or people who were in the wrong place at the wrong time(minus intentional wrong place wrong time events like mass shootings, I mean wrong place and wrong time like stray bullets).

a reply to: Phoenix

Oh, well don't forget this:



and



and

you get the picture
more here www.washingtonpost.com...
And of course this overall mass shooting, using guns of course. To kill.



«Since 1982, there have been at least 61 mass murders carried out with firearms across the country, with the killings unfolding in 30 states from Massachusetts to Hawaii.»
www.washingtonpost.com...

originally posted by: Gyo01
Im not against you but i believe you omitted handguns on purpose.600 people probably died in Chi, DC, and Richmond from handguns alone. I am pro gun, but your thread title is misleading.

My pro gun argumemt would be that most people who die from gunshots are jackasses or thugs who chose that way of life or people who were in the wrong place at the wrong time(minus intentional wrong place wrong time events like mass shootings, I mean wrong place and wrong time like stray bullets).

No omission and the thread title was original headline in source, the subject is the hysteria surrounding long guns in general and so-called assault rifles and magazines specifically when compared to other causes of violent death.

The FBI statistics bear this out.

If you want a pistol thread then by all means make one. If you want one about the thugs and criminals misusing guns and having law abiding citizens pay the price make one.

This thread is about the unwarranted fear mongering surrounding semi-automatic rifles and shotguns.

a reply to: voyger2

But knife aren't use for MASS KILLING/SHOOTING that's the POINT.

So why aren't you concerned about people dying from a substance that has no real redeeming value?

It is not about the number of people dying (as far as you are concerned) otherwise you would drop the gun thing and concentrate on a real mass killer like alcohol or tobacco.

originally posted by: Phoenix
No omission and the thread title was original headline in source, the subject is the hysteria surrounding long guns in general and so-called assault rifles and magazines specifically when compared to other causes of violent death.

The FBI statistics bear this out.

Did you not see the post by Kandinsky on the first page?

There were 1825 murders by a firearm of a type not stated in 2008. As in, it may have been a rifle, shotgun, pistol, or other. Assuming an equal distribution based on the distribution of pistol/rifle/shotgun/other listed (this is not a really good assumption), it'd be +90 rifles and +105 shotguns.

This would bring those totals to 470 rifle murders and 547 shotgun murders. You're stating a fact based on incomplete information when it's possible that said fact could be wrong, because there's a very large unknown firearm type in the data.

a reply to: butcherguy

Guns are used for mass killing by criminals and cowards. Alcohol, tobacco, peanuts, aren't use for mass killing.

You normal person, can defend herself against guys w/ knifes with help of other if necessary. knifes don't kill at long range and in large quantity's.

a reply to: voyger2

Glad you brought up Luby's Cafeteria even though it involved use of handguns which is not what this thread is really addressing and it'd be nice if you stop trying to derail by obfuscating the subject into a wider discussion which is about mass hysteria surrounding so-called assault weapons - maybe you can condense your charts to ones specifically dealing with assault weapon or semi-auto shotgun use and leave the handgun statistics for another thread.

Back to Luby's many of the victims followed Texas law at the time and left their weapons in their cars and thus had no means of self defense - another grand example of a "gun free" zone and how deadly they are, making them attractive targets for crazies.

After Luby's Texas moved to concealed carry specifically because of this incident - heard of anymore since then where concealed carry is legal?

originally posted by: voyger2
a reply to: butcherguy

Guns are used for mass killing by criminals and cowards. Alcohol, tobacco, peanuts, aren't use for mass killing.

You normal person, can defend herself against guys w/ knifes with help of other if necessary. knifes don't kill at long range and in large quantity's.

People die in far larger numbers from just alcohol than all of the different homicides.....
AND YOU ARE OK with that.

Worse yet, you allow all those people to die, because you support it.

originally posted by: voyger2
a reply to: butcherguy

Guns are used for mass killing by criminals and cowards. Alcohol, tobacco, peanuts, aren't use for mass killing.

You normal person, can defend herself against guys w/ knifes with help of other if necessary. knifes don't kill at long range and in large quantity's.

So, your fake outrage is driven by the method of how people die. Not that they are dying.

I heard that the MDA is hiring. You might want to submit your resume.

a reply to: Greven

And..................................................

"999 other weapons or weapons not stated"

Could be misused as a data point much like you used to increase the numbers of knives or hammers, touche'

Why can't you address the media hyped hysteria that politicians are using to nothing but jack with law abiding citizens whose Constitutional rights are jeopardized as a feel good measure that does nothing to reduce murders.

You want to fix this problem, look no further than your federal, state and local prosecutors office and its statistics on plea bargaining away sentences for gun laws already in existence.

a reply to: butcherguy

Alcohol isn't use for MASS MURDER, if you wanna drink to death, go on do it.

What's really frustrating is lack of perspective.

Mass shootings, as horrible as they are, don't even touch gang associated firearm deaths.

www.cdc.gov...

Of ~11,000 firearm murders in 2011, 8900 were of people with gang affiliation or organized crime affiliation. That is to say, criminals killing criminals. 7000+ of the 8900 is black on black violence. That's almost 20 a day!

If you aren't gang affiliated or part of organized crime, your chances of being killed by a firearm in the US is extremely slim. ~2000 firearm deaths out of a population of 330,000,000... that's .6 per 100,000.... making the US one of the safest countries on the planet.

The mass shootings in a given year, tragic and sad as they are, are a statistical drop in the bucket. If you really care about getting a handle on firearm crime, I suggest you look at fixing the systematically dismantled black family. Every people in the US that has been welfare--ized by liberal policy has been obliterated. Just look at black and native populations. Their societies have been absolutely annihilated by being turned into welfare societies. It makes one wonder if liberals are the true racists.

originally posted by: voyger2
a reply to: butcherguy

Alcohol isn't use for MASS MURDER, if you wanna drink to death, go on do it.

Thank you for supporting my contention that you do not actually care about people dying.

Remember that some of those 88,000 Americans that are innocent children killed by drunk drivers.
You are really a cold hearted person that doesn't care about innocent children.

a reply to: butcherguy

People die every where.I will die, just as you. I don't get it.

But there are People that die in the hands of LUNATICS WITH ACCESS TO FREE GUNS.

EDIT: don't TROLL on me.

originally posted by: Phoenix
And..................................................

"999 other weapons or weapons not stated"

Could be misused as a data point much like you used to increase the numbers of knives or hammers, touche'

Why can't you address the media hyped hysteria that politicians are using to nothing but jack with law abiding citizens whose Constitutional rights are jeopardized as a feel good measure that does nothing to reduce murders.

You want to fix this problem, look no further than your federal, state and local prosecutors office and its statistics on plea bargaining away sentences for gun laws already in existence.

Could be misused like I did?

I didn't claim a fact based on incomplete data. I presented a relatively fair assumption, that the distribution of the murders by unknown firearm type are the same as the distribution of murders by known firearm type. It's still a broad assumption and not necessarily accurate. You cannot definitively say for a fact that your thread title is accurate, because there is a large margin of unknown. You can say, based on a fair assumption of the distribution as I presented, that it's likely accurate. This has nothing to do with me misusing data.

Additionally, this is based on murder stats. There are a whole hell of a lot more firearm-related deaths each year. Suicide, accidental shootings, and self-defense are some of these.

originally posted by: voyger2

But there are People that die in the hands of LUNATICS WITH ACCESS TO FREE GUNS.

EDIT: don't TROLL on me.

The only response I can muster is so what?

Really. You've seen the numbers unless you're being intentionally obtuse. They're statistically insignificant. So why focus on it? Go crusade for fences around pools and you'll potentially be saving tens of thousands more people. Mostly innocent children.

Your focus is irrational.

originally posted by: voyger2
a reply to: butcherguy

People die every where.I will die, just as you. I don't get it.

But there are People that die in the hands of LUNATICS WITH ACCESS TO FREE GUNS.

EDIT: don't TROLL on me.

You calling me a troll?

I just want to hear why I should give up my Constitutional right to keep and bear arms because some foreign person that thinks to know better about my life..... purportedly caring about people dying... speaking of mass shootings...
All the while saying that people dying of other causes doesn't matter.

a reply to: voyger2

Theatricality and deception, powerful agents to the uninitiated.

I can type in all caps as much as I want, it doesn't make what I say true.

I don't think you're interested in fixing a thing, you just want to focus on the drama of it all... because it gives you a cause that you've been programmed to support.