Bob Lazar 25 years later...

I'm not going to defend Lazar. (and I don't blame someone for not wanting to go through 12 years of posts, lol...I don't have enough vested in it to do so either...)

As for education, I'd have difficulty locating a college classmate too, and have to really think about when I got my Masters. Simply put, I did my stuff in college, I wasn't very social. I worked two jobs and slept when I could. As for the ability to erase traces of being there, with all the recent info that has come out about the government's ability to monitor and access records lately, is it really that far-fetched to think they couldn't do so? Of course, my personal belief is that Lazar attended classes at these schools, but never graduated, and is exaggerating this.

Which is kind of the big thorn with Lazar. Having known some folks like him (going from interviews), he seems like the kind of guy who is prone to exaggerate. Regardless though, I still think there is a lot of truth in his story, mixed with his own exaggerations (especially as to his contributions to the project). As to how others think? Well, to each their own. Like most things in this subject, you have to choose what evidence you feel has some value.

originally posted by: Springer
My pal George Knapp finally convinced Bob Lazar to get in front of the camera one more time, on the 25th anniversary of his telling the world about the alien presence at Area 51. No matter what you think of Bob's story there's no denying it was a huge story heard around the world 25 years ago this week, and it's still a pretty big story in Ufology to this day.

I've never really been able to decide what I believe about Bob Lazar, I vacillate between thinking he conned the world to accepting there are way too many undeniable elements that support what he says to poo poo it off.

You can see the interviews (2 parts) here:
www.8newsnow.com...
www.8newsnow.com...

I can ask George back on for an "Ask Me Anything" on this if you all think it would be interesting and valuable.

Springer...

Bob Lazar is an enigma and the truth may never be known. However, I do not accept in any shape, way or form that there's any alien presence especially as allegedly claimed by Lazar. And there's no difference between him and alleged abduction victim Travis Walton whose claim to fame grew only because of the propensity of some humans to accept without questioning.

Springer, please answer this: Why does Bob Lazar's UFO as popularized by his collaboration with TESTORS which resulted in the plastic UFO model titled "Area S4 UFO Revealed" resemble almost 100% the Billy Meier's Beamship which has been pronounced a hoax with Meier's Beamship being a model made by him? I publicized this eons ago on many UFO forums and never got reasonable replies. Knapp should ask Lazar to come clean on this also. Perhaps you can convince him.

Find images of both and you can come to only one conclusion and that is that Lazar's claims are suspect and may not be based on reality.

Your ball.

a reply to: Springer

It would be a great idea to have George Knapp back on for this topic. Bob Lazar would also be a pretty good catch if you could get him on.

It's weird that 25 years later many of the scientific issue that originally plagued the whole Lazar Story seem to be getting slowly proven. It's a strange tale that may or may not be true, but the longer time passes the more true it seems to be. Personally the whole thing is up in the air for me still.

originally posted by: wtbengineer
a reply to: JadeStar

What did you make, a Van de Graaff generator? That might be doable, but wouldn't produce anything of value.

Particle accelerators typically do not produce anything of value other than science.

originally posted by: Guyfriday
a reply to: Springer


It's weird that 25 years later many of the scientific issue that originally plagued the whole Lazar Story seem to be getting slowly proven.

Really? How so?

originally posted by: Gazrok

What was verified?

For starters, the very existence of the facility. Lazar put Area 51 in the public eye.

The existence of Area 51 was known to aviators well before Lazar.

All Lazar did was popularize it.

What he never proved the existence of to my knowledge is the place WHERE HE SAID HE WORKED which was S4.

The fact that for 3 weeks, he knew in advance of the days and times of test flights, and these were witnessed by others, including members of the press.

One can imagine that through careful observation anyone could have picked up a schedule of drone testing if they didn't vary it much and then take gullible people, including the press out to see them.

The classified air transport to the base.

Janet flights were known before Lazar, just not widely known. It's like saying "hey, I can tell you where to look in the sky to see XYZ spy satellite, you see I'm an insider." while most satellite hunters know where to look for such things....

The road to the S-4 area was later confirmed via satellite.

There are lots of roads to nowhere in the desert southwest. Why should we believe this is anything other than that? Is there any sign of any facility which he claimed to work for in such satellite imagery?

originally posted by: Gazrok

He worked at S4 though, not area 51.

Part of the same complex in essence, he'd arrive at Area 51 and be bussed to S-4.

As for the road, I've been posting here since 2002. A search for S-4 should eventually turn it up here on ATS. I'm not one to try and convince others to believe Bob, just stating I do...with much reluctance, as mostly my gut telling me, rather than my head.

Show us the photo or it doesn't exist. Since you claim it exists it should be fairly simple for you to find it.

I have a theory about Lazar and it ties into the Roswell incident and that theory is the US intelligence community is using the UFO phenomenon as a cover for their secret projects and also caused the myth that the USA has secret alien technology which would make any adversary think twice about attacking them.

On the other hand I could be wrong and aliens indeed have a presence here and work with our government underground and behind the scenes. That theory I hope is not true because that tells me the aliens would have an agenda that could be malevolent and cause harm to people. Either way Bob's story is fascinating and has stirred many people's imagination.

originally posted by: Vasa Croe
Lazar was always a bit out there in my opinion, and I feel if he truly knew anything then something would have been done to silence him.

I heard someone say once regarding this kind of thing, "They don't care about what you know. They only care about what you can prove."

a reply to: Lichter daraus

I take it you didn't see George's first AMA with us here: www.abovetopsecret.com...

Enjoy.

ETA: I've asked him to do another one specific to the Bob Lazar topic (which will require the membership to limit ?'s to that topic only), we'll see what he says.

Springer...

Lazar had time on his side, and it favored him greatly.

As Gazrok mentioned, it's likely the guy exaggerated a bit.
But overall his story hits pretty close to home.

I am not decided on where the saucer technology comes from though, I think it's likely it could be Earthbound. We will find out more as time progresses because nothing stays secret forever.

Thanks Springer.
It was interesting and good to catch up on old times.

I once saw a few YouTube episodes of Bob Lazar's interview, seems pretty credible to me. Either that, or he is one hell of a liar. The videos can still be found on YouTube, feel free to watch them anytime.

The thing that intrigued me the most, is the way he described element 115, where it could have formed/existed and why it is stable, etc. etc.

I mean, how are you going to just BS everything and expect them to be true? He's either an amateur physicists who's lying his ass off, or he is truly a gifted scientist that is well versed in advanced physics theories. You have to pick one, he is one or the other, can't be both.

If you discredit him and take him as a shill, a liar, an amateur physics office temp, then he shouldn't be able to accurately predict advanced physic theories, such as the existence of element 115 and more specifically, how it was formed and why it can be stable.

Mind you that his initial interview was back in 1989. This was the first interview he did after supposedly having his tires shot out on the road. He gets paranoid, afraid of being snuffed, so he called out to go on record.

Whether those allegations are true or false, one thing is for certain, we didn't actually create element 115 until recent years.

There was also something else he mentioned in that 1989 interview. The way he describes why element 115 exist. He explained something about Zeta Reticuli, how it had a "Binary Star System" and that is why element 115 is possible in that region of space.

Didn't know what to react to this particular part of his statement, until many many years later.

There was an article on ATS, just a few months ago or perhaps a little over half a year maybe? It was a scientific article about a discovery scientists made in recent years, I think the official discovery announcement was back in 2012 but the headline was in 2013.

It was about how scientists discovered that different parts of the Universe, may be operating under different laws of physics. Which means, the laws of physics as we understand in our Galaxy, may not be the same as other parts of the Universe.

Which also implies, that elements on our periodic table can be vastly different from a periodic table pulled from a different part of our Universe.

What this tells me, is that back in 1989, when Bob Lazar mentioned something about element 115 can exist in a binary star system, he knew something back then that scientists wasn't sure of until recent years.

My question is, how does Bob Lazar know that different parts of our Universe had different laws of physics? How could he have known for sure back in 1989? Something that wasn't solidly proven until 2012?

a reply to: Springer

I think it would be fantastic to have George back on. Lazar's story is certainly right up there with the other interesting UFO/Alien stories in my opinion. Not sure what to think of Mr. Lazar's claims, but they are interesting and they do make you wonder. However, he has a really cool website selling real cool "scientific" items.

Thanks for sharing...this is why I originally joined ATS back in 2005 (with my old account). What a breath of fresh air, I suddenly feel reinvigorated!





ETA
It's always good to see you on Springer

a reply to: Springer

I too am on the fence about Bob Lazars claims.I think alot of todays ufo reports are infact gov't black projects.So I think it is at least possible Bob did infact see the infamous "sports model".

I remember John Lear claimed Bob took him to the outskirts of Area 51 to witness a saucer during a test flight.Alot of folks have claimed to see the same strange craft around that area.So again,I think it is possible.


As for George being on AMA,I too would love to ask him a few questions.Thanks Mark!

Areo gel makes me think Bob is a bit more on the side of truth than before. The man is a smart guy. If you do not know what areo gel is, it might surprise you when you look it up and just who was behind it.

No one can remember Obama from college either.a reply to: schuyler

I too am on the fence about Lazar's claims. Initially, I was intrigued by his testimony, then had my doubts after various forum posts, but now I'm edging more towards believing him again. The govenment has the money and resources to erase anyone's personal history, and thanks to computers it isn't that hard nowadays. Also, I read somewhere that he claimed to be a nuclear physicist yet failed a high school physics exam. Well, I studied math at uni fifteen years ago and I can barely remember any of it now, also we mainly did algebra, calculus and statistics, not geometry or similar high school related topics. Nuclear physics is esoteric and high school physics is not, they are completely different and, over time, it's entirely plausible that he just forgot the high school stuff because he didn't use or need it.

I've also heard people say anyone with a basic knowledge of science and physics could have predicted element 115, and yet nobody did....odd that eh? I got a B for physics and chemistry in school, not great but not bad, and I can say without doubt that I, or anybody else in my school, never mentioned the possibility of a new element. This was the highest level available in our educational system (Scotland) and yet, supposedly, only a basic education is needed to predict element 115. Casting further doubt on the debunkers.

As for Lazar's claims, well I have yet to meet a single human being who doesn't use hyperbole to some extent. So what if Lazar uses hyperbole, we all do and it doesn't make us liars for doing so.

As for the comment about UFOs being a cover so the government can secretly build crappy military craft. I mean who gives a crap about military projects? I sure as hell don't, if I did I woulda joined the military. I bet a VAST majority don't give a flying fudge about so-called black projects, thus making any kind of diversion pointless, futile and a huge waste of resources.

originally posted by: TDawg61
I didn't know what to make of Bob's story.But when I heard about element 115 and how close his description of it years before its supposed discovery,I'm certainly NOT ruling out his participation in top secret projects.

yeah tho Bob Lazars Element 115 is completly Stable

according to WIKI pedia LOL

that we dont have the Technolagy to keep it stable !

Stability Main article: Island of stability All the reported above isotopes of element 115, obtained by nuclear collisions of lighter nuclei, are severely neutron-deficient, because the proportion of neutrons to protons needed for maximum stability increases with atomic number. The most stable isotope will probably be 299Uup, with 184 neutrons, a known "magic" closed-shell number conferring exceptional stability, making it (with one further proton outside the "magic number" of 114 protons) both the chemical and the nuclear homolog of 209Bi; but the technology required to add the required neutrons presently does not exist. This is because no known combination of target and projectile can result in the required neutrons. It has been suggested[by whom?] that such a neutron-rich isotope could be formed by quasifission (fusion followed by fission) of a massive nucleus, multi-nucleon transfer reactions in collisions of actinide nuclei, or by the alpha decay of a massive nucleus (although this would depend on the stability of the parent nuclei towards spontaneous fission).

en.wikipedia.org...

but the technology required to add the required neutrons presently does not exist. This is because no known combination of target and projectile can result in the required neutrons. It has been suggested[by whom?] that such a neutron-rich isotope could be formed by quasifission (fusion followed by fission) of a massive nucleus, multi-nucleon transfer reactions in collisions of actinide nuclei, or by the alpha decay of a massive nucleus (although this would depend on the stability of the parent nuclei towards spontaneous fission)

HMM by Whom ? NO Known Combination of Target and Projectile ?

Wonder if this is the Same Element 115 Lazar talking about ?

Is this a Back Engineered Attempt of what BOB LAZAR has mentioned

About those Little Pellets of Element 115 Powering a Alien Space Craft creating Anti Gravity ?

hmm wondering if this Element that has been confirmed just last year if it was stable what use would it have ?

interesting Note that Russia is testing it too for experiments and uses

now here is a Bizarre Question What if Element 115 is stable in a vacuum or say Dimension ?

Now we are Hearing about NASA having Drawing board Ideas with Contractor candidates of creating a Warpdrive and have opened up to the Public to that fact would this type of this Super Heavy Element ( If it can be stable ) be used to Power a Warp drive Ship ?

"Our Star-Trek Future" --NASA Scientists Engineering a Warp-Drive Solution for Faster-Than-Light Space Travel (Today's Most Popular)

www.dailygalaxy.com...

Anti-Gravity Generators, Element 115 your ideas
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Just Looking For Answers like everyone else ,Folks!

a reply to: Springer

It's not easy to hold up after 25 years of being scrutinized under a microscope. If it was made up in his head you wouldn't know who he even is because he would have been Officially debunked and Gone Away from the public mind. Still debating 25 years later in itself tells you there is some truth to his story.

I remember hearing about Bob Lazars claims when I was just a kid on one of those old "Unsolved Mysteries" types of shows. He and John Titor are what brouht ne to ATS all those years ago.

Id love to see an AMA with Bob Lazar but even if it happened id seriously doubt that he would reveal anything new orearh shattering. He sells science equipment now and even handles a few govt contacts. It even says on his companies website that he has no desire to "Rock the Boat".

Either way, a fascinating story.