Oklahoma Botched Execution - Clayton Lockett took 45 Minutes to Die

originally posted by: AngryCymraeg

originally posted by: beezzer

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: NavyDoc
a reply to: FlyersFan

It wasn't botched. The piece of # is dead isn't he?


Here is what he did:

The spree in June 1999 began when Lockett and two others forced their way into Bobby Bornt's residence in Perry, police said. Nieman, 19, of Perry and another 19-year-old from Perry arrived at the home and were accosted by the men and had their hands bound with duct tape. One of the women was raped. Authorities said the women did not know the suspects.

Bornt, his 9-month-old son, and the two women were taken to a location in Kay County where Neiman was shot. Police said the others were put back in trucks, driven back to Perry and released. The child was not harmed.

Neiman's body was found in a shallow grave along a dirt road near Tonkawa. One of the suspects led police to the body.

The woman's two friends have said they believed they were allowed to live because they had children.

In addition to the murder charge, Lockett was found guilty of conspiracy, first-degree burglary, three counts of assault with a dangerous weapon, three counts of forcible oral sodomy, four counts of first-degree rape, four counts of kidnapping and two counts of robbery by force and fear. The charges were after former convictions of two or more felonies, according to the court clerk's office.

It should have been more painful for this animal.

For such a sticker for the US constitution you seem to be forgetting the 8th amendment.

Either you respect it all or dont respect it at all.

Then why can't the 8th be used towards those that commit abortions?

Abortions are not the topic on discussion here. And they are not criminal executions.

The death penalty is often brought up during abortion debates.

I find it ironic that many would be horrified against the death penalty yet find no issue with abortion.

This is why I bring it up.

I find parallels with each aspect.

a reply to: woodwardjnr

If you had seen my earlier post in this thread, you would know I'm from Oklahoma. My mother is from the northern part of the state, where these crimes took place, and I spent a great deal of my childhood growing up there.

I'm not a monster. I'm just a woman who is tired of seeing people wantonly hurt other innocent people, without a care, knowing there will be no consequences. My God, doesn't anyone else get fed up with the hideous crimes committed in this country??!?

a reply to: NavyDoc

God you always try and turn things into a left/right thing

Change the record.

Two dimensinal partasian thinking will get you nowhere.

Plus lefties can be just as brutal with human life.

a reply to: crazyewok

SO perhaps we should examine past atrocities and the punishments given. ok,

SO our last most vivid memory of dire injustice in need of a response was the Nazi persecution and murder of millions of people. Perhaps Hitler should have been allowed to live out his life in prison surrounded by those who revered him as a Demi-God? Perhaps every Nazi scum bag who bombed the hell out of innocent civilians deserved to live out their lives in relative leisure knowing that though they deprived innocent citizens of the UK and elsewhere of life, that they would die of natural causes?

Or how about the string of serial killers we have seen in the last decades? Perhaps they should have been allowed to live in relative comfort...not feeling the pains of hunger for not producing to feed themselves....being moderately entertained....so they can smile to themselves in their jail cells, as they think to the look on their victims faces, as they relive the details of their murders....


You call us hypocrites, yet you only have an ideal we do not share as they reason why....

ok.

originally posted by: beezzer

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: NavyDoc
a reply to: FlyersFan

It wasn't botched. The piece of # is dead isn't he?


Here is what he did:

The spree in June 1999 began when Lockett and two others forced their way into Bobby Bornt's residence in Perry, police said. Nieman, 19, of Perry and another 19-year-old from Perry arrived at the home and were accosted by the men and had their hands bound with duct tape. One of the women was raped. Authorities said the women did not know the suspects.

Bornt, his 9-month-old son, and the two women were taken to a location in Kay County where Neiman was shot. Police said the others were put back in trucks, driven back to Perry and released. The child was not harmed.

Neiman's body was found in a shallow grave along a dirt road near Tonkawa. One of the suspects led police to the body.

The woman's two friends have said they believed they were allowed to live because they had children.

In addition to the murder charge, Lockett was found guilty of conspiracy, first-degree burglary, three counts of assault with a dangerous weapon, three counts of forcible oral sodomy, four counts of first-degree rape, four counts of kidnapping and two counts of robbery by force and fear. The charges were after former convictions of two or more felonies, according to the court clerk's office.

It should have been more painful for this animal.

For such a sticker for the US constitution you seem to be forgetting the 8th amendment.

Either you respect it all or dont respect it at all.

Then why can't the 8th be used towards those that commit abortions?

Im sort of pro life and not a fan of abortions unless its medicaly life threating.

But come on breezer lets not derail the thread

Maybe we should just give them all hugs and tell them we forgive and release them. Hugs cure everything right?

I don't get it.
Why can't they use the same shot the vet gives when it's time to put rover down?
If it's humane enough for our dogs . . . . .

I agree with Crazyewok... just give them a dose of morphine 100X lethal dose. Cheap, effective and no suffering if that's what everybody is so worked-up about.

originally posted by: beezzer

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: NavyDoc
a reply to: FlyersFan

It wasn't botched. The piece of # is dead isn't he?


Here is what he did:

The spree in June 1999 began when Lockett and two others forced their way into Bobby Bornt's residence in Perry, police said. Nieman, 19, of Perry and another 19-year-old from Perry arrived at the home and were accosted by the men and had their hands bound with duct tape. One of the women was raped. Authorities said the women did not know the suspects.

Bornt, his 9-month-old son, and the two women were taken to a location in Kay County where Neiman was shot. Police said the others were put back in trucks, driven back to Perry and released. The child was not harmed.

Neiman's body was found in a shallow grave along a dirt road near Tonkawa. One of the suspects led police to the body.

The woman's two friends have said they believed they were allowed to live because they had children.

In addition to the murder charge, Lockett was found guilty of conspiracy, first-degree burglary, three counts of assault with a dangerous weapon, three counts of forcible oral sodomy, four counts of first-degree rape, four counts of kidnapping and two counts of robbery by force and fear. The charges were after former convictions of two or more felonies, according to the court clerk's office.

It should have been more painful for this animal.

For such a sticker for the US constitution you seem to be forgetting the 8th amendment.

Either you respect it all or dont respect it at all.

Then why can't the 8th be used towards those that commit abortions?

Because that is a silly comparison. The 8th amendment was intended to keep atrocities like cutting off a hand for stealing a loaf of bread, not to prevent the punishment from fitting the crime. Executions, pubic humiliation or flogging for minor offenses, manual labor, etc were all used by the FF and were considered Constitutional for a hundred plus years after.

originally posted by: tadaman
a reply to: crazyewok

SO perhaps we should examine past atrocities and the punishments given. ok,

SO our last most vivid memory of dire injustice in need of a response was the Nazi persecution and murder of millions of people. Perhaps Hitler should have been allowed to live out his life in prison surrounded by those who revered him as a Demi-God? Perhaps every Nazi scum bag who bombed the hell out of innocent civilians deserved to live out their lives in relative leisure knowing that though they deprived innocent citizens of the UK and elsewhere of life, that they would die of natural causes?

Or how about the string of serial killers we have seen in the last decades? Perhaps they should have been allowed to live in relative comfort...not feeling the pains of hunger for not producing to feed themselves....being moderately entertained....so they can smile to themselves in their jail cells, as they think to the look on their victims faces, as they relive the details of their murders....


You call us hypocrites, yet you only have an ideal we do not share as they reason why....

ok.

There is a diffrence between execution and long drawn out toture some are propossing here.

Last time I checked long painfull deaths are classed as cruel

Cruel pumishiments are banned under the US constitution.

Not sure that im missing anything?

So anyone here calling for cruel forms of execution but on other threads cheer over your 2nd amendment rights are infact hypocrites,

originally posted by: jtma508
I agree with Crazyewok... just give them a dose of morphine 100X lethal dose. Cheap, effective and no suffering if that's what everybody is so worked-up about.

But that creates the same problem. To many bleeding hearts, getting IV access is cruel and unusual and that was the issue in this case, not the drug used. The benzodiazepines or barbiturates used in the cocktail are anesthetic induction agents and are supposed to create euphoria and then unconsciousness. Vecuronium is a paralytic used in general anesthesia as well. What the drugs do is exactly the same thing (except for the potassium) that anesthetists do thousands of times a day, except we don't breath for them and they die by asphyxiation. The morphine overdose would do exactly the same thing--unconsciousness followed by death by asphyxiation.

originally posted by: beezzer


I find it ironic that many would be horrified against the death penalty yet find no issue with abortion.

The other ironic thing is that the guy who was executed was probably born of a mother who didn't even really want him, and he probably grew up impoverished and unloved. Most people who commits these kinds of crimes grew up that way. If he had been aborted, we wouldn't be talking about him today.

originally posted by: jtma508
I agree with Crazyewok... just give them a dose of morphine 100X lethal dose. Cheap, effective and no suffering if that's what everybody is so worked-up about.

Yup would very peacefull and painless.

Therefore it complies with the 8th amendment as its not cruel or unuseal.

a reply to: crazyewok

you have assumed that the constitution is not subject to interpretation by those it supposedly serves.

It has and will change as the needs of those its sevres change. That is also something supporters of the constitution love about it.

And like NavyDoc said, it was aimed at a specific purpose...not a generalized one that IDEALISTS can hijack to serve the whims of the last century. It is intended to stay valid until our nation falls. Not before then out of outrage for natural law being denied...which is entirely what it is based on...NATURAL LAW.

originally posted by: DustbowlDebutante
a reply to: woodwardjnr

If you had seen my earlier post in this thread, you would know I'm from Oklahoma. My mother is from the northern part of the state, where these crimes took place, and I spent a great deal of my childhood growing up there.

I'm not a monster. I'm just a woman who is tired of seeing people wantonly hurt other innocent people, without a care, knowing there will be no consequences. My God, doesn't anyone else get fed up with the hideous crimes committed in this country??!?

Does the death penalty prevent these hideous crimes committed in your country? It sounds like its not. Maybe there's something else that could be done to prevent such crimes happening in the first place?

Bring back the guillotine...Simple to operate...Quick...Easy...Painless.

I would rather my head chopped off in an instant than to squirm for even 1 min with poisons flowing through my veins.

Firing squad is another cheap and effective method but I would still prefer the guillotine.

a reply to: NavyDoc

But the point is why use a expensive cocktail which is difficult to get hold of when you can use one simple and cheap drug. One drug also means less can go wrong.

originally posted by: tadaman
a reply to: crazyewok

you have assumed that the constitution is not subject to interpretation by those it supposedly serves.

It has and will change as the needs of those its sevres change. That is also something supporters of the constitution love about it.

And like NavyDoc said, it was aimed at a specific purpose...not a generalized one that IDEALIST can hijack to serve the whims of the last century. It is intended to stay valid until our nation falls. Not before then out of outrage for natural law being denied...which is entirely what it is based on...NATURAL LAW.

Ok the 2nd means only those in a official militia can own guns.

How do you like that interpretation?

No?

Then the 8th amendment of cruel and unusual means exactly that.

You open one amendment up to interpretation and you may not like what you get.

Over dose the criminal rapist on morphine.

One shot, I'm sure many could volunteer.

It's not cruel.
It ends the life of an individual that ceded his rights already.

People getting upset because a murder-rapist died, is rather silly, in my honest opinion.

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: tadaman
a reply to: crazyewok

SO perhaps we should examine past atrocities and the punishments given. ok,

SO our last most vivid memory of dire injustice in need of a response was the Nazi persecution and murder of millions of people. Perhaps Hitler should have been allowed to live out his life in prison surrounded by those who revered him as a Demi-God? Perhaps every Nazi scum bag who bombed the hell out of innocent civilians deserved to live out their lives in relative leisure knowing that though they deprived innocent citizens of the UK and elsewhere of life, that they would die of natural causes?

Or how about the string of serial killers we have seen in the last decades? Perhaps they should have been allowed to live in relative comfort...not feeling the pains of hunger for not producing to feed themselves....being moderately entertained....so they can smile to themselves in their jail cells, as they think to the look on their victims faces, as they relive the details of their murders....


You call us hypocrites, yet you only have an ideal we do not share as they reason why....

ok.

There is a diffrence between execution and long drawn out toture some are propossing here.

Last time I checked long painfull deaths are classed as cruel

Cruel pumishiments are banned under the US constitution.

Not sure that im missing anything?

So anyone here calling for cruel forms of execution but on other threads cheer over your 2nd amendment rights are infact hypocrites,

Actually, in all fairness, having no sympathy for the discomfort for how this piece of human debris met his end is not an endorsement of state sanctioned torture. I think that you are extrapolating far too much from the comments and are being rather stupid about it and are unjustly calling people hypocrites.

Bleeding hearts are sobbing over the fact that this evil person suffered a little discomfort at his end and we more normal people are going, "Meh, who gives a #." One can feel no sympathy for his suffering based on the heinous acts he did and still not be a proponent of state sponsored torture and your leap from one to the other is illogical.