How do we get rid of ObamaCare?

reply to post by AllInMyHead


I agree 100%.

The difference is I chose NOT to pay my children's education, because it was giving them something for nothing.

Would I prefer that the government pay for it in full? Yes, but the tax implications for our country are too high. IMO we need to legislate the COST of education, because it is downright insane these days.

~Tenth

reply to post by tothetenthpower


Your Comment " I Believe in a Regulated Free Market " is an Oxymoron . Jumbo Shrimp is also one Straw Woman , eh?

reply to post by tothetenthpower


I am saying that Obamacare is the bailout to insurance companies in a special package. It is a backdoor bailout unlike what the automotive and bankers were given.

The policies of Bronze, Silver, Gold and Platinum work out to be similar out of pocket expenses between the premium plus the deductible. As a single male with no children, I don't have even a minor need for birth control pills or gynecological visits. But they are covered under those policies. Any policy that I could possibly purchase on my own (sans the exchanges) are not Obamacare compliant if it does not cover the birth control pills that I do not need. So despite having an insurance policy that runs oh lets say $350/month, it doesn't count when I file taxes and I must pay the penalty for "not having insurance".

But here is where the kickback comes in, the policies on the exchanges are set rates based on the County of the State you live in. What I would pay for a Bronze in Knoxville, TN is not what I would pay for a Bronze in Cincinnati, OH. Close but not the same. And because they are different policies with different prices...they have slightly different coverages...especially after the deductible is met. Same goes for the Silver, Gold and Platinum only the post deductible coverage varies wildly from place to place. For example a Gold in TN may pay 100% after the deductible whereas a Gold in NY only pays 80%-90%.

But let's say the premium for the plan you chose is $500/month. Then it is $500/month that the insurance company is paid. If you qualify for a subsidy, you might only pay $40/month...but the other $450 is paid by good old Uncle Sam to insurance company you chose for your plan. Now let's say you have to have dialysis three times a week due to kidney failure. How are you going to afford the $5000 deductible each year if you can only afford to pay $40 out of a $500 a month premium? Do you just skip dialysis until you can scrap up $5000? Most patients can survive if they skip a treatment now and then, but you really only have 5-6 days tops before the potassium build up in your body kills you. Keep in mind that it might not have been genetics that caused your renal failure...could have been booze or even OD on Tylenol. But the death panel ACA Board of Medical Advisors should help out in your treatment plans.

Oh keep in mind that your right protected under the Second Amendment is at play here too. If you don't have Obamacare (or lie to your doctor about owning a firearm if they ask) you have broken a Federal law. Sometimes you get off with just paying a fine when you break a Federal law, but most preclude you from legally purchasing firearms...well at least from a Federally Licensed Firearms Dealer. Some states still allow person to person private sales. No one knows if they do a quick Obamacare check when the FBI approves or disallows your purchase when they do the quick point of sale background check.

reply to post by AnteBellum

Hoping I burst your bubble a bit, but Obamacare has been good to me. My monthly premium has gone down dramatically since signing up. I have not spent ONE night in a hospital since 1962. I broke an arm, a wrist bone, had torn retina surgery, and had pneumonia a few times, once concussion..... but that's not too bad for being 55. Prior to Obamacare I had Blue Cross Blue Shield of Wyoming with a premium based on annual income and age. It has fluctuated with my income, being self employed, and for just myself, before signing up, it had been $1020 PER MONTH! In the years before it had been $530, $750, $675, but the giant increase to over a thousand a month was the last straw. I signed up. I have the silver package (there is a gold and a bronze) and I now pay under $300. I have no problem with Obamacare so far though I have had no claims yet. For me, its been a good thing. I do believe however, that the bill was in the hands of the insurance companies and lobbyists and health/medical companies for too long. I see no good reason why something as important as decent health care for our citizens should be a purely marketplace solution.
when CEOs and other top administrative people, stockholders, and so on, are getting RICH.... not just well to do, but RICH, this means a lot of money is NOT going back into lowering health care costs for regular people. You can lose your house because you broke your back, broke your leg, hip, ankle, had shoulder surgery, a heart procedure...... that is just wrong. Pharmaceutical companies included, this industry charges us huge amounts for what other countries pay far, far less. I call it gouging of the American people in order to make a few wealthy. This isn't something a person has a choice about, we need medical care at times. Affordable medical care.

reply to post by Zanti Misfit


Competition comes from improved service, a gimmick, or from innovation. Increasing price is not typically what you would think of as a way to boost competition. Especially in a monopoly. Breaking up monopolies doesn't really work, as they immediately begin to reform. Ma Bell was broken up twice. Were it not for the advent of cable/VOIP phones, they would be due for another one. Eventually we may see the same happen with the mobile companies. Competition has shrunk considerably in that market.

You can have a "free market" that has limits on how badly it can rape/pillage the customers it serves. I think everyone can agree that it is good to not have dirty water, or e. coli spinach. Or cancerous chicken. I think we can all also agree there is no good purpose for having to pay $100/kwh for elecricity.

What do middle class mean in our generation,my definintion is a home owner who is only a couple o pay checks and a very bad cough away from being out in the streets queing up for government assistance, I doubt many here were adults in the 50ts but from my understanding folks were getting paid the equivelent of $50 phr in today's money if they worked for the largest coropration at the time,ffwd to right now where the largest employer is paying $8.00 phr, corporate taxes were higher in the 50ts than now the income gap was shorter all kind of assitance were available that made for a strong middle class,the G.I bill among others,some universities were free..like CUNY and it didn't exactly sucked, it produced people like Colin Powell,Jonas Salk,Kenneth Arrow to name a few. politicians were men wth balls for instance L.B.J would tell one of his congressmen to vote for a civil rights bill he knew would not go over well in that particular district,he told him you are going to loose your seat but I want that vote!..too bad his undoing was the Vietnam war but that's when politicians had a pair on the left or the right,even Nixion passed the EPA ,today most conservative would be terrified to stand beside a guy who said climate change is real and we need to do something about it.

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


" Breaking up monopolies doesn't really work, as they immediately begin to reform "

If Governmental Legislation were in place (Laws) , Monopolies in a Free Market would be Forbidden . Unfortunately , nowadays Governments are Controlled by " Big Business " and therefore lack the Intestinal Fortitude to Bow to the Peoples Wishes and prevent them from forming . Corruption is rampant around the World in that regard today , and Revolutions were fought once the Greed of those Monopolies became to much to bear by the Economically Oppressed People that they Profited from . It will happen again and again until Just Laws are enforced by the Will of the People through the Courts or in the Streets .

My personal revolution is that I'm not participating.
I have made a deal with health care providers whereby they get cash in hand when they provide service. They have no paperwork to file nor do they have to wait for approval for their payment.
I'm writing my elected representatives voicing my displeasure.
I refuse to vote for a party member in federal elections.
I refuse to be forced to buy a product of which I have no need.
Since I quit working full time and began buying a personal policy, I've paid enough to insurance companies to buy a small home and I've never filed a claim.

How would I reform the system?
The only part of the ACA I see as beneficial is the requirement that insurance companies cover the people who want coverage regardless of past history.
I have no problem with having a healthy pool and an unhealthy pool where those who are using more care pay higher premiums. Seems fair to me rather than requiring me, at 60 years of age to purchase a policy that offers maternity benefits. Now that's just crazy. I haven't needed maternity benefits since I was 27 years old and made sure that I would never again need them.

I buy car insurance to protect myself and others should I be involved in an accident. The government gets a nice excise tax from that purchase. I have no control over whether or not I will be impacted by an accident, be it a dumb driver or a hail storm destroying my car. So I buy insurance.
I buy home owners' insurance to protect my investment on my houses and farm. The government gets a nice excise tax on that as well. Again, I have no control over whether or not lightning hits my house or a workman gets injured while on my property. So I buy insurance.
Whatever income I have is taxed by the governments.
My property is taxed by the governments.
I purchase phone and internet service and pay the government taxes and fees.
I purchase electricity and pay the government taxes.
Having just paid my yearly premiums on my houses and cars, and having just picked up my tax forms, I'm acutely aware of just how much of my income goes for these things and how very little benefit I get in return. So I've said, "Enough." and I will refuse to bow and pay the insurance companies. I do have control of my health and I take responsibility for it. I've chosen not to put it into the hands of the medical/pharmaceutical industry so most of my health care would not be covered by these insurance policies in any case as they are natural so they're considered "alternative."
There, my rant is done. I am fully cognizant that not all of us can control every aspect of our health but I also know that far more can be done to improve health by using natural cures rather than popping pills. But that's another thread altogether.

Zanti Misfit
reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan

 

" Breaking up monopolies doesn't really work, as they immediately begin to reform "

If Governmental Legislation were in place (Laws) , Monopolies in a Free Market would be Forbidden . Unfortunately , nowadays Governments are Controlled by " Big Business " and therefore lack the Intestinal Fortitude to Bow to the Peoples Wishes and prevent them from forming . Corruption is rampant around the World in that regard today , and Revolutions were fought once the Greed of those Monopolies became to much to bear by the Economically Oppressed People that they Profited from . It will happen again and again until Just Laws are enforced by the Will of the People through the Courts or in the Streets .

Pretty tall order now that SCOTUS made that ruling two days ago,nothing short of a constitutional amendment will revsese or tamper coroprate money in politics,but if folks really want to save their democracy then they had better up off their behinds put the politics of the day on hold and demand it,there is no other way,or get used to being Russia direct rule by oligarchs.

AngryCymraeg
reply to post by AnteBellum

 

So, you want to take health insurance away from millions of people? The question is: what would you replace it with?

first off you don't need to scrap it you just need to get rid of the mandatory part.

then actually deal with the real issues in healthcare and insurance. namely GREED[/I] aka profits. that is where the real problems with healthcare and insurance are at. get the prices down to affordable levels and people would line up to buy it, no need to force it on people. and those that choose not to have insurance would be able to afford the services anyway.

step one is to abolish "for profit" insurance companies. put rules in place that any medical insurance must be a non profit organization, in other words they are not allowed to create profit. no investors that need their take would dramatically reduce the price of insurance.

step two. abolish "for profit" medical services. again things like hospitals and medical services being run as non profit organizations. instead of having to make as much profit as possible, just having to cover wages, equipment, and supplies (like actually charging the purchase price of medications and supplies, not "padding" up the costs for profit) used would drive the cost of medical help way down. which would also drive the cost of insurance down even more.

step three. take on the medical supply industry. there is no way they should charge much more for something than the actual manufacturing costs. if they don't want to cooperate then start up new companies and remove patent laws from the industry. this would drive the costs of both medical and insurance costs down yet even further.

step four. (have you guessed it?) take on the pharmaceutical industry, to lower the costs of medications. again don't want to cooperate? then yet again start up new manufacturers and again abolish the silly patent laws on medications. the overcharging for medications is criminal. why can you buy the same name brand medications for so much less in other parts of the world if they are not seriously ripping off both consumers and insurance companies in the US? yet again this would drive the cost of insurance down even further.

all the nACA (non affordable care act), really is is a fancy name for bailing out the insurance industry by forcing everybody to PAY them. it is doing nothing to deal with the gross overcharging that is involved in every facet of the "medical industry", which is the TRUE root of the problem.