Gang dismantled that tried to sell machines for making missiles to Iran.

Madrid, 7 abr (EFE).- La Guardia Civil ha desarticulado una red que pretendía enviar a Irán equipos industriales susceptibles de ser empleados para fabricar misiles en un operación en la que han sido detenidas cuatro personas, tres de ellas de nacionalidad española y la otra iraní, en Barcelona, Tarragona y Palma de Mallorca.

Sorry its in Spanish again Folks. The guardia civil have dismantled a red that tried to sell industrial machine parts to Iran that could be used to make missiles. The operation ended with the arrest of 4 people, 3 Spaniards and 1 Iranian, in Barcelona, Tarragona and Palma mallorca.

Gang dismantled that was going to sell missile parts to Iran

Yet again the Iranian connection.

'La organización también trataba de desviar información tecnológica de planos y proyectos de ingeniería a través de un complejo entramado empresarial.'

Traduction - The group also tried to send technological information of plans and engineering projects through a web of businesses.

A los detenidos, a quienes se les imputa delitos de pertenencia a organización criminal, contrabando y blanqueo de capitales, se les ha incautado dos máquinas de conformado de metales consideradas material de doble uso, es decir productos que pueden destinarse a usos tanto civiles como militares.

Traduction - 'Of those arrested, whom are charged with belonging organized crime, contraband and money laundering, they have taken 2 machines for metal forming which are considered to be of double usage, thats to say of both civilian and military use.'

Strange but true - The machines where bought from a defense sector company in GREAT BRITAIN and smuggled into Spain and can be used to machine parts for missiles.

So, someone in England wants to make a quick buck, or we were going to sell them another smoking gun...if it's the latter, than some intelligence agency somewhere is spitting feathers..

Wall street journal

So, the important part of this is not that they machines were going to Iran, it's that they came from the UK...

Remember the US selling chemical weapons to Saddam and blaming him for having them later !!!

reply to post by andy1972


Nothing new in the world of arms dealing .There was a article a while back about a shipment of arms to Iran coming from Israel that got seized .Like the Liberty the west under the Zionist control quickly had the news quickly removed from the 24 hr. news cycle .A few months later Israel is in a photo op with weapons ceased that were going to Hezbollah from Iran .Or so the spinn was ...peace

guess where the iranian army got thier uzis from
en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by andy1972


I think the UK connection needs looking at in context. If an arms company, or a manufacturer of industrial plant machinery sells something which ends up in the wrong hands, or being used for the wrong purpose, that does not in and of itself represent government involvement.

If however, an intelligence operative was inserted in order to grease the wheels of a certain transaction, allowing it to get a certain way, say long enough to snare a mark, a target, THAT would be probative. In short, the UK has not sold something to Iran. A private company has, and they are separate entities unless they are linked to a degree by personnel or by having their operation commandeered by an intelligence initiative, which is not impossible, but is thus far unproven.

Machines "that could" be used to make missile parts. Like that stove at home "could" be used to make Meth, or that car with it's highly accurate SatNav system could be used as a pinpoint nuke delivery system.

These stories are always full of BS. They never have any proof of anything at all, just that the item may / could be used in a military programme, but also has many other non-military engineering uses.

TrueBrit
reply to post by andy1972

 

I think the UK connection needs looking at in context. If an arms company, or a manufacturer of industrial plant machinery sells something which ends up in the wrong hands, or being used for the wrong purpose, that does not in and of itself represent government involvement.

If however, an intelligence operative was inserted in order to grease the wheels of a certain transaction, allowing it to get a certain way, say long enough to snare a mark, a target, THAT would be probative. In short, the UK has not sold something to Iran. A private company has, and they are separate entities unless they are linked to a degree by personnel or by having their operation commandeered by an intelligence initiative, which is not impossible, but is thus far unproven.

The story says the company which sold the machines are a "defense sector company", so its not like they bought two drills at B&Q and then tried to sell them for making missiles, they are bought from a legitimate defense sector company that deals in arms etc.

Jerusalem post

Reuters

the2ofusr1
reply to post by andy1972

 

Nothing new in the world of arms dealing.

Thats the truth..
Two Israelis arrested for arms sales to Iran

Britguy
These stories are always full of BS. They never have any proof of anything at all, just that the item may / could be used in a military programme, but also has many other non-military engineering uses.

.

We know that, but the fact these stories are picked up by the MSM ans used for jingoism is whats really disturbing.

And the fact that everytime someones arrested for dealing them arms, they're arms dealers from countries that are supposed to be the "enemy"..like Israel or the UK...funny is'nt it..

reply to post by andy1972


Yes, but defence sector companies are not part of the British government. They are independent contractors, beholden more to their shareholders than to any flag or political ideal, other that those which by their existence, or their deed, allow them to accumulate vast wealth.

It is not the same as the Ministry of Defence selling arms or arms manufacturing gear to potential enemies. Until it is proven that a government or intelligence official had a hand in this, there is no link to the UK save for the geographical location of the company involved. It does not take vast genius to see that this has different implications than a sale from our MoD or one which was back channel ratified by our intelligence.

TrueBrit
reply to post by andy1972

 

Yes, but defence sector companies are not part of the British government. They are independent contractors, beholden more to their shareholders than to any flag or political ideal, other that those which by their existence, or their deed, allow them to accumulate vast wealth.

It is not the same as the Ministry of Defence selling arms or arms manufacturing gear to potential enemies. Until it is proven that a government or intelligence official had a hand in this, there is no link to the UK save for the geographical location of the company involved. It does not take vast genius to see that this has different implications than a sale from our MoD or one which was back channel ratified by our intelligence.

Private companies have to follow the same sanctions as the government of the nation they operate in. Sorry but greed isn't a good enough reason to be able to violate sanctions with impunity. So if these death dealers don't want to go along with the sanctions then let them move to some island and form their own nation.

reply to post by buster2010


OK...

Perhaps I am not being clear...

The law pertaining to these sales affects all parties equally, or ought to at any rate. However, a COMPANY doing something like that is awful, and illegal, but NOTHING like as bad as a government agency doing it. What I am saying, is that the media putting out phrases like "UK selling manufacturing machines to Iran" is misleading, and false, when the UK government are not the seller, or even remotely connected with the sale by anything else than being the nation in which the company responsible is based.

Do you understand the point I am making NOW?

TrueBrit
reply to post by buster2010

 

OK...

Perhaps I am not being clear...

The law pertaining to these sales affects all parties equally, or ought to at any rate. However, a COMPANY doing something like that is awful, and illegal, but NOTHING like as bad as a government agency doing it. What I am saying, is that the media putting out phrases like "UK selling manufacturing machines to Iran" is misleading, and false, when the UK government are not the seller, or even remotely connected with the sale by anything else than being the nation in which the company responsible is based.

Do you understand the point I am making NOW?

I don't normally agree with Buster, but on this occasion, he's right.

What we DON'T know is what's behind the story, as always.

We don't know if this company is just rogue and wants to make money at all costs (sanctions or no sanctions) which isn't a rarity these days, or if there is another side to the story and maybe the company had the green light from whitehall to do this as part of a bigger plan...

Anythings possible in the world they move in.

More than likely greed..

reply to post by andy1972


I am not saying categorically that there have been no intelligence industry shenanigans involved here, or that no element of the government can have been involved. However, until it is understood whether there has been or not, it is not good practice to either assume, or imply such a thing.

"Traduction - The group also tried to send technological information of plans and engineering projects through a web of businesses."

but do they not know about the internet where you just press the upload button.

Five years ago we were told that Iran was just months away from developing a bomb and just last night whilst watching a movie were all the blacks were calling each other "Nigger" I noticed when the script writer threw in a bit about Castro from Cuba being a drug warlord.

You see they keep repeating the same thing, time and time again and then hoping it eventual take root in our brains but don't lets mention Afghanistan opium output going up 2700% since we invaded whilst singing the same old tune about the war on drugs.

I am so pleased you reminded about Iran and it's efforts to build a bomb else I might forget just why the USA is placing missiles all around Russia in an effort to stop these missiles from Iran

We come in peace Jim, Shoot to kill, Shoot to kill

Yep....what machines?....are they merely surplus computer controlled milling machines?
Or special rocket tube lathes?(as if they exist) I wonder if the company merely retooled and upscaled or was going down the" tubes" having lost appropriations or what?
This really says nothing much......
Pretty much every corporation has mafia ties these days....money laundering has seen to that quite efficiently.....

reply to post by andy1972


Iran is moving way to fast. All the negotiations in the world are useless. You gotta BOMB them (or nukes).