Satan: Humanity's Hero

Currently, I am working on my Honors Thesis and will be writing on this topic.

Christians refer to the devil as “Satan” and, according to basic Christian doctrine, Satan is the epitome of all that is evil. One notices significant inconsistencies between this tradition and how the character of Satan is developed and depicted in Jewish and early Christian texts. This proves to be problematic because Christian doctrine relies heavily on the canonical biblical texts, and this poses a dilemma. With so many differing literary presentations, what can one accurately conclude about the character of Satan?

Satan of Scripture vs Satan of Tradition

Traditionally, Christians will say that Satan is "evil". When asked why, they generally only state that the mere fact that he "went against God" constitutes his evilness. But was he right in his rebellion?

First, I want to make a quick disctinction between 'God' and 'Lord God'.....

All of them were 'gods'. By them, I refer to any being that was extraterrestrial in nature. If the being was not of Earth origin, ancient civilizations referred to them as 'gods (today we call them aliens). God and Lord God do not share the same characterics, and in some passages, they are in conversation.

"God said....."

"Then Lord God said...."

The title 'Lord' distinguishes the highest ranking god. Satan to was a 'god'; just later deemed A SATAN, which means "adversary" when he rebelled and decided to side with humanity.

In the Garden of Eden, Lord God is upset when God, later cosidered a Serpent (aka: a traitor) decides to enlighten humanity with knowledge by advancing their intelligence. Why upset? Because you don't need your slaves being too smart.

Lord God bombs citites, practices physical torture of humans, enslaves, rapes, demands human sacrifice and MURDERS 2.3 million humans, not including the flood victims.

What did Satan do?

He rebelled.

Satan was not evil at all. Just wrongfully slandered by the winner.

What a diabolican twist to... HEROISM

then again it is just a story =D

reply to post by QueenofSpades


Christianity doesn't say much about satan actually... Just that hes the bad guy...

Though if you actually look in depth one can see who the real bad guy was... It was clearly the OT god

The gnostics called him the demiurge... a false god posing as the God of creation.

This entity proves himself to be dim witted, and cruel, unlike what we see of "Satan" who is always portrayed as sharp as a tack

Perhaps you should look at the symbolism behind this "satan" character...

Satan isn't a real entity, he represents materialism... and all the things that follow said wants

Great post. I've alwas wondered why if Satan wanted to dominate man he would give men knowledge. Contradictory in myeyes.

Biggest trick the real devil did convince all the Christians he is the true loving God when Satan is actually the good guy?
Lol I like it.
Prepare for the onslaught of doom OP.
Good luck.

reply to post by QueenofSpades


Interesting stuff. I think when the religious books are talking about God and the Lord God they are referring to the Annunaki.
The Annunaki Enki can be seen as The Good God and his brother Enlil can be seen as The Bad God ( Satan )
Enki cared about the humans and Enlil did not.

Religion is one big bad sick conspiracy created to dwell the humans race away from the truth and nothing but the truth.

YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH! "Jack Nichelson"

What I've read, is that in the oldest Biblical versions, the satan (notice the lower case) was an office or position, rather than a personality. A bit like the postmaster or the village blacksmith. And, the bearer of that office of the satan, seemed to have a good working relationship with God. They apparently had regular and fairly amiable meetings to discuss affairs of mutual concern. (Read Job to get a feel for it). The animosity and emnity came later...

reply to post by Annunak1


Absolutely!!

I remember in 6th grade...we learned about the Greek gods, the Roman gods, the Egyptian gods...then on Sunday, my grandmother made me go to church and learn about the Hebrew/Christian god.

It was way back that I came the conclusion that either ALL the gods were real, or ALL were fake.

Later, I realized that all the ancient civilizations described the history of the gods, here on Earth; same stories, but with oceans and mountains between them. The Greeks called them Titans, the Hebew called them the Nephilim...

This was not their imagination.

Satan is the tester, he tests our worthiness. I don't think this being is actually evil. If we take the bait we suffer the consequences. We are the ones who take the bait, Satan is just the fisherman. So is the fisherman evil, collecting souls to consume. I don't think so. If we do not desire more wealth than we need or more respect than we really deserve, we shouldn't have a problem.

reply to post by meridie


Yep!

Satan is not a name, but a title/position...the hebrew translation is "adversary"...nothing evil at all about it.

All one has to do is look at the story of Job to see God's evilness. Here is a story where the "good guy" tortures and destroys an innocent man's life all on a BET! Either God is truly evil or just got divinely trolled by Satan by getting God to do his evil work for him. Many apologists will claim that Job gets a new family and life as a reward for his devotion, but what about the other people? You may remember there are a few other people that were affected by this bet. Namely Job's family and servants. Do they not count? They end up as collateral damage in this stupid bet, almost like the poor police officers driving a patrol car during an action movie chase that gets blown up or t-boned due to some crazy driving by the villain while the hero swerves around the danger. Sure Job gets to go on happy that he has a new life, but these people are dead. And they remain dead when the story is over. We all know that God is supposed to be able to do anything, so why couldn't he bring these people back from the dead? But who cares about them right? Job our hero, turns out fine in the end.

reply to post by rickymouse


Just a poster stated, think about the story of Job. I think that this proves that Satan was not so much a "tester" but a "do my dirty work". Lord god forced Satan to murder Job's family out of a bet, all because he wanted to prove that his subjects loved him.

Satan opposed and pretty much said, 'No, they FEAR you."

reply to post by QueenofSpades


I just ignore them both.

Keep calm
And
Hail Eris!

Kallisti

If I had three wishes, I would wish to have a conversation, just one five minute conversation, with Satan. I want to hear his take on the whole heaven vs hell thing. In my opinion, he's been silent for way too long. He ought to be given a chance to defend himself to the people of Earth, right?

QueenofSpades
With so many differing literary presentations, what can one accurately conclude about the character of Satan?

What can one accurately conclude about the character of Captain Kirk? But moving on...

The title 'Lord' distinguishes the highest ranking god.

No, the title Lord is usually a translation of adonai, the vowel pointing used by the Masoretes where the consonantal text had the proper name of Yahweh. It was there to remind readers not to profane the name of God. The difference between God and Lord God is due to different traditions--Elohist and Jahwist--and how they were combined, edited, and translated (or mistranslated). Insofar as they may have been different characters, you got their relationship backwards. El (God) was head of the pantheon, Yahweh (the Lord) was not. See Deuteronomy 32, in which El Elyon divides up the nations for his sons' inheritance and gives Israel to Yahweh.

Various other gods in the Bible are called lord (ba'al), because the people did not speak their names, or the Biblical writers and editors did not wish to record them. These ba'als are usually presented in unfavorable, or even humorous, stories (e.g. 1 Kings 18:27).

reply to post by AfterInfinity


Read "Enki Speaks"

QueenofSpades
What did Satan do?

He rebelled.

Satan was not evil at all. Just wrongfully slandered by the winner.

So if he is such a mister nice guy, why doesn't this weak cowardly traitor get his banksters to pay peace keepers to dismantle every weapon of mass destruction before WW3 breaks out between the Russians/NATO or China/Japan ?

This will instantly prove that the Bible is a lie.

Like you said, satan is a traitor. In military terms a traitor is killed by firing squad. With immortals, they are thrown into the ultimate endless fire; the Lake of Fire.

So where is the coward Lucifer ? He is a high ranking seraph isn't he ? Lolololol

And he hasn't got the balls to show his face to all mortals.

QueenofSpades
Christians refer to the devil as “Satan” and, according to basic Christian doctrine, Satan is the epitome of all that is evil. One notices significant inconsistencies between this tradition and how the character of Satan is developed and depicted in Jewish and early Christian texts. This proves to be problematic because Christian doctrine relies heavily on the canonical biblical texts, and this poses a dilemma. With so many differing literary presentations, what can one accurately conclude about the character of Satan?

Satan of Scripture vs Satan of Tradition

Traditionally, Christians will say that Satan is "evil". When asked why, they generally only state that the mere fact that he "went against God" constitutes his evilness. But was he right in his rebellion?

First, I want to make a quick disctinction between 'God' and 'Lord God'.....

All of them were 'gods'. By them, I refer to any being that was extraterrestrial in nature. If the being was not of Earth origin, ancient civilizations referred to them as 'gods (today we call them aliens). God and Lord God do not share the same characterics, and in some passages, they are in conversation.

"God said....."

"Then Lord God said...."

The title 'Lord' distinguishes the highest ranking god. Satan to was a 'god'; just later deemed A SATAN, which means "adversary" when he rebelled and decided to side with humanity.

In the Garden of Eden, Lord God is upset when God, later cosidered a Serpent (aka: a traitor) decides to enlighten humanity with knowledge by advancing their intelligence. Why upset? Because you don't need your slaves being too smart.

Lord God bombs citites, practices physical torture of humans, enslaves, rapes, demands human sacrifice and MURDERS 2.3 million humans, not including the flood victims.

What did Satan do?

He rebelled.

Satan was not evil at all. Just wrongfully slandered by the winner.

edit on 3122014 by QueenofSpades because: (no reason given)

Hold on just a sec...

1. I'm not getting the Satan of tradition vs. the Satan of Scripture drift from your post. Can you elaborate on that?

2. To clarify, the Satan of scripture was not upset about the Flood, or anything else like that when he did that thing in the garden of Eden. The flood came later, according to the Bible (which you seem to be using as a source...kinda.)

3. Your death tolls are way off. The God of the Bible, by your logic, is responsible for ALL human deaths, right? By virtue of creating them? And didn't He say that He knows when a sparrow falls to the ground? So doesn't that make Him responsible for every natural death at the VERY least?

4. By what moral standards are you judging God?

reply to post by QueenofSpades


I see Satan (or 'the satan' or the concept of 'adversity') as a highly needed element in any former and current system of law. To me, Satan is the divine procecutor, or God's attorney if you like. His duty is to claim and speculate and it's up to the defendant to, well, defend himself against those speculations and the claims, evidence and indicia put forth by this Satan/procecutor. Some, me included, would claim that is a weak system soon ready to be replaced by something new.

One thing the whole "Tree of good and evil knowledge" has taught us, is that determining what is good and what is evil is difficult, with good and evil being highly relative concepts. The divine principle says "You shall not kill", but what if someone killed a notorious child molester or a serial killer? Wouldn't that, or even shouldn't that turn the table? Or atleast to some extent?

That said, seeing how technology develops these days, it's just a matter of time until total surveilance is not only possible, but put into perpetual motion. No more lies, no denial, no more escaping the truth. And with singularity at the doorstep, it's even possible to develop systems of true incorruptable inhability for determining concepts like genuine righteousness and thus enable us to execute pure justice hopefully for the mutual benefit of gods and humanity alike. Sounds a bit intimidating though.

reply to post by QueenofSpades


It's an interesting topic indeed.

I'm an agnostic but over the last few years I've been studying various sacred texts in an attempt to establish one, consistent, overlapping story between them as best as possible. That is because I've come to the realisation that a lot of these stories may simply be observations of an ET intelligence interacting with Earth.

There are several main interpretations of the story:

The Lord God created angels (no free will), then the Jinn (angelic like beings WITH free will) and finally the human. This is the Islamic account. Samjaza (Samjaza and Samael are the 'true' names of Satan) was a Jinn and was considered highly respected. When The Lord God created humans, he asked all Jinn to bow down to his 'greatest creation'. Samjaza, feeling sickened by the apparent betrayal (believing the Jinn were his greatest creation) and consumed by his own pride - refuses to bow to the human. The Lord God, angry at Samjazas disobedience banishes him to our realm along with anyone who dared stand up for Samjaza. From this point on, the Devil promises to spend the rest of his existence proving to God that humans are a flawed creation.

In early Christian/Jewish texts a different story is sometimes told. In Christianity, there is no distinction between angels and demons - they are the same entity in terms of Gods creations. Samael was a highly regarded angel. One day Samael challenged God on his human creation, saying "why do bother my lord? They are a lost cause'. The Lord turns around and says 'Dear Samael, I made a grand mistake with the form I gave them. You would be no better in one of their bodies.'

Samael takes on Gods offer and is incarnated on the physical plane we comprehend. Upon setting his eyes on a woman, while in the body of an Earthly man, Samael commits the act of rape. I can't remember how this story specifically ends, but its an interesting story to have in a sacred text. It practically paints The Main God as having an element of regret or self-blame in regards to our 'bad actions'.

Then, of course, you have the classic Biblical account. Like you said, the Devil decided to give us knowledge of Good and Bad (free will/consciousness) despite God not wishing it on us. This is why the Devil was banished to the Earth. Though, this story isn't repeated often in regards to the Devil specifically, and is often mimicked in early culture belief but attributed to a multitude of 'Gods' rather than just Satan.

In the Book of Enoch we have the most clear picture of the Devil. He is spoken as being one of the watchers of Earth (effectively angels/demons). For whatever reason, Samjaza and a group of his clan (all named in the Book of Enoch) decide to 'descend upon' Earth. They do so for our women, and this results in 'forced sexual activity' with Earthly women. These women had offspring which were regarded as Demi-Gods (Nephilim in the classic Bible) and were said to be larger than the normal man (hence the 12 foot giant claims linking to Nephilim). These Demi-gods and original 'gods' put us under extreme oppression, eventually causing The Main God to wish a flood/reset upon humanity to clear away the damage.

The classic Biblical and Islamic versions probably paints Samjaza in the best light. He is painted as a rebel in Christianity but you cannot discount that various texts describe the character as causing a lot of harm to humanity. Of course, the Main God did too. No one said these have to be friendly figures. If we created a race right now, how many humans would abuse that race?

Personally, I think when one combines these stories with that of the early Sumerians/Ancient Egyptians coupled with some of the oldest written texts (Epic of Gilgamesh - 2800 BC - talks about Gods flooding us and Noah's Ark ~3000 years before the bible or the Sumerians King list which claims 200,000 odd years ago 'Kingships descended from heaven to rule us' and were mostly Demi-gods until the flood) it becomes evident to one that we may have been contacted by an advanced intelligence a long time ago that has effectively messed up our spiritual path beyond repair at the moment.

Of course, I'm still skeptical, but its definitely food for thought. It can add up in a strange way if one looks at the history and teachings close enough. That could possibly be the greatest cover up in human history, more so than then the apparent abduction/current visitor cover up many believe to be happening.

If Samjaza was a real character somehow, I can't say I believe he was out to help us completely (especially since the raping of Earths women is a common theme in regards to him) but I must say I admire his pride if he truly did refuse to acknowledge a superior creation by his God.

Peace