Is China strong enough to fight Russia?

I've been thinking, most threads seem to get the idea that the next full scale war will be either China vs. US or US vs. Russia. Traditionally Russia would be a logical opponent, while recently China has looking more like a rival superpower to the US. But the US has never actually fought Russia directly, and the US has only directly fought the Chinese during the Korean war, which was about fifty years ago. The only two that have recently fought each other was Russia and China, during some border skimirshes. It appears that China is becoming less dependent on Russia, they have gone from copying Russian stuff exclusivly, to copying stuff from the US and possibly Europe in the near future. I figure if any of the three major military powers would fight each other it would be Russia and China. Also I've heard a few rumors that China has been eyeing Siberia. So the question is could China effectivly fight Russia if a war happened today.

It looks more and more like any war involving those two, they will be on the same side.

If they did go to war-Russia clearly has the high tech advantage. China clearly has the number-they both have nukes. I think I would have to give nod toi Russia for beter equipment and far better pilots and navy training.

I think Chine has become more powerful than most other countries will realize, why because the mystery surrounding that country, we know what Russia has or do not have, but do we know what China has under its sleeve.

Russia is technologically ahead of China, I definitely agree on that but the thing is Russia's military budget doesn't allow them to buy all the shiny new military gadgets such as new planes, new nuke subs and things like that so I believe Russia and China is on equal terms.

I think since they share a land border any plans Russia would have to fight China would involve nukes tactical and strategic. Russia has more then enough to kill everyone in China Im not sure China can do the same to Russia as its so big. Russia could absorb a fair amount of nukes.

Numbers of troops dont really mean much when you have as many nukes as Russia has.

If tactical weapons are involved then Russia will take China. Some tactical nuclear weapons will take care of the huge numbers of Chinese soldiers. But the war will not happen as both countries need each other. Especially China needs Russia. Oil and tech comes from Russia to China.

Out,
Russian

Nuclear war means no one wins because CHina will not be destroyed because of our huge amounts of immigrants and Tibet. Using enough nukes to destroy the entire mainland would definitely mean a nuclear winter so I guess the other countries will be getting involved to stop Russia's nuke attack.

Yo cyberdude, I am confused about where siberia is, is that above mongolia?

Yeah and I agree with Russian, China need Russia for oil and tech until there are no more oil and China has already caught up. The Russians need China also because the oil and the tech we spend in Russia are HUGE. They'll lose quite a lot of customers and get a increase in unemployment if the war happens.

[edit on 5-11-2004 by COWlan]

I think if US gets to greedy in the middle east, Russia and China may get together to stop US.

Siberia is that huge part of Russia to the east of the Ural mountains, yes it is above Mongolia, but it also borders China. Just above the Manchuria region. I'm thinking that China is becoming less dependant on Russia, and is starting to switch to the US. On a one on one basis, I'm convinced Russia has an advantage, but China easily outnumbers Russia in almost everything except nukes and subs.

I think your right Sibera is above the nice little buffer zone that is Mongolia. Sibera is one cold place in the north.

depends on thw typeof war...if it long andprotracted then russia would lose. there economy is still weak and couldnt support a long war. If its a nuke warthen noone will be the winner. Russia could probably only win if they let the chinese pull a germany1941...draw them in then bash their face in as they push them out. China is very mountainous and no way could russia make a swift strike for a quick win. Either way itd be very interestingto see what would be the aftermath.

No country with nukes has ever been on war, or atleast not directly. I dont know what people think about using nukes but i believe any country that would be in fear to be outrun by enemy military and occupied. if had nukes on had they wouldnt use em? Russia very proud country Mother russia havent ever been occupied, China goes same category this days.
Theres no possibility that such war wouldnt include using nukes and that means grand scale of em unless agreed to forget whole war. Country like russia with amount of nukes makes war against it unlike in anyway, its self destruction.

Have to wait 50 years and hope lot of new tech that specially disable nukes before deployed or shoot down on air will be around, of course thats again one arm race as now Russia, US, China all develop better, faster and all ways try to find ways to counter possible missile shield plans.
Conclusion is such war wouldnt ever exist for 50 years.

Future is only as its been now superpowers share world together and all fight their own little wars against mostly helpless countrys for their own interests, but superpower collision is far a head and its armageddon.

Actually I heard Japan is trying to develope a kind of weapon that can disable all nuclear weapons on earth from the another side of the globe but I am not sure that can be producd any time soon.

Just for the sake of discussion let's say that nukes won't be involved at the strategic scale. Yes this is actually a possibility thanks to the fear of MAD. On the ground China would probably win just because of the numbers, not that Spetsnaz wouldn't do plenty of damage. In the air Russia would easily win, since Russia designs it's own aircraft it's actually prepared to design new aircraft during wartime. Here's a few numbers to go along with the discussion:

1. Defense Budget ($bil): China:46 / Russia: 63.7
   
2. Army Main Battle Tanks: China: 7,010 / Russia: 43,700
   
3. Cruisers: China: 42 / Russia: 7
   
4. Frigates: China: 0 / Russia:14
   
5. Destroyers: China: 21 / Russia: 14
   
6. Submarines: China: 69 / Russia: 53
   
7. Active Troops (In Thousands): China: 2,270 / Russia: 988
   
8. Reserve Troops (In Thousands): China: 500-600 / Russia: 20,000
   

As a side note these facts come from The World Almanac and Book of Facts 2004, also I'm pretty sure that there must have been a typo were it says that Russia has 20,000 thousand reserve troops and over 40,000 MBTs.

Originally posted by COWlan
Actually I heard Japan is trying to develope a kind of weapon that can disable all nuclear weapons on earth from the another side of the globe but I am not sure that can be producd any time soon.

you are talking about quantum p. weapons
they work by using longitudal waves to convert uranium/plotonium to less dangerous elements all around the globe, which in effect will corrupt nuclear warhead and make it useless.

if that's it what you are talking about, then... japan IS DEVELOPING them.

russia has QPs operational, china has them too but i dunno if operational yet.


this weapon developement is very secretive, so there is NO OFFICIAL info on them.

This is probably the first time i say China would lose.Russia has a lot better numbers with better equipment,and in case of war,the backup troops will become frontline troops.

After the development of nuclear weapons, a war between countries with nukes, becames imposable, becouse nucklear weapons are the ultimate peace keepers.

But for sake of it if the nukes didn't exist Russia will win. In modern warfare numbers are nothing, and for the money, for prolonged war?, Russia had been in constant war for the last 50 years (Afganistan, Chechnia...) and has a biger defence buget, plus every man over 20 has almost 2 years of military training, with organize system for mobilization.

Originally posted by cyberdude78

Army Main Battle Tanks: China: 7,010 / Russia: 43,700

wow thats alot of MBTs with that kind of numbers even crap tanks can be effective and Russia makes good tanks. Man thats a armoured force to be feared. I guess that was a ideal force to march over europe in the Cold War days.

48,270 armoured vehicles to be exact

T-55 = 1,200
T-62 = 2,200
T64A/B = 4,300
T72L/M = 9,700
T80 = 4,500
T90MBT = 120
PT76 = 150
BRDM1/2 = 2,200
BMP-1/2/3 = 12,200
BRM-1K = 700
BTR50 = 1,000
BTR60/70/80 =5,200
MTLB = 4,800

Russias Total Military Manpower:
Active: 960,600
Reserves: 20,000,000
To verify that from a reliable source - www.fas.org...

Kenshin,

BMPs, BTRs etc are APCs, not MBTs. The last thing on that list that is a tank is the PT76 amphibian.