The Case for Rendlesham

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posted on May, 1 2005 @ 08:32 AM
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RENDLESHAM : The British “Roswell”

Disclaimer: This is a LONG post....


Early in the morning, around 2-3am, on December 26th or 27th (military documentation and police documentation conflict, due to it being a late night/early morning event), 1980, one of the most important events in UFO history occurred.

Radar at RAF (Royal Air Force) Watton in Norfolk, England, reportedly picked up an “uncorrelated target” that then vanished from radar in the area of Rendlesham Forest in Suffolk. According to reports, the same target was also tracked by radar at the RAF/USAF (US Air Force) Bentwaters base as well, also in the area of the forest. While the MoD disputes such radar contacts in officially released documents, the events that follow are not in dispute.

This event went unknown to the public, until Robert Todd, a member of CAUS (Citizens Against UFO Secrecy) obtained an officially released report of the incident under the FOIA (Freedom of Information Act). This report was dated January 13th, 1981, and was sent to the British Ministry of Defence (MoD) by Lt. Col. Charles Halt, the Deputy Base Commander at RAF/USAF Woodbridge, which is just across the forest from Bentwaters.



On 13 January l981 Colonel Halt officially reported the matter to London at the request of Squadron Leader Donald Moreland, who acted as liaison between the landlord MoD and their USAF tenants. Although Moreland personally saw nothing, he had every confidence in the men who did and sent a note fully endorsing Halt's memo to the MoD. (Jenny Randles)



Colonel Charles Halt (left) and Tech Sgt. Jim Penniston (Woodbridge Security Supervisor)

Halt’s FOIA-released Report:



From the report: (my notes inserted in brackets)



1. Early in the morning of 27 Dec 80 (approximately 0300L), two USAF security police patrolmen [Airman First Class John Burroughs and Staff Sgt. Bud Steffans] saw unusual lights outside the back [East] gate at RAF Woodbridge. Thinking an aircraft might have crashed or been forced down, they called for permission to go outside the gate to investigate. The on duty flight chief responded and allowed three patrolmen [now including Penniston] to proceed on foot. The individuals reported seeing a strange glowing object in the forest. The object was described as being metallic in appearance and triangular in shape, approximately two to three meters across the base and approximately two meters high. It illuminated the entire forest with a white light. the object itself had a pulsating red light on top and a bank(s) of blue lights underneath. The object was hovering or on three legs. As the patrolmen approached the object, it maneuvered through the trees and disappeared. At this time the animals on a nearby farm went into a frenzy. The object was briefly sighted approximately an hour later near the back gate


One of the men, the above pictured Tech Sgt. Penniston, would remark later, “The air was filled with electricity. You could feel it on your skin as we approached the object… On the upper left side of the craft, was an inscription. It measured six inches high, of symbols. They looked familiar, but I couldn't ascertain why.” More of his testimony: (Images inserted by me)



"I got to within 10 feet of the craft and the clearing where it sat. I estimated it to be about three meters tall and about three meters wide at the base. No landing gear was apparent, but it seemed like she was on fixed legs. I moved a little closer. I had already taken all 36 pictures on my roll of film. I walked around the craft, and finally, I walked right up to the craft. I noticed the fabric of the shell was more like a smooth, opaque, black glass. The bluish lights went from black to gray to blue. I was pretty much confused at that point. I kept trying to put this in some kind of frame of reference, trying to find some logical explanation as to what this was and what was going on. It was dead silent. No animals were even making noise anymore."

"On the smooth exterior shell there was writing of some kind, but I couldn't quite distinguish it, so I moved up to it. It was three-inch lettering, rather symbols that stretched for the length of two feet, maybe a little more. I touched the symbols, and I could feel the shapes as if they were inscribed or etched or engraved, like a diamond cut on glass."

Burroughs’ sketch:


More refined version:


Artist rendering:


"At that point, I backed away from the craft, because the light was starting to get brighter. Still, there was no sound. There was no physical contact with any kind of life form, but there did seem to be a life presence. It was mechanical, this ship, and it seemed to be under intelligent control."

"The next thing I knew, I was standing about 20 feet away from the craft with Burroughs, who I thought I had left back near the tree line. The craft moved up off the ground, about three feet, still with absolutely no sound. It started to move slowly, weaving back through the trees at a very slow pace, maybe a half a foot per second. It took about a couple of minutes for it to manuever itself back to a distance of about 100 to 150 feet, then it rose up just over the trees, about 200 feet high. There was a momentary pause -- and then literally with the blink of an eye it was gone. All with no sound. That still boggles my mind."

"We thought it had left, but then both Airman Burroughs and I saw the same array of colored lights maybe a half mile away. So we pursued it, trying to follow its course as best we could on foot. We only got about 300 yards into the woods before we turned around. We still had no radio contact, which I thought was strange. We weren't even getting squelch. We went back to the clearing. There, Airman Burroughs noticed the impression, the indentations in the ground. We found three of them, all triangular in shape, each about three meters apart. Then I decided we should head back."

"I had dropped my film off at the base lab for developing, but I never got them back. I never saw them. I was just told that they didn't turn out. I didn't understand that but was not in a position to push the issue. The cameras we carried in our vehicles were good ones, used to photograph people on the perimeter. We were under a high terrorist threat at the time with the Irish Republican Army (IRA), another terrorist group known as Black September, and some others, so we used them frequently as part of our patrol."

web.ukonline.co.uk... (a real-audio file is available here too)
All as published as a Special Report in Omni magazine, by A.J.S. Rayl

Many civilian witnesses also witnessed lights in the area at the time. These accounts are in numerous books on the incident, but I’ll include one here just as a minor example:



Local UFOlogists, Brenda Butler and Dot Street, later found many witnesses in surrounding villages to the lights that Burroughs had reported over the forest. The Webb family, returning from a Boxing Night party on the road through the forest, observed floating lights and had time to slow their car to a stop, eliminating one theory since proposed for this UFO: a short duration meteor (or Satellite rocket) that astronomers had witnessed in the sky around this time. (Jenny Randles)


A remarkable sighting to be sure, and by military personnel and civilians alike. Local constables were called to investigate also (as it was technically on British soil), but by the time they arrived, there was nothing else to see. (this is confirmed by released MoD documents, see Appendix A) Since they are available from other researchers, I’ll try to include photos of the areas in question, when able, so that we have an idea what the men were seeing as we go through the account.

Following (photos) are from David Rudiak’s site: roswellproof.homestead.com...

Here’s the overview of the area: (this image is to see the areas in question during each step of the incident)



Aerial Map denoting the area: (from Skeptic Ian Ridpath)
[img] www.ianridpath.com...[/img]

Here is a daylight view showing the vantage point of the witnesses: (first taken in 1981 (by Burroughs), the second in 2002 (Rudiak)) from the East gate. (area 2 on the map)




The farm clearing: (Ridpath)



Needless to say, the skeptics cannot account for how light from the lighthouse could be identified as a triangular, metallic craft…but we’ll discuss the lighthouse later.

Halt’s report then continues, as they investigate the area of the sighting the next day.

From the report:



2. The next day, three depressions 1 1/2" deep and 7" in diameter were found where the object had been sighted on the ground. The following night the area was checked for radiation. Beta/Gamma readings of 0.1 milliroentgens were recorded with peak readings in the three depressions and near the center of the triangle formed by the depressions. A nearby tree had moderate (.05 - .07) readings on the side of the tree toward the depressions.

(Marked as Landing site first night (Penniston) on the map)

Now we have physical evidence cited, and scientific readings taken and logged of the encounter site, as stated by the military officers involved. Halt insists that the event be logged in the security log.



Base commander, Colonel Ted Conrad, who had an awards speech to give at the party, ordered his deputy, Lt Colonel Charles Halt to gather a team and sort out the matter once and for all. Halt duly collected a tape machine to take notes in the dark woods , and took a small group of men, including Englund, an officer from the disaster preparedness team and a base photographer, to prepare for a nocturnal investigation. Gas-powered “lightall” searchlights were taken with them, but these constantly malfunctioned near to the “suspected landing site”. (Jenny Randles, www.ufoevidence.org...)


His report continues, as strange events continued to occur in the area.

From the report:



3. Later in the night a red sun-like light was seen through the trees. It moved about and pulsed. At one point it appeared to throw off glowing particles and then broke into five separate white objects and then disappeared. Immediately thereafter, three star-like objects were noticed in the sky, two objects to the north and one to the south, all of which were about 10° off the horizon. The objects moved rapidly in sharp angular movements and displayed red, green and blue lights. The objects to the north appeared to be elliptical through an 8 - 12 power lens. They then turned to full circles. The objects to the north remained in the sky for an hour or more. The object to the south was visible for two or three hours and beamed down a stream of light from time to time. Numerous individuals, including the undersigned [Halt], witnessed the activities in paragraphs 2 and 3.


Portions of these tapes can be heard here: (as obtained by the Sci Fi Channel, so I'll include their notes on this as well)



Exclusive: The Halt Tape

In 1984, a copy of what became known as the "Halt Tape" fell into the hands of researchers. (Released by a US Major who had held the tape since the event-(Randles)) Unfortunately, because of static and the fact that the tape had been dubbed on an old machine, much of its background conversations could not be discerned.

SCI FI has now acquired the original recording, which documents Lt. Colonel Halt (USAF) and his patrol investigating a UFO sighting in Rendlesham Forest in December 1980. This tape not only reveals much more of the background conversations but features names that could not be heard on the poor-quality 1984 dub. Below are five excerpts from the 17-minute-and-52-second recording, and a brief introduction to the material by UFO researcher Georgina Bruni, author of You Can't Tell the People.


(You'll nead Real Player for these)

Introduction

Lt. Col. Halt's Tape

Sgt. Bustunza Assistance Request

Residual Energy Discussion

Lt. Co. Halt on Barnyard Noise

Strange Lights

Transcripts can also be found here:

Part I

Part II

An Excerpt:



LT COLONEL HALT: We just bumped into the first light that we’ve
seen.

We’re about a 150 -200 yards from the site. Everything else is
just deathly calm. There’s no doubt about it, there’s some kind
of strange flashing red light ahead.

SGT NEVILLES: Yeah, It’s yellow.

LT COLONEL HALT: I saw a yellow tinge in it too. Weird. It
appears to be making a little bit this way?

SGT NEVILLES: Yes sir

LT COLONEL HALT: It’s brighter than it has been........It’s
coming this way. It’s definitely coming this way.

MASTER SERGEANT BALL: Pieces are shooting off.

LT COLONEL HALT: Pieces of it are shooting off.

MASTER SERGEANT BALL: at about 11 o clock..... [referring to its
position]

LT COLONEL HALT: There’s no doubt about it; this is weird.

MASTER SGT BALL: Look to the left

SGT NEVILLES: There’s two lights. One light to the right and one
light to the left.

LT COLONEL HALT: Keep your flash light off. There’s something
very very strange. Check the headset out see if it gets any
stronger. Give us....

SGT NEVILLES: OK, I have an indication that this is a vague
reading too (reading for radiation)

LT COLONEL HALT: A vague reading?

SGT NEVILLES: The cable has been removed

LT COLONEL HALT: OK.. pieces are falling off it again

MASTER SERGEANT BALL: It just moved to the right...went off to
the right

LT COLONEL HALT: Yeah ....strange, Auh.

LT ENGLUND: Went off to the right.

LT COLONEL HALT: Strange. Ahhh. One again left. Let’s approach
the edge of the woods at that point. Can we do without lights?
Let’s do it carefully, come on.. OK we’re looking at the thing,
we’re probably about 2-3 hundred yards away. It looks like an
eye winking at you, it’s still moving from side to side and when
we put the starscope on it, it’s sorta a hollow centre right, a
dark centre, it’s....

LT ENGLUND: It’s like a pupil...

LT COLONEL HALT: It’s like the pupil of an eye looking at you,
winking . ....and the flash is so bright to the starscope, that
err.... it almost burns your eye.


More Excerpts:



LT COLONEL HALT: 2.44: We’re at the far side of the farmers, the
second farmers field and made sighting again about 110 degrees.
This looks clear out to the coast. It’s right on the horizon.
Moves about a bit and flashes from time to time. Still steady
and red in colour. Also, after negative readings in the field,
we’re picking up slight readings 4-5 clicks now on the meter.

Break in tape

LT COLONEL HALT: 3.05: We see strange err, strobe like flashes
to the err ... almost sporadic, but there’s definitely something
there, some kind of phenomena. 3.05: At about err..10 degrees
horizon err directly north, we got two strange objects,
err..half moon shape, dancing about with coloured lights on
them
. but err. it has to be about 5-10 miles out, maybe less.
The half moons have now turned into full circles as though there
was an eclipse or something there for a minute or two.

Break in tape

LT COLONEL HALT: 3.15: Now we’ve got an object about ten degrees
directly south...

SGT NEVILLES: There’s one to the left

LT COLONEL HALT: 10 degrees off the horizon, and the ones to the
north are moving, one’s moving away from us.

SGT NEVILLES: It’s moving out fast

LT COLONEL HALT: They’re moving out fast.

MASTER SGT BALL: There’s one on the right heading away too.

LT COLONEL HALT: Yeah, they’re both heading north. Hey, here he
comes from the south; he’s coming in toward us now.

MASTER SERGEANT BALL: #

LT COLONEL HALT: Now were observing what appears to be a beam
coming down to the ground.


[Excited shouting in the background]

MASTER SGT BALL: Look at the colours...#

LT COLONEL HALT: This is unreal

Break in tape

LT COLONEL HALT: 3.30: And the objects are still in the sky,
although the one to the south looks like it’s loosing a little
bit of altitude. We’re turning around and heading back toward
the base. The object to the sou...the object to the south is
still beaming down lights to the ground.


Halt also knows others at the base witnessed the objects, as he confirmed to Rayl, from Omni Magazine:



"We knew that, because we could hear the chatter on the
radio", and he estimates that between 30 and 40 personnel stationed
around the dual base complex witnessed these events.


Though not involved in the second incident, Penniston was then interrogated again (the first interrogation was immediately after the encounter, and it was fairly cordial as this one was).



"After that incident, however, I was directed to report to OSI [Office of Special Investigations] at 0900 in the morning. I met with a couple of agents, whom I had known because they had an office on the base. They debriefed me for about an hour and a half about the incident. It was an oral debriefing where I basically just told them what had happened, and they seemed quite content with the information that I provided them at the time. They seemed to have no problem with the fact that I had seen a craft. And, of course, there was no evidence, hard evidence, or so they thought. I did not tell them at this point that I had approached the craft, touched the craft, but I did tell them about the photos I had taken. But all this was, in their minds, I think, another unconfirmed UFO sighting, though the term `UFO' was not used -- by them or me. I think they felt assured at this point that containment was going to be maintained and that there was not going to be a problem. Damage control was at a minimum, and I think they felt that at that point they had met their objective. (Special Report, Omni)


One of the most startling things to come out, involved hypnosis sessions that Penniston reluctantly agreed to, to see if more facts could be gleaned… He tells of being interrogated by two other agents (not remembered consciously), who seem to already know what he saw…



During the second hypnotic regression, the psychologist takes Penniston back to the debriefing by two Office of Special Investigation (OSI) agents, and he recounts the scene and events just as he recalled them consciously. But then, according to Penniston's memory under hypnosis, those two agents leave the room and two other officials, one American and one with a British accent, come into the room and ask Penniston to again recount the story. They ask him, he says, if he would mind being given a shot of something and then telling his story again while they tape-record it. Penniston agrees, "if that's what it takes." But he also tells his interrogators that he doesn't like shots.
In a dramatic and striking scene on the videotape, Penniston lifts his arm for a shot of sodium penthathol and the agents question him repeatedly about the trajectory of the craft, its speed and approach. Penniston calmly repeats over and over that he did not see any of that, that the craft was already on the ground when he saw it.

The interrogation continues, and Penniston answers the officials' questions about the craft itself and the symbols he found on one side. He recalls the two agents talking to themselves, saying there was "no point in going further," that they knew what had happened and now the question was how to contain the situation. "They know about what I've seen. They knew it already," Penniston says under hypnosis.


The most often cited explanation of skeptics for this event is almost too absurd to even mention. They assert that these officers saw the lighthouse beacon of Orford Ness Lighthouse. There are some serious problems with the lighthouse theory. First and foremost of course, how does one mistake a lighthouse for a triangular craft? Then of course, there are the more tangible problems…such as the fact that a light-blocking shield pretty much directs the majority of light out to the water (go figure?
)

The other problem is of course that any light that does make it’s way behind the lighthouse, then has to go through a mile of other forest and terrain, in order to be seen by the men. Also, it wouldn’t fit the witness descriptions of light colors, actions, etc. Then there is the question of the physical evidence of the landing sites. Finally, we’re left with the fact that such a misidentification never took place before or since, and surely the men would have realized a repeat performance if the lighthouse was the culprit…

The Orford Ness Lighthouse:


Indeed, as Nick Pope (UFOlogist and former Ministry of Defence, 1991-1994) states:


Nick Pope



The sceptics clearly disagree, returning to the theory that all the UFO sightings were misidentifications of the Orford Ness lighthouse or the Shipwash Lightship, or even of stars, and that the indentations in the clearing were caused by burrowing rabbits! When I met Charles Halt he was dismissive of this, and confirmed that he and other witnesses were familiar with the lighthouse, which was indeed visible as an entirely separate object for some time during his actual UFO sighting. Furthermore, as he explained on the Strange But True documentary on the case, “A lighthouse doesn’t move through the forest; the lighthouse doesn’t go up and down, it doesn’t explode, doesn’t change shape, size – doesn’t send down beams of light from the sky”.

www.ufoevidence.org...

Another claim the skeptics were quick to seize on, was when a claimant came forward that he was responsible for perpetrating a prank that led to the incident, named Kevin Conde.


Kevin Conde, Former USAF Security Policeman



One interesting utterance that a puzzled Halt gives on the tape recording is, "The red, white and blue lights of the UFO are still hovering over Woodbridge."

But former USAF Security Policemen, Kevin Conde, has exclusively revealed that these lights were the result of a practical joke he played on the gullible airman.

Conde says, "I drove my patrol car out of sight from the gatehouse, turned on the red and blue emergency lights and pointed white flashlights through the mist into the air."

"The bottom line is that, that was not a UFO it was a 1979 Plymouth Volare!" explains a bemused Conde.

www.bbc.co.uk...

There are of course, even more problems with this explanation. In fact, there are so many discrepancies, that it is hard to see where to even begin…. In this case, an author of arguably the best book on the subject, has done this admirably…Georgina Bruni, author of “You Can’t Tell the People.”



1. Conde can't recall the date of his alleged prank. If this is
so then how can he claim he was responsible for the 1980
incident?

2. Conde says there was fog on the night in question, but there
was no fog
during any of the incidents that week.

3. He says he played his loudspeaker, but the UFOs were silent.

4. The car he used for the prank was a 'battered 1979 Plymouth
Volare.'
Let us not forget that incident took place in 1980,
which means the so called battered police vehicle would have
been less than a year old at that time.

5. Conde claims he played the prank on the taxiway! The incident
did NOT take place on or near the taxiway, but inside the
forest. And let us not forget that the UFO was first seen
falling into the forest, which prompted those at the East Gate,
John Burroughs and his sergeant, Bud Steffans, to think it was a
downed aircraft. The lights, of course, were not going up into
the sky, but were falling down from the sky
.

6. Conde says he was unaware of the Rendlesham mystery until he
looked up his old base on a US military website. If this is the
case then how could he claim that as far as he was aware they
found nothing above background [radiation] levels?


7. USAF personnel usually work in pairs when patrolling the base
in vehicles. I'm assuming he was patrolling the base, and if so
then he most likely would have had a partner that night. Who was
that person and why has Conde failed to mention him
?

8. When asked about the metallic spacecraft and [ground]
depressions Conde pointed out that a large helicopter had landed
the previous night, apparently with three landing skids
. Conde
obviously hasn't seen the USAF photographs of the landing site
showing the three ground indentations being examined by a
British police officer and USAF Captain Mike Verano.

www.virtuallystrange.net...

Some have even suggested that perhaps the re-entry of a Soviet satellite, Cosmos 749 (or more accurately, the upper stage of it’s carrier rocket), was to blame for the sighting. Even skeptics dismiss this however, including one of the most avid Rendlesham skeptics, Ian Ridpath, “Although the Cosmos 749 re-entry sparked a rash of UFO sightings that were reported on radio that night and could well have put the airmen at RAF Woodbridge on "UFO alert", there is no evidence to suggest that it had any other connection with the later events in Rendlesham Forest.”

Again though, such an event fails to explain things observed such as beams of light shooting to the ground from observed craft, landing indents, damage to the treetops, etc. The bottom line is that we’re left with sightings by numerous military officers, of landed unidentified, and unfamiliar craft, exhibiting capabilities beyond those of known craft. Official documentation exists, even documentation of physical evidence, done by the military themselves.

The Ministry of Defence states that they could find no explanation for the phenomena described, and are of “no defence significance.”

They have also officially released documents regarding the incident. (see appendix A).

So, an American officer reports seeing a craft land on British soil. The account is seen as highly credible. Trace evidence is found of the landing. And yet this isn’t deemed as of “defence significance”? Given such logic, I assume that the touchdown of a Soviet chopper in Rendlesham wouldn’t be considered of “defence significance” either… Even the official MoD stance is that they simply don’t know what happened, and all they have to go is Halt’s report. Some officials even blindly accepted the lighthouse explanation, despite the evidence to the contrary. All in all, it remains a highly substantial account.

End.



APPENDIX A
The MoD documents can be found here: (I’ve indicated some interesting pages, the rest are usually the standard MoD line, that unless it is deemed a defence risk, they don’t investigate UFOs.)

www.mod.uk...
(Page 12 is especially entertaining, as it is by none other than Nick Pope, during his tenure at the MoD, hehe…when he was on the other side of the fence, so to speak)

www.mod.uk...
(Page 17 is especially illuminating, as a Squadron Leader D J Coumbe replies that the films (taken by Penniston and another airman, thus confirming this part of the story), were “faulty”)
(Page 18 confirms that the commander of the Bentwaters base likewise saw the unidentified lights of the second sighting.)

www.mod.uk...
(Page 3 (also page 34) is a letter allegedly sent to a UFO researcher that the MoD claims is false (and it likely is, as the witnesses do not report seeing beings)).

www.mod.uk...
(Page 17 appears to be a reply from the RAF, in response to MoD official, Pam J Titchmarsh’s questions. (I say appears because of the blacked out names, but the inference is pretty clear) However, it confirms the involvement of the Suffolk Constables, though they didn’t see anything after they arrived some time after the initial sighting. They record the response as being 4:11am on Dec. 26th. Since it was late night/early morning, it’s hard to know whether or not the event took place on the 26th or 27th, as one of the two (Constables or Halt) are in error, but of course this is likely due to the fact that many view such early morning times as still being the same day.)

www.mod.uk...
(Page 14 is interesting. It’s a letter from Pam J Titchmarsh (MoD) to Wing Commander J Davies of the RAF. “In addition, I would be grateful to know whether the USAF would be willing for me to say that they did investigate the incident”. It also points to the idea of censoring the Halt report.)

PS-I'm still trying to see if I can find the USAF pics taken during their investigation (as cited by numerous researchers). I suspect they are only in print form, so I'll add such pics if/when I find them.






[edit on 1-5-2005 by Gazrok]



JAK

posted on May, 1 2005 @ 08:41 AM
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Excellent, excellent, excellent Gazrok.

Being a Brit this is a fave event of mine in this field. I shall wait untill the dark early hours before reading
, I just wanted to thank you for all the work you have done with these projects of late.


Excellent work indeed. Way above.


Jack



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 08:46 AM
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here's more info


www.suffolk.police.uk...



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 08:55 AM
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Excellent. Since their (Suffolk police) involvement was supported in the MoD official docs, didn't feel the need to go further with it. Since the reports are filed with the military time as part of their nomenclature, it appears more likely that Halt was off by a day on the date. Personally, as one who used to work graveyard, I certainly know I see early am as the same day, so it's an easy error to make with dates.



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 08:56 AM
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Gaz! Excellent presentation!


There should be some kind of accolade that we can vote mods for. If you had a way above button under your avatar, I would give you all my aboves for this month


As always, impeccible research.



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 09:12 AM
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Hey gaz, wasn't there a film of the sighting if so WHERE IS IT.

BY THE WAY EXELLLLLENT POST



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 09:21 AM
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Supposedly, there was video from the second night as well, but all such information was turned in to their superiors. Same as the photographs...they were taken with USAF cameras, so turned in to the Air Force. This is one of the things that makes the MoD confirmation of the photographs so important, it proves that photos were taken and given to the Air Force, regardless of how they "came out". This "didn't develop right" claim has been used repeatedly in cases of military footage of UFOs. So much so, that one must conclude that either they are hiding something, or that USAF photo specialists are routinely more incompetent than the high school kids at a Photomat stand.



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 11:02 AM
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Very nice and well detailed piece Gazrok. I still believe Rendlesham's one of the more important happenings of all reports I'm aware of thus far.

I have almost every interview bt Penniston, Halt and other retired Military personnel from that time on that base, including the not so old refuting comments from the then Base Commander.

Both Halt and Penniston from what I have gathered have not swayed even a little from their original forth-comings in /96. They have added the 'pencil light' was sent down on a storage facility (nucs- that was not even supposed to on that Base). And casts of the three pod marks indented on the hasr soil.

Dallas



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 12:56 PM
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Yep, but only so much info I was throwing out there, hehe... It was getting pretty lengthy as is...
That was during the second sighting, when Halt heard radio chatter about the men at the base seeing the lights...and the beam coming down on a building housing nuclear materials. Other men at the base also confirm this, so I'll probably post some of their testimony as I corraborate it. If you have some reputable links, I'd be glad to see them, as the more the merrier in that regard.

I believe it was Penniston that has the plaster casts.



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 01:08 PM
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Gazrok this is why i think so highly of you!
You are fighting the good fight!
3
thumbs up mate

I will have to get a pack of cigs and spend a good hour or two reading all of this in its entireity
Right now ive only been able to look over the first of it

Hey but never ever think you are saying too much!
Your post is not lengthy!

This subject deserves a billion pages !

We humans have not done it justice yet!

If you ever need any help from me just let me know
i am at your service
lol



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 05:53 PM
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Wow how do you reply to this?

The work in Gazrok's post stands alone!!

Anyone interested in this subject should find this a must read!!

Awesome post Gazrok


*goes back to read it again*



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 05:57 PM
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Its a real shame, Gaz, you cant be voted for the TWATS award, because the work you are doing is way above. Its a great job you are doing, giving the facts and information about key cases in history, so that new comers and newbies in general can get a comprehensive, in depth information load, from good sources, instead of the general silliness involved in mainstream UFO reporting.

The Rendelsham Forest incident is in my book, on the same level of importance and intrigue as Roswell, and Im pleased to see it done justice here.

For two long skeptics have tried to hold onto the whole lighthouse thing which is absurd. I know from my own experience pulling guard duty that when youre guarding an area you live near, or are constantly in, you always are aware of surrounding landmarks. Many night when I pulled guard, we often went outside for a cigarette and would idly gaze at the sky and surrounding countryside. We tended to be mre familiar with local and far off landmarks than most of the locals, since having such points of reference made it easier to file reports of suspicous or unusual activity. And mind you, I was merely a lowly mechanic. No matter what your job specialty is, all personnel must perform guard service on various sites their units hold.

These guys were trained, experience military police officers whose entire job was guarding the base. They were thus, mroe experienced and knowldgeable about their surrounding than I was about mine. I can assure you, the lighthouse was a well known and commonly sighted landmark that would not have really held much interest to those guys, other than as a point of reference. They are, in ufological terms, amongst the most highly qualified of trained observers. The lighthouse theory holds absolutely no water, its not even worthy of cinsideration as a possibility.

Lord Hill-Norton summed up the situation perfectly, that no matter what the cause was, whatever happened out there was of EXTREME defense signifigance to the British govornment and the people. If an unidentified craft had easily and casually invaded British airspace, left radiation traces, and landed near a highly classified base, then the British MOD needs to be VERY concerned.

And if the American Security Police, who are guarding the largest stockpile of Nuclear Weapons in Non Communist Europe, are hallucinating, or running around in the woods chasing lighthouses and imaginary spaceships, isn't THAT of serious defense signifigance to the British people? I sure as hell would be VERY concerned, and at the very least, a full psych-eval for the entire base would be in order!



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 06:03 PM
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On another note, Gazrok, I got a good idea.

Since we get alot of new people who come here with interest in the cases you are describing, and they often make repetitive posts with the same information, I think making both your Roswell series and your Rendelsham Forest incidents into stick posts always at the top of the forum would be a great Idea, so that new people who would simply post another thread asking about Roswell can instead, see your series at the top, getting all pertinent information and helping to avpid repetitive posts. That way, they know whats already been laid out, and instead, can reword the posts or limit posts to new info regarding Roswell.

It would save alot of time and trouble, and similar things have been done in the terrorism forum regarding 9/11 conspiracies.

IKts a suggestion, and one I certainly favor!



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 06:08 PM
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Originally posted by Skadi_the_Evil_Elf
Its a real shame, Gaz, you cant be voted for the TWATS award, because the work you are doing is way above.


VERY TRUE!
Or applauded.


Excellent work though Gazrok! Sums it up well.



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 08:00 PM
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I finally found some time to read this, and it was worth it. I've seen several documentaries on Rendlesham and all were not as good as this post.


This was the first time I've heard of Kevin Conde claiming he was pulling a practical joke. And the lighthouse explanation was a joke as well.

One thing you didn't mention, that might also help explain Col. Halt's mistake on the date, was I recall he said they experienced missing time. I could be wrong, but I thought he said they thought they were only out in the forest for an hour or two, but it was something like 3-4 hours before they went back. I'm sure with all the excitement it would be easy to loose track of time, so it is probably pointless.

Something else I always wondered about this case. If the UFO was shooting off particles, did they ever go and try to find trace evidence of that? I would think you could maybe find some of it with a metal detector.

I also think this was an important case, but not just because of the strong evidence of a UFO, but because of the evidence of a cover up by the US military, the Royal Air Force as well as the MOD. This shows there is an international cover-up with regard to UFO's, and not just in America.

Excellent work, Gazrok.



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 08:48 PM
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Conde's claim he was playing a practical joke was spurious at best, and I put less faith in that than the lighthouse. It holds even less water, given the facts and evidence in this case. The imprints, the radiation, the radar returns, ect, sorry. Conde gives himself too much credit.

I've always known this is an international conspiracy. Its a common falsehood widely believed that UFOs are an American only phenomenon, which nothing could be further from the truth. Every single country in the world, from the supergiants like Russia, China, and the US, to geographically tiny countries like Belguim, to very remote and primitive tribes in the outback of Australia, savanahs of Africa, and the Himylayas of Nepal... UFOs are a very international, pan human mystery that cannot be written off as "dumb paranoid Americans in trailer parks drinking too much cheap beer".



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 09:37 PM
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Write this down.

This is the first case of Gazrok's since I've been a member that I won't try to debunk. This case is truly amazing.

There are a few points of the case that I have questions about, but others that just defy explanation.

I think this is one of the few 'real' ones.

Great work Gazrok.



posted on May, 2 2005 @ 01:34 AM
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if i was a paid debunker gazrok would drive me nuts


i wanted to add one thing to what skadi said about making gazroks comprehensive "study guides" into stickys
i think its a wonderful idea and i support it 100%

this one; all parts of the rosewell case; dont forget the battle of LA
and hmmm i havent seen any others that i can recall
if we forgot one make that one a sticky too!

im voting for this

maybe our admin will let us have our way

please please pretty please


ps- skadi makes a great point about the lighthouse theory
IF expieranced trained military officers are hallucinating and having wild goose chases in the forest after phantoms
than our military is in Serious Trouble!!



posted on May, 2 2005 @ 07:33 AM
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I think making both your Roswell series and your Rendelsham Forest incidents into stick posts always at the top of the forum would be a great Idea


I believe it would be a conflict of interest for a mod to make a content post (as opposed to a board policy post) into a sticky when they are the author of said post. If the Admins wish to do so, no problem, or even another mod of this forum, but it's really a case of ethics.



This was the first time I've heard of Kevin Conde claiming he was pulling a practical joke


That's probably because even most skeptics dismiss it as absurd. However, in the UK, since it was highly publicized by the BBC, I wanted to address it.



One thing you didn't mention, that might also help explain Col. Halt's mistake on the date, was I recall he said they experienced missing time.


The only reference to missing time, that I recall, more involved Penniston (Halt wasn't involved on the first night's events). When Penniston was touching the ship, he had thought Burroughs was back at the tree line, but then noticed Burroughs much closer soon after. Since this could have simply been the fact that his attention was focused elsewhere, I didn't want to erroneously call attention to it as "missing time". Also, remember that the craft was not very large at all, according to the witnesses...furthermore making abduction an unlikely scenario.

As for Halt on the date, when one works nights, and especially when events happen in the early am, dates tend to blend together and an am event could be remembered as a day or so off quite easily. Halt's memo was two weeks after the events, further making it easy to be off a day.



this one; all parts of the rosewell case; dont forget the battle of LA
and hmmm i havent seen any others that i can recall


Kinross, DC Incident of '52....




If the UFO was shooting off particles, did they ever go and try to find trace evidence of that? I would think you could maybe find some of it with a metal detector.


I believe that Halt and the men believe the lights that "shot off" became the additional lights that then went into different directions. Such activity has been reported in numerous UFO cases. The other possibility is that that particular light seen may very well have been the Russian rocket casing, as a simple coincidence, easily mistaken as part of the other phenomena seen!



Write this down.

This is the first case of Gazrok's since I've been a member that I won't try to debunk. This case is truly amazing.


So noted, hehe...
Such cases are the ones that help one stay grounded when surrounded by the stories of reptoid psychic vampires from the Hollow Earth, etc.




Its a real shame, Gaz, you cant be voted for the TWATS award, because the work you are doing is way above.


Ehh...won my share of them before, hehe...
At this point, a post or U2U from someone saying they enjoyed the post means far more than any Applaud or Way Above Award to me. Not like I need the points!
I'm just happy if such posts help organize things in one place, so that both skeptics and believers can see that those of us who think that we're being visited by beings not of this Earth, aren't loony, we're making a logical conclusion, based on evidence.




[edit on 2-5-2005 by Gazrok]



posted on May, 2 2005 @ 08:43 AM
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Great post!

One thing I wondered about though:



In a dramatic and striking scene on the videotape, Penniston lifts his arm for a shot of sodium penthathol and the agents question him repeatedly about the trajectory of the craft, its speed and approach.



What does that mean, what videotape is that, and who saw it? Also, how does he know that it was sodium penthathol?





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