Food ration cut if they did not vote. Iraq.

I find this funny. We have rock the vote in america, now we have no food if you don't vote in Iraq. Democracy is great, no?

www.dahrjamailiraq.com...


Many Iraqis had expressed fears before the election that their monthly food rations would be cut if they did not vote. They said they had to sign voter registration forms in order to pick up their food supplies.

Their experiences on the day of polling have underscored many of their concerns about questionable methods used by the U.S.-backed Iraqi interim government to increase voter turnout.

Just days before the election, 52 year-old Amin Hajar who owns an auto garage in central Baghdad had said: ”I'll vote because I can't afford to have my food ration cut...if that happened, me and my family would starve to death.

And then you have the US and Iraqi runners bragging about the huge voter turnout because the people were happy they could vote ...


A pitty this kind of news is never gona get to the US mainstream media. They people in the US will just keep thinking that big ol wonderfull great king Bush and his people have the Iraqi's on their side now ... but actualy, they are treatend with starvation if they don't side with Bush & Co. How does that make things different between now and Saddam's regime???

A douzen and more dead people a day also show the Iraqi people are still far from happy with the situation.

This is very strange.

I found the same article here.

www.alternet.org...

But this article by the same man states

"He said that when he picked up his monthly food ration recently, he was forced to sign a form saying he had picked up his voter registration. He believes that the government may use this to track whether he votes or not.

This rumor has circulated broadly around Baghdad even though there appears to be no truth in it."

While on the link to his own homepage that you posted, the same article spins the information as if it were true. Instead of calling it a rumor he says

"Calls to the Independent Electoral Commission for Iraq (IECI) and to the Ministry of Trade, which is responsible for the distribution of the monthly food ration, were not returned."

But the strangest thing, unless it's computer error, is that the alternet article is dated 1-25-05, and the article on his homepage is dated 1-31-05 but is clearly written before the elections took place.

Just who is this Dahr Jamail? And which article is the real one?

I love it.
You gys are so willing to believe the worst you take anything as proof regardless of the credibillity of the source.
Yeah they only voted so they wouldn't starve.
Keep beleveing that.
You people are irrelevant.
But what can you expect?

Nice catch. You must read a lot to remember specific quotes?

Nice being irrelevent, thank you!!

Originally posted by mwm1331
I love it.
You gys are so willing to believe the worst you take anything as proof regardless of the credibillity of the source.
Yeah they only voted so they wouldn't starve.
Keep beleveing that.
You people are irrelevant.
But what can you expect?

I cant believe Im going to say this but......MWM1331, I agree with you..
I'm sure we had to get the message out, that it would be safe. And what better way than thru the food lines. This was probably a case of "chinese telephone" and it got carried away.

Why is it that everyone latches on to every negative thing they can, but won't even try comprehending that things might not be all that bad there? Makes me think its covert propaganda from the enemy some times.

I think that if we just keep engaging the "insurgents" enough and keep disrupting them, their gonna run out of bullets and grenades. Simple as that sounds, I think thats our plans. Keep em on the move. They can get some here and there, but we can get alot more.

They probably used the 'food ration list' because it is the only accurate means of identification the Iraqi govt has at the moment.

Playing To The Peanut Gallery

Originally posted by LeftBehind
Just who is this Dahr Jamail? And which article is the real one?

Apparently, Dahr Jamail is just one of many whose mission is to supply those who will believe anything that supports their own preexisting prejudices, no matter how far-fetched or incredible.

If the response on ATS to people like him is any guide, business is good. Very good.

Truth has nothing to do with it. In fact, it just gets in the way of otherwise perfect bigotry.

Nice detective work by the way. Most stuff like this becomes unquestioned gospel among the willing dupes.

It's refreshing to see something like this outed for a change.

Still, there's always willing buyers for propaganda, and you can point stuff like this out again and again and again, and it will still mean nothing to those who don't respect themselves enough to maintain a reasonable degree of skepticism.

I can guarantee that no small number of people who read this thread will still insist Dahr Jamail is telling the absolute, honest-to-God truth. That's just the way these things work, it seems.

Thanks for trying, at least.

Way above, by the way.

This Dahr Jamail may be those who are spreading Anti-America articles to gain support to the insergents and making them look like freedom fighters. Then make the new government up and coming with America as the bad guys. Nice work LeftBehind of searching this through. I myself found this article very odd as the writer used the ration cut for not voting theme. We have not deny food, medical care, or human rights in this country. I can not see our troops doing this to these people. Furthermore, just another concept of one who trying to stir things up as always with bad news. We have too much of negative action against this war, not enough good news to filter through the medias or individuals.

PolarBearExpress.....................

Not so fast. I did a little investigating on my own and I found the same author on another site saying the same thing. I guess you have to be a little biased to write for antiwar.com. Go with God, or without him.

www.antiwar.com...

I went to the voting center and gave my name and district where I live to a man," said Wassif Hamsa, a 32-year-old journalist who lives in the predominantly Shia area Janila in Baghdad. "This man then sent me to the person who distributed my monthly food ration."

Mohammed Ra'ad, an engineering student who lives in the Baya'a district of the capital city, reported a similar experience.

Ra'ad, 23, said he saw the man who distributed monthly food rations in his district at his polling station. "The food dealer, who I know personally of course, took my name and those of my family who were voting," he said. "Only then did I get my ballot and was allowed to vote."

"Two of the food dealers I know told me personally that our food rations would be withheld if we did not vote," said Saeed Jodhet, a 21-year-old engineering student who voted in the Hay al-Jihad district of Baghdad.



[edit on 1-2-2005 by Justanotherperson]

The Point Already Made

Originally posted by Justanotherperson
Not so fast. I did a little investigating on my own and I found the same author on another site saying the same thing. I guess you have to be a little biased to write for antiwar.com. Go with God, or without him.

www.antiwar.com...

I'm not sure what you're trying to imply, but I found the following words from the article instructive:

“There has been no official indication that Iraqis who did not vote would not receive their monthly food rations.”

The man is deliberately spreading rumors and innuendo, and changed his quotation of one of his sources from one article to another in a manner that is deliberately misleading.

How slow to pick up on that should we be?

I found his mini-bio on that page interesting, but in light of his demonstrated inability to quote his sources honestly, I wouldn't recommend taking his words at face value:

Originally from Anchorage, Alaska, Dahr Jamail writes about the effects of the US occupation on the people of Iraq, since the mainstream media in the US has in large part, he believes, failed to do so.

If he really wants to accomplish his stated goal, he might want to further it by not putting lies in his articles and trying to pass off questionable, agenda-driven political commentary as “reporting”.

For Those Who May Have Missed It

Here's another illustration of the significance of LeftBehind 's observation, for those who may be wondering what the hubbub is about.

First, Dahr Jamail wrote this:

From the AlterNet article dated 1/26/2005:

But some Iraqis still say they will vote. "I'll vote because I can't afford to have my food ration cut," said Amin Hajar, 52, who owns a small auto garage in Baghdad. "There is a rumour that if we don't vote our ration will be stopped. And if that happened, I and my family would starve to death."

He said that when he picked up his monthly food ration recently, he was forced to sign a form saying he had picked up his voter registration. He believes that the government may use this to track whether he votes or not.

This rumor has circulated broadly around Baghdad even though there appears to be no truth in it.

Then he wrote this:

From the Inter Press Service article dated 1/31/2005 (five days later):

Just days before the election, 52 year-old Amin Hajar who owns an auto garage in central Baghdad had said: ”I'll vote because I can't afford to have my food ration cut...if that happened, me and my family would starve to death.”

Hajar told IPS that when he picked up his monthly food ration recently, he was forced to sign a form stating that he had picked up his voter registration. He had feared that the government would use this information to track those who did not vote.

What is conveniently missing in the newer article – removed by an ellipsis (...) in one case and complete removal in the other -- is the fact that both he and his source had stated in no uncertain terms that this was all based on a rumor.

What's worse, Jamail himself had even opined, and I quote: “This rumor has circulated broadly around Baghdad even though there appears to be no truth in it.”

For some reason, he didn't seem to find that lack of truth to be a problem when he decided to include Hajar's statements in his later article, with their questionable veracity deliberately omitted.

He didn't believe it, and he expects us to? Yeah, right back atcha, pal.

And he's using this to imply that Iraqis were required to vote for food, even though his own sources and comments refute that very same thesis.

That's not reporting, that's disinformation, and that's propaganda.

What This Means

He's busted, plain and simple. In a later article, the guy is pushing as facts what he himself had described as baseless rumors in an earlier article.

If he really wants us to know the truth, then why doesn't he just come out and tell it instead of pushing what he himself described as a rumor with “no truth in it”?

He deliberately removed critical information from his second account, which rightfully calls his credibility in general into serious question.

Heck, in the second article, Dahr Jamail didn't even tell us what he had originally said just five days earlier. His own words betray him.

No matter how he or anyone else may try to “spin it” (i.e. “lie about it”), this all stinks with an all-too-familiar stench, and Dahr Jamail has justly earned my enduring distrust and that of anyone who can read and compare these two articles.

Folks, it's hard to get more obvious than this. The guy's a propagandist in the classic sense, and he's not even good at it, because he got caught in an obvious lie.

Unfortunately for those who insist on deceiving themselves, however, most propagandists don't get caught. Even those who do usually just keep on pumping out the lies, and people swallow them up willingly – as long as they are being told what they want to hear.

You cannot con an honest man, so if you don't want to be conned, be honest. At least try to be honest with yourself if honesty doesn't come easily to you.

Deny Ignorance.

Or embrace it. It's your choice.

Originally posted by Justanotherperson
Not so fast. I did a little investigating on my own and I found the same author on another site saying the same thing. I guess you have to be a little biased to write for antiwar.com. Go with God, or without him.

[edit on 1-2-2005 by Justanotherperson]

Like I said, justanotherperson, this article is odd. Antiwar.com, never read liberals websites. Go with God, or without him? God is with all of us, always. I said anti-American, not antiwar. You make no sense!
PolarBearExpress..............

Majic: It was a good read. Thanks, I enjoyed it.

[edit on 1-2-2005 by PolarBearExpress]

[edit on 1-2-2005 by PolarBearExpress]

...That are interested in gobbling this malarky up hook, line and sinker... wanna buy a bridge?

Wait, let me guess... that evil no-gooder George Bushy and his tyrannical cast of Hitler wanna-bes have conspired to starve thousands of women and children in order to illicit a vote in Iraq, right? And when he's done starving them, he's gonna order that they all be taken out back and tortured , right? Then he's gonna lie about it, right?

Man, you people are truly mixed up in the head! Threads like these truly support my theory that we have succumbed to the moronification of a nation!

Having people register for the vote at food distribution centers is a good enough idea.

None of this suggests that they'd not be given food if they didn't vote, indeed, its a secret ballot, so how would anyone know. There is a conspiracy amoung them that thats what would've happened. Which iraqis have had and food rations cut because of this also?

Besides, in all honesty, who cares? If they tricked people into voting, co-erced them into registering by givng them food, who gives a dam? The election needed to have a large turnout, else a small interest group would have control of the constitution.

By hook or by crook that place has gotta be straightened out.

Originally posted by mwm1331

You people are irrelevant.

Dont you just love it when conservatives show thier true colors?

For those that are suggesting that people aren't open to skeptisism.
There is a difference between skeptisism and irrational thinking

Not feeding a nation in order to force a vote is completely irrational.
Some seem to be 'guff diggers' who just wanna find every single little unproven piece of guff on the US and try to exploit it into the minds of everyone else.

Those Iraqi people came to vote cause its the first time for them to experience freedom in their country to make a difference. For those here who have these freedoms already, put yourself in their shoes and tell me what you would do?.....Or give me solid evidence that starving these people to force them to vote was the truth.

Originally posted by LeftBehind
This is very strange.

I found the same article here.

www.alternet.org...

But this article by the same man states

"He said that when he picked up his monthly food ration recently, he was forced to sign a form saying he had picked up his voter registration. He believes that the government may use this to track whether he votes or not.

This rumor has circulated broadly around Baghdad even though there appears to be no truth in it."

While on the link to his own homepage that you posted, the same article spins the information as if it were true. Instead of calling it a rumor he says

"Calls to the Independent Electoral Commission for Iraq (IECI) and to the Ministry of Trade, which is responsible for the distribution of the monthly food ration, were not returned."

But the strangest thing, unless it's computer error, is that the alternet article is dated 1-25-05, and the article on his homepage is dated 1-31-05 but is clearly written before the elections took place.

Just who is this Dahr Jamail? And which article is the real one?

I saw this "news" earlier in the day and searched on the web for the article. When I looked at the attribution, I found some of the familiar names of websites (fromthewilderness.com, alternet.org, and so on) which have been publishing articles exclusively slanted against the invasion of Iraq. Needless to say, I thought it was probably propaganda.

I don't believe the food for vote article.

Here in Holland 2 third of the exiled iraqis have voted. When interviewed they told that this is actually the first time in their life they could vote and hopefuly have their voice heard in shaping the future of their country.

Also one has to consider that many Sunni , being minority, and former ruling class, eventhough not all very enthousiastic went to the votes for the mere reason they wouldn't want the Sji'ite perties run away with the grand prize alone.


[edit on 1-2-2005 by Countermeasures]

Thank you Majic, for clarifying my point.

I am not a big fan of the Bush administration, however it is disingenuos to be bothered by the slant and disinformation put out by the neo-cons, yet embrace the same thing because you want it to be true.

No one will take you serious if you cant be honest in your criticisms.

Not to get off topic but I thought the real failure of Farenheit 9-11 was that Moore had to use the same tactics as Limbaugh and Hannity to get his point across.

Both Jamail and Moore are propagandists in my mind, and Jamail may think he's doing the right thing, but then again so does Anne Coulter.

the "no food if we dont vote" article is irrational

theres Not One Single Gram of Evidence to Back this Up
Not One

If there is; why isnt it presented here?

the people who spread these lies are fighting a psychological war agianst USA

in fact; i dont even think food is rationed in this manner in iraq
anyone want to Prove that food is rationed in Iraq?

when i see video of the "streets of Iraq" on TV or Internet; it shows people with Vendors Selling HotDogs to people on the street!!!!!

if food was rationed as it is said it is; than how can people Buy food?
How come people make a buisness on selling Food?

True; food may be rationed as welfare to those whom cannot afford it;
but i seriously doubt that all sources of food are Illegal so that the govt can control food distrubution

lets see some evidence

from where im sitting; it looks like those with jobs buy whatever food they want on the streets at markets or vendors or resturaunts

this thread is obviously overbias and i consider it credulty at its finest