Thoughts on the Flood and Evolution.(Thanks to Flyers Fan)

ServantOfTheLamb
at the end of the day it will come down to faith for both sides of the argument because all either of us can do is show circumstantial evidence to support our opinion on the fact at hand.

Not true. I have given solid science and solid fact. Indisputable absolute fact. Not 'circumstantial evidence'. You, on the other hand, just gave 'I have faith' as your 'evidence'. (which isn't really evidence).

LOGICALLY ... Noahs ark did not happen. Not a chance.
And acknowledging the FACT that the bible isn't literally true, doesn't effect a persons' belief in God at all.

FlyersFan

ServantOfTheLamb
at the end of the day it will come down to faith for both sides of the argument because all either of us can do is show circumstantial evidence to support our opinion on the fact at hand.

Not true. I have given solid science and solid fact. Indisputable absolute fact. Not 'circumstantial evidence'. You, on the other hand, just gave 'I have faith' as your 'evidence'. (which isn't really evidence).

LOGICALLY ... Noahs ark did not happen. Not a chance.
And acknowledging the FACT that the bible isn't literally true, doesn't effect a persons' belief in God at all.

edit on 2/26/2014 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)

You see it as illogical, because your FACT does not consider the chance that a Scientific Anomaly might have occurred as the result of an Omnipotent Creator. However, I did not see one thing that wasn't circumstantial.

ServantOfTheLamb
You see it as illogical, because your FACT does not consider the chance that a Scientific Anomaly might have occurred as the result of an Omnipotent Creator. However, I did not see one thing that wasn't circumstantial.

You are making wild excuses. Then there is no talking to you. Nothing I posted was 'circumstantial'.
You lost your 'logic bet'. And now you are welching on the bet. shame shame.

reply to post by F4guy


"By "positive", I assume you mean that in the sense of natural selection, that is, a mutation that enhances survival and the ability to reproduce. So we have observed the bacterium Staphylococcus aureus mutate to a new strain of Methicillin-resistant Staphylococcus aureus (MRSA). Analysis of the genome of the new strain shows a mutation of a resistance gene, mecA, which stops β-lactam antibiotics from inactivating the enzymes (transpeptidases). We have observed six new Staphylococcal cassette chromosome mec (SCCmec) genomic islands "

Thanks that is super interesting, but notice it is still the same organism Staphlyococcus. What you are showing is an example of mirco-evoltuion, which I completely agree with. Now if it had mutated that gene, and also started growing legs then I would be mind blown.

reply to post by ServantOfTheLamb

What you are showing is an example of mirco-evoltuion, which I completely agree with. Now if it had mutated that gene, and also started growing legs then I would be mind blown.

Explain the established biological mechanism/boundary that prevents organisms from evolving further over time.

Seems like you do not understand the terminology of Micro and macro evolution or how it came about or used in science.

Grimpachi
reply to post by ServantOfTheLamb

 

What you are showing is an example of mirco-evoltuion, which I completely agree with. Now if it had mutated that gene, and also started growing legs then I would be mind blown.

Explain the established biological mechanism/boundary that prevents organisms from evolving further over time.

Seems like you do not understand the terminology of Micro and macro evolution or how it came about or used in science.

I cannot explain the mechanism; only that there seems to be one. The Fossil record has to many gaps in it right now to conclude that Macro-evolution is Micro-evolution over and extended period of time. From what has been observed, micro-evolution is closer to a genetic adaptation to specific means of an environment rather than true vertical evolution.

reply to post by ServantOfTheLamb


So the best you can come up with is that it seems to be that way.

You say microevolution can occur but macroevolution cannot, yet you cannot explain the biological or logical barrier that prevents the former from becoming the latter.

There is a reason you can't come up with a logical explanation, and that is because one does not exist. We have found thousands of missing links in the fossil records I have even started threads on some of the more recent and remarkable ones. Like how aquatic life developed the ability to walk on land and much later how land animals returned to the sea.

To say we lack the fossil evidence is a demonstration in willful ignorance of the one claiming so especially here on ATS where the information is literally a few clicks away on the science forums.

reply to post by AliceBleachWhite


Believe me, ServantoftheLamb is correct on this one. There was a flood. This flood happened about 13,000 years ago with the sinking of Atlantis. Don't believe in the Atlantis story? Well, do you own research, and you find its truths. In fact, there were major incidents that happened throughout Earth's history that caused massive catastrophes. I'm sure you have heard recently of a possible pole shift that could happen in our time, even Scientists speak of this. Well, these pole shifts did happen many times before. Some of them were minor while some were quite major. When a pole shift happens, the Earth's North and South poles sway anywhere between 90 to 180 degrees. But they could wobble to pretty much any direction. Did you know that the North Pole was once where Hawaii is today due to a pole shift? Imagine a tropical place like Hawaii in a state of a total ice age for many years.

So with the swaying of the poles, the world's oceans will also overflow over much land that is more than enough to reach on top of mountains. Even if there is not enough water in the oceans to cover all land, there are certainly enough when you are pushing massive amounts of water around.

But the Bible's story was not all true. The Bible indeed was tampered with as you can see here. The "God" mentioned during Noah's time was not God as the Great Creator of the Universe as people talk about. That "God" did not create the flood. But "He" certainly knew it was coming (the Pole Shift). He wanted it to happen so that most humans would die. Why you ask? Is it mankind's sin? Not really. The story is a lot more detailed than that. But I just wanted to give you a glimpse of why the flood was real. Where did I get this knowledge? Well, you have it as well. Quoting the Bible, "Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened."

I recommend that all of you on this thread and ATS to look further than the Bible, beyond the scientists, and beyond your own knowledge concerning spiritual subjects, history, philosophy, religion, and so forth. This includes the OP. Never stop learning, for the truth will transcend itself as you discover more about yourself, about this world, and most importantly, about whom you call God. Your understanding of God and the Universe around you never stop expanding; because that is the essence of the Kingdom of Heaven within you.

ctophil
There was a flood. This flood happened about 13,000 years ago with the sinking of Atlantis.

If you are claiming that the entire world was underwater and only a boatload of people survived, then nope. The scientific facts that I presented showed that's impossible - be it 2300 BC or 13,000 BC. If you are claiming that Atlantis sunk and there was some flooding inland ... then that's a different story and is possible. But it doesn't match the Noahs Ark flood myth and therefore isn't the same thing. Sorry.

reply to post by ctophil

This flood happened about 13,000 years ago with the sinking of Atlantis.

The only mention of the fabled and mythical Atlantis is from Plato a few hundred years B.C.

Everything else is pure imagination and speculation and wishful thinking that a magical place existed, that by today's fantasies was more advance than present day.

Plus after 10,500+ years, do you really think an oral tradition/folktale told by Plato of this fantastical place has any merit at all?
This was told at a time when the sun was still being worshiped...

Where did you get the number 13,000 years ago for "Atlantis" sinking anyway?

Don't believe in the Atlantis story? Well, do you own research, and you find its truths

What reliable "research" did you use?

ServantOfTheLamb
reply to post by F4guy

 

"By "positive", I assume you mean that in the sense of natural selection, that is, a mutation that enhances survival and the ability to reproduce. So we have observed the bacterium Staphylococcus aureus mutate to a new strain of Methicillin-resistant Staphylococcus aureus (MRSA). Analysis of the genome of the new strain shows a mutation of a resistance gene, mecA, which stops β-lactam antibiotics from inactivating the enzymes (transpeptidases). We have observed six new Staphylococcal cassette chromosome mec (SCCmec) genomic islands "

Thanks that is super interesting, but notice it is still the same organism Staphlyococcus. What you are showing is an example of mirco-evoltuion, which I completely agree with. Now if it had mutated that gene, and also started growing legs then I would be mind blown.

Give it a million years or so.

reply to post by ctophil


Because you say so?

Provide independently verifiable source citations.
Show us stratified layering like the K/T Boundary which marks the Chicxulub impact that killed off most of the dinosaurs that would support a global flood.
Show us the data retrieved from time-locked magnetic compassing in ocean floor or stratified layer samples that indicate a pole shift, and please demonstrate how a magnetic pole shift would have any relevant physical impact on a planetary body and why.

Our sun just went through a pole shift, like just this last year.
Catastrophe? Nope.
Crazy violent solar activity? Nope.
Magnetic shifting of the poles, even complete reversal would have very little to no physical effect on the planet, and definitely not result in some giant flood catastrophe.

Provide some sources to support your claims, otherwise you're just telling stories, and while that's entertaining mmkaythankyoubuhbye, it's just as worthless as saying everything mysterious is Magic, because Magic.


Thus far, we're still stuck at ... Noah's Flood because MAGIC, because god.

Brothers and sisters, my objective here is to give you some information that may help you go beyond your current mental image of religion, history, philosophy, and what have you. I'm not here to prove who is right or wrong. Because that is just a duality of the human mind. It's so very easy to get stuck on a belief system or understanding of a concept or idea, such as you can see in various religions in itself. Some religious cultures can be stuck in their beliefs for thousands of years with hardly any deviation from its roots, passing on their traditions to every generation. That is why you will see occasionally someone will step in to teach and share knowledge and wisdom that seem to be outside of the box so to speak. You can never raise your consciousness in betterment of spiritual progress and/or evolution of your human mind if you don't transcend your current level of Gnosis or to know. This is why there were dark ages in times past. The Collective Mind of the world is a direct projection of what you see in physical reality. Even the Pole Shifts I spoke of or extreme weather you see happening are part of a shift in the world's consciousness, most of the time lowering of the mind not upwards.

So with that, you should all question your current paradigm of thought no matter the subject. God's Absolute Truth will stay the same even if you continue to transcend knowledge and wisdom. So don't fear where will you land next in your quest to raise higher in consciousness each day. For example, the world's many religions may seem different on the outside, but deep within each religion lies the Universal Truth that can never be changed. However, your understanding of the Universal Truth continues to be surpassed, and your understanding of this Truth rises on each paradigm shift. And each time this happens, you have a deeper, more enlightened knowledge of the same concept.

reply to post by ctophil


... again, because you say so.

Just believe.

mmkay.

reply to post by Chamberf=6


I know Im a bit late, but I wanted to address issue I raised about the time gap that exists between the initial creation of the universe and the 6 day restoration of Earth (and/or the solar system).

I wont add to thread drift by going into detail. Instead, for those who have an interest in further exploring the Genesis Gap, I will direct you're attention to this article:

www.MT.net...

I disagree with parts of it, but for the most part, I think it is accurate and a very interesting read at the very least.

mamabeth
People of faith should always remember this...Debating with
atheists is like playing chess with pigeons.Also remember...
Not to cast your pearls among swine!

How true.

"Among the repulsions of atheism for me has been its drastic uninterestingness
as an intellectual position. Where was the ingenuity, the ambiguity, the humanity
(in the Harvard sense) of saying that the universe just happened to happen and
that when we're dead we're dead?"
-John Updike

Pray, pray, pray for conversions.

BELIEVERpriest
reply to post by Chamberf=6

 

I know Im a bit late, but I wanted to address issue I raised about the time gap that exists between the initial creation of the universe and the 6 day restoration of Earth (and/or the solar system).

I wont add to thread drift by going into detail. Instead, for those who have an interest in further exploring the Genesis Gap, I will direct you're attention to this article:

www.MT.net...

I disagree with parts of it, but for the most part, I think it is accurate and a very interesting read at the very least.

Thanks for responding.

I have a very good feeling that I may disagree with more of it than you do, but I'll read it.

AliceBleachWhite
reply to post by ctophil

 

... again, because you say so.
Just believe.
mmkay.

I disagree as well, Ctophil says 13,000 years ago, I say 12,000 years ago, (whos quibbling) but given that Atlantis was covered up (not sunk); we are both in agreement of the fact the seas rose due to the ice age ending and the poles and inland continental glaciers melted 9000 Bc. A 300 foot raising is not confirmed it was actually 500 feet in a sea level rise....again because I SAY SO AS WELL; and there is NO BELIEF SYSTEM INVOLVED regarding this knowledge at all. The first Egyptians (sirians 6th dimensional) came about in 12,000 BC (an instant civilization format overlay including the buildings/pyramids) came as refuges from Atlantis. Oddly the 5th dimensional Pleiadians waited for their format until 200 BC; within MesoAmerica same situation, refuges from the Atlantian era (same story, all things buildings etc. instantly manifested to suit the civilizations needs). This city states were overlays, no one physically built them, they just appeared and solidified upon this earth plane. Their purpose was to incubate the nine dimensional being 'jesus' in the temple of the son; and insert him (as an ideaform) into the middle east 200 years hense. They left, in mass 0AD; (the ancient Maya) leaving the classic Maya they bred with the natives to continue and thrive until the 1400s.

vethumanbeing

I disagree as well, Ctophil says 13,000 years ago, I say 11,000 years ago, but giving that Atlantis was covered up (not sunk); we are both in agreement of the fact the seas rose due to the ice age ending and the poles and inland continental glaciers melted 9000 Bc. A 300 foot raising is not confirmed it was actually 500 feet in a sea level rise....again because I SAY SO AS WELL; and there is NO BELIEF SYSTEM INVOLVED regarding this knowledge at all. The first Egyptians (syrians) came about in 12,000 BC (an instant civilization format overlay including the buildings) came as refuges from Atlantis, mmkay.

Atlantis you say?
You might want to read this:
6 Famous Mysteries (that have totally been solved)

Source of hilarity chosen specifically because of the hilarity

#4. The Fate of Atlantis

The Answer:

Atlantis is not a thing.

First of all, our knowledge of plate tectonics rules out the possibility of sunken mystery continents. But there's a far more convincing reason than even this: That is, Atlantis was something that Plato completely pulled out of his ass just so Socrates could have something to talk about, and he specifically mentions in his writing that Atlantis is a completely hypothetical city.

This is part of the reason why Atlantis was not taken seriously until modern times. Most ancients actually took Plato's dialogues as the thought experiments they really were.

What's more, the book that mentions Atlantis, the Timaeus, is fewer than 100 pages long. This is # you can seriously knock out while you're killing time at the bus station. Though it should not come as much surprise that countless books and god knows how many hours of the History Channel have been dedicated to asking a riddle as easy to solve as looking up a word in the dictionary. It's pretty damn easy to pass yourself as an expert in a book that most people have never actually read past the first few pages.

Atlantis is a thought experiment/exercise like Utopia. It never existed except in Plato's head.

lulz.

reply to post by AliceBleachWhite


Apparently you missed the last half of my post; in explaination. No person (still living or stuck in the Picean Epoch/aeon) that is scientifically minded has any idea of the majick that existed within the Osiris aeon. The aeon of Aquarius began in 1904; but the hold outs are the flibberdy jibberers; the ruler smackers those that still believe hard science is the doctrine. No imagination, their science died 30 years ago when they thought the key to creation was in discovering the 'God Partical' or the smallest partical to be found (there is no smallest) and because they are not spirtualally minded alchemists/qabalists will never discover the truth through modern day hard science.