Biology of the mind: Is consciousness merely the result of evolution, or something more?

At 2:30pm today(Yesterday now), some of the world’s preeminent psychologists, neuroscientists, and philosophers will discuss the biology of the mind. The discussion, which takes place at The Helix Center in New York, will focus on whether the very human concepts of the mind, consciousness, and self-awareness are merely a function of the mammalian brain’s structure, or whether there’s more to it. By the same measure, the researchers will discuss whether the mind is purely the reserve of humans, or whether it also exists further down the evolutionary scale.

Biolog y of the mind: Is consciousness merely the result of evolution, or something more?




I find this a most interesting subject as im sure lots of you round these here parts will also. Well what are you thoughts on the article and vid if you have the time?

Is consciousness simply a result of evolution or is there something else at play?

Video is rather long i'm afraid, i'm only about a third way through myself.

www.youtube.com...=38

reply to post by andy06shake


Definitely a topic of interest for me and I will find the time to watch.
Thanks for posting.
I don't think consciousness is the result of evolution. I actually think that in some way it's the other way around.
I'll be curious to see what they come up with.

I think all matter on the microscopic scale is conscious.

Plants can communicate care for their offspring .

I think humans need to stop thinking they are the crowning achievement of the universe. We are a destructive force that hasn't figured out how to live in harmony with the universe .

reply to post by andy06shake


I couldn't watch the utube video it was so poorly produced.

But my thoughts are that consciousness and awareness are intertwined. And on the evolutionary scale; man is still in diapers.

There is a pathway to consciousness and awareness [shamans way] but we are forbidden on ATS to discuss it. What's that tell you?

I think Terence Mckenna had some valid points if you want to google him.

olaru12
reply to post by andy06shake

 

I couldn't watch the utube video it was so poorly produced.

But my thoughts are that consciousness and awareness are intertwined. And on the evolutionary scale; man is still in diapers.

There is a pathway to consciousness and awareness [shamans way] but we are forbidden on ATS to discuss it. What's that tell you?

I think Terence Mckenna had some valid points if you want to google him.

edit on 23-2-2014 by olaru12 because: (no reason given)

edit on 23-2-2014 by olaru12 because: (no reason given)

i don't think this pathway shamans use is very important, but the 'destination' is the key. we can discuss that.

reply to post by taoistguy


The pathway is the destination. Awareness comes from the journey; It's manifested by process not product.

reply to post by olaru12


there are many ways to get there without chemicals. fruit and veg for example. and meditation. and breathing techniques. and physical exercises.

I don't think "Why are we here?" is man's greatest question.

I think if one were to climb the mountain, seeking enlightenment, the
best question to ask is; Why am I conscious and self-aware?

To me it seems such a strange and unlikely happenstance, that I arose
consciousness here on this particular planet, in this particular galaxy,
at this particular time...it seems an absurd notion if you really think
about it. Why do I exist as a conscious being? Why do we all exist
as separate consciousness...and not just us humans, but surely
other less evolved life forms as well...

I don't want to know where I go when I die as much as I want to
know where I came from...Tell me where I came from and
I'll figure the rest out for myself, thx.

Well I believe consciousness to be the reason the world exists. A fractal wholeness of sorts.
Say, take all the ideas of advanced physics (string, quantum etc.) and intertwine them and add them upon the inner-self descriptions given to us through religious and various occult texts (take out the dogmatic garbage) and I think we're close to the truth.

Though I still wonder if in that fractal wholeness I mentioned there lies a greater force behind all of it, I care to believe that. Though that is for me, and anyone who wants to believe it.

Good mention op and an interesting article, look forward to hearing about the results of the conference. Care to post them here and mind if I sub to take heed of them?

reply to post by rival


You are on a good path with this question. Find the beginning and you will know the end, and more.

Have you by chance read the gospel of Thomas where Jesus supposedly mentioned this approximate saying I referred to and is in direct correlation to your question?

Anyway, my reply to the thread gives a thought about a part of the answer, though, it requires having a ultimate first beyond everything entity.

reply to post by taoistguy


I concur, taking chemicals can only take one so far. One would think that in the world of work one would actually have to work for it aye?

reply to post by Sump3


agree. such 'shortcuts' are merely temporary and do not truly encompass the 'vitality' of the enigma. getting there by truly natural means through one's own effort and understanding is permanent and healthy. (and sane.)

reply to post by Sump3


i slogged thru the entire bible when I was younger but my retention is terrible.
I did it mostly just to say I had done it which is a poor reason.

My philosophy differs from yours in that mine doesn't necessarily require
an ultimate being/creator. I'm always stumped at this point because
my logic dictates that even an original creator must have a creator as
well....kind of a chicken or the egg question. Considering my meager
resource of brain-power coupled what I can sense and understand about
the universe around me, I pretty much leave that question alone...though
the "where" did I come from question rears its ugly head and sometimes
totally preoccupies me every time I look up at the stars or ponder the
vastness of the universe.

reply to post by rival


Ah, I do not believe in a thing we can describe, it would be to ineffable to do so. I don't believe it to be anything like us, though of sorts maybe, but how could I possibly give it measure?

I like your line of thought, we all make our mistakes(regarding you reading the bible with said point) but the important thing is to take lesson from it and work towards being better by our measure.

It's all good man as they say

Btw, the gospel of thomas isn't in the bible, it was rejected at a church council in the early christian church on the note that it was a "gnostic" teaching. Though now theologians believe it to be as near the source they call "Q" which was a collective of sayings that Jesus supposedly said.

I am in no way a dogmatic religious person. I don't like categorizing unnecessary things, it produces problems. We're all looking for the same thing and no matter what, if there was a first, it was a first.

ETA: Going to shut this conversation down on the thread with respect to the OP's premise. Though if you like we can pm and chat on.

andy06shake
I find this a most interesting subject as im sure lots of you round these here parts will also. Well what are you thoughts on the article and vid if you have the time?

A lot of people have really odd ideas about consciousness but then again a lot of people have other ideas that aren't well supported either. I suppose it must be part of the human condition, though I've made a goal to weed out fact from fiction.

This part of the article sums it up pretty well for me:

the fact is, we still need to do a lot more research before we can answer these questions with any certainty. We are currently at the point where we have a pretty good understanding of how individual neurons operate — but we still have almost no clue about how the form of the brain, and its various, distinct regions, affect its functionality.

So, to rephrase, we know some stuff, but not enough to form a full answer yet.

I don't know if an answer is even on the horizon but one interesting question raised in the video was "how would we know if or when a robot had consciousness?". This forces us to think about what consciousness really is and how we define it. Whether a robot with consciousness will ever be made or not I don't know, but I wouldn't rule out the possibility.

reply to post by andy06shake


I think there is much insight that can be gained by observing the behavior of a single celled paramecium or other single celled being in it's natural habitat.

Their behaviors are 'intelligent', 'purposeful' and apparently they are aware and conscious.

Yet they do not have a brain, nor nerve cells. In fact their entire being is one single cell.

reply to post by andy06shake


Even from a religious perspective it is obvious animals have mind's, humans are more intelligent and at what level is an animal self aware?.
Consciousness is a more difficult concept but I beleive some animals may have it as well, now strip away the mind and the body from yourself and what remains is conscousness, there are some whom think the universe may be conscious.

Excellent description of consciousness, from the excellent Dr. Stuart Hameroff.

Dr. Stuart Hameroff is a Professor of Anesthesiology and Psychology, and Director of the Center for Consciousness Studies at the University of Arizona. Together with British quantum physicist Sir Roger Penrose, Hameroff is the co-author of the controversial Orch OR model of consciousness.

VIDEO LINK

reply to post by freedomSlave


What about when we are asleep?

When we dream we are in an unconscious state(R.E.M sleep), but from our perspective we are still conscious. How do we know that our experience of consciousness while awake is any more real than when we dream?

en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by andy06shake


If I and another person switched cells between each other one by one until the other person had all my cells and I had all the other persons cells, would I be aware of myself as the same identity as before, or will I be aware of myself as the identity that once belonged to the person I traded cells with?

What do you think?