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What will happen if gays are allowed to marry?

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posted on Feb, 24 2014 @ 06:20 PM
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reply to post by Abavs
 


See once you push this further. Men is to marry dog. Female is marry horse.

Would you support that? I wouldn't.


Before you know it marriage will no longer be a sacred bond issued by the church under the hand if god.

Erm…. people have been having secular weddings for a while now.




posted on Feb, 24 2014 @ 06:24 PM
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Abavs
reply to post by poweref
 

See this is were it needs to stop. Man to marry man and female to marry female.this can be accepted. See once you push this further. Men is to marry dog. Female is marry horse. She male to marry cat, gender confused mafrodite to marry its self.


Okay, let's get this clear. Gay marriage is only about 2 adult humans getting married. Please get the idea of animals out of your head. Germany has lead the way by actually stepping up laws against bestiality since they adopted gay marriage (would you bleive that they legalised bestiality way back in 1969?


As a gay person I would stand shoulder to shoulder in unity with you to fight against any kind of animal or child marriages. I am asking to extend the current legal definition of marriage to include same sex, not throw it away and replace it with 'whatever, marry what I want'



Before you know it marriage will no longer be a sacred bond issued by the church under the hand if god. It will be issued by the government like a license.


What do you mean? What about all of the athesit and non Christian marriages out there? Marriage is a license handed out by the government. It can also be a sacred and traditional ceremony held in a Christian church.

Here is my own personal idea on the 'problem' of the church.

Make the gay marriage part of the law conditional on the basis that churches and religious organisations can say no to holding ceremonies based upon faith teachings.

It's the legal recognition we are after and we can create our own ceremonies. It also removes the issue of the 'under God' aspect of the marriage.



posted on Feb, 24 2014 @ 06:46 PM
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poweref

You are right. Well it is for me hard to say is this pro Christian forum or not. I believe, you would find much more gay supporters, than Christian religion supporters here. Who knows, but to say in other words, I believe pro gay is today much more trend, then to be anything else like religion like.

So I do not have proof, but I bet, that if there is a pool here, there would be like 90% of people support gay marriages, and like only 50% would support this being as pro Christian forum. I believe my point still stands strong, in regards to your argument.



Step into a Christian forum and you will find maybe 10% gay support on a good day. Certain threads attract certain types of people. Gay political issue threads are going to attract gay supporters because that is what they are for - for us to get our message out.

Go into say a gray area thread and there will be no mention of gay because it's got nothing to do with it.



Urge to fix the world. Why they fight to change it?


We fight for our rights because we are denied of them. An urge to fix the world is a noble thing, but you need to focus your energies on more positive things. Like trying to help the poor people in Syria caught up in the civil war for instance.




It is hard to agree on this point, since it is only one way to say 2+2 is not 4. To lie. I strongly believe, that we can believe in truth, and that it can be found between two different beings like you and me. We can agree on things, if we accept truth.


Math and homosexuality are unrelated. We are not lying and we are not trying to overestimate anything. We are just asking for equal rights. Read my last post and you will find that I personally am even prepared to compromise with religion and give it it's own special space on the issue of marriage.



Your argument assumes that anyone can be right about anything. I simply say that is not truth.


An opinion is neither necessarily right or wrong. I can say that my opinion on radio waves is that because I can't see them they therefore don't exist. I am completely wrong if I say this, but I am still entitled to my opinion.



That sounds like gay is something invented in 21. century. Gay is nothing new. World knows about you almost everything it needs through last couple of millenias.


And there have been times in the last few milennia that gay marriage was openly accepted. We did not have the advanced science of today 1000 years ago, so no we have not learned everything yet.



You are not fighting for acceptance. You are accepted. Now, you are fighting for completely new rules. You want that man marry man, and woman marry woman. As my concern, it is the same as marrying dog or puppet. You wont produce offspring naturally, but with technology, even your plastic puppet will give birth.


What? I mean what?


You are not making sense any more. Try writing with objectivity and not emotion.

You have this fixation upon childbearing in marriage. There are infertile and old people whom marry that can't have children either. I don't want kids - my partner is a human being and we have a very spoiled cat that takes up enough of our time.

edit on 24-2-2014 by markosity1973 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 24 2014 @ 11:04 PM
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]reply to post by markosity1973
 


Lets put conspiracy into this as this is a conspiracy site. The world is over populated. What better way to depopulated the world. As more and more people become gay the less children of tomorrow. Unless u got the money to grow a baby in a test tube. But as prices rize so does services. Germany and America both have already tried this in the past with eugenics.

Lets us not forget the Georgia guiedstone in witch the powers at B are shaping society to come.

en.m.wikipedia.org...




edit on 24-2-2014 by Abavs because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 24 2014 @ 11:05 PM
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reply to post by Abavs
 


Maintain humanity under 500,000,000 in perpetual balance with nature.Guide reproduction wisely — improving fitness and diversity.Unite humanity with a living new language.Rule passion — faith — tradition — and all things with tempered reason.Protect people and nations with fair laws and just courts.Let all nations rule internally resolving external disputes in a world court.Avoid petty laws and useless officials.Balance personal rights with social duties.Prize truth — beauty — love — seeking harmony with the infinite.Be not a cancer on the earth — Leave room for nature — Leave room for nature.



posted on Feb, 24 2014 @ 11:12 PM
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reply to post by Abavs
 

So they are artificially creating more gay people? How do you imagine they are achieving this?



posted on Feb, 24 2014 @ 11:28 PM
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Lucid Lunacy
reply to post by Abavs
 

So they are artificially creating more gay people? How do you imagine they are achieving this?


As this is a conspiracy site you can throw what u know on the table. : )

Chemicals and hormones in food. Media. The media tells us what is acceptable behaivior and how we should think. Remember the media are all privetly own by billionaires who pretty much control the world and its direction.
Sure there are many things to back up this theory. However I have had a long day. And im not gonna go look up infomation to support theory untill I have had a coffee.



posted on Feb, 24 2014 @ 11:43 PM
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reply to post by Abavs
 


As this is a conspiracy site you can throw what u know on the table. : )

Absolutely. I encourage it. As this sites motto is 'Deny Ignorance' I can question it to ascertain its truthiness.


Chemicals and hormones in food.

How would the perpetrators avoid eating it themselves if it was introduced into mainstream food?


Media. The media tells us what is acceptable behaivior and how we should think.

It does not follow from that everyone will mindlessly follow it.

Who told the media what to think and how to behave?


However I have had a long day. And im not gonna go look up infomation to support theory untill I have had a coffee.

Sounds reasonable to me



posted on Feb, 25 2014 @ 12:50 AM
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reply to post by Abavs
 


Well that post took a left off the Christian highway lol. I am open to exploring the idea that we are the result of certain stressors in the world. Other genetic anomalies work like this, so it's not entirely impossible. However, It would mean it's still not my fault I am gay under this idea, it's more that I was engineered into existence by nature or some covert agenda 21 scheme or whatever. Kinda like Robogay or something lol.

Even if you were correct about gayness and population control, we should be seeing a real surge in the number of young gay people. We need reliable and up to date data to prove this though. Last I read, the consensus was we are sitting stable at approx 10% of population. You're going to need a whole lot more than 10% gay people to slow breeding down. And then there is the thing that we have artificial insemination. Yep, we could make gaybies and lots of them if we so wished.



posted on Feb, 25 2014 @ 12:51 AM
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All this hyperbole and yet in the end nothing will change when we are finally granted the right to marry and recognized



posted on Feb, 25 2014 @ 07:03 AM
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Abavs
reply to post by poweref
 

Before you know it marriage will no longer be a sacred bond issued by the church under the hand if god. It will be issued by the government like a license.


So... this is all satire, then? Just in case it's not, a quick clarification of your two premises above: marriage can be both these things. Legally (in the US at least) it has to be the second, but not the first. Hope that helps clear things up.



posted on Feb, 25 2014 @ 10:49 AM
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Lucid Lunacy
reply to post by poweref
 


It is unproven fact that there exists pro-gay agenda

Freudian slip?


Nah. Also I wont quote all else, i will just respond.

"It's a big taboo, we're expecting it to cause quite a stir," admits the editor of Britain's award-winning gay lifestyle magazine, firstlook.org....

"There is this cliché that we are all having a great time partying, but actually we know, and the research is now showing, there are a hell of a lot of unhappy gay people; far higher rates of depression, anxiety and suicide than among straight men; far higher rates of self-destructive behaviour; substance abuse and sex addiction; and high levels of issues around intimacy and forming relationships."

Ok, well if that is not source, since you must discredit any, then please continue to google terms like mental/physical illness in gay community. I repeat, Im not walking library, informations come to fast to sort all them out in all areas that are interesting to me, like gay rights.

Gay agenda converts people with all means, through movies, magazines, internet, politicians, activists. Most of newly created movies are going in that directions that they show gay families, but i do not like that movies so i try to avoid them, or I will not remember them. Like... literally any movie that promotes something not so good as some perfectly wanted behavior, the same as they make killers look like heroes in movies. Any horror movie would fall to this category as immoral and evil in its root.



posted on Feb, 25 2014 @ 11:08 AM
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markosity1973


We fight for our rights because we are denied of them. An urge to fix the world is a noble thing, but you need to focus your energies on more positive things. Like trying to help the poor people in Syria caught up in the civil war for instance.


I have trouble with accepting this new right. For example, lets say both we are mans. I can marry girl, you can marry girl. I cant marry man, you cant marry man. So we have the same right, but you want new right. What we have from that right?

Lets say for example, every man marry man and every woman marry woman. So where do we get then? Do you see why your rule has mistakes? Because you want to propose rule that if everyone followed, humankind would stop to exist. So is this rule really good? You wont get this problem with "normal" definition of marriage between man and wife.

That is the reason why I have troubles in accepting gay marriages. New rule you suggest, creates worse world to wear, not better.



It is hard to agree on this point, since it is only one way to say 2+2 is not 4. To lie. I strongly believe, that we can believe in truth, and that it can be found between two different beings like you and me. We can agree on things, if we accept truth.
------------------------------

Math and homosexuality are unrelated. We are not lying and we are not trying to overestimate anything. We are just asking for equal rights. Read my last post and you will find that I personally am even prepared to compromise with religion and give it it's own special space on the issue of marriage.


I just argued that we have equal rights, and that you ask for completely new right. Far from equal.

Please try to give answer to my argument I mentioned before.
edit on 25-2-2014 by poweref because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 25 2014 @ 02:33 PM
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reply to post by poweref
 


Do you see why your rule has mistakes? Because you want to propose rule that if everyone followed, humankind would stop to exist.

People have sex and have babies when they are not married. Procreation doesn't depend on marriage.

Gay marriage doesn't magically turn every heterosexual gay..

Gay people can and do procreate. Insemination, surrogate mothers. Sometimes by having sex with the opposite gender.

What you're saying makes zero sense. Gay marriage isn't going to affect population growth anymore than it already does. You realize there are places in this World that have legalized gay marriage for a while now and they still have heterosexual marriages and people are still making babies, right? If you look at the link to my thread I shared with you earlier you will see a list of the '10 gay friendliest countries in the world' which shows population growth in each one not only not decreasing but in fact increasing.

As I said mentioned earlier, and source in that thread, population growth is projected to increase significantly within the next 100 years. There is no concern about dwindling population right now.


then please continue to google terms like mental/physical illness in gay community.

What do you get when you google keyword phrases that represent the opposite position? If I type in a keyword phrase like "Republicans are crazy" and come back and say I did a search and it said Republicans are crazy, do you think I was being objective?
The American Psychiatric Association removed homosexuality as a mental illness from the DSM 40 years ago
You and others may hold the position it's a mental illness but that's not the professional consensus.

As for their alleged unhappiness. There are plenty of very happy gay people. I know a bunch myself! I'm sure there are lots of unhappy gay people as well for all the normal nature and nurture reasons that cause it in everyone else. Additionally, I would hope you could see how discrimination might cause unhappiness as well.
edit on 25-2-2014 by Lucid Lunacy because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 25 2014 @ 04:10 PM
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reply to post by poweref
 


Okay, it's at this point we are flogging a dead horse now.

You are not bringing anything new to the debate and you have no less than two of us telling you the same thing in slightly different ways.

I will rebut your arguments one last time,

Argument 1

From your firstlook magazine article;



"It's a big taboo, we're expecting it to cause quite a stir," admits the editor of Britain's award-winning gay lifestyle magazine, firstlook.org.... "There is this cliché that we are all having a great time partying, but actually we know, and the research is now showing, there are a hell of a lot of unhappy gay people; far higher rates of depression, anxiety and suicide than among straight men; far higher rates of self-destructive behaviour; substance abuse and sex addiction; and high levels of issues around intimacy and forming relationships."


All of this is true. None of us ever said it wasn't. However, homosexuality in itself is not a mental illness. The American psychiatric society declassified homosexuality as a mental illness in 1974. Look at this article about Lebanon. Even some middle eastern countries are starting to see the light.



The Lebanese Psychiatric Society has declared homosexuality is not a mental illness. The society says in a statement: 'Homosexuality in itself does not cause any defect in judgment, stability, reliability or social and professional abilities.'


The whole idea of marriage is that we are trying to promote the idea that we can have valued relationships in the gay community. I can tell you now from personal experience that it is very hard for a relationship to work, when everyone including your family rejects you for trying to have a steady partner and keeps telling you it isn't going to last etc etc. And yes, it does lead to a feeling of hopelesness and depression and in extreme circumstances, suicide. But I can also tell you that once a person finds a partner and things work out (i.e. I personally moved to another country away from all the negativity my family gave me) it is possible to be very happy and live a normal life.

Argument 2



Gay agenda converts people with all means, through movies, magazines, internet, politicians, activists. Most of newly created movies are going in that directions that they show gay families, but i do not like that movies so i try to avoid them, or I will not remember them.
Like... literally any movie that promotes something not so good as some perfectly wanted behavior, the same as they make killers look like heroes in movies. Any horror movie would fall to this category as immoral and evil in its root.


The gay agenda does not seek to 'sign up' new gay recruits. If you are fearful that by watching these things you yourself will turn gay, then I worry for your mental ability. The gay agenda seeks to show gay people as part of everyday life and as people who are not to be feared and as part of the community. Perhaps it is you that belongs in a horror movie at this point.

Argument 3




Lets say for example, every man marry man and every woman marry woman. So where do we get then? Do you see why your rule has mistakes? Because you want to propose rule that if everyone followed, humankind would stop to exist. So is this rule really good? You wont get this problem with "normal" definition of marriage between man and wife.


We have answered this one time and time again. Would you marry a person of the same sex? Would your friend? What about your brothers/ sisters / cousins / uncles / aunts/ mother / father/ grandparents?

Quite simply, I know for a fact that the whole world is not going to turn gay if we allow same sex marriage.

As for your theory that humanity will become extinct, you've been told several times again that even if your worst fear were to come true we can still have babies.

To be perfectly frank, this argument is utter rubbish and you need to stop presenting it.

Argument 4




I just argued that we have equal rights, and that you ask for completely new right. Far from equal.


No, you are arguing from a heterosexual point of view. i.e. as a man you marry a woman and vice versa or you don't get married at all, therefore we are all equal.

That is far from equal.

It is like saying I am green and you are purple. Green people are allowed access to medical services but purple people aren't but we have the same rights because I'm green and you are purple.

True equality looks after everyone because everyone is considered equal. Current marriage laws say you are only equal if you are straight.

edit on 25-2-2014 by markosity1973 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 26 2014 @ 06:21 AM
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My gay agenda

- eat dinner
- finish history assignment
- wash clothes
- fed pets
- spend time with lover and family
- listen to podcast
- go to sleep
- wake up


simple.

sigh.



posted on Feb, 26 2014 @ 03:44 PM
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reply to post by Rosha
 

"Gay marriage is not a privilege its a equal right. No taxes for gay people would be a privilege." Now that I got that quote off my chest for a agenda to work there many factors that must come into play. This is going off topic for a second. (As Henery Kissinger said) "There is a need for a new world order" "The new world order has many characteristics at play" now if we take the new world order guied lines from the Georgia Tablet stone, it clearly states we need a dramatic population decrease as the world is over populated. What better way then to have multiple contiguous agendas at play say over a 20 - 30 year period in sexuality, mental and physical health, eugenics, social engineering. Now this is just a open theory I may be compleatly wrong. I do how ever find its really strange that there has been a big gay boom since 2000. Not to mention its only taken us since the dawn of human existence to about 2008 for gayness to be socialy accepted in society.
Why now what has changed, why all of a sudden a acceptance and from the catholic religion why have they had a change in mind especially when they use to announce it as a one of the biggest sins there is.

There is always an agenda at play for some bigger hidden agenda.



posted on Feb, 26 2014 @ 04:09 PM
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reply to post by Abavs
 

Funny after I posted the above I got referd to the disclaimer info page. I must of pushed some buttons.

edit on 26-2-2014 by Abavs because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 26 2014 @ 04:39 PM
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reply to post by Abavs
 




Not to mention its only taken us since the dawn of human existence to about 2008 for gayness to be socialy accepted in society.


Nothing could be further from the truth.

Perhaps you should read both of these well referenced Wiki pages.

en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...



Why now what has changed, why all of a sudden a acceptance and from the catholic religion why have they had a change in mind especially when they use to announce it as a one of the biggest sins there is.


Maybe its a realisation and acknowledgement that they've been wrong?



posted on Feb, 26 2014 @ 05:08 PM
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Freeborn
reply to post by Abavs
 




Not to mention its only taken us since the dawn of human existence to about 2008 for gayness to be socialy accepted in society.


Nothing could be further from the truth.

Perhaps you should read both of these well referenced Wiki pages.

en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...



Why now what has changed, why all of a sudden a acceptance and from the catholic religion why have they had a change in mind especially when they use to announce it as a one of the biggest sins there is.


Maybe its a realisation and acknowledgement that they've been wrong?
im sorry but Wikipedia and reality are two different things.



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