Police kill 80yo man in his own bed. Drugs were not found...

TheWhiteKnight
reply to post by gladtobehere

 

Looks like another cop bashing thread on ATS.

The guy was 80 years old. I wouldn't doubt that the guy's done something wrong, after all these years.
He might have been thinking about doing something wrong, you know.

At this point, what does it matter?

Give the poor cops a break already.

# 161

I sincerely doubt you'd have the same attitude if it were your friend, your father, or your grandfather, or perhaps your next door neighbor. Even if they did do something wrong at some point in their lives. As an american, I find your reply frightening that this sort of mindset exists.

If not the cops then who else might be stalking around your house in middle of the night that might kill you? Uh-huh, which do statistics reveal to be more likely, the cops or an actual home invasion by other bad guys?

reply to post by gladtobehere


* Coroner calls it - Died in his sleep.

Sorry for the brevity but this stuff is getting silly.
In a very sad and escalating kind of way ...

reply to post by gladtobehere


If this is a completely accurate article and nothing important has been ommitted, then surely this is murder plain and simple. The Sherriff (who I think resigned last month), the Detective, and the policeman who killed him should be arrested themselves.

TheWhiteKnight
reply to post by gladtobehere

 

Looks like another cop bashing thread on ATS.

The guy was 80 years old. I wouldn't doubt that the guy's done something wrong, after all these years.
He might have been thinking about doing something wrong, you know.

At this point, what does it matter?

Give the poor cops a break already.

# 161

First they came for the old men who were, of course, guilty in thought in their old hour... I did not speak out-- Because I was not to worry.


...

Then they came for me--and there was no one left to speak for me.

Benjamin Franklin (1706–90)

That it is better 100 guilty Persons should escape than that one innocent Person should suffer, is a Maxim that has been long and generally approved.

BENJAMIN FRANKLIN, letter to Benjamin Vaughan, March 14, 1785.—The Writings of Benjamin Franklin, ed. Albert H. Smyth, vol. 9, p. 293 (1906).

He was echoing Voltaire, “that generous Maxim, that ’tis much more Prudence to acquit two Persons, tho’ actually guilty, than to pass Sentence of Condemnation on one that is virtuous and innocent.—Zadig, chapter 6, p. 53 (1749, reprinted 1974).

Sir William Blackstone, in his Commentaries on the Laws of England, 9th ed., book 4, chapter 27, p. 358 (1783, reprinted 1978), says, “For the law holds, that it is better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer.”

www.bartleby.com...

Curious their thoughts on today's world.

Timely
reply to post by gladtobehere

 

* Coroner calls it - Died in his sleep.

Sorry for the brevity but this stuff is getting silly.
In a very sad and escalating kind of way ...

so you are saying they shot him in bed while sleeping?

Are unregistered handguns and knives now standard issue for cops, so when they shoot an unarmed person they have a plant weapon to justify their murder?

Even if the handgun was owned by the dead man and was indeed on the bedside table at the time, they still shot him then called out the warning. They also get to change their story for the investigation? And they are allowed to do this? WTF?

I see more and more of this from across the pond, the cops all geared up in military fatigues, body armour etc. I swear they get all orgasmic at the thought of gearing up and playing soldier, and it's a bonus if they get to open fire or beat someone, just to show how manly they are. It also seems though that these tactics are used for very low grade "crimes" such as drug possession, or even lower grade infractions. I guess though that they like playing dress up so much, they feel it's justified. I personally think they have watched too much Hollywood drivel and see themselves as Judge Dredd-like enforcers. there to carry out the role of police, through to judge and executioner.

reply to post by hopenotfeariswhatweneed


Theatrical speculation at best.

Britguy
Are unregistered handguns and knives now standard issue for cops, so when they shoot an unarmed person they have a plant weapon to justify their murder?

Even if the handgun was owned by the dead man and was indeed on the bedside table at the time, they still shot him then called out the warning. They also get to change their story for the investigation? And they are allowed to do this? WTF?

I see more and more of this from across the pond, the cops all geared up in military fatigues, body armour etc. I swear they get all orgasmic at the thought of gearing up and playing soldier, and it's a bonus if they get to open fire or beat someone, just to show how manly they are. It also seems though that these tactics are used for very low grade "crimes" such as drug possession, or even lower grade infractions. I guess though that they like playing dress up so much, they feel it's justified. I personally think they have watched too much Hollywood drivel and see themselves as Judge Dredd-like enforcers. there to carry out the role of police, through to judge and executioner.

this is because they receive a massive fail on applying to the military so the get a chip on the shoulder

TheWhiteKnight
reply to post by gladtobehere

 

Looks like another cop bashing thread on ATS.

The guy was 80 years old. I wouldn't doubt that the guy's done something wrong, after all these years.
He might have been thinking about doing something wrong, you know.

At this point, what does it matter?

Give the poor cops a break already.

# 161

I sure hope you're being sarcastic because this is one time I agree with the general consensus, that they were WAY out of line with their actions. I would also sincerely hope that they are brought to task over this incident, even if not by their department but by the I am sure Federal investigation that is sure to happen because of it.

Shooting anyone while they are sleeping, or otherwise not aware of your presence, is just an execution. Nothing more and nothing less.

reply to post by gladtobehere


At some point in the very near future people are going to have to stand up to these totalitarian so called police scum. These fools deserve justice to descend upon them, and I don't mean the diluted and blind form met out by TPTB. I mean street justice, an eye for an eye so to speak!

Fiat justitia ruat caelum!

Yeah, there are over zealous LEOs, some are bullies and some make stupid mistakes, but based on what I see on TV, most of the county mounties around these parts look like football players or Lou Fragrigno and that makes me think that steroids are being used.

In my opinion, "roid rage" would explain much of the ever increasing bad cop behavior. Throw in ineffective or nonexistent job screening or psych tests and you have a few probable reasons as to why this keeps happening.

LEOs should be held to the highest standards across the board.

How much pushing is it going to take the American public to finally say, "Enough!" and reclaim their liberty?

Obviously this is another victim of the War on Drugs. Are we so worried about an 80 year-old man damaging his health through substance abuse that we need to send cops into his home in middle of the night to kill him? The War on Drugs is a scam to jack up prices for our own government-sanctioned profiteers - this going back to at least the time of the opium trade with China centuries ago - and use it as a free pass to invade our homes and privacies at all levels whether on the street, in our homes, or in cyber space.

It has become so lucrative, this war against contraband, that we have a prison industry that utilizes a police force to induct more slave labor into its system of "justice." The War on Drugs is no failure, it is doing exactly what its purpose was for - never to stop drug traffic but to 'control' it and to control the population by making everyone a suspect.

Time to say, "No More!"

reply to post by gladtobehere


These kinds of threads are becoming repetitive, and these kinds of cops give me ideas. Sick ideas. I mean, what if I didn't like someone and just wanted them killed, at no cost to myself? I could call the cops from a junk phone and tell them I'm making an anonymous call about a large cache of hardcore drugs and guns in the house of the person that I don't like, and that I know for a fact this person sleeps with a loaded gun. Nothing would happen, probably, but in today's world of shoot first and ask questions later...who knows? I might get lucky, and have the cops do all the dirty work for me.

The fact is, the guy is in bed and has EVERY right to have a gun with him if he wants. The cops act like they have a right to blow you away if you're in your own home, sleeping, with a gun nearby. You're allowed to have guns in the home. You're even allowed to hold them in your hands, in your home. I don't recomend it while sleeping, drinking, or any other time when not in possession of your full mental abilities, but who knows? Maybe the old guy was afraid to be alone at night, and the gun gave him security (one of the purposes of these things we call guns).

I really am getting sick of hearing about the police blowing away innocent people. Yep, they have a hard job, but they had a hard job 40 years ago too, and sorry, but this kind of bullcrap wasn't happening on a daily basis, and when it did happen, the cops were usually prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law, as the violation of rights and proper procedure was so blatant. The violations NOW are just as blatant, but society has been numbed down nicely, to the point where we see it so much on youtube that we accept it. We complain about it, sure, but in the end, we just get numbed down more. Maybe 20 years from now, the police will be allowed to shoot you if they just don't like the looks of you, and we will probably be numb to it then too.

I believe cases like this is why the Posse Comitatus forum was created.

This happens all too often. Too many police officers will cover for another's mistake. Police reports are often re-written dozens of time until the report seems to match the facts. I was arrested about 2 months ago and my police report had false information, almost everyone I know who has been arrested under questionable circumstances find that the arrest report is full of lies.

No knock raids should only be served when going after a murderer, escaped convict, or someone who poses a grave threat to society. No knock raids on simple suspicion of drugs is absolutely wrong. Too many times the police have got the address wrong, or their informant gave them bad information.

I am very alarmed that house raids seem to becoming more common, and the vast majority of those raids are simply because of the War on the 4th Amendment that was sold to the sheeple as the War on Drugs.

reply to post by gladtobehere


If our 'supposed' protectors are to be threatened by 80 yo meth addicts, who have unbelievable strength and agility, mind you, they must be better equipped. An H&K MP5 is probably not enough, flashbangs wouldn't hurt, but maybe they need to deploy some WP to contain situations. They are obviously not riding hot enough. Even though they could probably confound him with applesauce and prune juice.

MichiganSwampBuck
Yeah, there are over zealous LEOs, some are bullies and some make stupid mistakes, but based on what I see on TV, most of the county mounties around these parts look like football players or Lou Fragrigno and that makes me think that steroids are being used.

In my opinion, "roid rage" would explain much of the ever increasing bad cop behavior. Throw in ineffective or nonexistent job screening or psych tests and you have a few probable reasons as to why this keeps happening.

LEOs should be held to the highest standards across the board.

I agree with your entire post.

Personally, I live in central Illinois, and I was driving a beater for a long time and had numerous encounters with the police because it was in insanely poor condition (which I totally didn't mind), and they have ALL, without exception, been very cool to me and relaxed, and just like all the "normal" cops I ever met growing up. I had to speak to the police in my apartment last week about something, and they were totally normal and courteous, and could have technically been asses to me, if they'd wanted to be.

These thugs in uniform who burst through doors like GI Joes and pump you full of lead before they even know what the hell is going on? Yeah, I'm staying away from those weirdos if I can. They are the dark force of law enforcement, and they seem to exist and continue to do what they do, with most of them getting away with it for the most part, and most of the media not even batting an eye about it (unless they can have a white v black racial component to the story, then they'll not only "report" about the story ad-infinitum, but will do everything they can to DRIVE the story, control it, and hopefully exaccerbate it until it grows into a story with multiple branches and outcomes).

If the media were doing their jobs, which is to protect the rights of the American people from being violated by their government (and those employees of the government, like the police), then this problem would eventually go away, but beyond local news and the internet, the national media hardly even talks about these stories. They spend more time talking about Justin Beeber than of people being murdered by overzealous, clueless cops, who DO appear to be on some kind of roids or other long-term mood altering substances. They act like blowing someone away is "just a part of my job, ma'am...glad to do it..."

Uh, no, you say that when you get Aunt Polly's cat out of the tree, being the good, helpful policeman, serving your comunity in all ways you can while on the job. Blowing away citizens who pay your salary always used to be the very LAST option.

It's also as if these "bad-robocop" police are incapable of thinking on their feet. I'm sorry, and I know an 80 year old man can shoot a gun too, but I keep hearing about all these senior citizens getting blown away, one guy a month or so ago I think was over 100 years old or something, and it's like shooting a 3 year old because he's holding a gun on you. Couldn't you back out of the doorway and regroup before you blasted him? He's 80? What do you think he's going to do? A drop and roll out the bedroom door and blow you away with your vests on? If these cops are such dimwitted pantywaists that they follow procedure blindly to the detriment of all common sense, then they are definitely "relaxing" the standards of becoming a policeman, and I'm afraid brutal, rights-violating, unthinking thugs is going to be the wave of the future, not a passing fancy, for our benevolent government overlords. May as well get used to it.

One of these nights, I'll probably run into one of them somewhere. I'll just try not to breath too suddenly while he's threatening me with the barrel of his gun pressed against my left parietal bone, because I started to reach for the glovebox to get my registration and title a little to quickly for his liking.

Sorry for the long post, but this stuff is a real concern to me, and I also wanted to put in a positive word for the police I've encountered here in my own neck of the woods for the last 4 years.

reply to post by Bedlam


you should be given an award for superb sarcastic humor..

reply to post by gladtobehere


It's Los Angeles, what do you want?

The LAPD has had a lot of problems for a LONG time and are probably one of the model PDs for America's coming Police State (arguable point). Add to that, NYPD, ChicagoPD, and a few others across the country and it's a matter of time.